Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Story & Character Discussion Daisy, the Absolute, and the Emperor [SPOILERS]

The guardian says "I WAS infected" - that is true. He is just now a full mind flayer where before he was an elf infected with the tadpole. "I seek to be free of IT" - IT means in his case the brain and enslavement. Of course he can't say that because at this point we don't know he is a mind flayer yet. But that is hardly a lie - he wants to be free of the brain and not being a thrall / slave to anyone, in our case the tadpole would lead to the same enslavement.

There are definitely things that you can accuse him off, but to call him a liar because of this line is in my opinion being very sensitive/picky. Have a look at our companions what they say and do, they have secrets, manipulate and/or say awful things (Lae'zel with her flaying people line). And people are cool with them but if the Emperor keeps things secret it isn't. But you can not recruit or kill of your companions and I think that you can't do the same with the Emperor if you don't like him just increases the hate he gets.

Of course, there are definitely things with the Emperor where I totally understand when people are upset by it, but sometimes there are just things I personally find incredible unfair - like expecting him to be some perfect being - someone that no one in the game (even not the player in most cases) is - perfect nice and altruistic person, never lying, never hiding any information (like he has to spill everything about his person on the first meeting? Who does that?)... and he isn't. But no one ever said he is? But I get the impression every line of him is being presented as proof how mean and evil he is. Does anyone do that with Shadowheart or Lae'zel or Astarion?

As I said before - if you play like being trusting and nice to him you will see that he is nice in return. And when people say - yes, that is totally what he wants from you - then I can only say: yes, but why shouldn't I? We have the same enemy, we both want to be free (not being a slave, the player also normally would not want to be a mind flayer too), we both need each other. What do I gain from fighting him all the way when it works with him (aside from role playing reasons)? Yes, there is Orpheus as option, but he is a risk - we are fighting his honor guard, which see us as enemies due to our tadpole - it is like the Emperor said - with the tadpole in our head we are as good as mind flayers for them. And we know from the creche quest that their idea of a cure is to kill infected. We can also feel that Orpheus hates us (at least it is what the Narrator says in the Emperor reveal scene after the fight).

Don't get me wrong - I would love to have a persuasion option to have both the Emperor and Orpheus available. Hopefully they will add it.



Sorry, but killing Ansur was not murder. It was self defense. Ansur tried to "mercy" kill him in his sleep. I would defend myself too if someone decided I am no longer like they wish me to be. Ansur even calls him still Balduran - if he think he is gone now, why does he not call him just mind flayer? And look at the letter that the Emperor wrote to Ansur - it is really heartfelt. He didn't want Ansur to be in pain and asked him to leave.

The Emperor does say at first he wanted a cure too but came to like what he is now. Not sure if a cure without his cooperation would work but Ansur wasn't able to cure him and yes, even if possible he wouldn't want it. But still, I don't think this is something to hate him for.



I have tried different options and looked at the game files for the beach mind flayer. He forces the feeling love on us so that we don't attack him and willingly let him eat us. I think when mind flayers eat brains the victim has an euphoric feeling. But that has nothing to do with the Emperor - why would he still manipulate us at the end when we are about to die (in Karlachs case)? There is nothing to gain. And he just leaves, he does not attack us (even if solo and no companions are around), he does not try to dominate us to make us a thrall, he does not try it later (going with the epiloge not in game but in the game files, where everyone meets 6 months later). He just leaves and might offer some parting words (even to a player who was mean to him before he wishes them luck in the future to get the allies they desire). Unfortunately, some dialog is hidden if you have no companions with you or are playing certain origins.

I like your line, they should add more options, no question. I am not even sure he would be able to make all of the companions a thrall (and if only making the player character a thrall the others would likely know it and work against him too so not helpful) or even only with Tav to keep it up for a longer time. We do know he can take influence - if you try to get into the upper city despite his 3 warnings, he will move you back on its own, meaning he took kind of control of Tav and group, at least for a short time.


Don't worry, I am not here to judge you .

