Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Story & Character Discussion Halsin Romance, Expectations and Obligatory Poly

(I promise Red Queen its only the first part :D)


This part makes me smile because I've seen this argument/observation recently and as a European I would have to disagree. Majority of people in the EU are monogamous and unless I missed the memo about those 2pm group sex meetings at the town square where we call Americans puritans I don't think much has changed.

Either way I was never someone who discriminated or cared about other peoples private/sex lives as long as those relationships were between consenting adults.

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We will disagree on this but to be honest, my perfect outcome for this whole kerfuffle would be the removal of poly options from Astarion/Shadoheart. Even now you can ignore/reject the drow twins/sudden poly/Mizora scenes and nothing will change and no contradictory statements will be made.

Only one issue remains and that is the party banter one, both character have one party banter during their romances where Halsin makes a move ('Can I join?' I'm honestly starting to hate that) and instead of rejecting him they end up flirting with him (and this goes back to my statement that Halsin feels like the writers pet - character changing and doing things that they would never do but suddenly its okay because its Halsin)

Its obvious that being poly is a big part of Halsins character and I don't want that to be taken away from people that enjoy it but unlike you said in your other post where you see him as 'sex positive/having a healthy poly outlook' I only see a guy that hits on everything that walks, talks and baaas. Sure he has conversation where he establishes his boundaries but then he proceeds to act like the main character in some cheap erotic visual novel. So yeah I do see him as rather shallow.

I don't want to go through a romance with Halsin where he talks about respecting boundaries, opening his heart to my character and his love for her, even the break up scene (what does he say? I don't want my heart being toyed with) only for him to start making moves on other companions/npc in front of my PC and doing the same shit he claims he doesn't like.

And again I want his character fleshed out. His story outside of the ha ha I was a submissive sex slave of a drow matriarch and I like bear sex consists of - Healer in prison, tells you about Moonrise towers, Thaniels quest and nothing else unless I missed something or it bugged out.

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Also I do agree with this.


Yeah the writing in this game and especially the romances seem to strictly follow this philosophy. 'Colse your eyes, imagine the weave, grab my dick' like holy hell. I miss the Judy romance from CP2077. (I promise I'm fully sticking to the Halsin discussion from now on)

Sooo... Is it only flirting when you're into it?

I love this incel question. It makes you think.

The relationships in poly culture I witnessed are playful enough to have your metamours flirt with each other, or have some banter. Those people share a partner after all - you'd hope they get along.

Some poly couples (primary partners) share a partner. Unicorn hunting isn't well received in the community, but that's not what Halsin and Tav are doing. Tav is having another partner.

Some primary partners expect to be asked before more than a hug happens. Some partners want to know details. Some don't want to know anything about their partner's affairs, relationships, and whatever.
It's up to each couple within a polycule to define the rules. Make sure they work for everyone else in a polycule.

Usually the "don't tell me anything" people are the ones who will become trouble in the future. Hickeys happen. And not being able to share that someone you're seeing is making you happy (more details aren't necessary) is a strain on a relationship. That's like "I don't want you to talk about your sister with me". Uhm, this person is important to me?!

Where do Halsin, Tav, Shadowheart and Astarion falling on that scale?

I'd say Astarion and Shadowheart want to be primary partners. They want a committed relationship with Tav.
Halsin seems to be a relationship anarchist, someone who does not want to label relationships as primary and secondary. Therefore he would describe his relationships as... fluid. Which he does.

There is no contradiction between someone being poly, and someone being a relationship anarchist. There's a difference on the commitment level.

The problem for some folks lies in here. He's non committal. But that doesn't mean he's a sex offender, holy cow! All the companions do is offer, none of them moves anywhere without being told to. Full control in the hands of the player (where it belongs, and yes I wasn't keen on Harleep, btw).

For the type of poly person Halsin is portrayed, his reactions make sense.
For people who are into committed relationships, that sucks.

