Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback Hill Giant Strength Potions

I can't help but feel like these potions undermine builds. They last until a long rest and are pretty easy to get. I could have my character use one after every long rest, which would always give me a strength of 21.

If I build a strength fighter, for most of the game, I'm better off using a strength potion. My own strength doesn't matter.

If I build a dex fighter, I'm basically better off using a strength potion.

If I build a pact of the blade warlock, I'm better off using a strength potion.

--it's the abundance of these potions that's the problem. Or the length of time they last. Either way, but both together just amounts to too much, imo, and sullies build decisions.

I agree, at least you can only have one potion active at a time so it doesn't get too crazy, and having it active until a Short Rest should probably be the limit rather than Long Rest. Potions are fairly easy to get or make so having a shorter duration just makes more sense and makes potions more valuable.

I got, like, 7 in a single playthrough and I still haven't used 5 of them sparing them for better times.
At little less than 400 golds a pop they don't exactly come as cheap and convenient to abuse without a single worry.

I'm also NOT planning to use them on fighters and so on (which reached STR 20 anyway over time) when the time comes, but on characters like Shadowheart, who could really benefit from a temporary boost in martial prowess.

Why the duration increase I wonder. With spells the trend has been duration nerf.

Can't say I like the focus on consumables that lowers the worth of class abilities. I didn't craft much of anything other than healing potions so I don't know how many giant strength potions you could make.

Because it's a game in real-time without pause (and without an actual time cycle/clock, too), so everything that is meant to be of a certain duration (1 hour or so) has been automatically extended "until next rest" to spare the players the anxiety of "having to do shit really fast" to not waste their most expensive potions.

So in Baldur's gate 1-2 the space bar was pause so you could set up everyone with their actions. BG3 we have Turn base mode (click the hourglass to activate anytime for use.) which has been used for quite a few things and events in game.
So you don't have to do things really fast. so for potions they should last 10 turns due to turn base mode. This would make players be a bit more conscious of when and where to use stuff and make them more tactful in their game play.

Potions of STR in D&D are supposed to last one hour, not 10 turns:

https://roll20.net/compendium/dnd5e/Potion%20of%20Giant%20Strength#content

One hour is pretty far from "until next Long Rest". Short Rest should also end it.

Is one hour actually that far from "until next long rest" in BG3 though? How often do players spend more than an hour of real time exploring, after you subtract time spent in combat, dialogue, or in loading screens (where time is effectively frozen)?

I think the issue is they are just way to plentiful. Shouldn't be able to have one through pretty much every part of the game lol.

Yeah, but we already talked about that part, too, didn't we?

It's my previous reply.

but yeah, generally speaking I'd be fine with Short rest also being a limitation for an Elixir duration, eventually.

There are way more than seven of them. As for the price, I'd have to go check the actual price, but it's lower than 400, probably by half.

It's an issue.

Eh, sure. There are as many as you want, IF you keep purchasing them.

I don't know, but I haven't used them once so far. They are sitting there for bad times ( only the ones, I found), but I didn't really needed them.
I don't really see this as an issue.

The issue, as I see it, is that this item -- *if utilized, as with any item* -- undermines every martial class build. It's not even like a wearable item that takes a slot on a character, causing them to miss out on some other vital piece of gear. It does, of course, mean you can't use another elixer, but that's not a significant downside.

Clearly, folks can choose not to use the potions, but I don't think that's necessarily relevant to the issue. The point is that there's an item in the game that can be used after every single long rest, which completely negates the prime stat build of every single martial class in the game.

And as Tuco pointed out, it costs gold to use. But if someone wants to build a character relying on those potions- why not? I personally would never dump the main stat of a class, but if people feel comfortable doing that, who am I to tell them, they shouldn't.

I feel like there's a disconnect between what I'm saying and some of the responses.

I'm not talking about dumping the stat. Even if you max your attack stat, the potion is immediately better, and that remains true for a large portion of the game.

