To your first point, this is a crpg and what you describe is something that's present in most crpgs I can think of. It's a consequence of this being a game, with a main character that is expected to be able to influence their party members. Our character is the main character, the one capable of influencing the story the most, the character with the most true agency. Furthermore the companions aren't bumbling fools. They're people in difficult situations who need support to help them get to the right path. Everyone finds themselves in those situations sometimes. Most people will be in that situation several times throughout their lives, even when they're adults. This is a game and a story, characters have to have arcs. If they start out knowing what they need and then never needing to change their beliefs or learn new things or gain new insights about themselves, then they would be boring characters. (...) And if the best outcome for every companion was to simply do nothing and let them make all the right decisions, that's less interesting to play.
If every single one of them needs to be persuaded or guided into a specific path that's considered to be the right one, then that's a poor rpg. There are no shades, no nuance, it's either this or failure. That's boring. You will never want to play a different way if you only have one way that is "good".
When it comes to charas, take Mass Effect for example:
Wrex - has certain strong ideas about the world, you can help him with his family armour, he considers you his friend eventually after growing to trust you, but his views don't really change much, he still does what he thinks is best for him. You see him thriving as a Warlord on his home planet in the second game. He didn't need fixing, he needed help. Thane - he needed help to save his son from following in his footsteps and getting himself into trouble, he was on a suicidal mission but then starts wanting to live again after finding companionship. He also didn't need fixing, he needed help. Tali - a young engineer who needs you to help her find an artifact to finish her pilgrimage, which is a rite of passage into adulthood. She sees more of the world travelling with you, grows into someone who fosters alliances and could even be a great politician one day. She didn't need fixing, she needed help.
They all grow as characters, they have a story and their own agenda, it's not boring, your goals are aligned, you're their helper, not their saviour.
In BG3 however, the characters are presented as "faulty" and clueless, you're accidentally bound to each other and then you have to fix them to "improve" them and their lives, instead of just being supportive.
This method of presentation reduces the value of roleplay and options and instead we receive a repeated, contrived story where you are shown as being "better" and more "knowledgeable" than the others.
I see what you're saying, but nothing you've said actually goes against my original point regarding Astarion. Because all those characters you listed still had arcs and still needed to learn lessons in order to change and grow, regardless of how much the main character influences those lessons. My original point was that an Astarion who ascends doesn't learn anything. He starts out believing that he needs power, and that once he has power he will have the right to do whatever he wants to whoever he wants. And then he gets that power and behaves exactly like how he always wanted to. To use one of your exampls as a comparison, it would be like if Tali started the first game wanting to be a politician, having the exact same beliefs and opinions she would hold in the third game, and she joined up with Shepard and the only thing Shepard contributed was that Tali helping against the Reapers boosted her reputation enough kickstart her political career.
I just feel like the idea that "AA didn't learn anything, you only have one shot at healing trauma, and if you miss the boat, it's gone forever and you become an unthinking, 1D no-no man forever" is just so flat.
Healing is multi-faceted. You don't 'miss the healing train' and never get to heal ever again.
BUT I will say, the story does show AA can still learn. If you do the threesome with the drow twins, he stares off into the distance, unhappy and dissociated afterward. It seems like that's a begrudgingly learned lesson that being "all powerful TM" doesn't magically absolve you of trauma. He clearly has an unhappy reaction afterward. He's reflecting on something.
You're right that healing is a multi-faceted process. It's complicated and nuanced. It's true that you don't only have one shot at healing trauma. But this isn't real life, it's a story with a beginning, middle and end. And by the end of this story, Ascending represents Astarioni not having learned anything. This story isn't about the complexity of healing and how you'll take steps forward and backwards all throughout the process. When I say he's learned a lesson, I'm talking about it in the narrative sense. The basicnarrative character arc is that a character has a thing they want, and a thing they need. And those things are different, and the character either learns to give up what they want in order to pursue and gain what they actually need, or they take what they want and as a result they're lesser for it, because they've not grown to the point where they can look part their more shallow want to get the thing they actually NEED to become whole and fulfilled.
If you want an example of a story that's actually about the messiness of healing and moving beyond past traumas, then I'd point you to the show Crazy Ex-Girlfriend. That show is all about how getting better is difficult, how you need to learn a lesson over and over sometimes before you can fully internalize it. And even then, the character's arc is very explicitly her deconstructing what she wants and realizing what she needs is very different.
