Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Story & Character Discussion Shadowheart Romance and the Hidden Fetish - (Spoilers inside)

I don't think they ever should have included it, in my opinion. But they're trying to cater to people with two very different tastes...

Glad to hear that the banter is likely a bug, hope it gets fixed soon

Yeah and they should probably remove the fantasy thing she says entirely and replace it with the regular foursome dialogue, along with not making the orgy scene look like all Tav did was watch with the twins.

All of that's just porn without plot anyway. They don't care if it makes sense. It's there for one thing and one thing only...

I got the game in EA, didn't want it to turn into something you can find on the Hub. Orgies being acceptable for 2 of the most traumatized members of the party, really?

Lol according to them yes. I'm pretty sure the orgy can actually be found on the Hub too lmao

I try to ignore that stuff though and think of the epic romance with SH, and the tasteful, romantic swim scene. That is way better than any and all of the weird porn stuff they have to offer.

In case Larian won't address the Halsin/Shadowheart banter after swimming scene I want to give you the way I look at it that may help put your mind at ease.

I looked up this banter on youtube (idk if I can post links here, so I'll just give the name of the video and timestamp: Party banter [Romances] | Baldur's Gate 3, timestamp 3:51)

Halsins tone there doesn't seem suggestive, he just talks about it like going to a pool with his friends. And Shadowheart doesn't seem super excited, she just seems not confident enough in her swimming skills and genuinely worried that she'll need all the help she can get in case she starts drowning.

And as for the brothel scene I think that given the context, everything there can be seen as just "dirty talk" and shouldn't be taken too seriously.

Shadowheart not being upset about Mizora, how good are orgies for her mental health and if it makes sense for her character is a separate discussion, but it shouldn't ruin your experience with her romance.

Yeah I know that banter can be interpreted that way, but it still looks pretty sus if I'm gonna be honest. As for the Mizora thing, I interpreted that as her being disappointed that Tav would do that to her. "If I wanted to bed something loyal and pure, I'd find a swan". The way she said it sounds a bit sad (to me, anyway).

As for the brothel, they could have just kept the default dialogue between Tav/Shadowheart/Twins the same even with Halsin in the party and he butts in so it doesn't look like she's been thirsting for Halsin the entire time she's been with Tav. And in the actual scene, it should have been either way more vague about what happened or the player gets to choose who gets more attention. It feels wrong to me, and I can't pretend that Shadowheart is a certain way in my Shadowheart exclusive playthrough because I can't forget any of what I found out. I know it's just a game and all, but I didn't play to feel this kind of thing.

Look at it this way. All that there is in the game only suggests that Shadowheart is not fully monogamous, she is open for some experimenting. That doesn't mean that she is against exclusive relationship, will be unhappy in exclusive relationship or even considers your relationship not exclusive by default. In drow twins discussion she says "If you are comfortable sharing, so am I". Halsin butting in and everything else happens only after player says "Yes" to that, which indicates being comfortable with at least some sharing.

Although disapproval if you refuse Halsin doesn't make sense and has to go. It also doesn't make sense and has to go for Astarion too while we are on it.

The banter is extremely suggestive. Especially if you keep in mind the fact that she heavily implies the rest knows what you two did in the dialogue after your scene together (the 'sand in my hair' stuff).

She not only pushes you into accepting, but when you do and Halsin shows how incredibly creepy he truly is, she will then say she's been dreaming of banging Halsin (even if implied it'd be in a threesome with you included), multiple times, meaning she's been dreaming of it before even having had sex with you. And if you say no, she disapproves? I've said it before in this thread, but the way that plays out would be actual grounds for divorce/separation in real life. If anyone who doesn't know this interaction exists stumbles upon that (which happens when you just ask questions to the drows), I wouldn't blame them if they just drop the game right there and then. Which has happened. People have deleted their saves over this.

