Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Story & Character Discussion [END SPOILS WARNING] Addressing Karlach (PLEASE PUT SPOILERS IN TAGS)

I'm not sure if Citadel DLC changed something regarding the ending, but the extended cut completely changed the tone of the red ending as high assets leave the earth intact and relays only damaged with Hackett saying they'll repair them. The original idea was obviously mindnumbigly stupid because as you said, half of the species that were stranded away from their planet would starve without FTL so luckily at least that was changed. We see damaged relays in the blue ending that are being repaired by the now controlled Reapers, but I think this scene was added in the extended cut so i'm not sure if that was the case in the original ending. As for Karlach and co being potentially captured in Avernus, you don't have to imagine anything, just remember that Karlach's tatoos and writings carved on her horns are Zariel's mockery. And when it comes to rewriting her, what I meant is that her concept needs to be changed, they could somehow put just another quest but if that was the plan I think it would be patched some time ago. If the change is coming, I'd expect it to be something bigger, likely expanding her questline in previous acts

Ah understood, thank you.
I didn’t get far enough to discover what the carvings on her horns meant as after stumbling across this thread I just stopped playing.

Why would her whole concept need to be changed her whole story isn't something that has to be rewritten from the ground up to add a fix. It could be larian is wanting to add more content for companions in general and they want to add karlachs expanded content with the rest of it. Also not trying to be rude but I'd like an answer to norrecs question. That being why you keep posting if you just want to keep reiterating that it's unlikely she'll get a fix, or any kind of happy ending in spite of numerous posts countering your claims. I'd bet larian is working on alot of act 3 stuff in general as well as asterion and other companions and would rather release something like that all at once. Perhaps as a new patch, or dlc, or even a DE

I never said she won't have a fix, I said it wasn't planned originaly because she wasn't even companion at the very begining. That was her concept, then it was changed to companion then to origin so quite a lot of changes and it shows considering she barely has any content (compare it to the whole dungeon for SH or a creche of Lae'Zel for example). That's why I say it's not likely they'll just patch some quick fix with Dammon, Gondians or whoever. If the change is coming, they'll likely improve her whole questline so she feels like an actual origin not side character. In short, they'll rewrite her concept

I see the argument that they'll add more to her quest like with shadowheart and laezel. Maybe make avernus a full area with the expressed purpose of finding a cure within avernus itself. But you keep ignoring all the components within the game already that point to a fix by saying well they would've just added it or well the enriched infernal iron could be anything. I do hope you're right and instead of adding in something small and keeping her questline small they add something large like the dungeon or the creche. And in the event they were to add an entire area like that it would take quite alot of work, something more than a patch I think. Maybe that'll be a dlc or bundled with other companion add ons. That being said though I'm not sure why they'd need to rewrite the whole concept that just doesn't make sense. Adding on a whole area for her to get the cure or fix from that is something I could see if they want to make her feel more like an origin character but that wouldn't require a rewrite at all. I'd love to hear the reasoning for the rewrite cause I'm seeing 0 reason for it

You’re not sure because it really doesn’t make any sense. You, and others, have explained that adnauseum for pages, and it’s clear enough for any casual visitors to the thread.

In the meantime, I’m wondering about which areas for her to get a cure would be better. Damon’s upgraded forge is there, and it’s awesome as has been noted, and the Gondians or Ironworks are also easy possibilities, but the House of Hope could always have an option.

I’m not sure if there are tangible differences here or if it would boil down to what simply makes for a better story?

Honestly though I do feel rather angry, Larian has done this to me twice now.
They know that critics are smooth-brains that often can’t even play the games they’re reviewing and often just play a few hours before writing their review.
Game awards usually take an aggregate of the reviews to make their decision.
So they make their first act excellent with plenty of choice then flop the rest of it only to possibly fix it later.
They did this with the other game of theirs I played Divinity 2 where I was very excited after the first and to a lesser extent second act only to get to the final part and feel really unfulfilled.

What’s worse as a citizen of the Isle of Rain and Misery I do love nautical stuff so of course my favourite character was Beast who was the one they selected to get shafted.

From what I understand they fixed him a year later but by then I had moved on because although their policy of being silent is VERY smart from a business standpoint as often situations are made many times worse by bad PR management (see Mass Effect 3) it basically forces you to just move on and forget.

And THEY BLOODY DID IT AGAIN, they gave me an adorable working class lass with a London accent and decided she would be an excellent subject for some railroaded misery porn.

I was ranting to my scouse mates about how good the game was and how I had heard some scouse accents finally giving them some representation (while laughing that they were of course bandits and shady dealers) only to get slapped in the face after I realised they had done it again and somehow picked the character I liked to be the butt-monkey.

Perhaps they will fix it in a years time, perhaps they will double down and insist that this is excellent story telling and we’re just too stupid and sensitive to appreciate their genius.

It wouldn’t be as bad but they hire god tier voice actors that really make you care for the characters…
Whatever, I’ll shut up and wait if they just this once break their silence policy and tell us they’re working on something but meh if not Larian are going on the Bethesda / BioWare pile for me.

I kinda liked an idea I saw that Damon even with his upgraded forge still needs special tools to properly work on the engine. That could lead to The group going to what's left of elturel to get his special tools or raid the demon forge he was at while working on infernal machinery. Something similar could be done with the gondians like even with all their skill they need special infernal tools to work on the engine. It could boil to any number of things I don't have a real idea personally but Damon would likely be the road they take.


