Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Build Discussion Rank the Races!

The problem was not disagreement, it was the lack of common decency.

Also the lack of common sense. If you get told that what you accuse others of saying hasnt been actually said by them, normal people would be open to the idea of getting explained what was actually said.

Instead the poster doubled down on disproving things that havent been said by anyone anyway, proving that interacting with this person is an extremely bad idea.

So I stayed away.,

Since my Halfling Lore Bard is progressing at glacier speed because I dont want to miss any content on him, I have started a Half-Orc Champion and I'm playing that guy now, because I want to finish the game for the first time in faster speed.

And all I can say while I'm very happy with the sheer damage output of the dude - I regularily miss my Halfling. The ability to reroll critical misses is just uber, and helps not only in combat, but also in dialogue and trickery.

So nope, no way I would rate the Half-Orc better than the Halfling. By the way the Halfling advantage also helps ALL classes; though being Bard, the jack-of-all-trades class, makes their advantage especially obvious. While Half-Orcs are only really good at being warriors. The moment you no longer use a weapon you no longer get a benefit from the extra crit damage.

I would argue that you having fun with a race does not suddenly make that race good. In BG3 critical failure on a roll is really annoying, especially in skill checks, but you get plenty of inspiration points, you can get advantage with enhance ability and advantage on stealth doesn't matter that much because line of sight in Baldur's Gate 3 is the way detection works. In tabletop, when you roll for stealth, you roll for getting hidden all around, not just walking behind a dude and crouching.

And if you want to have someone else rank different races, here is a good site that goes into detail with races for each class, feats, etc:

https://rpgbot.net/dnd5/characters/classes/

I would argue that you having fun with a race does not suddenly make that race good. In BG3 critical failure on a roll is really annoying, especially in skill checks, but you get plenty of inspiration points, you can get advantage with enhance ability and advantage on stealth doesn't matter that much because line of sight in Baldur's Gate 3 is the way detection works. In tabletop, when you roll for stealth, you roll for getting hidden all around, not just walking behind a dude and crouching.

And if you want to have someone else rank different races, here is a good site that goes into detail with races for each class, feats, etc:

https://rpgbot.net/dnd5/characters/classes/

Edit: Oh and I'm not looking for even more race ranking.

Well ... you asked, so please dont be insulted. Some races downright insult my common sense and I dont look kindly upon that.

1. Halfling
2. Gnome
3. Drow
4. Elf
6. Half-Orc
5. Human
7. Half-Elf
8. Dwarf
9. Tiefling
10. Githyanki
11. Dragonborn


Halfling - OP. Just OP. In a very skill focused game they reroll a critical failure. And then Lightfoots get Advantage for Stealth. So everyone else gets a 1:20 chance to have a critical failure on a Hide check, a Stout Halfling (that I dont play) has a 1:400 chance, and a Lightfood Halfling has a 1:160,000 chance. Not to mention they will roll higher on average anyway due to the Advantage. Why would you ever use anybody else for Stealth but a Halfling Rogue ? And it works in all kinds of other places including combat, too. You also reroll critical failures on attack rolls. As long as you can hit the opponent on a roll of 2, you have only a very minor chance to miss.

Gnome - Well on the plus side they get a kickass advantage. Much less universal though than Halfling, since it is only relevant in battle. On the negative side male Gnomes look just abhorrent in BG3.

Drow - They look cool, and they get Rapier as racial weapon, so even a Wizard or Sorcerer can melee just fine (Longsword, which is what regular Elves get, would need Strength instead). Not anywhere near as powerful in the past, but still great looking, and their racials arent bad.

Elf - They look good and their specials aint bad. My Paladin for example is a female High Elf. Just the purest race I can get. I wished I also could get an Unicorn mount to ride.

Half-Orc - Cool special ability, if you want to play tank. Very tempted to use them for a Fighter/Champion for maximum effect. In BG3 they look less ugly that in other games, too. I mean they look ugly, but in a heroic/manly way, as they are supposed to. But many games get that part wrong and make them just look ugly, with no chin etc.

Human - The carry capacity part is cool. Fancy them for a Wildheart Bear Barbarian for maximized carry capacity.

Half-Elf - I liked them in the past but in BG3 they just never come up as my race pick when I design a new character. The whole can use polearms part offers little additional functionality beyond that Shadowheart can use her goddesses weapon of choice.

Dwarf. Well, they always look so ugly. And in BG3 they are big time underpowered. Unless you want to be a mage in medium armor, I guess. Which is all I see people playing them as.

Tiefling horns are literally attached to the most fragile part of the skull. So the functions their horns serve ... is to make the skull, the most important part of the body, more fragile. Real horns would attach near the base and would increase, not decrease, protection of the skull. So yeah I dislike Tieflings with a vengeance for being a stupid concept.

