Never had any romance banter outside of companions flirting with each other, I'd know when I hear it. I've had 4 + 2 multiplayer playthroughs, romanced Astarion, Karlach, Minthara, Lae'zel for MP, and Gale is currently ongoing (but on pause for Minthara). No banter at all regarding who I romanced. I would say that part is cut content, but if not, I'm honestly confused as I do switch around party compositions often.
Minthara is an awesome addition to the "good" path because she makes the good path harder. Without her, it is easy to dismiss the cultists as just that: crazy, cruel cultists. You might know that many of them were tadpoled against their will - your characters have been too after all - but the level of deceit and cruelty is never fully illustrated unless you hear Minthara's gut-wrenching tale of how she arrived at Moonrise. I do really hope they patch her up and flesh her out a bit because I don't think, I ever want to leave her dead again. (And her voice actress deserves far more recognition than she has gotten, what an awesome performance.)
Fully agree with you here. And yes, Emma Gregory deserves all the love and attention she's been getting and so much more. Her performance actually carried the character for me and many others I've talked to about Minthara, I honestly believe Minthy would not be as well-loved as she is now if not for Emma as she was also very closely involved with writing her <3
I intend to keep discussion of other characters at a minimum, but I find your point with Gale very interesting, I am still romancing him now in late Act 2, but it's clear power is also a central theme of his story. For Astarion, power is the means for him to achieve freedom. For Gale, power is the means for him to prove to everyone and himself that he is worthy. For Minthara, power is the means for her to be safe and find a place to belong. It's just that Minthara has the highest drive/ambition for power out of everyone imo, which makes sense for someone of her background.
Minthara and Gale do share an interesting dynamic together, with her also being wholesome and encouraging to Gale when he had doubts about himself. This exchange below is something I very much hold dear :'3
Origin Gale spoilers:
M: "I hope Elminster's message has not left you feeling dejected, wizard. It is better for you to be free of Mystra."
G: "How is it better? Mystra is magic. I'm nothing without her."
M: "Oh? Are you suddenly incapable of touching the weave? Do your spells fizzle before you can cast them? I think not. You are Gale, Wizard of Waterdeep, and with or without Mystra, you are as great a practitioner of magic as anyone I have ever known."
G: "You're wrong. I need Mystra."
M: "She has made you believe that you need her. That is what the gods do. In truth, she is not so different to the Absolute. She infests your notion of the Weave, just as the Absolute's voice infested my thoughts. You will realise, soon, how little you need her. Or you will die, mourning a loss that has no meaning."
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I think you did a very nice write-up about her fears! Even the strongest character can break under enough emotional pressure (and she is not at her best after everything that has happened to her since Act II). But I agree with you that this is not a view that might be shared by most fans and in the end it would be easier to just cut the scene out again as I don't think Larian wants to put in the resources to make this work properly (and I prefer that they fix her bugs).
Thank you! I'm glad we share this perspective. I also doubt Larian wants to improve this dialogue especially when we consider their track record with her, but it was nice to think about. Plus I'm mentally preparing myself for this GoT-season 8-like breakup being real lol.
Yeah, I was a bit cynical. I still think though that a few of the newer bugs are correlated to her implementation alongside Halsin (that she has no bed camp in the Elfsong tavern for example).
Of course. As with
any new implementation, bugs are bound to follow, but
their inability to fix her bugs in a timely manner, to prevent these bugs from even appearing, and seemingly ignoring them for months is a completely separate issue.
For the record, my very first experience with Minthara was through a somewhat neutral/good playthrough. I used the "Good Recruitment" mod and I grew to love her with this path; yep, with the scarce content and no romance scene whatsoever. Then I decided to experience the evil playthrough with DU, went full evil this time but still rejected Bhaal. I was more fond of the first playthrough simply because it had more substance and I was given the opportunity to challenge Minthara to see how she reacts. This, again, is not an opinion shared by many but ultimately I see a lot of value in adding the knockout recruitment, even with all of its glaring flaws.
I am of the firm belief that if the knockout recruitment wasn't added, Larian would pay less attention to Minthara than they do now. Why? Because I saw how alienated Minthara was compared to everyone whether in fanworks/discussion, etc. She was barely ever seen as a companion by the majority of players, she was just the random NPC with cool-looking armor in the Goblin Camp. I saw concrete difference in how people were treating her after this addition. Having it be locked to a path that requires you to
massacre innocents is also very limiting in terms of gameplay and roleplaying purposes.
Mind you, Larian took the
easiest route with implementing this possibility. People had many detailed, more coherent ideas on how to improve Minthara's recruitment. If they took the easy way out (and this is assuming they're not currently developing a more coherent recruitment for her), I highly doubt they'd add more content to her even with the KO method never existing - what with the small amount of people playing evil too.
Just wanted to add a different perspective here. I've seen way too many people say "they should've never added KO to recruit Minthara" while not taking into account the work Larian put into it and the effect it had for other players.
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That's kinda the thing for me though. Even if they massively rewrote the scene to narratively fit the scope of the game and the character, I would still not be in favor of Minthara trying to break up with the Dark Urge in any shape or form.
At best the only compromise I would be completely alright with is her potentially questioning our decision and lecturing us about it depending on how deep our bond is, as she has been doing so throughout the whole game when we make decisions which she does not entirely agree with. This I can totally see happening and would even welcome, as it would give us an opportunity to explore her way of thinking even further (this is even mentioned in my raw feedback post to have her react to Dark Urge's fate).
But breaking up over a personal quest regarding our own eternal fate, after everything we did for her? Just no.
That's fair. I see you have a very strong opinion about this, and I respect that :3
I've also seen many people say that her anger is valid but this being a breakup is too extreme. I can understand this too. I don't think she would be questioning your decision like, for example, the way she did if you destroyed the Last Light Inn. You did
die (almost recklessly so) and was brought back by sheer luck, so this scenario with Bhaal is clearly more severe. Having her give you a harsh scolding but then eventually seeing the value in your freedom would definitely make sense.
It's better to remove this, both to save their time and to regain what semblance of consistency she has left, though I can't help but mourn the loss of content and its potential for Minthara with how scarce it already is. Fingers crossed they do add more for her, whatever it may be,
just make it make sense Larian pls.