To bring this back around to Astarion, what he wants is power. What he needs is (at least in my reading) to learn that you can have relationships that aren't based in power and domination, and that he's not weak for choosing those kinds of relationships. That's a simplistic reading, but it's by design. Of course there's more nuance to the actual story, I'm just stripping it down to illustrate my point. Regarding the brothel scene you described, is it the same as if you go to the brothel with Spawn astarion? If so then that sounds more like more act 3 being incomplete than a scene that actually says anything about AA. If I'm wrong and it's a unique scene, then that's interesting and an idea that should be more deeply explored, because it would be very interesting and it would actually support my point even further; ascending hasn't actually helped him emotionally. He's still got all the same problems emotionally, and rather than making a hard choice, he simply jumped to get more power so he can pretend that will make him emotionally whole.
I have a question here against the background of all the arguments: how does SPAWN Astarion become an Ascended VAMPIRE if the ritual itself is for True Vampires? Astarion does not drink Cazador's blood, and technically he is a spawn, the ritual does not turn him into a true vampire. The ritual transforms only a true vampire into an ascended vampire...
The ritual sacrifices whoever is in the sacrificial places, with the appropriate scars from the contract. The one holding the staff, then ascends with the sacrifice of 7007 souls as tribute. He is a new monster, not bound to Mephisto, but created anew.
No, it's not like that. There is no word in the ritual that this is a new creature. On the contrary, it is a direct contract with the devil, and it is clearly about vampires.
The Rite of Profane Ascension Oh, piteous dead! Oh, ravenous dead! Immortality is your gift, but darkness is your prison and hunger its gaoler. The Rite of Profane Ascension will release you. Walk in the sun. Suffer not from hunger. Grow your power beyond anything you imagined. A pact has been made with the Lord of Hellfire. Deliver unto him seven thousand souls, each bearing an Internal mark, and you shall be free of your chains. You shall know true power. Deliver the souls. Speak the words. Ecce dominus, Has animas offero in sacrificio, Nunc volo potestatem quam pollicitus es mihi.
But the text from Latin translates as: "The Lord, I sacrifice these souls, Now I want more power than you promised me."
I think, a reference to Strahd, because Strahd originally made a pact with the devil and became a vampire. And the surname Zarr is an anagram of Strahd von Zarovich. And an interesting detail, the souls in the contract need to be "freed", those souls that are already cursed. From the ritual, we understand that the souls of the spawns are already cursed.
[ If I'm wrong and it's a unique scene, then that's interesting and an idea that should be more deeply explored, because it would be very interesting and it would actually support my point even further; ascending hasn't actually helped him emotionally. He's still got all the same problems emotionally, and rather than making a hard choice, he simply jumped to get more power so he can pretend that will make him emotionally whole.
Yep, you're wrong, it is different.
Vampire Lord says: "My fair consort, I can't wait to dine upon this four-course meal with you." And the player can answer: 1. "I don't know if we should..." AA Answer: "Just a figure of speech. I promise not to bite down to the bone." 2. Bite the male drow. 3. Bite the female drow.
*Astarion boldly throws himself into the centre of attention in your little group, and all lavish their pleasures on him.*ORI_Astarion_State_BecameVampireLord *But as you sit on his lap, resting afterwards, you look into his eyes, and see no trace of joy. Just an intensity that makes you shiver.*
And I think Spawn says: "You're looking at me rather curiously. Speak up, tell us what you want to do." Player answer: 1. "You don't need to wait for my command. Do what you wish." Spawn Astarion: "I wish... to drink. And to be drunk." 2. "Sometimes when I see how beautiful you are, I'm just dumbfounded." Spawn Astarion: " Me too." 3."Only making sure you're all right."
*Astarion lavishes attentions on everyone present with flawless technique, unfazed. It's all pure instinct.* *But when you meet his eye for a moment, there's a look about him that reveals he's a million realms away.
"I would, thank God, watch the universe perish without shedding a tear."
You're right that healing is a multi-faceted process. It's complicated and nuanced. It's true that you don't only have one shot at healing trauma. But this isn't real life, it's a story with a beginning, middle and end. And by the end of this story, Ascending represents Astarioni not having learned anything.
Of course. That doesn't mean it couldn't have been done better. Right now it feels like it's at the emotional maturity of a children's book. But I'm also cynical, and not easy convinced by 'The Power of Friendship!' stories.
Originally Posted by Gray Ghost
If you want an example of a story that's actually about the messiness of healing and moving beyond past traumas, then I'd point you to the show Crazy Ex-Girlfriend.
I'll check it out! Thanks for the rec.
