Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Build Discussion Loss to ESL from Fighter vs. Ranger

@Crimsomrider


Hello, can you slowly repeat to me exactly how this concept works? How do you do damage? Why do you need this dance spell? Why this equipment? How does it all fit together?

I might have to make my own fully detailed thread for this because I didn't expect any interest in my roleplay build, just wanted to answer what ESL meant

Here's how Eilistraee's Sword Dancer deals with "Grandpa";


*Sorry about the video quality, forgot to set up for a recording*

• Naturally strategy is important; if you plan on casting at all during this fight by fighting him solo, you have to take care of Illasera. I personally prefer to slap her out of the fight immediately.

• As for Haste; I wouldn't say it's absolutely essential, but I love using it in boss battles or huge spread-out battles because it provides +2AC with Concentration along with a massive movement range bonus. Plus sword singing requires an Action, so you can see at 01:35 in the video why it's super helpful for Melody: Shriek + Defensive Flourish + Stage Fright combo.
  
  Without it you will end up wasting turns because you won't be able to reach your enemies. And although she does have a bow equipped for its passives, she's forbidden from using it because Eilistraee's sword dancers do not use bows.

• As for her hit chance it's not an issue at all. Grandpa's AC in particular only gets overblown if you take out Sendai who grants him permanent +6 AC., but even if you kill her it's not a big deal because any time he enrages with Deathbringer's Legacy he loses that AC.
  
  Which is why I just ignore her since all she does is cast Command Grovel or Slow, which she can't even land because my Saving Throws are incredibly high so the only way for me to fail the save is if I roll a 1 or 2.
  
  As for her damage; her fighting style is a combination of both her sword and spells which together form a dance to unleash a blend of Physical/Psychic/Holy and Thunder damage types. Because the beauty of the build is that it's versatile, built for both short-term bursts and long-term adventuring since Eilistraee's Sword Dancers are not one-trick ponies. Even though her sword is the primary focus of the build, as you saw her magic is equally as deadly.
  
  Stage Fright is just one ability out of many in her diverse arsenal which naturally helps against physical enemies, but does nothing against casters. Just like Smite may be a great burst ability, but can't be used against enemies who can't be hit or have Radiant Retort. Each situation has the best tool available for the job and that's where the build for me truly shines.
  
  For example I could have gone that entire fight without a single Smite or Stage Fright by just using regular attacks with Vicious Mockery since he can barely land a hit on me as it is, but being economical with resources is not interesting to watch. I also could have just ignored Illasera, baited her Counterspell and then used Hold to paralyze him and do some giga-crits. Or if I can't hit him I could have started Melody: Shriek and unleashed Magic Missiles upon him. There are numerous ways one can approach the fight and that's why I enjoy the build so much.

• [Mirror Of Loss]. Without spoilers, it's at the end of Shadowheart's personal questline and you need to pass 25 Arcane and Religion checks to obtain the buffs. If you want it immediately as you enter Lower City you can also sneak into the place and obtain it without losing any story content.

If you wish to see it partially in action the video above shows some of her combat prowess solo against an Honour Mode boss.

I might have to make my own fully detailed thread to explain everything, but in short it's my roleplaying build specifically shaped to reflect all the lore elements of Eilistraee's Sword Dancers, inspired by Qilué Veladorn the Dark Sister who as Eilistraee's High Priestess was equally deadly with her spells as she was with her holy blade called "Iluemeirarra", an Eilistraee's priestess whose soul was bound the blade.

• (The Sword Dancer)

  
  

  Quote

  The Sword Dancers were skilled sword wielders, known to use their art while fencing. They fought employing an agile and acrobatic style, that allowed them to quickly and gracefully move on the battlefield, with movements that resembled a dance.
  
  They could form a particular bond with their sword, which allowed them to infuse the weapon with Eilistraee's magic. They could imbue it with a variety of magical enhancements, let it sing like a singing sword (making them strike with increased precision and rallying their hearts), or let it dance (like a dancing weapon) to attack the enemy on its own or to protect the priestess.
  