Githyanki literally look like insects. Their nose is simply too small to function properly. Basically the moment they can no longer breathe through the mouth for some reason they would suffer from Asthma. Their racials are very powerful and I hear that the itemization for Gith Fighters is OP.

Dragonborn. So they're a sentient race ... but they cant smile or do anything else with their face. Begone.

Anyone can advantage on stealth checks though, you just need a level 3+ spellcaster with Enhance Ability.

And Enhance Ability: Dexterity aka Cat's Grace also gives you Advantage on Sleight of Hand and Acrobatics, too.

The advantage of Lightfoot Halfling and Grey Gnome is just -- they have it always.

By the way the Halfling ability applies always. You also have far less critical misses in combat, for example. Basically if you can get your attack high enough its far less likely to ever miss.



Of course thats all childs play compared to the Rogue level 10 ability to always roll at least 10 on skill checks.



Either way I'm not unhappy that people think the Halfling special is weak, because that means its likely to stay.

We already have people demanding in other threads that Halforcs need to be nerfed.



Well then maybe dont answer this thread ? ;-)

In general, few of the choices made at character creation are permanently impactful. Stats. skills, class can all be respecced at nominal cost. You can freely switch from a Monkbarian to a Bardlock or vice versa. You can take your Oath of the Ancients Paladin and temporarily 'forget' their oaths as you switch them to a Thief or Assassin Rogue, embarking on a crime spree across the land, only to switch them back to the Oath of the Ancients Paladin once you are satiated, with their oaths apparently intact and unbroken. With adequate gold, you can have your character be a 'master of all trades' and have them be the ideal build for any given environment and situation. One of the few things you cannot change and are stuck with after choosing it at character creation is their race.

Given that, Rank the Races! I'll start, but I encourage everyone to not just critique my rankings but more importantly to supply their own. Judge them by whatever criterion you see fit. For myself, I'm grading them on 3 primary criterion: Appearance, Flavor, and Mechanics, all of which in my opinion matter for your primary character and avatar in the campaign. Without further ado, here we go!

1. Drow
(Appearance A, Flavor S, Mechanics A)
Elves, Humans, Half Elves and Drow all have more body types available than any other races. This includes the 'lithe and attractive' and 'swol beefcake' varieties. They also work well with any hairstyle and generally have the most and best customization options for appearance of anyone. Mechanically, Elves don't have the best abilities ever, but they do have a *ton* of them. Darkvision, Sleep Immunity, Charm Resist, a bonus proficiency in the always useful Perception, potentially useful or useless weapon proficiencies, and that's without even adding in what they get from their subraces. Drow get all of that, then trade high elves' cantrip for a cantrip and 2 2nd level spells and also superior Darkvision, with absolutely no downsides whatsoever. They also have the most unique interactions and flavor of any race in the game. They are, in every way, the complete package.

2. Githyanki
(Appearance F, Flavor S, Mechanics A)
It says a lot about how dominant Drow are that you can drop so far, from the best appearance set in the game to the worst, and still be in the #2 spot. Githyanki are central to the story and from a lore perspective have the most reason for being there and interacting in the plot. They also have a nice set of spells, proficiencies of variable usefulness, and most importantly the absurdly useful Astral Knowledge. The ability to gain proficiency in up to 5 skills until a long rest, and swap it as needed, is the equivalent to a feat and a half if not more, and it can literally double a character's skill coverage before even considering its flexibility. Sure they lack Darkvision, but unlike some races without it, they *absolutely* make up for it. The main thing holding them back is how absurdly gangly and ugly they are in my subjective opinion. If you're into that more power to you, of course, and in that case they might even hit the top spot. But for me they're #2.

3. Gnome
(Appearance D, Flavor C, Mechanics S)
Gnomes are in this spot for basically one reason and one reason only - Advantage on *all* saves for Int, Wis, and Cha is just that good. Those saves are the ones which typically 'suck' the most (spells targeting them are typically "save or suck" effects taking you out of the fight or worse), and it's nearly guaranteed a character has one or more of those stats as a dump stat. To then gain advantage on them, which is better than a +5 to those saves mechanically, for not just one save or type of effect but all 3, is crazy powerful. The subraces gain useful things as well, either setting them up to be a great scout (deep gnomes) or unlocking bonus flavor (forest). Their appearance is unlikely to be particularly inspiring for most, and they certainly aren't as central to the plot as some others, but nonetheless you can never go wrong, with any character of any type, by rolling with a Gnome.

4. Elf
(Appearance A, Flavor C, Mechanics B)
I've pretty much said all that needs to be said in the Drow entry. It says something that even after losing a ton of flavor and being substantially worse mechanically "normal" elves are still #4, they're just so favored in terms of appearance options and the raw number of benefits thrown at them. Of the subraces Wood Elves have the most unique and useful benefits.