What I wish would be an option to get into a relationship with someone post Act 2. Some romances could be re-kindled. That would make more sense for people who wanted Halsin, but don't feel like his view on relationships is their cup of tea.

There have been several times in my life where I had to break up with someone because their poly wasn't compatible to my poly. Or their wish for committment doesn't work with mine.
Most have stayed friends. You can love someone, and still aren't relationship material.
There's an inherit sadness when that happens. Still, not even rare to happen.

PS: I know of several polycules who meet for stuff, swinger clubs, kink bars etc. If you didn't find your town square fuckaroo group, you aren't looking hard enough /joke

People drifting apart and relationships changing due to altered feelings/circumstances/etc. isn't a poly thing. It's universal. Even committed relationships/marriages end. This is why all of Halsin's talk about hearts being free sounds a bit strange to me - none of my characters are casting permanent compulsions on their romance partners. Maybe the relationships will end someday. Maybe not. That's life.

I don't at all expect them to make Halsin not poly, but I'd at least like an option to go off together with him when the game is over, like we get with all the other love interests. Sure, some conversation about what happens if/when he finds someone else would be nice - do we just not talk about it? does our relationship turn into "just friends" for awhile? - but that's not as necessary, I can headcanon all that myself. (And if you assume that my headcanon would involve him just happening to never fall for someone else again - you would be correct. )

LOL, and here I thought I was having a conversation with a grown ass 30+ woman and not a reddit user.

Throwing insults and implying people are incels because someone disagreed with you, come now.

Maybe its the poly outlook that you are used to/hold that doesn't allow you to see this but the problem doesn't come from people flirting with others, it doesn't even come from people flirting and experimenting in open relationships. It comes from companions flirting while in established mono relationships and mono mindsets. Both Astarion and Shadowheart don't talk or mention any of their willingness to share outside of those Halsin/Mizora scenes.

It is as if there are two version of those characters. One that exists in the main timeline where you are doing their story/romance and the other that rears its head when the game needs a spicy poly option despite that other version clashing with the already established story.

Again if a character isn't willing to open their relationship with anyone and are fully against it suddenly change their mind for this one character I'm going to point out that its contradictory, poorly written and full of implications that this character is a writers pet (OC please do not steal - look how cool and better my character is)

edit. To make my stance even more clear and my irritation as to how it was written. What is your opinion on this - You ask a character about their opinion on sharing and they say they are against it, you ask this character about opening you relationship and they say no they are not into it, you flirt and become intimate with someone else and this character immediately starts a conversation how they don't like it and that the relationship cant continue because they are not into opening the relationship but then a scene that is no way, shape or form connected to their story and your characters relationship with them shows up they say they are down with it and they were always a fan of poly relationships. Because to me that is a bit contradictory is it not?

And no, Halsin and his writer have leaned deeply into the degeneracy (not polyamory) during this games marketing and writing. He's not an romance anarchist he's just a poorly written character that people had hoped would have more depth than just being a thirst trap.

As someone who has experienced the hook up culture and had my fair share of partners I can say without a doubt that I have many issues when it comes to poly people and their dogma of repeating the same lies of respecting others boundaries despite being selfish and emotional abusers most of the time. (maybe you are different and that makes you unique)

I understand being emotionally tied to a character (everyone has been at some point) that offers you something that other games don't and the criticism of others has maybe made you combinative. If we could continue this discussion somewhere else I would love to (preferably without it turning into a insult fest - I'm okay with disagreements) but I think at this point the Red Queen is going to jettison our asses out of this thread.

He was added because of community feedback, though, so I was hoping his target audience would be everyone.

And he was, I'm pretty sure that he wasn't going to be a companion originally. But my question is are you satisfied with what was given or do you find his character lacking (compared to other companions)?

I do think I made my stance clear on him, but he just feels like a kink character and not a fully fleshed out one.

You're wrong with Astarion and Shadowheart though.