If a player/character is purposefully avoiding using something it means it likely too powerful because they feel it's a 'cheat'. The suggestion to 'just not use it' is a cop out and actually reflects poorly on the game design. That said, bg3 is far from the first game in the series to have 'cheesy items'. *cough* Bg2 *cough* lol

Any STR-based martial class is goin to want their main stat at 20 by the time they take their second feat.
Which in practical terms is exactly the same than the 21 offered by the potion.

Or in case they’ll pick another feat before, they’ll sit at 18 with the potion basically providing a +1.

Using these potions comes as a SIGNIFICANT money sink, too.

And they are ordinary D&D consumable that Larian didn’t exactly invent on the spot.
They just extended the duration to “until rest” as they did for everything else lasting more than a bunch of turns in the game.

I genuinely don’t understand what the fuss is even about. This reminds me the reactions some of you had during EA with the “incredibly overpowered” circle of intellect.

An item that according to WOTC DM guide ranks as “uncommon” and a suitable reward for level 2-4.

Except the objection was never “don’t use it”.

There’s absolutely no issue with using it if you are content with burning cash to match a certain standard of effectiveness, rather that get there more gradually.

And if you think smoking 300-400 golds on a single-use consumable is way too cheap to the point of “feeling like a cheat” I’m not sure what to tell you.

Incidentally there are arguably more powerful elixirs in the game even for martial classes. The one that refund your action after every kill comes to mind.

1. So a lot of martial classes don't get an equivalent attack score until level 8. Which is pretty far into the game.

2. The "significant" cost being referenced is not significant. It doesn't touch the fortune my party has amassed, at any rate. And that's only talking about the ones that have to be purchased, as opposed to found or stolen.

3. I don't particularly care about what items were or weren't invented for the game.

4. It's the abundance of the items coupled with the way they last until a long rest. In other words, all the time.

5. The dex based fighter/ranger/monk/whatever doesn't even have to bother using their main stat for 8 levels of a 12 level game.

6. The pact of the blade warlock is using strength instead of charisma in melee for the first 8 levels of the game.

7. The headband of intellect is not the same. It takes a head slot which is a very valuable resource that could be used otherwise. It also happens to get the score *equal* to what a starting character could get, and can be surpassed in the first 4 levels. It's not even close to a valid comparison. (The opportunity cost of an elixer is nowhere near the same.)

8. It's just a bad design. Whether that bad design stems from Larian or DnD is irrelevant, in my opinion.

The Headband of intellect used to set int to 18. It was nerfed to 17 because people whined that in EA it used to make raising int irrelevant for a mage… which is in fact a stupid argument, since you don’t want to go all the way to the endgame with a low int Wizard only because you had what’s broadly considered a crutch-item in the beginning.

And head slots arre not “extremely valuable “ at all. It takes a whole lot before you start to see items of some significance there. I had my barbarian sitting on a “+3 m movement” until Act 3 or so, because there weren’t really that many better options.

To this day I still have half of my party wearing borderline pointless stuff in that slot just to not have it unused.

But that’s beside the point. It doesn’t change the fact that popping almost 400 gold PER-character on a daily basis only to get a +1 in their main attribute is absolutely NOT what I’d describe as cheap or money-effective.

Especially since ALL THAT AMAZING GOLD your party saved doesn’t even cover for a fraction of the ACTUAL good shit for sale by the time the player hits Act 3.

Okay, Tuco.

If you are a Dex based fighter/ranger/monk, you would get nothing out of the elixier apart from maybe a higher carrying capacity and the bladelock can use their charisma stat right when they get their subclass, so again, why would they need a strength elixier? You don't play half of the game with the wrong stats and then change your playstyle completely.

