Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Story & Character Discussion The romance with Astarion pulls you over to the "dark side".

I was just reading a post on the discord feedback referencing Minthara. A player has pointed out that Minthara has also been character assasinated and done a 180 in the latest hotfix. Sooo... Larian have either been taken over by aliens or several of the original writers have moved onto other things and left patch 6 (and probably subsequent patches) entirely up to staff writers who don't know, or don't care, about the characters story arc not just for Ascended Astarion - which we already knew - but Minthara as well.
I guess all we really have to do is wait for the inevitable assasination of the DJ Shadowheart character as well. The outcry will probably hit the rafters. Maybe at that point something will get sorted.
I'm just hugely relieved I had a patch 5 backup on my cloud. To me patch 6 is an abomination that should have never been released given not just Astarion but all the other problems it has caused.

Gods... What did they do to her?

Lae'zel was also slightly changed in patch 6 and people on reddit are not very happy about this. Her changes: now Lae'zel is okay to be in a relationship with a mindflayer. No one asked for this and her fans agree that this is a complete OOC

This was already a thing in patch 5, I also posted about it and was surprised she was ok with it. Fortunately Astarion still has standards.

That's utterly ridiculous. The only thing Lae'zel should be doing with a mindflayer is killing it, and only just managing to refrain from such an action because its Tav/Durge. Completely breaks all known Githyanki/Githzerai lore.


So Lae'zel changes break DnD lore
Minthara from what I can gather, and the vid the posted on discord, now leaves you if you take the good Durge route because you refused Bhaals power
Ascended Astarion turns into a sexual abuser (apparently overnight) but has amnesia at all times it hits and is immediately himself again after his little episodes.

Good lord what are the writers thinking?

Well, I know Minthara wants you to claim your heritage and loves Durge, but damn... Instead of fixing a magnitude of bugs and broken things related to her, they decide to alter and limit the shred of a romance that she actually has.

Maybe the Netherbrain took over Larian Studios and is now trolling people?

O my god! I am speechless. I will not analyze that manipulating brain. It's beyond my imagination.

What is going on...

Well, in the 6th patch, Astarion invites the mind flayer to enter into an alliance, and in the epilogue a scene occurs, like in the romance with the ascended Astarion, I don’t know if this is a mistake. And if you want to eat Astarion’s brain, the narrator says that love comes from Astarion. I checked it myself. While the spawn of Astarion only feels friendship. So despite Tav's unpleasant appearance, Ascended Astarion loves Tav. Unless it's a patch bug.

I think that's the only rational explanation for this mishmash of a patch. Even internally just in the patch it makes no sense whatsoever. So the Ascended really loves whilst the Spawn has friend zoned but the one who really loves is the abuser.

Yup. Makes all sorts of sense - ummm. I'm wondering if we all ought to club together to send the Larian writers on a holiday somewhere, they clearly need a break, preferably before they write anything else.

The mind flayer alliance has already been there before patch 6. He's totally disgusted with tentacles. Just because he still has lingering feelings for the Tav he knew, doesn't mean he wants to be in a romantic relationship with a soulless monster who has Tav's memories. The epilogue basicly calls him a smooth brain, yet he has the most brain cells to realise the old Tav is gone forever and doesn't hold on to the pretence of a romance.

The love line has been there since patch 5, I've posted a link to a short with it in the improvements thread a day before the Gale/AAstarion kneeling kiss was revealed by Larian. I had a feeling something would go wrong in patch 6.

It kind of can make sense though if we see spawn Astarion as the one who develops emotionally on a more mature level. He is able to move on from his romantic feelings, while A!A has more of an obsessive love for Tav/DU which is a lot harder to move on from.

This might indeed be the case! Well said.

I did a little research on the subject. Based on their interviews with game magazines. https://forums.larian.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=938937&#Post938937

I hope I don't get banned for this

There seems to be indeed a "special" *writing* and rewriting going on on the game, which shows a huge lack of understanding (both in terms of the story and what makes a good role-playing game) and this isn't quite good for an RPG... a pity.

Wow, thank you, that is very interesting and that really gives a very good insight. I won't comment on it here now. But the interviews are really remarkable. And telling.

@The Red Queen: You're right, I edited one of my sentences. But I can't edit posts of others, so the quote will remain.

A reminder, please stick to critiquing the writing not the writers.

Friends! Journalists have already noticed our problem! An article in a German gaming publication!

Neue Astarion-Küsse in Baldur's Gate 3 wirken verstörend auf Fans und das ist der Grund
("New Astarion kisses in Baldur's Gate 3 have a disturbing effect on fans and here's why")

At the beginning of the article, the author warns the readers (hereinafter I give the quotes in English translation):

"Trigger warning: This article deals with sexualized violence."

Thanks to the author of the article - he cares about the readers' feelings and warns them.

Further down in the article you will see a truthful assessment and description of the scenes that upset us so much, as well as a link to our forum. You can even see quotes from your posts, we have been heard!

"Our character suddenly shows open aversion and Astarion continues against his consent. This turns what could have been a lustful love game with a dominant and submissive role into a violent, assaultive scene."

"In contrast, the scene is now reminiscent of domestic violence, or violence within a relationship, in which one partner crosses boundaries and shows no consideration for the other person's displeasure."

And I can't help but quote the conclusion of the author of the article:

"These are 'triggers'
People who have experienced terrible things in real life, such as sexualized violence, often react to certain stimuli that are linked in some way to the trauma they experienced.

Put simply, this means that something is triggered by the memory/flashbacks: Scenes such as the new kisses can cause individuals to relive their trauma intensely. This can have a wide variety of serious psychological consequences. Important: This has absolutely nothing to do with the casual comment: "That really triggers me".

You can imagine it as being similar to people who have been traumatized in war and hear sounds reminiscent of gunshots. This reaction cannot be consciously controlled.

Of course, not everything that triggers people can always be avoided in art. After all, this can be very diverse. But there are scenes like this that are very clear and problematic for many people. And bringing them out unexpectedly is something that could be avoided very well."

Thank you GamePro, I have nothing more to add here, thank you for paying attention to the feelings and experiences of many people.

Thanks for sharing ??

Larian could add 5 types of Lord Astarion's strikes if they so wanted to show that he could scare the player with something.
This could perfectly be done if the player broke up with Astarion, before the battle, to show his behavioral, attitude. The player doesn't want to - Astarion does.
There are so many possibilities. Kissing is not one of those possibilities.
When the player wants to, the player doesn't hit Astarion, and kisses him, no fear, kisses him.

Thank you for sharing this. It's nice to feel like someone, anywhere, is hearing us.

I played patch 6 blind and the new scenes were extremely triggering. Any attempt to discuss it in the broader community just ended in being told I'm media illiterate and stupid for taking the AA route.

I wish Larian would at least come out and say "No, they're right, were doubling down," or "We didn't mean for it to come off this way." The amount of vitriol the new patch has brought into the community has put me off the game for awhile.

Forcing you to RP a victim as the *ONLY* AA option seems off. Please don't give Tav victim faces. At least make it consistent with the choices the player makes. It was perfectly fine in Patch 5.

The article is good. Thank you. But there are not many comments there, but most say that everything was done correctly, because Astarion is toxic. This is sad.