Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback Minthara's Compendium Of Issues

The introduction of the knockout recruitment was a massive step in the right direction for Minthara as a character in the eyes of the player base, however in order to solidify it as an actual part of lore it could use some improvements because although it has been made official, currently the way it's implemented does not feel like a truly official part of the game since the story does not even react to it.

It would be a lot better if (just like Mother Superior in ACT III) Minthara got automatically knocked out once her HP dropped down to 0 at any point throughout ACT I and thus trigger a cutscene that would allow the player to ask her a few questions about the Absolute and Moonrise Towers as the truth fills her with doubt and uncertainty about her faith in the Absolute before choosing to either let her go or kill her. Thus solidifying the optional recruitment as an actual part of lore that the story would get to react to, including herself as well later in ACT II.

Another issue about the knockout recruitment method is that there is no content in place to compensate for the loss of her ACT I camp scene. It would be nice if she could get a camp scene or two in early ACT II so the player can at least talk about what happened during ACT I and somewhat bond with her as a companion.

Minthara's unique [Xyanyde] mace should not be unobtainable when legitimately recruiting Minthara by raiding the Grove, instead it should either be on the table within Moonrise Towers' torture chamber or on one of the guards who escorted her there.

Although having sex with Minthara during ACT I is not a part of her romance due to her completely valid reasons (because she was still a vulnerable brainwashed victim enslaved to the Absolute throughout the whole scene), it is precisely the post-sex part why the whole scene ends up feeling so disconnected from her character because none of the player's actions throughout it carry any weight for her ACT II character arc, other than her simply acknowledging that the camp scene happened.

The very core and foundation of Minthara's actual romance once she is truly herself is complete honesty and trust, yet she never gets to react in ACT II about the player's own honesty/deceit during their ACT I scene when her own individuality temporarily resurfaced, finding herself with her back against a wall in a very conflicted and vulnerable state full of confusion and fear as her true heart and enslaved mind were at war with one another.

Thus to bring some meaningful weight to ACT I's sex scene and have it feel connected to her character arc in ACT II; Minthara should react to whether the player always had her best interests in mind during her most vulnerable state. Trying to open her eyes about the Absolute by being completely honest with her should unlock a unique dialogue, an appreciative scene or at the very least a significant approval boost from her later in ACT II.

After all when she's about to officially become a love interest she says herself that her whole life has been full of deception and backstabbing, unable to truly love because of it... until she met us. Even though she is not fully herself during ACT I, that is the very beginning of our own honesty towards her and us building the foundation for the romance, so she definitely should be reacting to it later.

When the Dark Urge at the end of their personal quest finally confronts Bhaal, Minthara will not have any dialogue about the eternal fate that befalls her beloved Dark Urge, not even a reaction to it.

Considering how much Minthara loves, admires and supports Dark Urge in absolutely every decision they make as a couple and how much she despises the gods, it is entirely against her character to not have anything to say to her beloved 'alurlssrin' being eternally enslaved to Bhaal, chosen by Bhaal or freed of Bhaal.

She absolutely needs to have a meaningful camp scene or dialogue with Dark Urge after dealing with Bhaal to reflect on what kind of fate befell her beloved, because their bond is deep and their lives are bound to one another. This is a massive thing that affects her and them as a couple, therefore not reflecting on it makes her break character.

Unlike Halsin and Jaheira who have fully developed unique personal quests that come with meaningful consequences and multiple outcomes while taking numerous player actions into account because their quests can only be completed by them alone, Minthara is the only companion who does not have any actual personal quest whatsoever and therefore has no effect on the story at all, ultimately reducing her to a mere sidekick tag-along for any main character, rather than a companion who brings her own weight to the story.

The whole premise of her personal journey is seeking vengeance by piggybacking off of the Dark Urge's main quest and personal quest villains Ketheric and Orin, who as unavoidable main villains are not even her own personal quest and don't even react to her being present in the party at all. Therefore she has absolutely zero influence on the story and has no meaningful personal payoff for herself as a character because having her or not having her in the party changes absolutely nothing about these characters and story, let alone her own character arc.