5. Tiefling
(Appearance B, Flavor A, Mechanics C)
They have some major plot interaction early, and the appearance of Tieflings may not have as much flexibility as Elves do but it's certainly a unique and interesting appearance, which many folks will be pleased with. They just don't have a ton going on mechanically, just a package of spells, darkvision, and fire resist. Certainly not as bad as some, but compared to what Drow or Githyanki get offered it's almost insultingly little.

6. Half Elf
(Appearance A, Flavor C, Mechanics B)
Generally you're trading an Elf's always useful proficiency in Perception for a sometimes useful set of armor and equipment proficiencies. For some builds, the tradeoff is worth it. Thankfully for them they're more elf than human mechanically. It can also be a way to cheat those proficiencies onto a Drow, which *can* be very useful and in which case it's a totally different scenario from a flavor standpoint. Still, for other builds those proficiencies are totally useless, and as such they're generally less flexible and thus overall worse mechanically on balance vs a "full" elf.

7. Half Orc
(Appearance B, Flavor B. Mechanics C)
Like Tieflings, they may not have a ton of variety in appearance, but there are many who will be pleased with the appearance you're given nonetheless. Okay flavor, and mechanics which look awesome at first glance. Triple damage on crits seems incredible, and automatically getting back up when downed is potentially game changing. Of course the latter is purely reactive, and does literally nothing if you're not downed. And the triple damage on crits *can* be good, in certain contexts and builds, specifically crit fishing Rogues or Paladins with lots of bonus dice added in. However since it doesn't impact non-dice damage, and things like Sharpshooter, Tavern Brawler, or Great Weapon Master rule the roost in damage, very often dice are much less than half the damage being dealt, and as such it's exceedingly unlikely to be better than say +10% damage overall in a fight. That's before even considering the high potential for overkill, or the countersynergy with effective target prioritization which would dictate targeting an enemy you *know* you can down without relying on a crit. Overall they're not bad, but not great.

8. Halfling
(Appearance D, Flavor C, Mechanics A)
Like Gnomes, the appearance will certainly be ideal for some folks, in which case they likely slide higher up on this list. But generally they have few customization options and let's just call it a 'niche' appearance, and while their mechanical ability of rerolling 1s is quite good, it's not as good as what Gnomes have going on. This is both because they're one of the few races without Darkvision (along with Githyanki, Dragonborn, and Humans) and more importantly because the usefulness of their ability is tied to rolling in a neutral state or even better yet with disadvantage. If you're rolling with advantage in the first place, you only have a 1/400 chance of getting a 1 in the first place, rendering their ability effectively moot. Still, rolling a 1 is enough of a feels bad, and having an automatic reroll on *everything* whenever that occurs is simply fantastic, preventing them from sliding further down this list.

9. Dwarf
(Appearance C, Flavor B, Mechanics C)
Of all the races, none lose out from their Pen and Paper equivalents more than Dwarves. Appearance wise, their bodies are suitably Dwarven, but the most important element of their appearance customization, the beard, is woefully slim pickings. You can't customize the jewelry or braiding, and if you want a nice, full, dwarven beard you really only have one or two options. Mechanically, they lose their Stonecunning and Tool Proficiencies with absolutely nothing to replace them, though they still get darkvision, poison resist, proficiencies of extremely questionable value, and some goodies from their subclass, none of which though are particularly impressive. They're still not terrible, they're just not what they could be and what many might hope them to be.

10. Dragonborn
(Appearance B, Flavor B, Mechanics D)
Their appearance is up there with Tieflings in terms of being awesome and inspiring for many, and who doesn't want to be partially freaking Dragon, in a game set in Dungeons and Dragons. Unfortunately while Tieflings don't have much going on mechanically, Dragonborn have it far worse. They basically trade the Tiefling spell package for effectively a single spell, and can swap the fire resist for a different one, but only a different choice on character creation not on the fly, and none of the options are better than fire resist anyway. They also lose Darkvision for reasons which make no sense at all to me, given the incredible perception powers (darkvison and even blindsense) of full fledged Dragons. If Half Elves are more Elf than Human, Dragonborn are *far* more Human than Dragon, unfortunately.

11. Human
(Appearance A, Flavor F, Mechanics F)
Last by a mile, humans are the absolute worst. Compared to Half Elves, they trade darkvision, a status immunity and resist, and subrace goodies for a skill proficiency and an almost completely irrelevant bonus to carry capacity. Compared to Drow, they trade being able to pick what their proficiency is (instead of it being Perception, which is again always useful), and having a different set of free proficiencies, and their useless carry capacity bonus, in exchange for losing a spell package, darkvision of any kind to say nothing of superior, a status immunity and advantage vs another status, and basically all of their flavor. I know folks that want to play as humans anyway because they always want to play as humans, but effectively choosing to do so is in my opinion basically like playing on a flavorless challenge mode compared to what you could be doing.