fun for all the family its for everyone! cant wait for my nan to stumble apon some sexy fun bear time I'm gonna get her a copy and force her to play it, lets see which is more powerful Larians bg3 or her pacemaker - let the games begin
Hot Take: You can like a thing and also think it is deeply flawed, pointing out said flaws while still mostly enjoying said thing. Enjoyment and criticism are not mutually exclusive. It’s how we take things that are “good” and make them “better.”
I’m not quite sure whom this is directed at but nobody has said that people shouldn’t or can’t be critical of any media.
This thread was made in response to another (that was rightfully locked) made by somebody who was upset that there were things in the game they didn’t like, mad that it was trying to appeal to people who weren’t him, and doing quite a bit of gatekeeping railing against the “casuals.” The problem wasn’t that he had criticisms, it was that his tone was bitterly dismissive and not constructive.
Originally Posted by Warlocke
Originally Posted by Zerubbabel
Hot Take: You can like a thing and also think it is deeply flawed, pointing out said flaws while still mostly enjoying said thing. Enjoyment and criticism are not mutually exclusive. It’s how we take things that are “good” and make them “better.”
I’m not quite sure whom this is directed at but nobody has said that people shouldn’t or can’t be critical of any media.
This thread was made in response to another (that was rightfully locked) made by somebody who was upset that there were things in the game they didn’t like, mad that it was trying to appeal to people who weren’t him, and doing quite a bit of gatekeeping railing against the “casuals.” The problem wasn’t that he had criticisms, it was that his tone was bitterly dismissive and not constructive.
I was unfamiliar with the other thread. In the interest of forum continuity, I will leave my initial comment unedited, though.
Remember the human (This is a forum for a video game):
Argument by popularity leads to the conclusion that live services garbage is the best that gaming has to offer and One Direction is the best music. Let's please not go there.
Let's instead go have the world's best food at McDonald's.
When we're talking about a product, popularity is the only thing that matters.
When company's forget this and instead try to develope based on arbitrary ideas of what they think a consumer wants or needs they turn into modern Blizzard.
In other words, you want BG3 to become a bloated live service mess with a ton of microtransactions, because those are hella popular. Maybe add a battle royale mode too, because PUBG is so popular as well? And after all, popularity is really all that matters!1
That whole "chase popularity" nonsense is why almost every single triple-A game released is shallow and unsatisfying. They're not designed by people with a vision, they're designed to check the maximum amount of boxes to have all the popular stuff. You need "sidequests", you need "minigames", you need "exploration", you need crafting, resource gathering, survival elements, item tiers, you need some character level system so players can watch numbers grow into bigger numbers, you need battle passes, and most importantly, you need microtransactions!!
For all intents and purposes, modern triple-A game developers do to good ideas what Netflix has done to the Witcher.
N7Greenfire just said that the creative decisions Larian are making seem to be paying off and increasing the game’s popularity, raising its profile and selling copies, which is way Larian wants in the first place.
Why you are taking that out of context and contorting his words to suggest he is saying Larian should turn BG3 into a live service game is a mystery to me.
And that's even ignoring that most of people who are buying the game on the trail of its hype-train do not even know enough about the game to have any settled opinion on its mechanics or balance.
After 500 playing hours to get from the crash site to the Goblin Camp then suffering 37 total party wipes trying to free Halsin, I dare say the appeal of watching bear sex will have dimmed somewhat. Post release, the support section here will be inundated with cries for help.
I think the general quality is very good BUT the cheap Rest/Camp System and the boring combat can kill the game for many like the Ship Combat in PoE2. Its like a Minigame inside another game and can be lead to frustration because you dont have the "Skip Button" to enjoy your Decision making, Render Videos and 17.000 endings. The plain combat presentation is like a rusty Chain segment in a maybe very good game.
This is definitely true. Problem arises when the only thing someone express is hate. I don't buy that someone actually like something when the only thing they do is pointing their finger at things.
Ok. Not sure who are you even talking about, though. Not me, since I have three years of post history on multiple boards arguing both the positives and negatives of the game.
Then again, sucking off Larian here on their home turf is not what I'm particularly interested about. We are approaching the end of it now, but the whole point of discussing the EA for me was to highlight things that need to improve.
Party control in Baldur's Gate 3 is a complete mess that begs to be addressed. SAY NO TO THE TOILET CHAIN
Lastly, I suspect those that make the most use of the genital-options here are the same demographic as those that downloaded CBBE for Skyrim. Which, incidentally is in the top ten most downloaded mods for it.