  The Sword Dancers had the ability to cast the magic missile spell, or to use its energy to empower their next sword strike, surrounding their blade with blue-white flames. They could also use their magic to temporarily enchant a bladed weapon with a silvery glow that increased the precision of its strikes, without the possibility of it being dispelled.
  
  The Sword Dancers could sing and dance to channel the power of Eilistraee and had the ability to sing their magic even amidst the chaos of the battle, while dodging and dancing around or while wounded. They could use a particular kind of Spellsong. A solitary spellsinger could replicate the effects of many spells (of 4th level or lower), heal a given creature or grant her protection from magic, a choir of them could create more powerful beneficial effects (like restoring lost limbs).
  
  Other magical abilities of these specialized priestesses were the capacity to cast spell turning, commune, true seeing, stone telling and plane shift.

  
  

• (The Guardian as Eilistraee)

  

It's a specifically shaped roleplay build reflecting all of Eilistraee's lore that just also happens to be quite strong and versatile. So to understand the concept of it one would have to read the lore about Eilistraee's sword dancers.

Thanks again. Your build is just great because it is perfect from lore as well as effectiveness, so interest in it should not surprise.

I will not copy your build because I'm a wood half elf without relations to Ellistrae and I cannot use Illithid powers any more (that's RP, not from the game). Hurts a bit as flying around was so convenient. One practical aspect, I never played the encounters in Act 3 before, so I cannot plan the fights strategically in advance. Your build offers nevertheless a lot of inspirations. What I take the most from it is the first approach to the Bard and Paladin classes which I always avoided before. And maybe I should visit this House of Grief, the mirror makes me greedy.

My current group, with Alicia in her new gear (she likes it a bit unconventional, she's an artist; often she goes barefoot, but a difficult fight may be just around the corner, so she donned boots with flying ability), a bit more armored than your char, but still light enough to dance a little bit:

Which Feats did you choose?

Whom do you mean? The char shown by me is 2 Cleric/ 8 Bard/ 2 Paladin, so there are only two feats available. That does mean to take two times the increase of Dexterity, up to 20. Important for hit chance, initiative, AC (the armor shown is actually the medium Armor of Agility, 17 AC + the whole Dex modifier, just transmogged to a different appearance) and to a lesser degree damage increase.

As Crimsonrider's char has 22 Dex, I bet she also took two times Dex increase to 20. To start with 17 Dex and taking Athlet one time would also be possible, but that would be bad for the Wisdom attribute.

I wanted to know the feats Crimsonriders took

Understandable, I was actually not going to be using tadpoles for her but I managed to roleplay it in by her believing her Guardian is really Eilistraee or at least her avatar. So she never asks the Guardian directly who she is, she just presumes her to be Eilistraee.

Also nice character, lovely elvish style. The only thing I personally can't stand in any game ever are helmets because they hide individuality of a character, which is why I prefer always seeing their faces when I roleplay

I hope Larian gives us transmog so we can truly make our character's individuality shine.


I start with 10 STR / 17 DEX / 8 CON / 8 INT / 14 WIS / 16 CHA.

+2 DEX as the first feat, Savage Attacker as the second to maximize melee damage (especially smites).

The Hag I convince to give me the +1DEX along with Mayrina, and then I nuke her butt outside of dialogue with Shadowheart

Just 8 Constitution, that's bold. And never ever a deal with the Hag, a rule since first EA days.

I can totally understand the reluctance with helmets, especially as most helmets are quite ugly/deformed in BG3 (the helmet you see is actually the uber-ugly helmet which deals 1d4 radiant damage to enemies who missed, transmogged with a Paladin helmet). I however have problems with being without a helmet when wearing considerable body armor. Nobody would wear body armor but no helmet. It's not a problem with your sword dancer in a robe, makes sense not to wear a helmet. That is the main reason I changed my concept and gave her a robe too. I then transmogged the helmet to a headband.