That bladelock is going to build 8 strength, then drink the potion and have 21 strength, and use their strength stat for all attacking and damage rolls because it's higher than their charisma, which was at best only 17.
They aren't playing with the wrong stats, they're playing with extra stats. They don't WANT to use their charisma, it's not high enough in face of the potion.. They'll still build charisma, for their spells, but they'll use strength for their melee.
It's not a comparison between a bladelock who built strength and one who didn't, it's a comparison between two bladelocks who made strength a dump stat, but one has 21 anyway, and that one will outperform the other.
Rather than progressing their melee effectiveness by raising their Cha at levels 4 & 8, they'll be level 1 with level 8 effectiveness using strength, and neglect to use their charisma until it's already 20.
Same for the monk and ranger with dex. Anyone doing melee can use str. It has no impact on their playstyle, only what stat is used for the rolls while using the same playstyle.

Likewise you'll have barbarians that dump strength, build up dex and con instead, then have 21 strength anyway.
All that extra unarmored defense in return for one little potion per long rest? Time to trivialize tactical difficulty

As The Old Soul says above.

The way the game works is that the weapon attack/damage uses the highest score. A dex based fighter using finesse weapons will still *default* to the strength score if it is higher than the dex score. Same with the pact of the blade warlock. It's just the game mechanic.

So a dex based fighter using the potion doesn't actually use dex until around level 8. And then the dex is just equal to what the strength has been the whole time.

The entire point is that the potions undermine the martial builds. They're abundant. They're long lasting. They're easy to get. And they're not expensive. No one's saying every character has to use them after every long rest, but having one character use them consistently breaks the basic fundamentals of the character build.

I played barbarian and NO, I fucking wouldn't. Because the last thing I want is to play a game in this genre and being expected to waste hundreds of coins at-a-pop every time I decide to rest for whatever reason.
And that's assuming one uses just ONE martial character, otherwise you can multiply the money sink.

Especially because in the early game running out of resources is comparatively trivial (hello, TWO spell slots!) and far more frequent. "Potion of strength" or not.

You are all getting a hang-up over a completely fictional issue.
What would be the "best practice" you are suggesting as alternative? Having the potion locked behind an ACTUAL real-time countdown of 60 minutes, in a game where everything else isn't and time outside of the occasional turn-based encounter isn't even a concept?

And the consequent benefit? You'd be actively encouraging the player to:

1) skip dialogues as fast as possible to maximize effectiveness
2) avoid any sort of inventory management to not waste 30 minutes out of these 60 looking at your bags
3) to actively save and QUIT the game if they get a phone call or are forced to a pause for whatever other reason.

...for what gain, exactly? Not having that hour extended to, say, two or three at most? From 18 to 21 STR it's a PLUS 1.

I mean, it's not like it can't be done, but at some point you need to ask yourselves "Why am I even bothered by this pointless bullshit?"
Are you actually going to pop a potion daily, every rest, for each character, until you get to level 8 or so?


Some of you, the same people who were far more dismissive about far more serious gameplay issues in the past, too.

JandK is the same guy who in the previous episodes:
- defended the horrendous chain system and the lack of control over your characters while exploring in real time as if they were some endearing, quirky quality of the game.
- didn't think a reaction/interrupt system would benefit the game and advocated for its entire omission from the game ("Just get rid of counter-spell, I don't care" was more or less the exact quote).
- still thinks that HULK-tier six-meters shove as a bonus action is a great addition to the game's flow.

but now he's incredibly concerned because a CANONICAL D&D consumable has its duration marginally altered.

Tuco, can you take it down a notch? Seriously, what is wrong with you? You're on the constant verge of having an aneurysm.

Is it really that hard to understand that other people might have an issue with something you don't, or that they don't have an issue with something you do?

There are more solutions under the sky than the "60 minutes" silliness you proposed above. But it's just not worth discussing with you. You've got problems that seem to go beyond these forums.

And ps... there's nothing wrong with the chain system, which millions of people seem to be able to play with just fine. Shove works fine and has for a long, long time, as I mentioned before. And the reactions, while a nice addition, were not necessary "or the game will be broken beyond repair and the sky will forever fall on the rest of tomorrows," which was more or less your quore.

I said, "Okay, Tuco" in a post above to attempt to agree to disagree with you. Leave it at that.

Nah, I'm not.
It's called "projecting".

