Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - General Most Popular Class&Race by Larian!

I think the racial diversity would have been better if they had left the 5e racial modifiers alone. Right now the racial bonuses do not create enough racial choice division and so people go with what they know.

I’m glad Larian disagreed with you. Who cares what the general diversity of chosen races across the player base is? This way people can just play what they want.

This is not really true. Sure the ASIs being wide open make all races at least somewhat viable for all classes but that's really not the end-all be-all...it's not even the half of it. The racial proficiencies and bonuses create an enormous division if you look at the right races. If you're looking at humans or dragonborn you will see nothing there that merits much consideration. But then if you look at wood elves for Rogues with the stealth and perception proficiencies as well as the extra movement speed, Half Orcs with Relentless Endurance and Savage Attacks for barbarians, etc. There is A LOT more to consider there than ASIs.

Shadowheart also is my tank. The best tank. Amazing tank. Not just AC but with Spirit Guardians / Glyph of Warding.

If I can find a chokepoint in fights, Shadowheart is in the choke point and everyone else behind. Lae'zell goes in after mobs have pulled into the Spirit Guardians / picks off mobs that have exited it and has polearm expert so extra attacks on the mobs trying to break past shadowheart and go after the backline.

Double caster or caster main & astarion behind picking things off with ranged.

If they did that then the unpopular classe2 would be even more unpopular because the majority only want to play with +2 CHA stat. So Drow and High Elves would simply be more popular, all the other races would have fewer players.

You can actually make a Gith play any class, also the proficiency ability to a whole ability's skills is very nice, you could do this on a Gith caster, or melee or any class.

People aren't playing them because they don't like them. If they were still stuck to +2 Str, +1 Int racial lock, even fewer people would be playing them.

In TT DnD the latest available statistic says:

The most popular D&D races in D&D Beyond in 2020:

Human
Half-Elf
Dragonborn
Tiefling
Half-Orc

The older one:



So, maybe you are right and popularity of half-elves grows. But I suspect for video-games the appearance matters more. No matter the bonuses, shorties in any videogame is in minority, and if half-elves have bonuses of full-elves (they do) - they always vin over the pure races.

Humans are popular when its the variant human - free feat at level 1, more skill(s) (points), +1 each stat.

We don't have that in BG3.

Actually in EA wasn't human the popular race, and Larian put out a post saying most players are boring with racial selection? The reason for the stat change was to equalize the races so players would also play the others.

Half Elves / High Elves are popular for the extra cantrip. Drow are popular for the superior darkvision and faerie fire clickie. The darkness one is rather meh.

If you gave humans a free feat at level 1, two stats +2 instead of +2, +1, and 2 extra skill proficiencies, they would become the most popular race again.

I am seriously considering making a Gith Eldritch Knight that is red with black markings.

She will be my Sithyanki.

I would expand what you have indicated to say face classes aren't just about persuasion, but about a great many other aspects, including Insight, Knowledge, Animal Handling, and even Perception, Survival, and Sleight of Hand, making them the main character for every possible interaction with people, animals, and things. It's actually hard to build a Knowledge Cleric that isn't a good Face, or INTERface, if you will, for everything. You can go with Soldier for Athletics + Intimidation (or Charlatan or Criminal for Deception + a DEX-based skill) and Persuasion as a Class Proficiency, then gain all WIS Proficiencies (perhaps taking Actor at 4th Level to get Expertise in Deception and Performance). Or you could go with an Urchin (for interaction with things) and Insight as a Class Proficiency, then gain all CHA Proficiencies. You just maximize the number of proficiencies you have in either CHA or WIS and use the Class Ability to get Proficiency for all skills of the attribute you neglected. It works with every race, too. Your Elf might be better off neglecting CHA Proficiencies (because they already get Perception) and using the class feature to gain proficiency with all CHA-based skills, while your Human would benefit more by putting their extra proficiency in a CHA skill other than Persuasion (along with a background that gives you a CHA Proficiency other than Persuasion) and take Persuasion and a Knowledge as a Class Proficiency and all WIS-based skills as the Class Ability. Even Rock Gnomes work fine, letting you start with Expertise in 3 different Knowledges and using the technique I just described. A Bard or Rogue designed specifically for social interaction can be better at the CHA-based skills, but they are not as effective with the other skill tests that often matter. Paladin, Sorcerer, and Warlock can only compete if they spend their Proficiencies to get something close to what a Knowledge Cleric can get with no effort (and they still only get 4 Proficiencies, plus 1 or 2 for race). The Knowledge Cleric Class Ability to gain 3 (DEX-based), 4 (CHA-based) or 5 (WIS-based) Proficiencies *in addition to* the 4-6 they start with just makes them an easier choice. You don't have to force it at all.