And that's ignoring the fact that it's completely out of character. If it was at any point before that implied that she wasn't planning on staying faithful or wanted an open relationship, that's different. But it's not. It's not implied before, it's not implied after. You're lead to believe the complete opposite and the opposite remains true after the fact as well because it has no story consequences, it's just mindless - for the lack of a better word - porn dialogue. It'd belongs in some random fanfic, not in the actual game.

Judging by how she reacts to similar scenarios (such as you breaking up with her), she should be angry and quite unapproachable. Other companions (at least some, can't speak for all) will let you explain yourself or ask you to double down on wanting to break up. Shadowheart just gets pissed and doesn't even let you explain yourself. But at least the Mizora scene is avoidable - you did just cheat on her, so either you are roleplaying a prick or you're just doing it to see her reply before F8.

It does house the statements regarding how she was raised as well, which are in complete contradiction with her entire Sharran story arc. But that's a problem for another time.

Nothing at all implies she isn't fully monogamous. She remains fully monogamous after these interactions, and she was before these interactions. They have absolutely zero story impact. I'll quote the line she says if you suggest an open relationship with Wyll again:
Shadowheart: In truth, I don't think I'd want to be your spare lover. I'd always want more of you than you'd have to spare. Better perhaps to bow out with dignity.

If that doesn't indicate monogamous, plus her actions (declining an open relationship with ANY of the other companions, even those she was actually flirting with) then I don't know what is. She wants you and she doesn't want you wasting energy on anyone else. That's monogamy talk. And that's just one of many examples, while nothing ever implies otherwise.

You conveniently left out the incredibly suggestive "Now there's an idea..." she also says when the twins suggest it without you ever asking them for sex. I hope you realize that in a situation where your love interest pushes for a night of pleasure with prostitutes (no matter how out of character it is for her to do so), some people will feel pressured into accepting. The rest of the dialogue is unavoidable the second you do and as I said in the post above, is grounds for divorce/separation and people have quit the game over it.

Yes. Both Astarion and Shadowheart have had part of their character ruined because of the late inclusion of Halsin's creepy romance. Thankfully it's all avoidable by not bringing Halsin. But not everyone knows that bringing Halsin will ruin their immersion.

Edit: But the disapproval isn't the only problem. It's what she says before that already.

I agree that disapproval over Halsin exclusion in a brothel needs to be removed as well as that Halsin comes off creepy. But she isn't pushing you into accepting, just says that she is comfortable with it ONLY if you are ok with it too.


Yes, it wasn't implied because it isn't the case. In my reply to other poster I said that there is nothing in game indicating that she needs or even wants an open relationship, only that she isn't opposed to the idea ONLY if her partner is ok with it too. She considers your relationship exclusive by default and seems perfectly happy with it. She would never do anything to hurt her true love.


I can see how it may seem that way upon reading it in a text log, but upon hearing it without in-game music and city noise I just don't see it that way. And it is pretty reasonable to think that not every time you go to the beach it has to be very intimate.

My second post refutes most of the above. I'll wait until you've replied to that one as otherwise I'd just be repeating myself (I wrote the first one before you replied to Ehhhh123 so I had to separate them).

It happens the day after your intimate night together (sure, it can happen later if you don't bring Halsin until then, but it's coded to happen straight after). Other companions potentially talking about it was foreshadowed by her implying they'll know. It'd be naïve to assume it wasn't referring to the intimate night you had with her. Plus, the way you both talk about wanting more of those nights and how she'll be an eager student if you are a thorough teacher, it's heavily implied that the rest will be quite intimate too.

Sure, she says "Now there's an idea..." upon hearing drows proposal. All that means is that she says her opinion on the matter before you say yours. It's a discussion. She isn't pushing and if you refuse she won't disapprove (like I said disapproval over Halsin specifically was a bad call from the devs).