On a technical note, CBBE is just a (female) body shape. You would need a skin texture that has the genitals. I was always a UUNP man myself but there are now other body mods providing an alternative to the CBBE shape. In Skyrim male genitals are dealt with by their mods. After more than 12 years the Skyrim modding community is still very active and productive.
Argument by popularity leads to the conclusion that live services garbage is the best that gaming has to offer and One Direction is the best music. Let's please not go there.
Let's instead go have the world's best food at McDonald's.
When we're talking about a product, popularity is the only thing that matters.
When company's forget this and instead try to develope based on arbitrary ideas of what they think a consumer wants or needs they turn into modern Blizzard.
In other words, you want BG3 to become a bloated live service mess with a ton of microtransactions, because those are hella popular. Maybe add a battle royale mode too, because PUBG is so popular as well? And after all, popularity is really all that matters!1
That whole "chase popularity" nonsense is why almost every single triple-A game released is shallow and unsatisfying. They're not designed by people with a vision, they're designed to check the maximum amount of boxes to have all the popular stuff. You need "sidequests", you need "minigames", you need "exploration", you need crafting, resource gathering, survival elements, item tiers, you need some character level system so players can watch numbers grow into bigger numbers, you need battle passes, and most importantly, you need microtransactions!!
For all intents and purposes, modern triple-A game developers do to good ideas what Netflix has done to the Witcher.
Your the only one calling for live service and micro transactions, popular games dont need those.
Live service games are also an entirely diffrent genre
Heres the thing, most modern triple A games arnt chasing popularity. Devs are just making souless games based on formulas that have worked in the past.
Thats why so many triple A devs are scared of bg3. Because it's shaking up the stagnent market and showing players they don't have to settle for 1 dimensional games.
You know thinking back appealing to popularity is what killed WoW.
vanilla WoW was genius - it was uncompromising and challenging - although deeply flawed by today's standards.
Then Blizzo tried to make the game for "everybody" after a few expansions it became garbage. The difference there was you could not mod the core systems of the game until the Private server community came together and agreed on what they wanted to play was a proper game that wasn't for everyone.
Now Blizzo is stuck in a terrible cycle of making these microtransaction games that milk whales and are designed around that. Bleh. Or creating an interesting game that makes you think they have gone back to being a good gaming company then doing a bait and switch once people are invested. I am sorry, but if you buy a Blizzo game you are part of the problem. They are fundamentally untrustworthy.
The Private server community is still going strong btw.
However, WE CAN mod those systems to our hearts content. In the end, this is the only thing I have to remember.
Even if I don't agree on a decision, the multiplayer server will get together and we will take a vote and decide what core mods we want to implement and that is how we will play. (It will probably be some Hardcore rules version of the game but with variant Human - I know my people).
I don't need to buy Diablo 4 to know the game sucks. Ive seen enough videos, and what not, to know it sucks.
It's not for me, either. Then again, it'll never occur to me to head over to the Diablo 4ums to tell people that. Let those that love it, love it.
Originally Posted by Tuco
And that's even ignoring that most of people who are buying the game on the trail of its hype-train do not even know enough about the game to have any settled opinion on its mechanics or balance.
You're acting as if they should. Or even could. You do realize that you're commenting on a game you have also never played, right?
Originally Posted by Tuco
I absolutely DO NOT GIVE A SHIT about the little footnote on the official books saying "it's just a guideline"
It's actually not a footnote. It's in the introduction, where they explain how the book should be used.
Now, what if one of those poor unwitting souls buys the game, thinks to himself; 'Hmm, Beastmaster sounds fun' and it turns out it couldn't deviate from the holy book?
Argument by popularity leads to the conclusion that live services garbage is the best that gaming has to offer and One Direction is the best music. Let's please not go there.
Let's instead go have the world's best food at McDonald's.
When we're talking about a product, popularity is the only thing that matters.
When company's forget this and instead try to develope based on arbitrary ideas of what they think a consumer wants or needs they turn into modern Blizzard.
In other words, you want BG3 to become a bloated live service mess with a ton of microtransactions, because those are hella popular. Maybe add a battle royale mode too, because PUBG is so popular as well? And after all, popularity is really all that matters!1
That whole "chase popularity" nonsense is why almost every single triple-A game released is shallow and unsatisfying. They're not designed by people with a vision, they're designed to check the maximum amount of boxes to have all the popular stuff. You need "sidequests", you need "minigames", you need "exploration", you need crafting, resource gathering, survival elements, item tiers, you need some character level system so players can watch numbers grow into bigger numbers, you need battle passes, and most importantly, you need microtransactions!!