Shadowheart mentions in her quest, if(!) you loot a specific book, that relationships between other Shar worshippers were encouraged. That she liked that. There's an implication, that they kinda had orgies or at last changing partners. She mentions how she liked that about her upbringing.

It's not a cutscene. Maybe that's how it can be overlooked?

Astarion is okay(-ish) with sharing you with Mizora. It doesn't sound like he's too keen on it, either, and I think he could be poly, but is just too traumatized to really make an informed decision, but that's an entirely different can of worms. My point stands: Astarion does not only share with Halsin, he also shares with Mizora, so there is a pattern of him sharing Tav.

You're calling poly people selfish and emotional abusers, liars, and bring them towards hook up culture, which is very different from consensual non-monogamy. I don't like those pseudo-poly folks who are using the "I am in an open relationship" lie to fuck around without their partner finding out either!
They aren't poly, thought. They are cheater!

I think you're reading things in his behaviour that were not intended. Or maybe I am.

If Larian wants to clarify part of his romance, or adds additional scenes, I am all for it!

I do like having him as a companion, so I am very happy about that! It would be great if they could add a nonpoly option to his romance as well as letting you recruit him earlier!

Maybe it bugged out for me, but it sounds similar to what she say after she catches you with Mizora. But I took that as more of a casual sex thing/orgies between initiates opposed to a poly relationship (I know some people might loose their minds that a 50 year old woman had previous partners but I don't care about that my main issues is with the writing)

I already wrote in my previous post edit that the issue comes from how her romance is portrayed (reject Shar and before that) - she is against poly in it is she not? (she rejects any attempts to open the relationship and says that she's against it) So when Mizora/Halsin thing shows up it feels as if its out of left field. If they went with making Shadowheart poly only in her accept Shar version then it would at least make sense since she's fully into the being a Sharan, 'exploring her sexuality' and not being tied down because her main interest is with Shar. (like you said hook ups from her past)

(A quick question tho - I know you are poly but imagine yourself in a mono relationship. How would you react if your mono partner in your mono relationship started flirting with others? That's what I was trying to say, if a character is poly and flirting I don't care as long as they make sure their partner is okay with it but if they say they are in a mono relationship....eh not as cool now is it)


I do agree that there is a possibility for Astarion being the 'share' type but the way it was done just rubs me the wrong way


With this I can agree with, it's been fun talking to you.

Thank you, I do enjoy a discussion, even when we don't find a compromise. It's good to get another point of view. So thank you for discussing with me.

SH only has this ending when she rejects Shar, and to me it makes sense. She defines which parts of her life she wants to keep, and which she wants to change. If she now feels safe enough to share Tav, that's great! It means her insecurities aren't a bother to her.

But! I'd like for her to talk things out with Tav, and with Halsin. I think a healthy conversation about *her* boundaries, and Halsin being respectful to her about them, would help a lot. As I posted before:
Communication is key.

She, as well as Astarion, should have an option to ask "What if I don't want to share? Who would you pick?" or something like that. We poly folk try to avert this. An ultimatum is never a good thing. They *are* common, thought. Inexperienced poly people will ask where they stand. They *need* this conversation. "What happens if you fall in love with a third person?" is another typical question. As well as "What about me? If I find someone for myself, would that be okay?"

Someone who could get in a relationship with them when Tav rejects them, that would be amazing. Let them have their own love life! Heck, let it be Halsin if Tav does not romance any of them! Astarion is into the Hunk (he makes a flirty comment about Halsin once he joins the camp)! Wouldn't that be hilarious?!

To your question about jealousy and flirting:
I can't.

I have never, in my life, been jealous. For years I thought something is wrong with me. I am supposed to not be okay when my partner flirts with someone else, not tell them how pretty their flirt is, and please use protection. I was afraid of not being enough for my partners before, but I never felt betrayed by them flirting.

People have cheated on me. I don't tolerate that. But flirting? Eh. Even kissing was never a problem for me. Kiss away!

Hence him asking if he can join is totally harmless and playful for me. He's fine with a No.