Forgot about that. But then again at this point player indicates some level of comfort with sharing. And while yes, it is an uncomfortable thought that your romantic partner sometimes may think of someone else, there is no indication that Shadowheart is going to act on it. If player doesn't say they are comfortable sharing, she will keep her thoughts to herself to not compromise what you two have.

I'm not saying that her change of stance on open reltaionships makes sense or I am opposed to Larian making changes discussed here. I am saying that you shouldn't allow it ruin your experience.


Sure, but this game already treats time passing and distance travelled very unrealistically. It certainly wouldn't be bad if it was coded to be 3 long rests after or something like that (or removed, again I'm not consdering this banter essential to the game)

PS: Sorry for slow posting, I'm not used to this.

Here we go again...
1.) As was stated earlier - banter might be bugged and might get get fixed soon. As I said many times before - it makes sense to hear that banter if you decide to run both romances at once. Also I it is very suggestive, considering it occurs instantly after you've spent night together and obviously it wasn't only "swimming action".

2.) Drow convo. Shadowheart says her line always after you initate and ask if your lover is up for it("If YOU are comfortable sharing, so am I..."), unless you are first time there and you decided to "play fool"(there is an option for her to say this first if you chose dumb responces, like: "What do you want from my lover", or something liek that, can't recall correctly.). Disapproval is the huge thing here aswell and should be fixed asap imo(because it only occurs if you are with Halsin, if you are as 4 and decide to not do it - you don't get any disapproval).
Scene itself is rather questionable aswell, but it can be fixed easily for those who dislike "that" fetish without affecting those who do. There was a suggestion in discord to put additional dialogue option that won't require any voice acting. Basically add another dialogue choice after Halsin's line :
Something like: 1. Go for Shadowheart 2. Go for Halsin 3. Remain and watch
Obviously Shadowheart's lines about "dreams about Halsin" cannot be fixed without additional voice acting and rewriting, but they are, obviously, questionable and probably in need of fixes eventually.
Also it might be better to just lock Halsin's self insert behind active romance with him.

3.) Mizora cheat. I think overall her reaction is fine. She is still jealous and expresses that at the start of the dialogue when she talks to Mizora first. Considering her insecurity in 3rd act, I think her response is fine("Swan..." and her last line does it for me). That being said, some disapproval would't hurt and would add some immersion I guess("Wyll disapproves...Wyll disapproves").

4.) Insecurity. Obviously she is insecure about relationship and it shows all the time throughout 3rd act. 1 time she gets confident during last battle, but that makes perfect sense, because you have to be confident there, there is no hesitation and doubt, you need as high spirit as you can. Insecurity and hesitation is 50% of loss. And it kinda makes sense in the epilogue scene for her back to her "normal" attitude. Also you can see how relieved she is when you tell her that you are with her. Also yes, at worst she "will be waiting and easy to find"(Don't do this to her though).

These are all great takes but each of us is build different. Even if I try to rationalize everything said in Sharress's Caress or banter both characters SH and Halsin are ruined for me. Both are manipulative egoistic beings, to say the least.

As you didn't touch on this subject again, I'll reply to this.

She has declined every other attempt from the player to start an open relationship with her. This has happened up to 5 times by the time Halsin shows up. Her dialogue when you suggest an open relationship with any of the other companions sets in stone that she wants a monogamous relationship with you.

This is her reply if you ask for it with Wyll:
Shadowheart: In truth, I don't think I'd want to be your spare lover. I'd always want more of you than you'd have to spare. Better perhaps to bow out with dignity.

That's pure monogamy talk. It doesn't even imply that she doesn't want to share, she says she doesn't want to share. The fact that we even suggest an open relationship after that should make her wonder if we had amnesia, considering she's made it very clear she doesn't want it and yet we bring it up again. I think a -50 approval would be way more in character because of how inconsiderate the player is of her decision to keep the relationship closed. The Halsin situation is therefore completely out of character for her, and the game gives no explanation whatsoever as to why it's suddenly different now.