Originally Posted by Gray Ghost
If I'm wrong and it's a unique scene, then that's interesting and an idea that should be more deeply explored, because it would be very interesting and it would actually support my point even further; ascending hasn't actually helped him emotionally. He's still got all the same problems emotionally, and rather than making a hard choice, he simply jumped to get more power so he can pretend that will make him emotionally whole.
I'm surprised you haven't seen this one. It's a hot topic. I'm fully in support that it hasn't helped him emotionally. Ascension doesn't magically fix him. And I think what he says after the ritual is a lot of hubris. But I also tend to see him as immensely bratty. He doesn't cross me as a 'dom'. Just a spoiled noble boy with shiny new power and little strategic thinking. An evil Tav would definitely be the brains of that operation. BUT, I digress. Here:
UA and AA each have their own unique line. UA is more hurt, AA seems almost...seething. I think he's angry that trauma can still hurt him. @6:57ish for the specific line.
Edit because I forgor: I agree that ascension does not fix him. I disagree with the notion he doesn't still reflect on his trauma, and is closed to any path of healing within the current game.
If every single one of them needs to be persuaded or guided into a specific path that's considered to be the right one, then that's a poor rpg. There are no shades, no nuance, it's either this or failure. That's boring. You will never want to play a different way if you only have one way that is "good".
Which for me breaks the game and the companions: the game doesn't respond to my actions in any way. I can kill, act cynical and cruel. Betray Shadow Heart, give someone to the dancing fish. And then tell Astarion (even without taking him to a ritual, for example) um, you know, it was for good. The game is just blind to the style of play, although this is an important point here, it's not a detail and side quest. Start moralizing at the ritual by being an immoral character, to dissuade Astarion. "I want you to live a life you're proud of ". "I know you think this will set you free, but it won't. This power will trap you, just like it trapped Cazador". Meanwhile: "Yes, taking over a cult sounds fun, Astarion", "Yeah, I think taking that power would be useful and fun".
Nothing. Just a dice, even the check number doesn't change. Although it would be possible, for example, to make the number of conviction higher if the player did evil and then suddenly does not let Astarion do the same. And if say there was a "scale of good and evil", the conviction number was 99.
Astarion: Are you kidding me? Player: Yeah. :3 Astarion: HUH Ritual. Player: no. Astarion: well, I'm going to kill you. (which is already pretty much there, but the answers are just for good, neutral, lawful).
It could be evil player wouldn't think of interrupting the ritual. Power, murder and fun - I'm into it. Although in this case the deception would be interesting. For a evil player, who makes romance with Astarion, the concern is because whatever the contract is with Meph sounds murky. Could care less about spawn souls, but it's just a worrisome business. But again this is a player's speculation, there are no such options. Though the contract was made by Cazador and all the consequences are probably on Cazador's head. His signature, his payment, his own fault for losing. Only answers for a good player, in the mouth of an evil one sound just not suitable. I made an ambitious suggestion here for a "scale" to game style, but I don't even know... Though what style of game are we even talking about when a game where the storyline is that player can break up (tadpole), forces the player to be scared and unhappy while kissing, that the player clicks on. Happy valentine's day, by the way. Ametris, I can't, it's so substandard.
Deliver unto him seven thousand souls, each bearing an Internal mark, and you shall be free
That's the ceremony that signs the contract. The contract itself is written on the back of the spawn. We don't know what the infernal mark says, if we knew infernal and lined the 7 up we would know what devil lurked in the details.
With Gale I wouldn't even say you need to do much reading between the lines. He thanks you for caring for him as a person so directly and so often, it really is hard to miss what's going on. Though both him and Astarion put quite a lot of effort into persuading you to give into their weaker nature - that discussion with Gale at the brainstem when he is trying to guilt-trip you into allowing him to use the orb is just no fun at all.
But what I wanted to comment on - from a few pages back - Thanks for the book recommendation. I didn't know it but I looked it up and put it on my ever growing "to read" pile.
About the 7K Spawn: I was more explaining why I think saving them makes sense in the narrative, I also think that killing them would/should be the lawful-good choice. But then again that's the path I rarely tread, so I am happy with the moral ambiguity of a more chaotic approach to the matter - and my bookclub in the Underdark.
What I would have wished for, would have been a better visual representation though. We know the spawn can't travel through BG (it's day) and that they don't travel through the sewer (the door is still locked - though there is some weirdness with Chessa and Kass) so the Turmalin Depth must have it's own access to the Underdark, as the narration also sounds as if they went there directly. I don't think it would have been too much to ask if someone had plopped down some mushrooms and a sort of gateway on some corner of that Dungeon to better visualise the whole thing.