My Githyanki Soldier Knowledge Cleric (the least popular race and class combo, lol) has 10 STR, 18 DEX (once I got the gloves), 16 CON, 17 INT (with warped headband of intellect), 16 WIS, 16 CHA (after taking Actor). She's good in combat with shortsword & shield or light crossbow; expert in Religion, History, Deception, and Performance; and Proficient in everything except Investigation. You can't get that kind of coverage with your traditional face characters and even a Bard who takes Expertise in two CHA-based skills is not significantly better (if they are better at all) because of all the other tests that are not based on CHA (and Deception, Intimidation, and Persuasion are often redundant dialog choices anyway). Only a Githyanki Bard can match it, though that build makes the Jack-of-all-Trades Class Ability pretty weak. Warlocks, Sorcerers, and Paladins, even Githyanki ones, are worse.

Also, although you declared "end of story," I think you are wrong. A Shield Dwarf gets Darkvision (which you don't need if you have a camp wizard to cast Darkvision on anyone who doesn't have it like I do), Medium Armor, some STR-based martial weapons, and Dwarven Resilience (Resistance/Advantage against Poison). You would benefit from Medium Armor and Dwarven Resilience from being a Wizard, which is nice because you can get a 17 AC with 14 DEX and decent armor and still have 14 CON and 16 INT, plus a 12 somewhere else that doesn't matter much. A Human gets Light Armor + Shield and a Proficiency Bonus, plus some other crap; you can get an 17 AC with 14 DEX and decent armor and a shield (with an upside if you increase your DEX even further) and get a proficiency in anything, which is pretty good when you have so few to start with. That matches up reasonably well. But a Dwarf is slow, so Human > Shield Dwarf. Gold Dwarf Wizard would have better hp but worse AC, so it's even worse than a Shield Dwarf. Same for Sorcerer except Shield Proficiency works with a Draconic Sorcerer, so Human >> Dwarf. In either case, increasing STR to higher than DEX is generally going to result in a less effective character because DEX is more important if you aren't wearing Heavy Armor, you don't want to dump CON, you need a good INT or CHA, and you probably don't want to dump WIS. There just isn't much room for a decent STR-based Wizard or Sorcerer build (unless you cheese out with INT as a dump stat for a Wizard and used the Warped Headband of Intellect).

Moving up the armor ladder to lightly armored classes, Shield + Proficiency in anything > Medium Armor + Dwarven Resilience + Slow. A human's Proficiency Bonus will not be quite as interesting for a Rogue because they may have "enough" so you get diminishing returns, but Medium Armor is not going to be desirable, either, because you typically want a DEX higher than 14, so Light Armor is just as good as Medium and a Shield + Proficiency is at least as good as Dwarven Resilience and +1 hp/level (I think it's actually better), plus a Dwarf is Slow. Human > Dwarf.

For Medium and Heavy Armor Classes, Human Proficiency in anything > Dwarven Resilience & Slow, but a Gold Dwarf is arguably about the same power level as a Human; depending on how important you think +1 hp is compared to being slower, reasonable minds could differ. In my estimation, a Human is always better than a Dwarf. That's far from "Dwarves are better, case closed."

So I just used gale for the first time in combat. The Halsim portal. And I learned that Wizards are crapo.

Sorc can move cloudkill and cast fireball or icestorm on the same turn. Wizard can't.

But so far its just that damn portal fight that needed maximum pew pew pew to beat.

I noticed that, too. I think there should be some adjustments for a couple classes that take into account the changed rules. My biggest gripe is that the 4 least popular races all lost racial abilities they had in 5e and got nothing in return. Rock Gnome lost Tinker (a big one) and Dwarves lost Tool Proficiency and Stonecunning (and have the added insult of Humans and Half-Elves being better with Armor/Shield than Gold Dwarves). Githyanki need their Psionic Resistance back, which they had in 5e.