And most of them to dislike it.
I mean, I can "play with it just fine" as well. Hell, given that it's not my first minute around past Larian games as well, chances are I'm better than you at using it effectively.
I'm just not under the delusion that this is enough to make it a good system.

Okay, Tuco.

I think it's pretty low impact, there are no giants in the game so to make the potions you have to buy the parts, and since it takes three I have never been able to make them. And on your characters that it would be useful for, like karlach, it's essentially a plus one attack and damage bonus which isn't a lot. I guess it's strong on shadowheart but let's face it you probably aren't using her in melee anyway as she only gets one attack per round unless you are doing a melee multiclass, which is unadvisable as she doesn't have the stats for it and there are not enough potions for her to always be juiced up.

I know no one who played like this. It isn't even necessary to do that. You get well through the content with your normal stats.
And if people want to waste all their hard earned money on those potions instead on the really nice stuff, you can buy, well then let them. I don't play like that and as I said, most people I know, don't play like that either.

Honestly the main thing I'm getting from this thread is that some of you are long resting ridiculously often.

These potions are abundant.
You can give your martial character(s) free 21 strength every long rest and get all the way from start through act 2, if not also all the way through act 3, without ever buying a single potion.
You won't need to. There's far too many you'll just loot, and the few extras you'll make after looting the ingredients.

The only way you could manage to make using these potions seem like you're wasting too much gold, is if you long rest after literally every fight, maybe even sprinkling some cases of doing half a fight, fleeing, resting, then going back.
And doing that with a party of 4 melee's instead of using any casters or archers.

My first tactician run is definitely going to be an 8 strength barbarian because I know I'll be able to potion my way through the entire game without buying a single one.
And I won't be the first person to have done it.
Because we'll actually do multiple fights in one day like you're bloody supposed to.

The money argument is just ridiculous on its face. There are so many of these potions and even if you buy them, they don't even dent the party's wealth. I'm having a hard time even taking that seriously.

Make them last a hundred turns, maybe. Make them as scarce as some of the other elixirs. Something.

As a player, I personally don't want to use them because I'd prefer to rely on my actual stats, but I feel ridiculous in every combat knowing I have so many of them sitting around. It really makes me feel like my stat choices are obsolete.

It's just a bad item due to the abundance and long lasting nature. This is blatant and obvious.

I mean, sure, I could probably finish the entire game only with autoattack and cantrips, if I hated fun and tried hard enough.

I went through the entirety of EA without even "discovering" Astarion was a vampire spawn, once.

Ok, JandK.

There is SOME vague truth in the absurd claim, incidentally.
I wouldn't say the item itself is BAD, but yeah. It's at least a SUBPAR option when I can fill my "elixir slot" with something far more valuable that a bland +1 STR proficiency I can obtain natively with ASI.
Like an Elixir of Bloodlust giving me 5 temporary hitpoints per turn AND refunding my action once per turn after every kill (absolutely trivial to achieve, as a big beefy barbarian).

Bloodlust is an example of an elixir that exists in moderation. There are far fewer of these throughout the game, which is a good thing.

Yeah, i just checked: I have 5 elixirs of Hill Giant in inventory after using probably one or two in total so far.
Meanwhile I have 2 elixirs of bloodlust unused, but guess what, enough reagents to craft 5 more. The game also puts the average price of the latter below the former (for whatever weird reason, because it's clearly more valuable).

That aside, imagine taking seriously any attempt to leverage the argument "We have too much money anyway!"
...said with a straight face, too, when you reach the third act and the city and there's a WHOLE COLLECTION of items on sale often ranging between 8 and 20K EACH one, all far from negligible trash and that are absolutely worth buying if they fit your build(s).

Chances are no one will ever have enough for everything, let alone money to WASTE for minor benefits over temporary consumable.

I don't like the abundance of 21 Strength potions, 17 Int Headbands or 18 Dex gloves for the single reason that they override character stats. Character stats should always matter.