She needs to be far more integrated into Orin's story and Dark Urge's personal quest, so that having her or not having her has meaningful impact on how this part of the story plays out and therefore grants her personal payoff that would allow her to grow as a character together with the Dark Urge. For example;


- ORIN NEVER REACTING TO MINTHARA BEING PRESENT IN THE PARTY -

Despite Minthara being Orin's personal worshipper for a meaningful amount of time while she was enslaved, Orin not once throughout the whole game reacts to Minthara being present in the party and it is precisely because of this lack of acknowledgment and reaction towards Minthara that she ends up feeling like Dark Urge's sidekick tag-along throughout the whole game, rather than a companion that puts her own weight onto the story.

Orin should absolutely be constantly reacting to Minthara if she's present in the party and especially try to get under her skin if she's Dark Urge's love interest. Currently the only villain who actually reacts to Minthara being in the party is Disciple Z'rell in ACT II, who is not even her nemesis.


- MINTHARA HAVING NO IMPACT DURING THE SHOWDOWN WITH ORIN -

Despite how sanguinely poetic Orin is when it comes to murdering people and how much Minthara wants to massacre Orin for everything she did to her, there's zero interaction between these two going on even during their final showdown. Instead it's just the Dark Urge and Orin in their 1v1 duel, when it should be the Dark Urge and Minthara against Orin if she happens to be a love interest.

Having Minthara as a love interest present during the duel between Dark Urge and Orin should have an impact on how Orin reacts and approaches the duel, by wanting to fight both lovers at the same time so she can present their corpses to her Father. After all it entirely fits Orin's character to want to kill both lovers in front of her Father's throne, therefore it would be an amazing addition to have a uniquely designed two-phase boss fight in which Minthara and the Dark Urge have to work together as one to overcome Orin in their duel.


- MINTHARA HAVING NOTHING SPECIAL GOING ON ONCE ORIN IS DEAD -

Even when Orin finally meets her end, there is nothing special going on with Minthara.

Considering how much trauma Orin inflicted upon her and how personal Minthara's vengeance was, this should be a meaningful milestone for her as a character and overall arc and something special should happen. A passionate love scene, a meaningful one-on-one camp scene, a new perspective, a unique memento of hers from the past, the player pulling her to the side one evening at camp to lift her spirits... SOMETHING that makes this milestone special and emphasizes her character arc reaching a meaningful point because she finally killed the very person that made her a victim of the Absolute.

All other companions have elaborate conclusions to their own personal quests and interesting outcomes, but Minthara unfortunately has none even when her own personal journey reaches its peak.

Apart from evidently numerous issues mentioned above which make Minthara quite barren as a companion, she is also the only love interest who does not have a single one-on-one camp scene, romance scene, love scene or romantic action.

Unlike other companions (like Shadowheart or Karlach) who have numerous camp scenes, romantic scenes, several love scenes and several romantic actions throughout all three acts allowing the player to sit down with them and truly connect with them, Minthara on the other hand unfortunately does not have any resemblance of an actual romance whatsoever because there's not a single moment in the entire game where the player just gets to sit down with her and enjoy her company so they can connect with her on a deeper level and explore her character.

Companions like Karlach have scenes like sitting by the campfire, having a love scene in ACT II, chirping happily like a bird the next morning, bursting out of joy when she's told she's loved, the funny dinner date, the awkward flirtations etc. Shadowheart also has numerous romantic scenes and even romantic actions such as gifting her the Shar idol or a Night Orchid or even getting hugged at the end of her personal quest in ACT III.

Minthara's one and only such scene does not even affect her romance (for very good reasons) and is only available where she is not even Minthara, but instead a vulnerable enslaved brainwashed victim of the Absolute who's terribly conflicted, confused and afraid throughout the whole scene, all because her heart and enslaved mind are at war with another.

And to make matters worse not only does she not know who she truly is throughout the whole scene, but she is even being manipulated by the player themself too. Minthara's one and only camp scene is available only under these conditions where she's a mentally enslaved and abused victim by so many parties at once, when in actuality she's an incredibly intriguing, wholesome and most loyal love interest once she's truly free.

She needs one-on-one camp scenes, romance scenes & love scenes throughout ACTs II and III once she's a free woman so that the player can sit down, explore and connect with her character on a deeper level. She also needs more romantic actions that expand her character and personality (examples below), and possibly a newly discovered hobby in Baldur's Gate so she has something going for her as well. She loves banquets, she loves food from the Underdark, she loves her homeland and even misses it, she relates to felines a lot and there are a ton of cats in Baldur's Gate, she owned several displacer beasts during her past... yet all of these aspects of her character and personality are learned from random idle comments she throws out, instead of learned by sitting down with her and truly getting to know her, like all the other companions.