There was something else I wanted to comment on but there are just som many walls of text in here by now, that it kind'o got lost.
@ShyShy: I know what the lore states, yet the game states only what I wrote, from dialogue/cut scenes/banter/scrolls & books of the ritual. So I don't know what our Larian "DM" is stating since this is their homebrew one-shot. We can only guess.
General statement:
Yet this is still just a suggestion/feedback thread. For Story/Discussion: that is up a few tabs. If you have a suggestion/feedback/why you want the story that suggests/ why: it destroyed player agency after patch 6 with Astarion, then please continue. You wrote your opinions, yet we are also trying to communicate we want our player agency and why here in this forum. If you are happy with the story, you put your opinion...then to further discuss why you lost your player agency, whether it be for the lore / the rules / the dialogue / changes that have led up to it, has made it OOC for my Tav's (& player's) ability to roleplay your own character due to the only choices available are XYZ / the kisses, etc etc. Then please give your suggestion & why.
Once you put your opinion and if you are happy with the game as it currently is, it should be further discussed in the story & discussion tab. Larian hasn't followed the dnd rules/lore 100% (there is even ways to discuss it without taking over a suggestion thread). If patch 6 made you not want to play anymore, then state a suggestion and why here, under this particular forum.
It is quite simple. I am trying to get the thread back on course. I am not discounting opinions, but repeating the same things that may or may not be is still just an opinion and/or head canon. If you want to suggest & say why, then cool. All opinions matter. But to take over a thread that is asking for suggestions and feedback to Larian is really not the place for ongoing discussion. The Story & Discussion tab is though.
I am just wanting to get back to the point of this forum, as the original post creator posed.
Let's just keep to the forums in a way, that benefits all.
If every single one of them needs to be persuaded or guided into a specific path that's considered to be the right one, then that's a poor rpg. There are no shades, no nuance, it's either this or failure. That's boring. You will never want to play a different way if you only have one way that is "good".
Firstly, one of the major themes in the game is change and transformation. Origin characters go through significant changes in opinion, religion, and alliance. The game also provides opportunities for both Tav and Durge to embody this theme. We also encounter Balduran, who underwent a major change both physically and morally. If you do not engage with the game's narrative, you are missing out on a crucial element of game experience.
I'm engaging with it perfectly fine. I mentioned seeing repetitions and the same type of story and mechanic being used for companions - they are all wrong, Tav is right and knows best. That's why I like the AA path. Because for once it could have been a story of a companion being right, and Tav being naive and inexperienced. Railroading all stories into only good and bad is fairytale moralising, not a dark fantasy rpg.
The game that did it right was DAO. Let's take a look at Alistair - you can keep him soft or harden him and he can still stay as a warden or become a king. He will be kinder, more altruistic and wanting to please people or stricter and learn how to be a bit selfish sometimes, stand up for himself and not just be duty bound. With Astarion the game is saying: turn him into a vampiric angel or a devil twirling mustache villain.
Originally Posted by ahania
Originally Posted by KillerRabbit
Secondly, you are factually incorrect. Not every individual needs to be guided or persuaded. Shadowheart is challenging to keep on the DJ path, Lae'zel changes sides independently after discovering the truth and seeing evidence, and Gale reacts based on the assurance provided by the player. You literally just have to be supportive of them. You don't fix any of them yourself, they fix themselves if you support them on their paths.
Sort of. I've not seen the code but I believe that if you don't' have enough trust for SH to share the memory she will kill the nightsong. And Selunites have an easy way to persuade her to become a DJ. Selunites can tell Shadowheart to spare the nightsong so Shadowheart can turn away from her wretched goddess. Then she always kills the nightsong.
As for Lae'zel you need to take her to see how the zaith'isk works, remind her of it while she's talking to Vlaakith because she threatens to kill you if you don't listen to the Lich Queen, then argue with her after meeting the Guardian, once more tell her off when she's thinking it's all a test of faith from Vlaakith, and even when she meets Voss she's still in denial for the better part of the conversation. She still needs guidance.
Originally Posted by Gray Ghost
My original point was that an Astarion who ascends doesn't learn anything. He starts out believing that he needs power, and that once he has power he will have the right to do whatever he wants to whoever he wants. And then he gets that power and behaves exactly like how he always wanted to.