That said, the potions are fine if they had their duration cut and made less abundant. Gulping a potion and throwing someone is a valid move. Fun, even. But it should be about tactical use of a limited resource, not a persistent chained effect that affects character builds.

1) The solution is to make the potions far more rare or tone them down to potions of Strength (18). The game is already way too easy.

It's a problem if the best thing you can do as a STR character is start with 8 STR instead of 18 and just give up your elixir slot (really not a big deal) to just be a super-strong character... with all your STR points invested somewhere else. Since the 18 DEX gloves can be obtained really fast too (act 1, can be rushed at low lvl) you can also start with 8 DEX (and give up your gloves slot) to just be a demigod stats-wise

IMO no Spell or Potion should last until Long Rest. Non combat Spells at best until Short Rest, everything else - 100 turns max.

As to Ability Score changing magic items - well, in BG1 one made a beeline for the 18 (IIRC) DEX Gloves :P. But there was no respeccing then (and we went to school uphill BOTH ways too!).

I disagree.

Incorporating Potion of Giant Hill to your build is just not effective, if you're maxing fighting and less camp-ing, you possibly lost content, not sure if anyone would like that.

I mean what could a 21str potion could possibly do that a +27 Str glove can't? (an item you can bee line your way to, as soon as you reach lower city).

And you're telling me you want to restock enough 21str potion enough to hold up for the entire campaign until you can speedrun to get 27str glove?

Also, you're losing the benefits of elixirs.

So why the heck you would want a 21str apart for situational thing like hauling big loot to vendor (in my case).

I think everyone could agree if the stats is your main stat, you don't want to cheese with with potion.

As I said, this is for STR-based characters. You can pickpocket ridiculous amounts of these potions in act 1, you will long rest tons of times (possible more than a regular playthrough if you're pickpocketing these potions + the mats needed for them and cloud giant elixirs). The gloves aren't even good, not to mention they are all the way in act 3. You're missing out on much better gloves by using them instead of elixirs, even if you don't care about boosting your DEX to 18. You don't need any elixir benefits other than juicing your main stat if you're going for this.

I have finished this game solo in Tactictian mode as a fighter using this method. It doens't just work, it's busted.

You know what, I never thought I'd agree with Tuco but here I am.

As for "resting too much" or whatever the argument is.... do you not play with casters? Do you not try to push the story along? Many events only happen at camp when you end the day. I rest all the damned time because of it, and there's nothing more obnoxious than being out of spell slots.

I also rest at the end of every session before I save and quit so that I don't forget to when I start back up the next time.

And then comes Cloud Giant setting Str to 27, grab that proficiency bonus and add it to the broken as hell Balduran greatsword, and nothing short of a sorc with Dribbles clown gloves can even come remotely close in damage output. 2H damage fighting in this game is so ridiculously effective because of how many paladin/fighter favored items and consumables are in the game vs. other classes. And stealing in this game is so easy thanks to Fog and Astarion with gloves of thievery+smuggler ring.

I mean, you HAD to be right about something at some point.

The potion really did not fit into this game's system, instead of tiny to zero improvement, it got 13/19 additional strength, while 8/9 point on creation that would be realocated on other stats, with unlimited supply. The result is it nullify the need of strength investment, makeing the game looks bad no matter player use it or not.

My way to make it fit into bg3 would be make it increase by but not more than (hill giant only) instead of increased to. The reason why not reduce the duration is because it would only encorage player to refresh vendor to accommodate the attrition or skip rests if per short while lootable only would encorage player to resepc and overstretch sections. Removeing it works perfectly too but it would be boring.

They could just keep the potion's benefit for athletics and acrobatics checks and disable its benefits for combat. It'd then be a utility potion for extra carry capacity and athletics/acrobatics overworld checks.

There are too many potions in general, I think.

I tend to agree with this.

My biggest problem with this particular potion is that it undermines so many builds, and it's so abundant that there's no practical reason to not use it every long rest.

