YT comments are like this too. If I hear one more person say, "cycle of abuse" I'm going to scream. That's not how the cycle of abuse works.
This hysteria-abuse-attack with AA is an attack on the real victims of abuse who are being healed by this romance. The attack is ruthless and ignorant. “You can like it, just accept, admit that it's abuse"...
Admit that Spawn Astarion's healing is deadly. Abusive and controlling relationships clearly already transitioning to reality and to real morality only begins to attach to Astarion after the Ascension. Because if it worked initially, Astarion can't be touched, he's dangerous.
Honestly, narcissist, manipulative, with huge trauma from slavery, power-hungry, thinks power is fun, bloodthirsty, cynical.
Ppl-cycleAAabuse.. out of their refined gingerbread house, with fudge instead of shingles, where they heal and “make better” Astarion, see a gothic gingerbread house and they start screaming about abusive behavior, yelling for someone to admit something.
No, I'm not creating victim characters. My Tav and Astarion can't live without each other. The game judging by Tav's answers allows to do that, even after that douchey scare face by kiss.
I'm playing with a problematic manipulator like you do, which Astarion was, and will remain for a very long time.
I know spawn of fans who are sympathetic and don't try to force anyone to acknowledge anything by putting ashes on their head. Because they know Astarion is dangerous, and no one should care if he's an arrogant Lord or a morally questionable assassin.
Oh man, I would love to read those. Someone else posted the cut lines party members have with Astarion regarding Ascension/turning Tav and they are just incredible. Wyll's bit might be my favorite. https://shiakihades.tumblr.com/post/737825265777033216
Yes! Those are the ones I meant. They're fantastic. It's a damn shame that they're not able to be triggered in the game. I hope they get put in / restored at some point. I love the Wyll one too, also the one with Minthara as it shows he only wants to give the 'gift' of immortality to his darling (us!). The Halsin one was very interesting too. What he said to Lae'zel was eye-opening to me, and what Karlach said was really sweet. That's so true about YouTube too, people just parroting the same narrative and I've gotten so sick of it.
Ohhh I think I saw you say the word "party" and had a brain fart and thought you meant there was additional cut dialog at the epilogue party. I really hope those get triggerable too. They provide such valuable insight into the characters' mindsets and it would provide a much more immersive experience if they commented on it. I think dialogs like these would go a long way to prove that AA fans aren't just looking for a pure "wish fulfillment" story. I actually like that so many of the companions are disapproving. It's a RPG where I've arguably made a pretty dark decision. In a tabletop game the other characters/players would comment on it, and they should do the same here. But it also shows Astarion's devotion to Tav, so it could also put to rest some of the "he's abusive" folks. Of course, those who are dead-set on it aren't going to be swayed by anything, I think.
Originally Posted by LiryFire
Originally Posted by starryophonic
YT comments are like this too. If I hear one more person say, "cycle of abuse" I'm going to scream. That's not how the cycle of abuse works.
This hysteria-abuse-attack with AA is an attack on the real victims of abuse who are being healed by this romance. The attack is ruthless and ignorant. “You can like it, just accept, admit that it's abuse"...
Admit that Spawn Astarion's healing is deadly. Abusive and controlling relationships clearly already transitioning to reality and to real morality only begins to attach to Astarion after the Ascension. Because if it worked initially, Astarion can't be touched, he's dangerous.
I literally, actually, no joke saw someone saying this on an AA video. Something like, "You can play however you want, but you have to admit that he's abusive." Maybe one of Niraart's? I'm not sure I want to go dig it up but if I come across it again I might screenshot it. It was an old comment by the time I saw it or I would have said something like, "We don't have to admit anything, actually. We get to interact with the game however we want."
YT comments are like this too. If I hear one more person say, "cycle of abuse" I'm going to scream. That's not how the cycle of abuse works.
This hysteria-abuse-attack with AA is an attack on the real victims of abuse who are being healed by this romance. The attack is ruthless and ignorant. “You can like it, just accept, admit that it's abuse"...
Admit that Spawn Astarion's healing is deadly. Abusive and controlling relationships clearly already transitioning to reality and to real morality only begins to attach to Astarion after the Ascension. Because if it worked initially, Astarion can't be touched, he's dangerous.
