Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback Criticism for Halsin's Drow Backstory

Trigger Warning: Heavy discussion of SA

Preface
I'm afraid to post this. It's hard opening up when a story's subject hits close to home. It leaves me open to criticism that I'm overreacting- that "it's just a story." I'd like to request openness and empathy while reading this. I tried posting about this subject on Reddit before and maybe that was my first mistake. These forums seem a bit kinder, though I'm still afraid of how people will take this. I don't mean to ruin anyone's fun, and I'm sorry.

An introduction to myself- I am an adult male victim of CSA and just general SA. I speak from experience but also from a wealth of literature on the subject of SA. I am by no means an academic expert, but I've studied the subject in an effort to make sense of myself and my life.

I've seen this mentioned in a different thread, but the thread's main topic was not about this. I wanted to draw direct attention to this topic and will try my best to respond.

Subject
In ACT III, Halsin has a dialogue about his past as a sex slave for a drow couple. That, in itself, is not a bad thing to write a story about. Astarion's story is a very good example of that kind of story and I appreciate it. However, how the scene is written and handled does not come off as respectful.

To be blunt; he speaks and remembers his time as a sex slave at least half-fondly. It is not in good taste and has made me not want to interact with the character at all. People often have conflicted feelings about their trauma, yes. This isn't a great way to portray that. Instead, it feels like a glamorization of a very real and terrible thing. Or at the very least it feels very dismissive or jokey.

I don't think anyone who likes the character is a bad person. I do not assume any malice on the part of the writers. If anything, I think it may just be a misinformed writing choice. I do not hate your favorite character. I'm not trying to make you feel bad. Please have an open heart and consider this.

If anyone at Larian reads this: Please consider taking another look at this scene. Perhaps consult a sensitivity reader if possible? I know that people on the internet like to mock sensitivity readers, but I think it would really benefit things.

Thank you for reading.

Fortunately or unfortunately I have not come across this in my playthroughs but I also have very little to do with Halsin in most of my play sessions.

I am sorry for your experiences as a SA victim and unfortunately this is a reality in both the game and in real life. But I agree it could have been handled better by Larian in the story. I did google the spoilers for that story arc in question and yes it is a bit... tasteless, to put it politely. But I am going to chalk it up to another one of the small criticisms I have with the games writing. Like the number of same sex couples that have biological children together... somehow.

First of all, I'm really sorry this happened to you. It's strong of you to speak up and I don't think you are overreacting.

I think the drow scene as a whole really needs some double checking considering some of the characters that can end up in it - namely Shadowheart, Astarion and Halsin. It's not handled very well for any of them, especially since all of them have a history of SA.

When I had the talk with Halsin afterwards I was most of all annoyed that they gave him this background at all. It was totally unnecessary for his character and does not add anything to him. We already have two companions where this topic is handled way better. SA should not be used as a trope.

And I agree with you that his reaction made it feel like he partly enjoyed it (or maybe he's just deflecting). If you speak to him when he propositions you he can tell you about the many lovers he has had and one line is a fond "and I went to the Underdark, many many times". At that time I thought he had gone there willingly. This made his reveal later even worse.

Act 3 Halsin is a mess. I think they should cut this part from his backstory since it is not handled with the respect it deserves and because it does not add anything to his character.

Agree!

We've hashed this over many times in the Story & Character forum, so I'll just say that I also agree - either address the subject fully and respectfully or cut it. This shouldn't be relegated to a couple of light-hearted throw-away lines.

Hey op, I'm sorry, this happened to you - in the last days, I saw a lot of people saying, the Halsin story makes them uncomfortable because they experienced SA themselves. You should take a look at the big Halsin trhead in Story & Characters, the last few sites. People do generally agree with you.
I haven't experienced that, because I'm not inetrested in Halsin as a character or those drow prostitutes, but from what I've heard, it is really bad, so it is good to call it out.

OP, thank you for your courage in bringing this up.

OP, thanks for your courage to bring this up. It's an important topic and I hope Larian will take the feedback seriously and make appropriate changes.


100% agree.

There´s just so much grey area in the writing around this that is difficult to interpret. Is it supposed to be playful? Lighthearted? Are the things revealed about the companions in these situations supposed to be a core aspect of their person, or just some fun sidejoke (like the bear sex)? Probably the latter, since there is no follow up where the MC can actually move forward and resolve anything and nothing changes in regards to the dynamics between the MC and their companions. It's just as if it never happened.

There's so many discussions where players are truly confused about the motivation of the writers here. In most other cases it is very apparent when the writing is supposed to be some on the nose joke or reference, but they just didn't manage to make that clear enough here. And if it's supposed to be a joke, yes, do a full sensitivity review of the whole thing. Yes, you can joke about serious matters, but then it has to be funny and everyone has to be in on it, I don't think this checks both those boxes.

I sincerely appreciate everyone's empathy here. It helps to know that other people have had concerns about the scene. I felt like I was going crazy for a while. I don't know if Larian actually sees these forums or anything, but I just hoped it would help.

That kind of got lost in the midst of... well, everything else, didn't it? The loss of control associated with his wild shape form. Which comes up twice, I believe, without being followed up on or addressed in any way, despite it being rather odd and concerning for an archdruid. Ah well.