This is alot of what kills me is karlach is everything I love wrapped into one character and I was so ready to enjoy her full story until I found out the truth. I'm really hoping for news after the game awards with this being their biggest hit and them saying dlc isn't off the table makes me hopeful we're gonna hear news sooner rather than later

Tbh, I'd love that, as her content now is barebones. At times, she does give me the 'npc' companion feeling than an actual origin character which is sad. If Larian didn't manage to get her story whole due to time, then all the more reason to add more content now that the game is out.

Yea it would make sense if they want to add something large for karlach to get you up to scale with the other origin characters. I'm here for it as long as we are gonna get it but as others said larians history of not talking about anything is good for business bad for us. I just hope they give some small post on insta or Twitter that says yes we are giving karlach more content and a happy ending. I know it won't happen but I'd be really nice to see.

Apologies for being slightly off topic (or on topic?) but I wanted to add my voice to this incredibly long thread. The way Karlach's story resolves as it is right now in incredibly cruel, and nonsensical. It's not just cruel in writing, but it indirectly implicates all of the other companions around her as callous and cruel as well, as it indirectly makes them callous and uncaring to her situation. As numerous people have stated early in this thread, there are a number of ways for other companions to defy death that can also be shared with Karlach, and I'm really wondering if whoever made this decision didn't fully consider that this also implicates a level of cruel indifference in the other companions, or perhaps they just don't care.

I am feeling a little bitter though, since I'm only just reaching the end of the game for the first time, and tried to see if there was a way to help her that I was missing---since the game itself sprinkles a thousand hints and foreshadowing that you can---only for me to find out here that it's not at all possible. If that was your intention, you should not have written her story this way. And if it was your intention, it needs to be clearer from the very beginning. You're not just killing Karlach, you're also making the other "good" characters indirectly cruel through inaction, and stringing the player along with breadcrumbs that lead nowhere. As others have said, there are other companions where a perma-death would make more sense as the conclusion to their story, but it just does not make sense in the narrative you've created once we arrive in Act 3 for Karlach.

If she's to have an unavoidable death, it should be through player choice or inaction, not some inevitability because some content had to be cut and the reaching implications didn't matter. I know that the "return to Avernus" ending also exists, but that is not what I would consider a good or happy end, either (unless some sort of DLC is planned to expand on that, in which case that could also potentially resolve this, but still ...)

Anyway. Apologies again for being extra salty in here, I am just very passionate about Karlach. I love her and I love this game, so to have discovered that this is supposedly the end of her story deeply sours me on act 3 as a whole. It just doesn't make sense, given the context of the Steel Watch, given the context of Dammon being present with his forge, given the context of having access to multiple points of Divine Intervention, as well as a True Resurrection scroll. All of this, this entire thread and all the people asking for something to be done, could have been avoided if the possibility was provided (or taken away) through player choice.

Hell, I would've been more inclined to accept it if the companions didn't all universally love Karlach. The other companions clearly don't all like each other, and if they were even simply neutral towards Karlach then inaction is logical. But if there's any ONE person they all universally care about from the beginning to the end, it's Karlach specifically. Even if we the player do nothing, the rest of them love her and thus, arguably, would try to help her in some way. This is just another "this does not make any sense" example to add to the fire here.

Welcome to the club friend! Yea you pretty well hit all the points on the head it's something that really doesn't make sense when weighed against the themes of the rest of the game. That being hope and fighting to win against crazy odds and winning. But in karlachs case they just said yea she doesnt get to win ignore all those ways you could save her cause they dont work. I hadn't considered the way her fate makes the rest of thr group looks until recently but you and others are 100% correct it paints the group even in the morally good runs as uncaring at best and intentionally cruel at worst. Dlc isn't off the table as larian said earlier but the content or number of those dlcs is anyone's guess.

If its karlach ending salt, this is the place to do it my friend.
Any new voice coming in and saying the same points most of us have made alrdy is still good cause it shows larian theres a big desire to see her story line beefed up/tweaked to be more inline with the other origins. Aswell as just giving mama K a happy ending she actually* deserves. Perferably not in hell
>_>

100% the larger the this thread the better.

Gondians will help us in DE, I'm sure.

The the DE we trust.

Patch 5 comes out this week and their isn't even a mention of karlach :') well that sucks

At this point im glad of that. The less changes* i see to karlach in patches the more likely *imo* that they are working on bigger fleshed out content rather then small tweaks and fixes to *appease* us. Lol like you said in DE we trust.

But hopefully patch 5 fixes patch 4. I cant continue anything in act 3 as my companions refuse to follow me.

I haven't seen that big but maybe I'm not deep enough into act 3 to get hit with it. You're probably right about the less changes though and larian isnt likely to give any info until a week before they drop it.

I wouldn't have expected anything related to Karlach with Patch 5, to be honest. If they do give us an engine fix, it will require more time, especially with them currently working on the xbox release as well. I'd rather have them do it properly than give us another band-aid like the last time. No news is good news, for now, at least they're not making things worse.

I'm curious what Patch 5 entails, though, they did say that "a lot" was going to be adressed. Hopefully Minthara finally gets an actual bugfix.