Also, just to clear up an issue that was mentioned earlier in this thread, these elixirs are *not* expensive. They go for around 70 gold a piece, assuming you're even buying them in the first place. Someone else mentioned that you'd run out of money because they were in the ballpark of 400 gold. That's just not true, even when you factor in low charisma and not having someone like Wyll purchase them for you.

Yeah. So I generally do like the idea of elixirs - by giving per-long rest bonuses players have incentive not to long rest too often. However, I thought Deadfire did it better: bonuses were tied to food that we were consuming (so while there was plenty of food so you can rest whenever you want, food with good bonuses was more scarse/fiddly to get that would resting less). Also bonuses weren't as OP as they are in BG3.

Perhaps, a flat bonus to strength would be a better solution for the potion? (+3 and +5) Or would that result in it stacking with something else, making it even more OP? One could make it so only the strongest buff applies - but now we would move even closer to Pillars of Eternity system

I don't see how that would make it any "less OP".

Stacking bonuses, even in itemization, are generally considered more powerful (and abusable) than just matching a set value you can also reach by more organic means.

After reading many of the replies, I'm struggling to understand why so many people defend the current duration of this potion. These potions allow the player to invest 17 starting points in a second category and potion their way through the game without risk.

1. It's 1 hour in default rules for a valid reason. The difference between one hour and long rest, as someone else noted, is massive.

2. BG3 version of the potion exceeds what you can achieve by investing feats and base points into strength with no downside. If I could take a cheap drug that would give me all the effects of going to the gym and training hard for several hours every week....wait, no one would do that right? This is the steroids of Baldur's Gate, and it penalizes both the ai and the role playing aspects of the game.

3. As far as I can tell, it cannot be removed by anything but death or a specific potion that replaces all other potions. What happened to dispel or remove magic from Baldur's Gate II?

4. It is cheap: my first trip to the Grove is to visit Auntie Ethel and pick up three of them with my puny funds.

5. They are plentiful. Ethel restocks them after short rests. I have had 10 of them after my first long rest, which was enough to buff my lead character for the duration of the game.

6. Of course, one could not exploit the potions, but should we be forced to limit what we use because it's broken, or should we fix it? If I want to play an all natural character, I will foreswear potions entirely. But, if they are in the game, they should be implemented in a way that allows a player to use them without trivializing the difficulty or character creation process.



A fix could include:

1. Remove magic spells that have a chance to remove potion effects.

2. Shorter duration (1 hour) or until short rest.

3. More expensive.

4. All of the above.


Of course, we could mod this, but as things stand, mods are so unstable with the current patch, that risking one's whole run seems like a poor choice to fix one annoying aspect of the game. The developer should do this. If you want to have high strength that lasts all day, put points in it. As it is, using a base feature of the game feels like cheating against an AI that is already weak.

One of the major problems in 5e as a system is that we get so few feats, and that ability scores and feats share the same progression. In earlier D&D systems, feats and ability scores had separate progressions so you got both. Most 5e characters only get 3 feats by lvl 12, with Figther and Rogue being able to reach 4. Most of the good feats don't have an ability score increase worked into it, which would've made the system a lot more interesting. Increasing your strength, for example, is often effective, but it is often very boring compared to getting access to additional abilities. So much of our character is already determined by what class and subclasses we play with that having a straight stat increase be one of the optimal choices we can make is a reduction in what little freedom we have.

I think that having these items and potions available is overall a good thing, because it means that we have a bit more freedom with the few feats we get. But even then, this freedom isn't free. If I am using a strength elixir, I am not using another type of elixir, because they don't stack. If I'm using the Gloves of Dexterity, I can't use the Legacy of the Masters. And so on.

Another solution could've been to do the same thing OneD&D does and give every feat an ability score increase. This would also have made starting with 17 in your primary stat more interesting, as it would let you reach 20 with 3 feats. This would've required them to fully embrace homebrewing the feats though, as they'd need a serious rebalancing (even more than the feats already do, I mean).

Because it's a fake issue, entirely focused on expressing disproportionate concern for an expensive and inefficient solution.

