Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Story & Character Discussion [END SPOILS WARNING] Addressing Karlach (PLEASE PUT SPOILERS IN TAGS)

What is cut content and isn't is frankly irrelevant. Whether or not Karlach's endings were what the writers intended or are a result of the cut Upper City (which I still don't really buy) doesn't change the fact that I'm disappointed with the ending's current state, hence me joining this thread to begin with.

Maybe Karlach did have a quest in the Upper City, maybe not.
Maybe we'll see the Upper City in a future Definitive Edition. maybe not.

Either way, the tools that the game provides should give us an option to repair the engine. If Larian wishes to go the "sometimes you get dealt a bad hand of cards and that's life" route, that is their right as the writer of the story, but I'm also well within my rights to complain about disagreeing with it and wishing for a better outcome.

I dont remember than im living in Faerûn... I thought that my world was named as Earth... Well, thank you for pleasant surprise! Now i can go to find some dragon or seduce some cute dragonborn, because this is a life!

Well they can either add entire upper city which will take ton of time, or just move like one npc or add one quick quest. Look Karlach had the biggest thread on discord, and now has the biggest thread on forum. One simple quest and everybody calms down and bombs them with positive feesback.

Every origin character essentially joins the party with a “bad hand” dealt to them. The interesting and attractive aspect of the game is that the PC has forms of influence on the outcomes of their narratives, ranging from (subjectively) bad to good. With these impacts one would expect to have that with Karlach as well, but that’s where it feels like something is missing.

Having 5 obvious ways of fixing your problems right in front of you and not even being able to try isn't life though

In my most recent playthrough on Act 3 I started running into some of the added lines that apparently attempt to "add context" to Karlach's inevitable bad end.

I absolutely hated it.

The added lines just feel condescending to me. As if we're being told to shut up and accept that this is happening.

And I just hate the idea of this being a "sometimes now matter what you do you can't stop a bad end" kind of story. If that's the case, then let me ask this:
Why the Hell are we even playing this game? Isn't this supposed to be a fantasy RPG? This is the definition of a setting where you can stop the bad end and have a happy ending if you try hard enough. Why even bother if you're not even going to deliver on the actual fantasy when it's most important?

I don't care how fancy you think this story is, I'm sick and tired of these tragedy tropes. A lot of people are. I'm not interested in it, I don't want it, I have no interest in playing it, much less being forced to accept it.



For Larian themselves, if they are even reading this, I feel like I do need to clarify given the harsh stance I'm putting here. I'm not angry with Larian, I'm not trying to rage at them or anything. I have HUGE love and respect for you guys and am still amazed and happy with all the work you've put into this game. But if this is the only ending I'm allowed to have with Karlach then the game just isn't worth playing to end at all. For all the amazing things you put into the game, they all lose meaning very quickly if despite everything we are still left with such a horrible ending.

It is because I love this game so much that I'm giving, and will continue to give you guys this strong but respectful feedback; Give us a happy ending with Karlach.

I already said it before, if they really want to stick to this ending, first they need to explain to us, why all the hints, why all other ways don't work. It's not some ancient unknown curse we are dealing with, it's an infernal engine nobody is really surprised by. If all we can do is return to avernus I want to know why, and I want it to be a good explanation

We can bail out a guy with nuke inside chest that was ordered suicide mission by literal goddess. After that, any bullshit argument about "such is life", "this is realistic outcome" and all is instantly irrelevant

I really don't think it's useful to speculate on what is/is not cut content. We just do not know enough about how development was done to know when certain stuff was added or cut, or why. I prefer to base my assessment on what we actually got, because that's something we do understand well.

Again, the major issue I think leads to so much frustration isn't so much "Karlach gets only bad endings" (whether or not there was a cut "good ending" doesn't change this much, IMO) as "Karlach is the only origin companion with exclusively bad endings, and whose quest gives you no meaningful ways to improve the outcome."

Just contrast the amount you can do- and the crap you can go through- in any of the other characters' personal quests. You can invade Hell! You can try to out-bargain a devil! You can fight an ancient and powerful vampire! - to Karlach's quest, where you're told she's going to die, and both Karlach and the MC basically just accept it and give up on trying to fix it.

Yeah, and all that knowing that she survives if you actually play as Karlach lmao

I hope Larian would just say if they're done with Karlach, so people could move on. I sure would like to know.

I believe Swen said in an interview recently that they're working on new endings/epilogues and doing content updates, although he didn't mention fixing Karlach's ending specifically. Larian doesn't usually publicize what they're working on until it's ready to go.

They definitely know that the matter isn't settled with the community though, Justice for Karlach is on the list of frequently requested feedback on the Larian discord server and there's still new feedback threads popping up about it. Between that and this rapidly becoming the largest post on the forums right now I think they're pretty well aware that we aren't happy.

Yeah, the Patch 2 Karlach addition marks the first time Larian has actually gone out of their way to say they're going to do something like that before they do it (Addressing Minthara as well, congrats Minthara fans). Fane from DOS2 wasn't touched until 10 months later in Definitive Edition with a similar "bad or worse" ending scenario.

As much as Larian has hurt my trust with Patch 2, I'm glad that they at least RECOGNIZED the issue, and hopefully that means along the line, with time and work we'll see an actual large addition to Karlach in the form of a real good ending, and fleshed out story. Time and patience is the game.

Maybe when Definitive Edition drops in a year lol.

What's the story behind the "DOS2 definitive edition"?

The problem with patch 2 was absolutely abysmal wording. "New ending she deserves" that wasn't even new because avernus was an option from the very begining and saying that slave returning to their abusive master is what she deserves is very poor choice of words. Still, last minute band aid solution? Fine, Sven himself said they did it in like 2 weeks, but we need some clarity. There are far too many plot holes to say we did everything we could for Karlach because we literally didn't try anything. If they say, even enigmatically, that they are working on something that will allow is to fix her engine, the whole affair ends in an instant

From what I heard act 3 of DOS:2 got revamped and one character that was screwed with endings got a happy one fans requested, basically Karlach situation

The biggest thread on discord, the biggest thread on forum, yeah if they ignore this, they would have to really go out of their way to piss off the fans. As much as I still have faith I would really love to see the issue somehow adressed. Still, all we are asking is one more simple quest, then they can move to adding all they want, since it will take ton of time. One quick quest won't take that much

While having solutions right at your face, with hints about something possible to be done. See a steel watcher

Yeah, same... reached Act III again last evening and ran into the added lines, killed my mood again. The drop was almost palpable, I had to quit the game and go to bed early just to not think about it.