As people have already said, he does get a reality check in the brothel. Also in the epilogue he admits that power is nothing without Tav by his side. If he's not romanced, he confesses that power comes with loneliness. He does learn, just in a different way.
I am just wanting to get back to the point of this forum, as the original post creator posed.
Let's just keep to the forums in a way, that benefits all.
To be honest I don't think we've wandered off topic. We are discussing why some would like to see the story changed and why some would like it to stay as is. In either case the length of the thread increases the chances that Larian will see it so all benefit.
But there about a dozen of these threads. By default this seems to be the most active one but I wouldn't but upset if the mods decided that all discussion take place in thread X.
To be honest I don't think we've wandered off topic. We are discussing why some would like to see the story changed and why some would like it to stay as is.
I don't think that's a fair tldr and a big misrepresentation of what everyone has put effort into saying.
More like: People who actually play and enjoy the AA storyline feel like it's been changed for the worst with patch 6.
People who do not like AA and do not play the storyline don't want the new changes to go away because that would change their understanding of what it was about.
I won't lie, it is immensely frustrating that some seem to fighting so hard to stop our playthrough, when it won't affect yours at all. Though, I do understand your allegiance to your idea of the story.
We're not asking for anything to change. Quite the opposite. We want it back the way it was.
**As another poster kindly points out, there are also those who don't pursue AA that don't agree with the patch 6 animations for their own reasons as well!
Last edited by Natasy; 17/03/2411:45 PM. Reason: 4 truth
This is really just AA players wanting to keep their game the way it was, and people who don't romance AA, don't like him and haven't experienced him personally in the game, advocating for changes they won't ever see in their own game to be inflicted on people who are actually dealing with them and feel terrible about them.
This would be the same as AA fans going into the Astarion good ending thread and arguing that this ending is perfect and Tav should stand there like a statue, and not give a crap about Astarion while he runs off and that Larian should never change it because it fits the narrative and our headcannons.
Your's is (or is also) a gross misrepresentation @Natsay because quite a bunch of people who don't see A!Astarion as an aspirational ending have stated in this and other threads that they also have issues with the animations - even if for other reasons.
And this thread was exactly about the animations and not being able to roleplay Tav according to our vision of the character. Then it became diluted with all sorts of other discussions.
[quote=KillerRabbit] To be honest I don't think we've wandered off topic. We are discussing why some would like to see the story changed and why some would like it to stay as is.
Quote
I don't think that's a fair tldr and a big misrepresentation of what everyone has put effort into saying.
With all due respect I also find your posts a bit frustrating. Even if I enjoy reading them
It is a fair tldr, one I addressed repeatedly but I think your interpretation of the patch 5 romance is mistaken and can only be maintained if you believe that AA not acting like charlatan.
I believe I have sympathized with two points - a) I do understand that it is frustrating when cinnematic underlines the author's preferred interpretation. This happened to you and I am sorry b) I would support finding a solution that would not involve changing Spawn Astarian's breaking-the-cycle-of-abuse story without triggering people. [*] A trigger warning is the obvious solution but I am open to others.
I have also offered possible solutions - such as reaching out to the modding community.
I mean you can of course ask that this become another echo chamber where only people who agree with your premise - patch 6 changed the romance - are allowed to participate but I don't think that will help you much. I don't want to invoke their names but there have been other threads with a handful of highly dedicated fans only speaking to one another for page after page and that wasn't successful. Indeed I believe they hurt their cause . . .