No one who isn't a complete idiot is going to build a STR character with a primary stat gimped only because he can use extremely expensive consumables after every rest.
They also compete for your unique "elixir slot" with other stuff, which makes questionable at best to build your entire strategy around them when you could get the same result with a permanent stat increase.

And the problem with "fixing the duration" is that it doesn't recognize how the game work. Fuck me sideways if I want to have any expensive consumable lasting "an exact hour" in a game where

- there's no proper clock
- there's no actual pause
- timeflow doesn't stop when you browse the inventory or any other menu
- you can spend tens of minutes at any given time sorting said inventory, because it's a freaking mess.

+1 to that

I could NOT have said it better myself. Thank you

haha, they're not extremely expensive, not at all, why do you keep saying that? :rofl:

you seem to have a lot of skin in keeping these potions despite constantly saying how only idiots would use them...

Duration until short rest would make sense. 160?gp for boosting strength to 27 (30 gp for a boost to 21) according to bg3.wiki doesn't feel expensive at all.

Actually I don't thing the strength potion is a big issue at all. They are way more broken elixirs like suprise or bloodlust.
What they offer is unique.
The maximum strength is any way 30 so it's way above that.
Mybe even more than 30 . I just dont find something else to improve it more.
I agree the amount of gold that we need to spend is cheap but magic items like +1 sword is even more cheaper.
But in the end it dosnt matter because to get money in this game is even easier then in divinity 1-2. So I don't even think nerfing the potion will make any difference.
If I can have 10 k gold at lvl 1 w/o cheating. What difference will it make to decrease to 1 hour or 10 turns.
I think devs realised this so they say'd make it an elixir.
But in the mean time they gived other powerfull elixirs as well.

Just they forget to adjust the game with difficulty with the same lvl.

Because 360 gold for a temporary buff IS expensive.

Especially for what''s functionally the equivalent of a +1 to hit/dmg for any character that didn't have STR as a gimped stat.
Because yes, that's what the difference between 18 and 21 is, in practical terms.

I know some of you are simply bad at understanding sub-systems and mathematical averages (which is why you cry yourselves to sleep for these potions and then shrug for far more egregious bullshit like Shove as a bonus action or the lack of an attunement system), but that's really your problem, not mine.


Also, it seems some of you struggle to grasp what the crux of the discussion should be, which is NOT the potion's existence in itself (since that's part of STANDARD D&D itemization) but how its duration had to be adapted to the peculiar way BG3 tracks the passing of time.

Are you sure that's not the price of Elixir of Cloud Giant Strength which boosts str to 27?

Whenever I play a game that has timed consumables with short buffs (Dragon Dogma, Solasta, Skyrim, Fallout, etc...) I usually end up hoarding them because I don't want to use them "inefficiently".
I like to either reach a level of supply where I can manage permanent uptime on the effect, or save them for some mega min-maxed sprint. For example if I have an XP boosting potion and there's a limited supply in the game you can bet I'm only gonna pop it when I'm about to kill the one enemy in the game that awards the most XP, and only when I am under every single other XP multiplying effect in the game.

I think the way Larian has implemented "until long rest" effects actually encourages me to use my consumables because I can control when I got enough value out of them and end the effect. Similarly, I never find myself using the "lasts 10 turns" consumables because it never feels like this is the opportune time to get maximum value out of it.

Dude, for the 100th time, that's not how much it costs. When's the last time you played the game? Why do keep insisting it costs that much?

You can pick up three of them from Auntie for a couple hundred, yo. A couple hundred for all three, that is, not each.

You need a better dealer. My goodness.

*

lol, as for what the discussion *should* be, I'm the one who created the thread!

I am satisfied how they are. You still have to ration them smart. In addition there are way stronger candidates for potions.