I literally, actually, no joke saw someone saying this on an AA video. Something like, "You can play however you want, but you have to admit that he's abusive." Maybe one of Niraart's? I'm not sure I want to go dig it up but if I come across it again I might screenshot it. It was an old comment by the time I saw it or I would have said something like, "We don't have to admit anything, actually. We get to interact with the game however we want."
I see people saying this daily. "Like what you want, but admit it's abuse." It's so patronizing.
Not ascending doesn't suddenly make Astarion immune to being toxic or repeating abuse patterns. He's still Astarion. There's no magic cure for trauma.
It's the same argument with every vampire since the beginning of fiction. Even YA novel vampires are anazlyed as abusive. Wake me when vampirism is in the DSM. Players don't have to admit anything to like what they like in the way that they like it. We don't owe anything to anyone to have fun with a game.
This is a RP game. If you want to RP as a mistreated victim, you can. But you can also RP as evil and having fun with your evil LI. It's an included route in the game! There's dialogue options for *both*.
Curious that everyone who downloads the game these six months from February 17 to September 7 patch, will click on the kiss and see the character shake with fear and sadness. Probably reload. And no one will see these answers at all, for the consonant dynamic no one will see, it's forever a fear, a sadness for story. Even DU someone did a very good job to slaughter this romance
END GAME
One negative: Player: I think we should break up.
Player: Let's see everything, now I'm free of my Father! I want to travel the world. REALLY_DARK_URGE Player: I want to see the world, with you at my side. ORI_Astarion_State_GoingToTravel Player: I want to live forever. Make me a vampire. ORI_Astarion_Event_TurnIntoSpawn = False Player: I want to sit on your lap, sipping blood from a chalice, ruling the Gate from our foul throne. REALLY_DARK_URGE Player: We'll start with Baldur's Gate - Let's make this city ours. ORI_Astarion_State_TakeBaldursGateTogether Player: Let's put our enemies to the sword! ORI_Astarion_State_BloodyStruggle
EPILOGUE
Two neutral lines: Player: Do you want to see the others? Say 'hello'? Player: I'll get back to the party. Do you want anything?
Player: Is that what we're doing? 'Flourishing'? Is more neutral, since it leads to two neutral.
Two negative lines: Player: Freedom? Player: Nothing. Forget I said anything.
Player: True. We are spectacular, after all. Player: It is wonderful. I'm glad I get to share this with you. Player: None would dare, my love. Player: I'm sorry I kind of disappeared. I didn't mean to leave you like that.
6 patch, script, though
Feared character plot is applicable as a main plot, the game assumes that the player character understands nothing and is a victim. I don't create victims who go for the kiss themselves.
3 negative responses for sad-Tav-victim. 10 positive responses for Tav\DU consonant dynamics. I prefer more content and creating the suitable character - ally and lover.
Why is the reaction to the kiss not consistent with most of the lines?
So... patch 7 is scheduled to be released in September. At least 3 more months of having to endure these great "improvements" to AA romance (if these changes even get reverted at all).
Meanwhile, modders are doing even more fantastic work. Once again, thank you modders for fixing the game for us! <3
I love when Tav takes charge in the kisses, I didn't know how much I would like it before seeing this. The one at 2:55 timestamp, I would love that.. Very good mods! *clap*
Having at least one like that in unmodded game would be great honestly. Why can't Tav play with Astarion like Astarion plays with Tav in the kisses? Sometimes it's Astarion, and sometimes it's Tav that leads the kiss. There is no logic for Tav to be a complete doormat in the relationship when they are at that stage in the romance. Fresh, new and in love.
I love when Tav takes charge in the kisses, I didn't know how much I would like it before seeing this. Very good mods! *clap*
Having at least one like that in unmodded game would be great honestly. Why can't Tav play with Astarion like Astarion plays with Tav in the kisses? Sometimes it's Astarion, and sometimes it's Tav that leads the kiss. There is no logic for Tav to be a complete doormat in the relationship when they are at that stage in the romance. Fresh, new and in love.