For classes, I'm more inclined to think they should make the least popular (Cleric) more interesting without making them stronger. Like drop and Armor Proficiency down a level for some in exchange for a Proficiency (or drop Knowledge Cleric to No Armor and give them Expertise in 3 Knowledges instead of 2); drop Nature Cleric to Medium Armor (you still have some other Clerics that can wear Heavy if that's the draw) in exchange for a free proficiency in either Animal Handling, Nature, or Survival, with the other two as options; and drop Trickery Cleric to Light Armor in exchange for a free proficiency in either Deception, Sleight of Hand, or Stealth, with the other two as options. Players would then put some thought into whether they want to go with a lighter more skilled Cleric or a heavier less skilled Cleric (and you would feel like you were getting something out of the Medium Armor Proficiency of a Githyanki or Shield Dwarf).

Even though Wizards are not the least popular class, I think they are most deserving of an actual power increase. Clerics are powerful enough; they just aren't as interesting as they could be. Wizards are weak because they kind of stood still in a game that made Sorcerer better. They have the added burden of relying on the worst attribute (INT), which for some reason didn't seem quite as bad in TTRPG because you could be the smart one of the group, but with limited Knowledge rolls and no option for using INT in a creative manner, Wizards feel like less than they were in BG3. I'd just straight-up bump their power level (with no tradeoff) by adding Arcane Foci that let you do things depending on the type of Arcane Focus. Like a Wand that allows you to invest a 1st Level Spell of your School (or higher Level Spell at higher Level) and cast 1/Long Rest, an Orb that gives you Proficiency (or Expertise if you are already Proficient) in Arcana, a Crystal that allows you to replenish Spell Slots with a Short Rest kind of like Arcane Recovery but for free, a Staff that allows you to swap prepared spells as a Bonus Action 1/Short Rest (you can already swap between spells outside of combat, so this would be a cool thing that only Wizards could do in combat), a Rod that lets you add your Proficiency Bonus to Concentration (or twice your Proficiency Bonus if you already can add Proficiency Bonus), a Material Component Pouch that lets you cast any Spell you Know 1/Long Rest, and stuff like that (and Swap Arcane Foci after a Long Rest if you can find others during the adventure). I think it would be a mistake to try to make Wizards compete head-on with the Sorcerer's metamagic, but giving them more spell flexibility or spellcasting "endurance" seems like a good way to go. You could also let Wizards learn an additional Spell of their School when they get access to a new spell level instead of having to add a scroll spell to their spellbook at a discount, especially considering Clerics and Druids know all their spells each time they get a new level of spells.

I think Larian actually knew Wizards needed something extra because in EA they allowed Wizards to learn spells from any Class if they found the scroll, but removed the option because of player feedback. I kind of agree with the feedback regarding that particular ability, but Larian didn't replace it with anything.

Wizards are normally my favourite class, but INT is useless outside of being their DC stat in this game.

Sorcs are just OP - I made a mistake though of taking the spell crit feat at level 8 instead of ignore poison resistance.

However people saying that humans are weak, I just found a reason for them towards the end of Act 2. The big bad boss drops a +1 spell DC shield. Non human casters lack shield proficiency and I can't change my race, but its ok for now as I can pass it to Wyll or Jaheira.

I recruited Jaheria so was forced to use her for the mind flayer pit, and found out druids are actually good for spellcasters. No fireball but call lightning and moon beam are ok, the problem is all their good attack spells are concentration based so you can only use 1 at a time. I plopped down two level 5 slot firewalls on the Mrykyl boss and he just melted.

But now I need to find a dead animal to raise into a spore thing. I made Jaheira a spore druid mainly for double cloudkill, and halsim a moon one.

I have the acid arrow staff on my sorc still and poisoner robe, gloves and cape. which removes two +1 DC items in the chest and gloves slots, but I handed them to Jaheira instead of using medium armour and the +1 ranged spell DC fire staff and +1 DC shield. Mega double firewalls or cloudkills. Also the fireball staff adds fire bolt cantrip, and it works off Wisdom instead of Int for Jaheira, plus the elemental infusion ring so +1d4 fire damage on top of shillegah when not using spell slots.

Yep. I've been saying humans are no longer weak because of the Shield Proficiency, but I still don't like it because shield proficiency for humans and half-elves is not thematically appropriate, especially considering Dwarves don't get it. Wood Half-Elves are still better than humans because they get the Shield, too, but the 3 most popular races also happen to be the best for the 4 most popular classes (plus Wizard). I don't think that is a coincidence. In my opinion, you can achieve the best synergy of race and class with only 3 races: Wood Elf, Wood Half-Elf, and Half-Orc.