I always find it both sad and funny when some poster wants to change the game to fit "there version" of what they think the game should be... all because they obviously don't have the will power to resist these boosts themselves. Oh.. gosh! Someone is "cheating the game" is the wrong attitude to take, seriously let others play the game they want too. If they want to use these boosts like potions to "game" the system ... just let them. They paid for the game too, so let them play it their way, after all you are not their DM. And you play it your way... just enjoy the experience, and try out different ways rather than critiquing the way others "might" play the game.

Well, gosh, let's get potions that increase strength to 100. Just don't use it if you don't want it. And maybe a set of dice that always roll 20. Don't like 'em? Don't use 'em!

Feedback. It's a thing.

How about 72 gold is that expansive?

That's the price Auntie Ethel sells them for to a 16 charisma character. Even if you started the trade with a 10 charisma character it would only cost 90 gold.

Personally I am not bothered one way or another about their duration. I just want you to stop making things up to support your argument. Merchants do not sell an Elixir of Hill Giant Strength for 360 Gold.

Just stumbled upon 5e potions.

Its filthy op, especially on classes with dual stat dependecies like pal or war cleric. You can get 4 potions per long rest in act1. Enough to last you entire game.

Where do you get so many of them? I had both Jaheira and Minsc run on builds that required Strength potions and my reserves ran empty quickly enough. Maybe I long rest too often. ^^;

Auntie sells 3 per day, the Abused Dwarf Wife sells 1-2 per day.

"Until Long Rest" is insane. Should be 6-10 turns.

Auntie doesn't like my any more in Act 3 and the dwarven alchemist only sells one every second or third day, sometimes I am lucky with ingredients though.

Stock up in Act 1? I usually end it having 10-20 in my backpack ...

Auntie is the last person I deal with before I finish act one and maybe some of act 2….

Agree, these elixirs should be nerfed to potions. When the best execution of a strength-based build is with strength 8 + elixirs it's just not how it should be.

I just wanted to revisit this thread and point out that, now after the game has been out for a while, we can clearly see how so many of the ridiculously overpowered builds are reliant on drinking strength potions every day.

I've been watching several build videos recently. So many of them are entirely based around nothing more than taking advantage of strength potions.

Substance abuse rears its ugly head in BG?

You start playing around with the hill stuff and before you know it, you're into the clouds. There ain't no coming back from that. Do you even lift, bro? Did you beat the Absolute, or was it the juice?

*

It was always my position that the strength potions were too much, but I recall another poster continually commenting that they weren't overpowered or too abundant, and besides, even if they were, they were too prohibitively expensive for anyone to use repeatedly.

Cut to: it's the source of the most popular broken builds in the game.

Dumb as bricks.

Did you ever figure out how much they cost, by the way?

What do you mean? I never had problems "figuring it out".
It's just that the price changes according to the cahracter's stats, difficutly level AND patch version.

What never changes is the whole thing being a fake issue.

Weird. Having played through all the patches, difficulty levels and stat spreads, I never noticed the price climbing anywhere near as high, but yeah, must've been one of those old patches we can't verify anymore. I see.

As for a fake issue, maybe that word's being lost in translation. As an idiomatic speaker of the English language, I'm not sure it means the same thing to me. I would call this a *real* issue. The potions are so prevalent that, again, it's literally the source of many of the most popular broken builds in the game. In fact, there are videos all over the place with builds based on drinking daily doses of strength elixirs.

As a matter of fact, I was just watching a Luality build guide where she outlined three builds. Two of which were entirely reliant on drinking strength elixirs.

Ah yes, the "now conveniently unverifiable" patches that you refused to check back then, when I pointed the fact multiple times and it was STILL verifiable.

And about Luality I guess being fundamentally clueless about metagaming is not your exclusive, apparently.
Otherwise they'd be aware than there's far better uses for elixir slots that getting a semi-permanent +1 at a bunch of gold per-pop.

I use my STR elixirs as throway crap on clerics and similar (when I do use them at all) because if I'm really invested into min maxing, any dedicated melee is FAR better off with Bloodlust or similar.
Stuff that gives you unique advantages on the action economy, rather than a bonus I can get in several other ways (itemization included).