I am so sorry. It was extremely triggering for me also. So much so I have had to delete that save and I can't play my favorite character anymore.

There is a thread here https://forums.larian.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=879967&page=47

Where some of these things have been discussed.

I am so sorry

You're not crazy. My story is similar to yours, and I am two months after still having anxiety attacks and nightmares from the combination of traumas Halsin brought to life.

I thought Halsin would make me feel safe.

He made me feel entirely unsafe.

Honestly, your post there was what kind of gave me the courage to try and make this into its own discussion rather than part of the larger thread there. If anything, I should be thanking you. It feels less lonely knowing others have the same feelings as I do.

I really wanted to highlight this because I'm afraid it would be overlooked in favor of the more broad topic. I debated on putting this in Feedback or the Character/Story forum but I figured maybe Larian would have a better chance of seeing it here?

And I know what you mean. I was "lucky" enough that I saw a post about it before I encountered it myself. I abandoned the save I was playing too, because I thought his romance would be fun but- yeah. Now I really don't even want to interact with him in the story because it feels like I'm a joke or something, you know?

That's both lovely and heartbreaking. I am so so sorry. I have spoken out against how this was handled since the beginning and I have recieved no small amount of harrassment for it: I have been told my feelings are invalid, that I am not respectful of how different people handle trauma, and that me pointing it out (somehow) makes me a homophobe.

It's stories like yours that makes me take this without remorse, because I don't want you to feel alone and wrong in your own skin, as a safe place that is supposed to give you relief from all of this, turns into a nightmare.

I am sorry, and thank you for your courage. <3

I really appreciate this and I'm sorry you've had bad experiences with this. I got a lot of negative comments when I posted about this on reddit so I tried to be really clear that I'm not trying to upset anyone in my post. I've heard a lot of excuses for the scene and it just makes me feel so tired. Sometimes I don't even have the strength to argue.

If it helps, I don't think it's homophobic at all and have no idea how they got to that conclusion. I'm literally gay married to a man and I would have to give the most bad-faith, intentionally hostile reading of the criticism to get homophobia from it.

I admire your bravery for speaking up as well, and I hope you're doing alright.

Thank you so much. Halsin triggered like five traumas in me at once and I have experienced anxiety attacks and nightmares for the past two months as a result. It is slowly getting better, but BG3 was my place of calm, so I could face the difficulties in my life. With that now being associated with it, I am lacking my personal break space.

I am fine and get through the day, but I could certainly have done without this.

It's such a missed opportunity. We have several characters in the party (potentially) starting their recovery from abuse, sexual or otherwise, and here comes this wise, strong, reliable, respected leader who - we could've slowly found out - was also a victim of abuse, and is also on the road to recovery, though much further down that road. He could've been a symbol of healing and hope and a source of advice from someone who's already gone through what they're going through. But no. Instead it's all sex jokes and meme fodder.

You know, I didn't even think about this before, but that missed opportunity makes the drow orgy with Astarion and Halsin an even shittier choice.

Very good point. It was handled so poorly that it initially didn't occur to me. They could try a story like this but honestly, I'm sort of confused as to why this plot point for Halsin was ever needed in the first place.


I really tend to agree with this here. I actually like "Quest Halsin" for lack of a better term. All the stuff with the Druid's Grove and his quest in Act II were nice enough. "Companion Halsin" feels like a completely different character. Like, where did the guy who likes books and whittling duck figurines and who is academic and researching the tadpoles go? Of course, anyone can have trauma and if they really want him to have it, then as long as it's written well and respectfully, I don't mind. But it feels like they abandoned whatever character traits he had before and just shoved whatever they felt could be titillating or justify his hypersexuality in its place.

This doesn't feel like they even thought it through. No other part of his character seems to have been written with this in mind. People's experiences inform their choices and that would absolutely impact him even if he's healed from it. Mostly I just see people shrug and say it happened a long time ago so obviously he must be better. Or that the druids would have been supportive and helped him. That just seems like a lot of headcannoning in order to fit this into his story. It's never made clear that he has a strong emotional support system in the grove. If anything, he seems sort of isolated in his leadership position. And "it was a long time ago, get over it" is something that is too painful for me to be able to interact with, so hopefully someone else can explain why it's not great.

I don't want to derail into personal matters and details too much, but I do want to at least speak in support and understanding here. It's an attitude that I've seen and encountered a fair share of, and it's not good... because the reality is that we are shaped by the events in our lives, one way or another. Traumas like this; with time and healing, and support from those we care about, we can move forward in a healthy way, and perhaps it's no longer a source of trauma or pain... but it never "goes away"; it's always there, ever after, and you don't just 'get better' and have it be gone and forgotten... It will always have had an impact and be something that shaped us moving forward, and for many people, unfortunately, no matter how much time and healing may pass in between, reminders of things like this may never be too far from the surface. It doesn't always show on the surface, and maybe for some who have dealt with it and made those experiences a healthy part of who they now choose to be, it may never show on the surface... but it also never goes away. So to any who ever deal with these topics, in any form, please, try to be considerate. That's all I really want to say publicly on that, and to let others sharing stories in this thread know that they're heard and seen by another pair of eyes.