Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Build Discussion 6/6 paladin-bard on tactician?

I’m thinking of doing a Shadowheart origin playthrough, but I’ve played her as a cleric so many times that I’d like to do something a little different. So I’m thinking about respeccing her into an oath of vengeance paladin. I’m also interested in having the spirit guardians spell on hand, so that she can do some good radiant damage while in melee. I don’t want to split my stats between charisma, strength, and wisdom, so getting to level five cleric is probably not going to work.

I was thinking of doing a lore bard and getting magical secrets at level six. So I could have spirit guardians and counterspell, which is always awesome to have. I also love cutting words, so that’s a plus. Thoughts on this combination? Thoughts on level progression and what I should take when? I was thinking two Paladin levels first to get all of those smites, but after that I’m not quite sure. Thanks folks!

Not a bad combo for Party Face and Social Skills Monkey .
Which to take as first - this depends on how much you want Heavy Armour.
Save Throw Proficiency - Bard gives you DEX and CHA, Paladin - WIS and CHA. As neither gives you CON save proficiency (for Concentration), a toss up
Two starting lvls of Paladin would also give you Defence Fighting Style, good for a tank.
I personally would start with two lvls of Paladin - more for the Defence than Smites - and then 6 of Bard. I'd push AC to 22-23 (HA, Shield, Defence, one or two +1AC trinkets) and wade into melee, letting the Spirit Guardians do the work. As the 2nd Attack would come only at lvl 11 I'd leave it out of consideration, the Smites being a Nice to Have feature
If you Fall, simply play as Oathbreaker.
As I have never started Act 3 nor passed beyond lvl 9 I have no experience and can only ask - how relevant would that 2nd Attack be? Could Bard 8/Paladin be better than 6/6, due to extra Feat? The lvl4 Spell?
Also - if I am reading things right - at 6/6 ESL would be 6+(0,5x6)=9. At 8+4 it'd be 10. The difference is having one or two lvl4 Spell Slots.

Done this with vengeance and college of swords

5 levels Paladin + 5 levels bard (and 1 more level Paladin + bard, order doesn't really matter)
Potential problems: Build comes fully online only at level 10 (bardic inspiration resets on short rest, giving a lot of double smites)

The cost is a second feat only at level 9, not 8. No third feat. Would not recommend for lone wolf runs. This build basically builds upon the strengths the vengeance Paladin already has, but since they drop off after level 5, multiclass gives another major bump late game.

You don't really lose any important benefits long term except a 1d8 to smites. Having higher level spellslots than a pure Paladin and being quicker at depleting them more than makes up for it in my opinion.

There is a version which starts out as bard, then takes Paladin levels and works only really in combination with invisibility.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=0_tfO5w-0Hc&pp=ygUIYmFyZGFkaW4%3D

The go to for mutliclassing vengeance paladins is the Sorcadin, however. (For good reason. Not in the least: double hold person as a bonus action --> Band of the mystic scoundrel.)

What I personally don't like about such builds is that the smites are always competing for spells slots with everything else. What it does do is that it creates a character that is equally deadly no matter the distance, but that is only a boon if mobility is a major problem. The Investment for CC is more worth it, but I did do it to be contrarian. Also, it's not like I can't have an actual sorcerer for it in the party.

Vengeance paladins get their mobility at level 5, the same time they get multiattack. Going 2 levels Paladin, X everything else therefore majorly hurts not only your mobility, but pushes multiattack a lot further back (11). That means half the amount of smiting. You'll be rather reliant on items as well, because a Paladin is regretably incredibly slow.

But, because Paladins don't use charisma to smite, I'm not sure if a Paladin 5, cleric 2/3 dip wouldn't give you spirit guardians alongside better benefits. Do you really need 5 cleric levels, let alone 6 Bard levels? BG3 counts half casters in a weird way: it might just give you enough to unlock spirit guardians at levels 8. That's not fantastic, but the lore bard way only gets it at level 8, too. Might as well pocket something useful from a cleric subclass, like warding flare. Or war priest charges. If lore bard got multiattack, they'd have my vote since decent bonus action > reaction, but they don't.

Paladins are single target damage dealers. If you cast hold person or hold monster successfully, anything is dead. If it's not dead, try again with a monk as backup. Adding aoe is tempting, but there's usually a downside. However, Swords Bard 10, Paladin 2 gives you everything you asked for, except... you'll be in the middle of Act 3 by then. Start out as Paladin 5, switch at level 8 to Paladin 2, swords 6.

No cleric spells until level 12. Maybe bearable if you install one of the mods that makes the end game level 20 (either for real, or through mutliclassing only (so still only up to 12 levels in each pure class)). Add a diffulty mod. Aaand... The experiment is alive?

Going 2 Pally/10 College of Swords Bard works really well.

Take Pally first for heavy armor and smite at level two. Then go Bard the rest of the way. You can take defensive style with Pally for +1 AC and then either dueling for +2 damage with sword & board or go with dual wielding.

16 str
10 dex
14 con
8 int
10 wis
16 cha

Feats = dual wield, either savage strikes for more damage on average, +2 str, or heavy armor mastery for +1 str (+ hag) and -3 incoming damage. Or if sword & board shield mastery for better dex saves or whatever you want.

You get your 2nd attack at level 8 but dual wielding gets you an extra attack and the bard flourishes can help in striking multiple target, movement or better AC. Once they reset on a short rest you can use them pretty often.

Lots of spell slots for smites. Plus you get the bard secret spells at level 10 along with the great bard skill perks.

Very nice.
BTW - I lost my Oath by not killing the Hag ...

I had Vengeanace Paladin 2/ bard 10 and it was strong enough for Tactician.

I am playing a multiplayer game where we each get one companion and mine is Shadowheart. I made her a Paladin with high Charisma (and lower Wisdom). When unlocking the secrets of the Necromancy of Thay book at Paladin level 5, I decided to add Warlock (The Great Old One) as a second class which seems to fit from a role-playing point of view. This is a really nice combo since Pact of the Blade bonus attack stacks with the Paladin extra attack and any weapon I bind will use Charisma as the stat for attack / damage. The only sacrifice is the third feat.

I think the final build will be lv 5 Paladin and lv 7 Warlock to get the level 4 spells in Act 3.