Ascended Astarion gets a very explicit insight check where you discover he thinks you are degrading yourself by agreeing to this relationship, and also states if broken up with that he would have ruined you until you were nothing.
Originally Posted by LiryFire
He thinks he thinks Tav is degrading himself by being with him. WITH HIM. He's right, because life with decadence, he's not a fairy tale prince "and he knows that's what you want." Also shows his insecurity and hurt self-esteem during the years of slavery, not that "Tav is being humiliated, disrespectful, lower". He wouldn't be saying "we" and a bunch of other stuff if that were the case. I think narcissistic-dominant-obsession with a vampire is more complicated than that.
Yes, he remains insecure despite all his power, he still needs to get used to it and can't just discard his feelings with a wave of the hand. He was suffering from self-esteem issues before the ritual and he is still the same person after it. He thinks you deserve someone better than him, but if you are into being humiliated then he shall provide and enjoy it thoroughly. I heard that in the German translation it is specifically said that he thinks he's not a good person and that's why you're humiliating yourself by being with him. Besides, he'd already shown hints he has a domination kink and is fantasising about being rough with Tav.
As for the ruination dialogue - it takes him 3 days to calm down before he can even speak to you. No one else takes the breakup as bad as he does. I think he's saying what would hurt Tav the most. He had all this time to prepare his speech. As his VA stated, and what is noticeable in the game he drops the theatrics after ascending. Yet, in this one and only scene he actually goes back to them. Notice his body language, how he moves. He even bows down mocking his old behaviour saying how he's discarded his former self. He's extremely hurt and wants you to feel bad for abandoning him. I don't believe his threats because of it. It's just a case of sour grapes as I've seen someone nicely put it.
Originally Posted by Veranis
They are trying to hammer home their point about abusive Astarion with a sledge hammer now and it just feels cheap. Like they don't trust in their own storytelling anymore.
Honestly, I'm tired of it. How about they let people roleplay however they want. If someone wants to roleplay this as an abusive relationship there are ways to do that. If someone wants to have a power couple dynamic it is also possible to do it. They keep contradicting themselves all the time with the narrative, it's clear someone from Larian hates Astarion and wants to push the abuser theme down people's throats. It all feels like it's written by at least two people who keep clashing and can't decide what he should be like. I want to roleplay a power couple dynamic, my Tav loves dark Astarion and knew what she was getting herself into. It was her choice. I don't want them to railroad my decisions.
It's funny, really, they hate him, yet they keep giving him new content, while the spawn path has less things in it, now they even gave him the promotional smirk and allowed you to rule the world with him. They're basicly showing ascension is his canon path with these decisions.
Originally Posted by Veranis
For me, the kneeling kiss is just way too much. Tav could just say "nah" and Astarion couldn't do anything about it. He'd not risk that. This kiss would be perfect on the other hand for the epilogue party, showing the development the relationship has taken the last six months with him getting more and more powerful and now able to control Tav. So, for now, Tav should have the chance to very much be into the rough kisses, at least the Karlach kiss and the lip bite.
I like it but I wish it was more situational. Because of this I will avoid kissing him in public and just do it at camp or when no one is looking. It's a private moment and cheapens the kneeling scene if it's repeated like that. I like your suggestion to make it an epilogue kiss. It could show that Tav has fully embraced the power dynamic between them and is ok with all of this. They really need to fix it being available right after ascension and before the actual kneeling scene.
I can't stand Tav's scared facial expressions. My Tav would not behave like this!
Originally Posted by Veranis
And talking about the lip bite - why is Tav suddenly pouting about that? They could have been offering their neck to him every evening, but suddenly a little bite is making them all resentful?
Exactly, what is even funnier is that Tav is already a vampire then. I'd expect them to enjoy it and actually lick their lips after it while giving Astarion a lustful look.