I think there lies a big secret:
You can only really accept something if you are allowed to say No.

And it doesn't feel like Tav can have the sex without accepting the open relationship. That's the issue, right?

There are ways to change this. For example he could ask Tav if they want exclusivity. And maybe if Tav wants that, he can offer exclusivity until the tadpole crisis is averted, with a talk about it later. Maybe they will break up in the epilogue, or find a compromise ("Sleep around when I'm away, and don't tell me"). Maybe Tav will have an option to be okay with it.

Player agency there would be nice. But it's also fine if he says no to casual sex even when he's poly, and you're not, because it could mean too much for him emotionally.

So many ideas for great cutscenes...

Unfortunately, it looks like Larian either never had much or too much for Halsin planned. As I've said before now, there's speculation

Halsin was never planned as companion.
That only changed because some people constantly thirsted for him, so Larian made him into a "anything goes" sexdoll.

Hence the lack of content.

Sadly I have to kind of agree with that. I don't get, why he is still there - go home, pal and take care of your grove. There is literally nothing going on with him in act 3.
He either needs more content or they should go back to Helia. And I'm not even talking about romance, just storyarc, involvment.

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quite literally me right now reading these latest posts. we always knew that halsin was pretty last minute, just, i don't know. my character had a little moment with gale once we found his cat, he was discussing having dinner with my character, keep in mind though, i only brought gale along with me because i wanted to see his reaction to his own cat. seeing that interaction though, that's what i feel halsin is missing. he's missing little moments where he connects with our character, moments where all the orgin characters have these moments with our character. i really hope they'll add more halsin content in the definitive edition. there's no way for them to get it all done in a month, this is something they'll need to rework and redo which will definitely be in the spot of their final version of the game. halsin as is is barebones, this is where i feel the majority of our frustrations lie. he has no content.

I want to make clear, that I'm not hating on Halsin or his fans. I just wish, we would have more story with him, otherwise, it might have been better to stick to the planned Helia. He is just so barebone atm. And Ifeel sorry for you Halsin fans. I just leave him at camp and don't care much about him, but I get, that people, who really wanted him as a companion, can't be really satisfied with what they got.

The problem, again, is that he isn't only written as a fling and casual sex option but as romance option too. But both paths are mashed together so that it isn't clear what is going on. If he was only meant as fling, then it should be clear from the dialog in game that this is all he wants and Tav can go for it or not. They could even had all origins being ok with him but they decided it would only be ok for Astarion and Shadowheart. Astarion even says that Halsin isn't something serious, so Astarion basically is only ok with sharing Tav because he sees Halsin as a fling. And as other people pointed out, Shadowheard and Astarion are only ok with non origins (like Halsin). This further shows that it is only ok for them if they share when there aren't feelings involved, if it is only about sex and not love.

But now we have Halsin written like a fling but also as a romance option. And have him talking romantically about his stirring heart and so on. This doesn't fit. If he is for sex only, this should be clear and then I wouldn't expect him talking about his feelings like he is totally in love with Tav. And Tav needs to be able to make it clear that it is only for sex too. But right now it feels like Halsin is in love with Tav, but doesn't really want something serious (I am not talking about marriage or commiting on one partner) and the other see Halsin as a fling and Tav can't even really respond and tell Halsin what Tav wants their relationship to be.

I am not poly but from what I understand there are two ways to approach this - one is the open relationship where you love your partner but it is ok to have sex (without feelings) with others and there is the way that people fall in love with other people and are basically having multiple romantic relationships with each other. So basically not just sex, but really being in love, just with multiple people at the same time.

But with Halsin I am missing the seriousness in the relationship - as already mentioned, even if you are married it is possible that your feelings change or you fall in love with someone else. This happens. Halsin can be poly but would still be able to marry and settle down with Tav for as long as they love each other. And if that changes, it changes. He might fall in love with someone else and maybe Tav would even be ok that they all live together. Or they separate. Who knows. But the seriousness that they want to see if it still works after their adventure when the daily routine kicks in is missing - and the option for Tav to accompany Halsin is very important in this regard.