I also really like the fact that Astarion kept his ominous smiles and furrowed brow. His facial expressions are also changed in the old kiss (now Spawn exclusive) to fit his evil lord mannerism.
I love when Tav takes charge in the kisses, I didn't know how much I would like it before seeing this. Very good mods! *clap*
Having at least one like that in unmodded game would be great honestly. Why can't Tav play with Astarion like Astarion plays with Tav in the kisses? Sometimes it's Astarion, and sometimes it's Tav that leads the kiss. There is no logic for Tav to be a complete doormat in the relationship when they are at that stage in the romance. Fresh, new and in love.
I also really like the fact that Astarion kept his ominous smiles and furrowed brow.
Never remove the ominous smiles and furrowed brow! <3
Ohhh I think I saw you say the word "party" and had a brain fart and thought you meant there was additional cut dialog at the epilogue party. I really hope those get triggerable too. They provide such valuable insight into the characters' mindsets and it would provide a much more immersive experience if they commented on it. I think dialogs like these would go a long way to prove that AA fans aren't just looking for a pure "wish fulfillment" story. I actually like that so many of the companions are disapproving. It's a RPG where I've arguably made a pretty dark decision. In a tabletop game the other characters/players would comment on it, and they should do the same here. But it also shows Astarion's devotion to Tav, so it could also put to rest some of the "he's abusive" folks. Of course, those who are dead-set on it aren't going to be swayed by anything, I think.
Agree with everything you said! It's a crime that we can't trigger those lines! They really would make the experience more immersive and sheds light on certain blind spots that the game has right now. It always felt kind of empty and odd to me that none of the other companions comment about you becoming a spawn or anything about the new dynamics of your relationship. I agree some people will never change their mind about hating on A.A. and saying he's abusive - but at least we'd have something more substantial. It does show his devotion and the depth of this bond we share with him. <3
Originally Posted by Ametris
So... patch 7 is scheduled to be released in September. At least 3 more months of having to endure these great "improvements" to AA romance (if these changes even get reverted at all).
I saw they mentioned in this update that some things will be added before September, and even though my hope is slim, I will hold on to some hope that they will change those kisses soon. Because they are destroying this romance for so many players and fans. I'm happy for those who enjoy roleplaying it like that, but you can't just force something shocking like that on everyone. Those kisses are inconsistent to the rest of the romance (dialogues, etc.) and they just don't make sense to me no matter how I look at it.
I'm hoping that they get enough constructive negative feedback on it that they will do something about it. How can they not see what a mistake this was. I've gotten more sour about it the longer they ignore / don't change it.
Both of those Minthara animations (at 2:55 and 3:25) on Tav during kisses and the appraisal and bite kiss (with changed expressions) from Patch 6 would be my dream kiss cycle. With kneeling kiss in epilouge tavern (also with changed expression).
There is so much focus on Astarion changing and becoming "bad", but Tav is changed too. When becoming a spawn or bride I would expect a new lust for blood and violence. Absolute devotion to Astarion as their Vampire master but also brimming with want to taste his blood.
So... patch 7 is scheduled to be released in September. At least 3 more months of having to endure these great "improvements" to AA romance (if these changes even get reverted at all).
Meanwhile, modders are doing even more fantastic work. Once again, thank you modders for fixing the game for us! <3
This is an awesome mod! The biggest joy I've had in a while! Too bad I chose body 3 in my walkthrough, but now I can start a new game, with DU and Astarion, and will know what beautiful romance lies ahead.
Such variety, every kiss is wonderful! I know kisses of other companions have been used, but since I haven't had any romances other than Astarion, it's just such a huge variety for me and I think everything fits wonderfully. Very pleased with the kiss on the cheek, after which you can kiss Astarion passionately yourself! And when Tav touches Astarion's cheek with her hand and he covers her hand with his, closes his eyes and they touch foreheads and then kiss... And when Tav kisses Astarion's forehead... Yes they are all passionate and loving!
And hugging Astarion is now possible too. <3
I don't think Larian themselves will do any better than this, but they should at least remove trigger traumatizing content from their game just to avoid hurting people. I will most likely only play with this mod.
