It's interesting to me that these might both be uniquely American things, both the "Lifetime movie" trope we discussed in the other thread, and the idea that if a woman enjoys a story with a darker love interest, there must be something wrong with her. We saw it with Twilight and 50 Shades (and I'm ashamed to say I participated in some of the bashing, though a lot of that was because I thought the writing was embarrassingly bad and the characters ridiculously flat), and we're seeing it again with Astarion, but bonus points because this is a playable story, so there must be something extra wrong with you if you want to act it out.
"50 Shades" - totally disliked it because of the fact that it's about "an romance with a millionaire". Romance with a millionaire, in my opinion, is a stamp of cheap tabloid reading, just mentally remove from the book all the BDSM, so attracted the audience, and what without BDSM in this book will remain? It feels like the heroine is breaking herself for dough, honoring a contract, and then sort of falling in love and trying to "soften" or fix this "dominant" guy who was born with a golden spoon in his mouth. When I boredly imagined myself in her place, I realized that I would probably agree to such a contract on one condition - if before this smart guy lives at least six months, blocking all his bank accounts from himself, getting some hard and ungrateful job - a loader, janitor, or at least a waiter or salesman, rent some hole on his salary, and will live only on the money he earned on this job. For the sake of such a thing, you can risk being a subordinate, but he himself will flake out and quickly run away, and there will be no funny story.
Originally Posted by starryophonic
That's interesting! The closest thing to a negative emotion I felt for that line was surprise, that the game would so blatantly point out that a player who ascends him might be someone who likes to be dominated. It's not a source of anxiety for me; it's something I've long accepted as something I'm into.
Yeah, I realized later, after going through it, that this is what the game meant. The very idea of a sex store, when the authors imagine the player as a person who makes important choices based on his own sexual preferences, I don't like it at all, or at least the character should be presented immediately and explicitly as a character who has special tastes, so that people like me would get it right away. But I really enjoyed the experience! In addition, I met and talked to interesting people who are into the topic of BDSM, broadened my horizons and learned something new about myself among other things. I catch myself thinking that in the previous post I did not quite correctly wrote that then with Astarion "there is no submission", there is, and those who like it, pick up on it. It would be more correct to say "there is no submission in a form that crosses the line beyond which that submission would make me feel lousy". I see D/s as therapy for Astarion, to give him pleasure if that's how he feels best. It's no problem for me, it's not a big deal, as long as it makes him feel good. I can "dominate" opponents elsewhere if I want to, after all. The knights of the past kneeled before the lady of the heart, elevating her without humiliating themselves, why can't a woman behave in the same way towards a man, are we actually equal or not? After the ritual, Astarion catches the "arrival" of the sudden power, his senses are heightened, new feelings appear, you can imagine what he feels at that, his behavior changes. But after a while he calms down, gets used to it and becomes himself, really becomes himself, he no longer needs to wear masks, play roles, adjust, he is completely free.
Originally Posted by starryophonic
I understand the point of view of people who say, "Ascended Astarion is only nice to you as long as you agree with everything he says." But I think that assumes that a Tav who agrees with him is ONLY doing it to not incur his wrath, and not because they genuinely do agree with him.
It makes me laugh, too. My Tav hasn't been a coward the whole game, and now it's all fear of wrath. And it's not Merisue, I IRL with all my will I can never be so cowardly as they describe it. In general, the theme of fear in the game is presented in a very strange way, you take the power - it means you're afraid. In general, they don't see the difference between fear and rational readiness to face danger. I don't know what kind of hothouse conditions a person must live in to be seriously afraid of everything the game suggests to be afraid of. I don't lick icicles in the cold because I'm a coward and very afraid of the frozen tongue effect, and so I've only ever dreamed of it my whole life, based on this logic of the fearful victim-Tav. And Astarion is happy to have defeated the brain, he doesn't even remember offering to control it, he's happy to finally be free of the larva. I'll bet anything that in the future, if Astarion suddenly wants to do something dangerous with unreasonable risk and Tav takes his hand and says, "Nope, my love, we're not going to do that because of this and that," he'll have the exact same reaction. I couldn't choose a breakup phrase in my game, I can't hurt my Astarion, I watched the video and this one is not cruelty in any way, he's suffering, he's been betrayed. Suddenly betrayed by the one person he could only trust. I can't feel anything other than pain for him at all when I see this, and a desire to comfort him and console him. All those petty fears and resentments just can't be experienced or imagined.