(To be honest, I skilled her back to Cleric/Sorcerer in the end, but that's a different story ... )

I actually do not understand how much damage you can make in a passive way

2D6 Psycic Damage - Stage Fright
1D8 Thunder Damage - Shriek

thats an average of 8 Damage . What do i miss?

It doubles Psychic damage, so;

• Stage Fright is actually 4d6.
• Psionic Backlash is 2d4 per enemy's spell level.
• Cull The Weak is 2d4.

Psionic Backlash needs a spell wright?

No Thunder Damage from Shriek?

Correct.

No idea what you mean by the 2nd question though.

https://bg3.wiki/wiki/Phalar_Aluve:_Shriek

I meant the ability of Phalar Aluve

If you're asking whether I use Shriek along with the passive damage mentioned above, then yes.

Though I use Shriek primarily to make enemies susceptible to spells, the thunder damage is a nice little bonus to overall damage since it applies to every source of damage done against enemies.

Are the 2 Levels of Paladin really necessary?

Depends on how you want to play your fights, I think. You lose at least a big chunk of damage, without access to Smite.

Due to lore, the reasons why I take two Paladin levels are;

• It allows her to imbue/enchant/empower her blade with Eilistraee's magic and by doing so makes her extremely deadly with her blade when required.
• The Oath Of The Ancients upholds everything Eilistraee stands for;
  
  (Oath Of The Ancients)

  • Kindle the Light; Through your acts of mercy, kindness, and forgiveness, kindle the light of hope in the world, beating back despair.
  • Shelter the Light; Where there is good, beauty, love, and laughter in the world, stand against the wickedness that would swallow it. Where life flourishes, stand against the forces that would render it barren.
  • Preserve Your Own Light; Delight in song and laughter, in beauty and art. If you allow the light to die in your own heart, you can’t preserve it in the world.
  • Be the Light; Be a glorious beacon for all who live in despair. Let the light of your joy and courage shine forth in all your deeds.

So they are necessary to me for roleplay purposes to embody certain aspects of Eilistraee's priestesses which cannot otherwise be obtained through other classes. Because as I mentioned before I carefully crafted my character to be equally deadly with both her blade and her spells while fully maintaining the roleplay and established lore, therefore without these two levels not only are you losing out on lore aspects related to Eilistraee's priestesses, but also massively gimping your own blade.

This delicate balance is what allows her to solo Honour Mode.

and for more less roleplaying reasons ?

In pure gameplay terms;

By dropping the Paladin levels you'd be gimping your own melee damage in scenarios where you may want to burst down an NPC quickly and by doing so you'd be shifting your arsenal balance drastically towards spells (like Magic Missiles) rather than being equally deadly with both the blade and spells.

Which means any NPC with Counterspell would entirely restrict you to just pure melee (which still does decent damage), but you'd waste several turns hunting them down due to lack of melee burst damage instead of just smacking them once to get them out of the fight (as the video above evidently shows how both casters got knocked out in a single turn).

That's why the Paladin is useful so she doesn't become a one-trick pony that's easily shut down by a single trivial spell, instead she's equally deadly with both melee and spells. She always has options for every scenario.

But as I keep saying this is a roleplay build I carefully crafted for myself to fully embody Eilistraee's lore, that just happens to also be powerful and versatile enough to solo Honour Mode. Without the Paladin, solo Honour Mode is out of the question and if one is not interested in the roleplay aspects of it, then there's really no point in even trying to replicate it.

I can assure you that you can use this build very well in Baldur's Gate 3 even without roleplaying specific interests, admittedly in a normal group. How do I know that? I'm playing it right now . It works very well when someone else in the party speaks Hare and you can protect yourself with Blur as it triggers various artifacts anyway.

I just wanted to know if from your point of view Paladin levels are really necessary from a purely gamistic point of view or if you could go for example to Cleric 5 / Wizard 1 / Bard 6.

As I said, a purely gamistic approach