[*] (and changing the facial expressions WOULD impact that story - I know you've insisted it would not but I don't find your arguments persuasive. Ascention is not a good outcome for any of the companions. Gale is insufferable, both Lae'zel and Shadowheart break off the romance, I feel terrible that I allowed Karlach to transform. . . )
It seemed obvious to me that the new AA "scenes" that I personally can't call "kissing" contradict the character's behavior and what he does throughout the game. And even afterward, in the epilogue. The animation of the new "questionable relationship scenes" doesn't look like a romance anymore. Before patch 6, Tav and AA's relationship could, albeit with a big stretch, be called a sub/dom. Though in fact Tav and AA's relationship looked quite sweet and affectionate, because AA has no sense to bully Tav, because Tav helped him in everything and agreed to be with him voluntarily. If it's a sub/dom, then Tav is not breaking the "rules" and therefore there can be no "punishment". And this kind of dismissive treatment by AA in the new "scenes" seems unacceptable and repulsive. If the authors wanted to make the sub/dom line clearer, then it is 100% out of character, because the dom would never hurt the sub without consent, moreover the house would patronize the sub and take care of him. This is not a relationship of moral humiliation of the partner, but a co-dependent relationship where everyone is satisfied with their role. The new scenes would be okay if Astarion for example licked the blood off Tav's lips, didn't push Tav away and especially didn't slap her. Now it's not a romance, now it's a moralizing by new authors, not Astarion's creator, about "what awaits you if you get involved with a man who has unlimited power". First of all while there's an epilogue where AA says that everything he needs is in front of him and only with Tav does he feel whole and without Tav the power wouldn't make sense. Secondly the epilogue contradicts the new scenes of Tav's humiliation. These new scenes humiliate Tav, hurt her morally, show that the player is bad. Not Tav is bad, but the player is bad, you chose this relationship and now you suffer and plunge into negativity. Experience the moral humiliation. Feel bad. I think the game shouldn't hurt players, shouldn't insist on only having the "right" romance. My opinion - if AA is so terrible according to new authors, just remove the novel. Remove it and don't traumatize the players, we don't deserve to be treated this way by RPG authors to be humiliated and "taught" how to live our lives. And I wouldn't be talking about this if the new authors didn't change the release version of the game and character behavior. There's a huge difference between support and violence of will. Parents can control a 5 year old child, parents can forbid them to do some things, parents can instruct and put their view of the world. Parents can forbid doing the "wrong" thing in their opinion. Adults do not have the right to forbid, instruct and control an adult against his/her will. Adults can give advice and support, they can refuse support, but never one adult has any right to force another into a something against his will out of any, even the kindest and best intentions. The choice should always be left to the individual. If the new authors see the novel of Tav and AA as a victim/aggressor, then I think it's better to just delete such a novel. Or this novel should be completely rewritten, starting with act 1 of the game, where Astarion will behave like a scoundrel from the very beginning showing his slippery nature without options to make him a cute cute cat. Now new humiliating scenes cause cognitive dissonance and absolutely cannot be justified by a "ritual".
Now it's not a romance, now it's a moralizing by new authors, not Astarion's creator, about "what awaits you if you get involved with a man who has unlimited power". First of all while there's an epilogue where AA says that everything he needs is in front of him and only with Tav does he feel whole and without Tav the power wouldn't make sense. Secondly the epilogue contradicts the new scenes of Tav's humiliation. These new scenes humiliate Tav, hurt her morally, show that the player is bad. Not Tav is bad, but the player is bad, you chose this relationship and now you suffer and plunge into negativity. Experience the moral humiliation. Feel bad.
It just feels so heavy handed and clumsy too, tbh. Astarion giving Tav rough kisses that Tav isn't enjoying before the tadpole is gone is frankly OOC for the way he acted until that point. It's just there to show players "look, look what an abusive man he is!" If Tav didn't look scared then that would be one thing, and it would make more sense. But Astarion is really going to treat his spawn like that, giving them unwanted rough kisses, BEFORE he can control them permanently? That is just a very bad idea all around and his brain isn't that smooth.
Of course, @Rabbit, and it's no shade on you as a person. Just the difference in opinions.
I am curious, those who oppose--given you already had the cycle of abuse story line clear to you in patch 5, would it not still exist if it went back to how it was? What would stop you from seeing it that way if the change was un-changed?
Unfortunately, a trigger warning wouldnt help players who want to play him. Essentially, it would lock players with a history of abuse and triggers from playing the character they choose. Which I imagine would feel extremely frustrating, as they're now unable to play something they previously loved.
Im just curious, as you say changing the facial expression would impact the story, but the previous happy facial expression didn't impact the story. Players were still happily discussing the cycle of abuse pre-6.
Edit: sorry I'm on mobile so I miss half of what I wanted to say. But! The mod community is an excellent suggestion. Unfortunately, the consensus right now is facial animations specifically are very difficult to do. Right now the popular solution is free cam mod for a better angle.
make Tav\Durge face, body language and movements happy in consensual kiss with the vampire Astarion.
Abuse contains there is a victim and an abuser - in Tav's head tadpole, break up at any moment. Not neutral - happy, because it would be like alienation anyway. There is such a problem with the face during a UA kiss in tiffling, "fr, you're too gentle" kinda, "like you ate a lemon" associations people's are different.
That's why Happy Faces during a kiss.
Making the player a scared, disgruntled victim by force with a kiss, which the player clicks on - senseless mockery contrary to the meaning of the: role-playing game, romantics of ?Astarion, tadpole-plot, attitude towards kink community "on.your.knees" tweet, fanservice for Valentine's Day on twitter and common sense.