ACT I

Her ACT I camp scene should not be the one and only one-on-one camp scene for her entire character and this scene should not feel so disconnected from her overall character arc.

As mentioned in the improvement section above, the player's honesty or deceit during the ACT I scene should be acknowledged and reacted to by Minthara in ACT II so that the scene carries some actual weight into her ACT II character arc. She is very grateful when the player saves her life, therefore she would be grateful too if the player attempted to save her by opening her eyes about the Absolute plot during ACT I.

ACT II

In ACT II she needs to have a love scene when she officially becomes a love interest, so she can finally as a free woman of her own mind and free heart enjoy true genuine feelings of pure love, passion and trust with her chosen romantic partner, something she did not get to do in ACT I and never got to experience in her entire life due to her own deceptive backstabbing culture that forced her to be so distrustful of everyone.

ACT III

In ACT III she needs to have some one-on-one camp scenes, romantic scenes and once Orin is dead a passionate love scene to solidify her as a love interest and allow the player to explore deeper layers of her personality so they can truly connect with her. As noted by examples of Shadowheart and Karlach who have so many romantic scenes and actions which they themselves initiate even so the player can connect with them, Minthara has absolutely no such scenes at all in ACT III nor does she even act as if she's romantically involved for the entirety of ACT III (with the exception of two minor encounters that aren't even her own; such as the Dryad and the Drow twins).

Outside of these two minor encounters she never addresses the player as "her love" throughout the entirety of ACT III and doesn't even have any romantic attitude toward her partner. The entire ACT III is completely devoid of any sense of romantic relationship with her.

An intriguing mostly-unknown aspect of Minthara's character and personality is that she relates a lot to the ferocious nature of felines by outright saying how just like felines she hates being wet and would scratch the eyes of anyone annoying her. Yet the most interesting aspect of her ferocious feline nature is that she also had plenty of pets in her life and they were not Lolth's spiders, but actual displacer beasts who she admired and respected.

It would be fantastic if this part of her character, history and personality could expand more by having Minthara interpose when Nessa is rescued from Yurgir in ACT II since she knows how to handle displacer beasts and thus have Nessa join Minthara as her summonable beast/camp animal, because Minthara respects intelligently ferocious feline animals and would bring that part of her character out more.

Having Nessa's recruitment exclusive to having Minthara in the party would not only elevate both as characters, but also bring some weight to having Minthara around by slightly fulfilling her lack of content in ACT II and slightly compensate for all the content her legitimate recruitment deletes across all three acts.

So Nessa becoming Minthara's own personal summonable beast to hunt prey together would elevate both characters and add some weight to them, since Nessa despite having quite extensive dialogue with some incredibly steep persuasion checks (30DC) to get her on our side, unfortunately just despawns afterwards. She could get the same treatment as 'Us' did by being a summon.

One of Minthara's biggest regrets as an 'independent Drow' (to the uninitiated; it means exile of Lolth) is having to suffer bland surface food, instead of enjoying food from her Menzoberranzan life such as her favorite spiced Ulaver wine and thinly sliced rothe steak. Despite her deceptive culture and being unable to fully enjoy her food due to it potentially being poisoned, this meal left a significant mark on her despite the dangers she faced.

It would be great if the player could come across these delicacies somewhere in Baldur's Gate and by doing so spend a night with Minthara enjoying a nice cozy romantic dinner and getting to know each other some more so she's made somewhat relaxed and reminded of home.

Baelen & Derrith Bonecloak after all constantly venture into the Underdark and have a Rothe with them, so some shop in Baldur's Gate having rothe meat would be a start to trigger Minthara's love for this meal and by doing so lead to a fancy dinner with her where she shares more about herself and culture.

A pretty rare randomly triggered dialogue with Minthara when kissing her is finding out that her lips are covered in poison, a result of her always dosing her meals in order to maintain her poison immunity. It's a very fascinating bit the player gets to learn through a very short and intriguing dialogue (which even leads to her 'joking' about potentially poisoning all the guests later during the epilogue party), but unfortunately that's all it ever is. A very short and sweet part of her that we don't get to engage with ourselves.

It would be amazing if the player could actually engage with her in this practice and spend a night together with her slowly guiding us into it since she'll always keep doing it herself. After all one of her romance banters as our love interest who really cares about us is that she is intentionally dosing us with small quantities of poison to build our immunity, so it would be wonderful to actually be able to slowly get into it together with her.