Saying that this issue about him being poly is very narrow minded. Because while it is a deal breaking to some, him being poly is mostly not the issue. The issue is that it is in fact because he is a porr and limited representaion of such.

Now, polyamorous relationships come in many forms, but the successful ones include actual relationships, commitment and dedication - things which Halsin's romance does not depict at the moment.

Two real life examples of healthy polyhamoury:

1. A married couple, who has a pulycule with a third person. In addition to this they have swinger elements to them. They have clear agreements as to what is acceptable and not acceptable, and when the others are needed to be involved in a decision. This varies from time couple to couple and changes with the time. They live in the same house, and all parent their three children. Key here is; commitment, dedication and compromise

2. These are multiple polycules - to make this "simple" we will follow one person. This person has three people living in their frst household. They were with their lover since they were young, and now shares their home with their partners second partner. They also have another partner, and for half the week they live with them, and their other partner. These relationships also have swinger elements to them, but again: They have a relationship contract for what is acceptable and not acceptable, for how and when the partners have a say on new permanent partners.
In addition to this they have schedules and date nights to make certain that no partner is left out and that all have their individual needs met and adressed.

Being in a healthy polyamorous relationship (stresseing the relationship part) takes a huge amount of commintment, dedication and comrpomise - thease are all things that Halsin's romance does not encompass. In some cases he will flat out deny it.

Adverstising him as a poly relationship is actualy borderline false advertising.



Halsin is a walking midlife crisis, if you're unkind.

A friends with benefits if you're kind.

A sexual trauma victim, who as a result as a "depraved" sexuality and commitmentissues (which some banter actually suggests) if you're being very dark about it.

At worst a person, who sees your in love with him, uncompromisingly tells you what you need to be in order to be with him, has you around while you're fun, while manipulating your emotions ("You are all I want" then starts to hit on anything that moves for example). And then leaves you hanging in this "hook" situation entirely on his terms with no discussion.


I am not saying, which ones of these are the right one, but I am saying that his "poly-relationship" is not a fair despiction of something that is already under a lot of stigma. And in addition, the way some of his content is gated and presented, makes a mockery for some sexual trauma victims, and make Tav an unknowing link to a traumatic sexual experience.


All of this might have been fine, if not for the fact that it gives you serious whiplash. It's a romance that starts as an adorable slow burn, and then transforms into a friends-with-benefits trope, where Halsin wants to suddenly hump anything that moves.

i haven't seen halsin attempting to flirt with random people in my playthrough...thank goodness. may i ask who does he want to hump as he's in a 'relationship' with tav?
the closest i've come across are the drow twins, but even there, its implied the drows chose to watch him and your tav go at it

It's mostly through party banter (Although I have to say that party banter seems broken the more I look at it. Not reading flags properly, not activating at all etc.).

I can't remember the exact words but as soon as you are done with his romance/sex scene he flirts with the person asking/talking about it and asking them to join.

And another thing to add in regards to Halsin. (but it can apply to the rest of the game) Halsin and his flags are entirely broken. I've been reloading saves, trying new playthroughs (romanced/not romanced/romanced someone else) and Halsin thinks my character is in a relationship with them no matter what lol. Romance some other companion and a (!) will pop up above his head as soon as you finished with the sex scene and he will start the poly/sharing conversation even if you rejected/ignored him.

^i know what you're referring to. the cut romanced party banter they supposedly removed from the game. i assumed when he spoke to astarion and shadowheart in the banter, it was with a tav who romanced astarion and shadowheart and accepted halsin in sharing, because he mentions shadowhearts skinnydip scene in her banter. agreed too, halsin is unfortunately just as broken as gale was. hence people are calling him horny, and the 'bear sex' route. this brings me to astarion saying he doesn't mind your character being with halsin since it's not 'serious', the friends with benefits thing that Cowoline commented on comes into play