Don't forget that a wizard will have knowledge from books and I don't think the writers of the books we encounter have met many renegade mind flayers. It even says in the book that mind flayers will try to isolate you - yet the Emperor encourages you to get allies (even non tadpoled ones like Jaheira and Halsin), and that you should pay attention to its actions and not its words - what ever the Emperor says to you, at the end you can see that he keeps his word and destroys the brain and leaves you be.

We also know that mind flayers are not soulless (as it is so often said), Withers himself uses the term apostolic souls - mind flayer souls can't be used by the gods. We know they have souls because Ed Greenwood the creator of the forgotten realms confirmed it. Anyway, as the Emperor said - not every mind flayer is the same. They have feelings, I think that is canon from other sources (I think they can grief the death of their favourite thralls so much they might even die from it too). Don't forget Omeluum feels too - Blurg says he knows that Omeluum feels regret for the actions of other mind flayers. I interpret his line "feel some warmth" differently, not that he doesn't feel it but that he doesn't find the correct words for it as he doesn't remember his past life and now has to learn about humanoids and their ways.


Here some screenshots from dev notes from the game files
If you romance the Emperor and (sorry that must be hard for some to read now) kiss his tentacles he will enjoy it:


This is when he speaks about the now dead Duke Stelmane (I suppose you could argue that he is just sounding like it but doesn't mean it - but there is no proof for both that it is sincere or not)


He does show genuine gratitude if you acknowledge that he has feelings:


Here is the dev note regarding his line that he would never lie to you:


And here the comment for the whole romance night - no need for manipulation anymore:



I don't mind if people hate him - that is even understandable if you consider that he made the Duke a thrall. Although even with that we don't have all information. Stelmane is not a new character, there are pen and paper adventures with her and there is one where it says a mind flayer from the underdark (named Gruuk I think) was responsible for her stroke when he attacked her. But we don't know what made it into the game, Larian changed things. So maybe the Emperor is meant to replace Gruuk and is the one who gave her the stroke. It could also be argued that he found her with her stroke and with making her a thrall allowed her to "function" again in a way.

I don't think this is what happens but I want to say that there are things that we don't really know, we find books and information in the game but we had a rewrite and things changed (you can find in the game files for example that the Duke was at some time to be longer dead and the Emperor continued with her work) and additionally, if someone writes a book you have to keep in mind that you shouldn't maybe belive it to be true 100% too - that is what my history teacher even told me back in school about historic documents - always think about who wrote it and why would they write it? How would the content change dependend on their view? Not saying Larian went that way but like with the book about mind flayers - just because the "normal" mind flayers are evil (because the elder brains are apparently), doesn't mean that every mind flayer is (especially the renegade ones).

I would also not put "he worshipped a devil" on him because we don't get any information about that in game. I think this is from a source outside as the Duke and the knights weren't created by Larian. I don't think he would worship a devil, from his lines about Raphael he doesn't sound like he would do that but instead despise them.

I also understand if people hate him because he might be the one that tadpoled us. However, while I think it was him, it doesn't mean he was it. We don't have 100% proof. The biggest thing that is missing is a reaction from the player character upon seeing him in the reveal scene. The player character is a little frightened it seems but no response or recognition, no narrator telling us, yes, that is the one who put the tadpole into you. And if you play Durge, he wasn't responsible for tadpoling the player character. So for some people he is not the one and so this is not a reason to hate him. But you could interpret it as such and get a new impression. But even then, I don't mind if he did it to my character, it was a way to safe the city at last. And if you play evil, to get more power. Depends how you role play or not, maybe I see it just practical as way to get the game going on...

For me personally, I think he is an interesting character and it is fun to have a renegade mind flayer that is at least on the good side (working towards a good goal) for once and that we can interact with aside from killing it. And that he isn't the knight in shining armor - there are problematic actions he did (at least implied with the Duke, I don't count Ansur to this) and yes, he is out to ensure his freedom but he is not evil evil like Orin or Gortash who want to enslave everyone (or to simply kill everyone). And depending on your interpretations and experience with him (and we have in many cases not 100% proof to say he really means it this or this way so different interpretations are valid) you get a different experience and can see him as evil or at neutral alignment (if one cares about that).