Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - General Why the nerfs were made (speculation? or fact)

I just want to remind ya that the racial bonuses never made sense in the first place. If they did humans, the best wizard and sorcerer race in the lore would have a +2 int and +2 cha.

Theres other weird stuff like gith not getting +2 int eventhough they are multidimensional raiders who love to consume new knowledge.

For all we know Larian wasn’t permitted to comment on it because WoTC wants to control how all the news comes out. Then again I’ve been saying the changes were mandated by WoTC ever since I first heard about them.

I didn't appreciate the youtuber's "anti woke" comments but he's largely correct. This is coming from WotC and not Larian. 6e is shaping up to be the most generic version of DnD to date.

That doesn't mean we shouldn't ask Larian to make it an optional feature and to retain 5e version. I suspect they have some pull and WotC knows that fans are upset after OGL kerfuffle.

I want to be able to play a gold dwarf - to be born a twin to be better spoken and have less rugged features that mountain dwarf kin.

And half elves were the quintessential adventuring species. It makes sense that someone that would always feel an outsider in either an elven or a human community would chose to forge their own path trough life and chose a life of danger over a life of comfort.

You think WotC would have learned its lesson after the 4e fiasco : don't take away things players like.

There was maybe 1 13 AC light armor in the underdark that had no other redeeming qualities. It was better to have quality robes and mage armor up. If your point is that it is good that after 20+ hours into the game you may start finding things that make your profeciencies useful, then you win your point. I don't think that is an appropriate amount of time though.

There are a handful of helmets and other bits and bobs that are better than an empty slot, but they aren't built to be caster friendly.

The shield is a better bonus than light armor, and it is good to have for casters since they don't need a free hand to cast spells. It would have been nice if there was a finesse weapon or two to go with it rather than armor that only 2 classes don't have access to (both of which have a better option from a level 1 spell).

They arnt taking any of it away though, just redesigning systems.

Everything and more is still there.

The video is just misleading.

We can just sit One DnD or 6e or however it is called out and wait for the next one after that or just continue to play 5e.
But I agree with everything you said .

They are taking it away. Yes I now have WotC's permission to make a half-troll / half-dwarf (as if we needed that permission) and I could go back the 3.5 sourcebooks and recreate a gold dwarf from those sources.

But WotC is all but announcing that they are not going to develop any gold dwarf story lines. If I want to play gold dwarf I need to use old books and just expect that my existence as a gold dwarf will not be acknowledged in video games, supplements and, well, anywhere but at my own table.

Which makes me curious to see what systems emerge out of the ORC license since WotC keeps bound and determined to screw up Faerun.

Thanks. You're right - this might be another 4e moment. We can pass on 6e / OneDnD and hope that they repair the damage in 7e.

You can still play a gold dwarf. Purely cultural subraces like mountain and gold dwarfs can be done in backgrounds.
If there's an actual biological difference like with the elves they still get rules splitting them.

Why I do not play modern D&D anymore. I am sensitively touched and harmed by WOTC, Hasbro and Mattel's decisions.

As I predicted since the beginning of EA, Larian DOES NOT have free reign on their game. WOTC really pulling the strings. And we can expect what Larian did is in line with future D&D rules.

Pathfinder rules all the way. Or anything Monte Cook.

What never made sense is that stats are capped at 20, leading to the truly mindblowing idea that a 40 pound gnome with 20 strength is as strong as a 250 pound dragonborn with 20 strength. Take that away and the ASIs make plenty of sense.

And please do remember that "best wizard and sorcerer race" is something you've decided based on the end of the journeys that those arcane types went on, not the start of it. Humans tend to get there, in part because there's just a lot more of them, and in part because they're often crazier than most other races in terms of breaking rules and taking chances to achieve their goal.

There are both magical and cultural differences. Magically, gold dwarves are usually born as twins and their features are less rugged. Culturally they have experienced less loss, endured fewer atrocities at the hands of monsters than other dwarven communities and thus more inclined to resolve conflicts with diplomacy instead of battle.

(slightly off topic - I prefer to think in terms of magical differences instead of biological ones. I don't believe that things like DNA, genes and the like exist in Faerun)

I get that 6e is going for a pizza shop model for species but if I'm going to design my own species I'll do that in my homebrew world. If I'm going to play a video game in Faerun I want to play one the races of Faerun.

True, this is possible. Might even be probable, at least until the game is released. But it would seem odd to me that Larian wouldn't even be able to tell why the 5E races are gone in their D&D 5E game even after they've launched the game.

Mystra explicitly favors humans though.

From her lovers and chosen being almost entirely human, I think there was about one half elf chosen, to the sorcerer daughters she chose to birth being humans as well.

No matter how you slice it humans not being able to get +2 in in int or cha is just doesn't fit with the lore.

Take another example, Drow, known mainly for their evil clerics/evil church can't get even a measly +1 wis. Not to mention Drizzt one of the most popular characters of the franchise, a ranger, can't get his +1 wis either.

The old asi are a gamey relic of the past. Limiting character builds and ideas in a game where character builds and ideas are the main focus is silly.

To be frank, I don't give a damn about what WotC wants, for all I care they can burn in hell. I'll just ignore the crap they want to turn D&D into and either stick to my 5E books or go back to AD&D 2nd edition.
I only hope that all of this nonsense won't taint other RPGs and future D&D editions.



How long will you continue that nonsensical claim?
The human dominance in the lore has NOTHING to do with having any genetic disposition (that's what racial are in D&D, at least in older editions) and everything to do with humans being ambitious and more populous than the older races (elves, gnomes, etc).

And please stop trying to sell anyone that the +2/+1 stat progression is a straight up buff when it's not. It only makes race choice less impactful and everyone mostly the same within a given class.

I'm not sure you're trying hard enough to argue your point in good faith.

For instance most of those wizards and sorcerers are far into their adventuring careers, and many of those careers span the editions.

What the appropriate stat modifiers for Githyanki are can't really be determined until psionics has rules again. Should they get +1 to intelligence, or charisma? Maybe Wisdom, maybe just the Githzerai get wisdom, from the eons conquering Limbo, you know, the way magic and your environment can determine your physical and mental development.

Mystra is bored out of her skull and human craziness is fun to behold. No matter what happens, they improvise, they adapt, and they overcome. And they do so without losing their potential in any particular discipline.

Humans not getting +2 in any stat fits perfectly, because the average human is not that special, and even the special humans aren't usually born as special Mary Sues, they have to take a bumpy path to get there. That's what the stat bonus shows, the beginning of the journey rather than the end of it.

That said, I'm not at all convinced that 5E does a particularly good job at representing the diversity of life in D&D. But making everything more generic is not an improvement, IMO.

The god of the weave was a human and openly favors them. Also she has 7 human daughters who have had the last 700 years to pass on their genes. Not to mention all the borderline godlike mages that we know for a fact have been passing their genes, like Elminster.

And not to mention the drow example again.

I bet if someone wanted to write about the scores of gnome and elf lovers Mystra has had, your tune would change. Humans dominate most of the lands, in-universe by virtue of being the most populous, and out of universe by virtue of being the easiest fantasy cultures to write about.

Sure? But untill then we gotta roll with the lore we have.


I know tons of people roll for stats on tt so it doesnt matter as much there, but i'm glad Larian is letting us finally play accurate human in game.

Seeing a Gnome have more int than Gale, who is basically second only to Elminster, really wrecks the immersion.