For all intents and purposes, modern triple-A game developers do to good ideas what Netflix has done to the Witcher.
N7Greenfire just said that the creative decisions Larian are making seem to be paying off and increasing the game’s popularity, raising its profile and selling copies, which is way Larian wants in the first place.
Why you are taking that out of context and contorting his words to suggest he is saying Larian should turn BG3 into a live service game is a mystery to me.
He said popularity is the only thing that matters. Live services are undeniably popular.
My point is, popular does not mean good. I'm sure we all want this game to be not just good but absolutely mind-blowingly spectacularly good. But just chasing "popularity" doesn't really lead there, does it?
By the way, Cyberpunk 2077 absolutely killed it in terms of units sold. Was that a good game, ignoring the technical issues? I would argue that it was not. Precisely because it tried to do everything and ultimately didn't do anything particularly well.
Agreed. I don't post on forums on games I dislike at least not for very long. Its why I stopped posting on the BIO boards before they even close down, and why I stopped bothering with Obsidian forums. Those companies no longer make games I wanna play. I don't have time to waste on them. I'll criticitize BG3 because it looks like it be fun, but I hope they won't ignore me and will add things I like which I doubt they will. Since they know they have my money so I don't matter in terms of that. L0L
Argument by popularity leads to the conclusion that live services garbage is the best that gaming has to offer and One Direction is the best music. Let's please not go there.
Let's instead go have the world's best food at McDonald's.
It's also almost revoltingly disingenuous as an argument.
"a lot of people bought it anyway". So fucking what? I bought it as well. Three years ago. That doesn't make me blind to the things the game handles poorly, nor it bars me from commenting on them.
And that's even ignoring that most of people who are buying the game on the trail of its hype-train do not even know enough about the game to have any settled opinion on its mechanics or balance. Not to mention the ones that aren't simply equipped with enough knowledge of the genre to comment on it, to begin with.
Agreed. I don't post on forums on games I dislike at least not for very long. Its why I stopped posting on the BIO baords before they even clsoe down, and why I stopped bothering with Obsidian forums. Those companies no longer make games I wanna play. I don't have time to waste on them. I'll criticitize BG3 because it looks like it be fun, but I hope they won't ignore me and will add things I like which I doubt they will. Since they know they have my money so I don't matter in terms of that. L0L
They'll add thing which they think the majority of the consumer base will like, including wild and untamed bear dongs.
Now, what if one of those poor unwitting souls buys the game, thinks to himself; 'Hmm, Beastmaster sounds fun' and it turns out it couldn't deviate from the holy book?
They could mod the game and cheat their way to some immediate gratification and convenience as much as they want.
This is an officially licensed product, not the friendly table in your backyard. That's what you would be supposed to do when you don't want to stick to the official rules, to begin with, not what you should be forced to do if you want to play by them.
Party control in Baldur's Gate 3 is a complete mess that begs to be addressed. SAY NO TO THE TOILET CHAIN
the only good and bad things I genuinely care about are the ones according to my taste.
Well Larian didn't make the game specifically for you and this close to release the design choices are final. It's time to accept or move on. This is too large of a game to expect Larian to listen to each and every one of your issues. Ultimately they had to do what they thought was best for the game even if you disagree and don't like it. No game is ever made for one person...especially not one as large as BG3. If you went into EA expecting everything to be changed to your specific tastes, you had the wrong idea.
Well Larian didn't make the game specifically for you
Yeah, but my perspective is the one from which I'm commenting, the one I care for. You all can keep repeating that "most people won't mind" until blue in the face and it will STILL make absolutely no difference in my low level of care.
Not to mention that subjectivity is typically implied among normally-functioning human beings and shouldn't need to be stressed every two comments. But I digress.
Party control in Baldur's Gate 3 is a complete mess that begs to be addressed. SAY NO TO THE TOILET CHAIN
This is an officially licensed product, not the friendly table in your backyard.
This is my backyard. I love it. Notice the friendly table. It's the wooden thing in the middle. So many games I was allowed to play there. He's so friendly.
But, you know what. You're right. I will bow before your wisdom. They made such a bad call fixing the Ranger. What were they thinking? Thank you for this enlightenment, oh Tuco the Everchosen.
![[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]](https://i.imgur.com/8OzAGRw.jpeg)