Originally Posted by Naginata
The spells I mentioned can also be used at higher levels and you can then quickly checkmate 3-4 opponents and finish them off with critical damage. I played a Paladin 6 / Sorcerer 6 Critlander on one run. This works excellently. There are plenty of ways to increase your spell DC, so it's all worth more than five percent of Champion, but of course only in terms of game mechanics. If there are other reasons (roleplaying) why you take Fighter forget what I said smile

If you play with a normal group you don't even have to do the following options on your opponent (I can't guarantee the completeness of the list)

- Hold Person
- Sleep (I mean the condition not necessarily the spell)
- Drow Potion
- Glyph of Warding (Sleep)
- Crawler Mucus (Paralyzed Condition)
- Hold Monster
- Ghouls from Danse Macabre
- Wolf Wild Shape (Exposing Bite)
- Killer Sweetheart
- Luck of the Far Realms


And the most important artifact is of course Diadem of Arcane Synergy wink


But thanks again to you for the nice discussion

I'm not sure we talk about the same. You can do all this stuff for criticals. You need usually two chars for it, one has to have a high spell DC, one has to have a reliable high damage action to make it worth it. It's not great to crit after Hold Monster with a low damage roll. Paladins do decent damage on crits, at least as long as spell slots are available, but I don't have a Paladin in the group (I don't like them). Wether it's a good idea of "wasting" an action with a control spell instead of doing damage is a separate question. I'm too lazy to do the math, including hit chances.

For me that is not an argument against a crit build however. Methods for guaranteed crits do not make the Champion feature useless. I can do all the fixed crits too (Gale is mainly a Magic Missile machine and has only 22 spell DC, so it could be surely better), but my main also crits with every fourth normal spell. If I would not prefer a balanced approach with also defense in mind, I could crit more often.

The problem of leveling Champion is not that it is only +5% crit chance. It is the loss of a feat I could otherwise get which would free me an item slot. But I can compensate the missing feat with a +2 Charisma item while I needed medium armor proficiency to wear the appropiate head item with + crit chance, which a pure Warlock/Sorceress does not have. So in the end the dip into Fighter as third class is the better alternative.