@ Nicotta. Love the post! While I do like the "crush it" option the idea of bringing down The Emperor with a thrown tadpole is so fun I might just have to take your suggestion.

@ussnorway While our actions differed it seems we had the same reaction!

Oh so the main path in the game is evil - I guess BG has gone from "can you resist the evil inside" to "you should embrace the evil inside - it's fun!" (tell me you can't imagine the Larian CEO saying that)

@Cawden

This is:
A) my attempt to get @Salo or however combs these forums to notice that some people are not happy with the end game

B) just good fun.

I'm not here to ruin your fun.

If you want to see The Emperor as good - as it want you see it - that's great. That's fun for you. OF COURSE this is all IMO. It's video game forum and this is all interpretation of text that has multiple authors, has been revised several times and is designed to support different playthroughs. We're all staring at ink blocks.

That doesn't mean I'm not going argue vigorously smile I do think I'm right! But I also enjoy hearing about your experience. But, yes, yes, yes we all just talking about interpretation. It's just a game.
Quote
Using tadpoles if the Emperor assures you aren't going to affect you negatively to increase the chance of success is not evil

As DM I would totally accept that from a player and remove the alignment violation check away from the character sheet. But - and I'm going to have to bleed over into your #2. Yes, mind flayers - with a handful of exceptions - are intrinsically evil. They create thralls, dominate and feed on others. Omelleum's do exist but they are exceedingly rare.

(and the emperor isn't an Omelleum - he acts like a independently evil mind flayer)

So swallowing tadpoles - inching closer to becoming a creature without an apostolic soul - is something that threatens alignment. And doing while being manipulated by an evil mastermind should impact DM rulings I think good roleplay would involve discovering evidence of the emperor's evil and finding a way to cut the strings.

Omelleum vs the Emperor

Omelleum's alignment is true neutral. As he is listed in the FR books. (with a different name) Omelleum joined a scholarly society, he has tried to find a moral alternative to brains and has come up with the same one I use with Astarian: if they attack your party you can feed.

The emperor is evil. Yes because he is a mind flayer - which are evil monsters - but because he does not act like Omelleum. He acts like a Manshoon or other evil mastermind. Is he nice to us if we are nice to him? Sure, the same way I'm nice to scratch. If we are good we get scritches but if we make master mad . . . Btw, did you notice that if you click on the dog collar in his lair you automatically put it on? Read that interaction again keeping in mind that the believes that Illithid are the superior species. He likes us if we act like a good girl.


In bullet point

Omelleum-

No thralls
No domination
Solitary study
Tries to help extract tadpole
No evidence of belief in the superiority of illithids
Constant search for alternative to brains

Emperor

Thralls
Controls diabolic criminal organization
Dominates and manipulates others
Believes mind flayers are a superior species
Encourages Tav to become half illithid
Ranches humanoids



The Knights of the Shield

Let's be clear - there is no doubt in the FR lore that the Knights are an evil organization. AGAIN, I am not saying The Emperor is a devil worshiper, I'm saying he works for a devil. The purpose of the Knights of the Shield is Garguth's purpose. Just like in 3.5 DnD the purpose of the Zhentarim was the purpose of the Church of Bane.

Was The Emperor (TE) "worshiping a devil" by corrupting the leadership of Baldur's Gate? No but he was advancing the interests of devil. If the BG did not engage in corruption the leadership would have been removed - TE would have lost its position. And a mind flayer in an excellent corruption agent.

To belabor the point - TE might not have known but he would have been replaced as leader if Garguth wasn't happy. The Knights do what The Shield tells them to do.

Sure, as you suggest, Larian could have changed the lore. But they didn't. Why have the Knights and some other random criminal organization? Why make the corruption of BG's leadership be part of the story? Why have Wyll comment on it? Wyll's story - what little of is left of it - is about discovering that the Knights were at the heart of corruption in city. The leader of Knights made a duke into a thrall, smuggled, killed the protector of the city. TE was an end boss before the dead three strolled back into town.

And thus my upset - we have to choose between two evils.