The suggestive tone in her voice shows serious interest. There are a lot of people who don't like saying no to their love interest (or anyone they care about for that matter) when they show interest in doing something, especially people more insecure. They don't want to disappoint the other. That's what happens here. In fact, the writers even know this, because you can do that exact thing to Gale. You can pressure him into accepting through a persuasion check, and while I don't know the exact words used there, I see this as Shadowheart rolling a persuasion check on the player. Some people will be more inclined to accept.

They had relationship experts for this kind of thing. I think those did an inadequate job in this scenario.

There is a massive difference between being okay with (reluctantly, since she's the one who suggests it) sharing with prostitutes, and sharing with a travelling companion - a "friend". And her comment on dreaming of being with him in a threesome before she's even had sex with you alone is absolutely not okay in any way, shape or form.

Even if she thinks that way about him, supposedly wanting a threesome (it's out of character, lets not forget that), that's not something she's supposed to voice. That kind of thing is grounds for divorce/separation without a serious chat to explain 1. why 2. boundaries. But we don't get to talk to her about it, at all. If my spouse in real life were to suddenly tell me she's dreamt of a threesome with a friend of mine after that friend of mine suggests having one (or in this case, fivesome), I'm genuinely not sure how I would react but it wouldn't end positively. Add her (and him) showing disapproval and.. well, I don't think I'll ever want to see either again.

Don't worry. it hasn't for me, but I understand that it has for others. I just dislike inconsistent writing in general, even more so when it touches important subjects like this.

I'm still against him suggesting it and her reply to it. Neither make sense, as he said he'd respect your decision and she has shown no interest in an open relationship with anyone else thus shouldn't be interested in one with Halsin without some serious explanation as to why she would be.

Nothing to be sorry for!

This can be applied to her Mizora reaction btw, especially when we know that she is, in fact, insecure.

I agree, that would technically be a valid way for her to respond. But past the first line, nothing in the dialogue and the tone of her voice show any of that, and Jennifer is an excellent voice actress so I am not going to assume she just messed up - it's clear to me that it wasn't written that way. The only thing she seemed disappointed about is that you didn't ask first. There's plenty of times you can hear genuine disappointment and sadness in her voice throughout the game to know that this isn't it. And I'm still vehemently against the idea that she supposedly expected you to cheat on her. She's not insecure enough to defy a goddess (her only support) for someone and devote herself fully to someone she thinks will cheat.

Though, judging by her reaction if you break up with her, I don't think she'd canonically respond that way anyway.

And like I said, the dialogue regarding how she was raised directly contradicts her entire Sharran story arc and how she acts throughout the game.

Edit: Also, for someone supposedly that insecure, she seems awfully keen on suggesting a session with a bunch of prostitutes. It's just inconsistencies within inconsistencies. All three of these optional scenarios are horribly written.

Guys, what are the chances of this debacle at least being acknowledged by Larian? Some of the feedback threads on Discord regarding it can't be reacted to for some reason, and I have no idea how they would even sort through them in the first place. As for Reddit, the posts that criticise this don't seem that popular and get downvoted/ignored. I've only ever seen one get around 7k upvotes. I guess that this and the Halsin thread are one of the more popular threads on the forum, so we have that going for us.

Her break up line is ok, you are not supposed to press it out of random anyways. I think they could've tweaked it to play different lines based on approval and what you did to your LI.
She seems like she blames Mizora for this obviously(some people tend to react this way) and she doesn't say anything about her expecting to cheat though. She just expects you not to praise her because of what she thinks of herself, what a bad person(and lost person, she feels like she is nothing without her godess) she is. That's also main source of her insecurity.
First line to Mizora, swan line, last 2 lines suggest that she is not ok.
I read it this way. Thus being said, some disapproval would seal a deal(Seriously I watched yt reactions to Mizora cheat and only who disapproves is Wyll).
Which one has 7k upvotes?