So... patch 7 is scheduled to be released in September. At least 3 more months of having to endure these great "improvements" to AA romance (if these changes even get reverted at all).
Meanwhile, modders are doing even more fantastic work. Once again, thank you modders for fixing the game for us! <3
This is an awesome mod! The biggest joy I've had in a while! Too bad I chose body 3 in my walkthrough, but now I can start a new game, with DU and Astarion, and will know what beautiful romance lies ahead.
Such variety, every kiss is wonderful! I know kisses of other companions have been used, but since I haven't had any romances other than Astarion, it's just such a huge variety for me and I think everything fits wonderfully. Very pleased with the kiss on the cheek, after which you can kiss Astarion passionately yourself! And when Tav touches Astarion's cheek with her hand and he covers her hand with his, closes his eyes and they touch foreheads and then kiss... And when Tav kisses Astarion's forehead... Yes they are all passionate and loving!
And hugging Astarion is now possible too. <3
I don't think Larian themselves will do any better than this, but they should at least remove trigger traumatizing content from their game just to avoid hurting people. I will most likely only play with this mod.
Crossing my fingers that when mods are available for consoles in September, this will be included. I will 100% replay if it is.
I don't think Larian themselves will do any better than this, but they should at least remove trigger traumatizing content from their game just to avoid hurting people. I will most likely only play with this mod.
I feel so relieved. Knowing it is a way to play the game if September update is a bust. BUT Larian need to do something about the kisses still if they don't want to exclude a large number of players from the AA path. I think Larian can do a very good fix if they want to, after all it is them that made all those animations.
Originally Posted by starryophonic
Crossing my fingers that when mods are available for consoles in September, this will be included. I will 100% replay if it is.
Hoping for you console players, you all deserve to have some joy with AA too!
I saw they mentioned in this update that some things will be added before September, and even though my hope is slim, I will hold on to some hope that they will change those kisses soon. Because they are destroying this romance for so many players and fans. I'm happy for those who enjoy roleplaying it like that, but you can't just force something shocking like that on everyone. Those kisses are inconsistent to the rest of the romance (dialogues, etc.) and they just don't make sense to me no matter how I look at it.
I'm hoping that they get enough constructive negative feedback on it that they will do something about it. How can they not see what a mistake this was. I've gotten more sour about it the longer they ignore / don't change it.
After watching that lecture I don't think they will change it. Larian wants us to feel bad. Apparently gaming studios are now ethics teachers, personal psychologists and relationship experts.
I'm so glad at least modders are in touch with the players. Now we only need the bite kiss to be fixed and we can fully enjoy the game again.
After watching that lecture I don't think they will change it. Larian wants us to feel bad. Apparently gaming studios are now ethics teachers, personal psychologists and relationship experts.
I'm so glad at least modders are in touch with the players. Now we only need the bite kiss to be fixed and we can fully enjoy the game again.
I hope you are wrong about Larian. As things stand the romance with A.Astarion is so inconsistent, it is really frustrating trying to play through the romance and RP as a Tav who wasn't just into some kinky vamp sex and who doesn't bitterly regret the ascension. That isn't a story I'm interested in at all, I just want a classic Dark Romance.
I am delighted to see these mods for the PC master-race, but at the same time, I'm crying softly in PS5. This is much more like what I was hoping for from the Valentine's 'gift' in Patch 6. I love that Astarion's expressions have been kept, loving all that intensity and passion. Also really happy to see Tav taking some initiative.
Originally Posted by KiraMira
There is so much focus on Astarion changing and becoming "bad", but Tav is changed too. When becoming a spawn or bride I would expect a new lust for blood and violence. Absolute devotion to Astarion as their Vampire master but also brimming with want to taste his blood.
I totally agree, I would expect Tav to change in this way, certainly when I rp my Tav they are not going to be afraid and passive. I think it might be nice to have other options for players who wish to RP differently, but honestly, all I want at this stage is consistency. I want a Dark Romance that feels like a romance and an A.A. who consistently behaves like a romance partner/lover. At the moment A.A.'s kisses completely contradict the dialogue in game.
Larian wants us to feel bad. Apparently gaming studios are now ethics teachers, personal psychologists and relationship experts.
I'm so glad at least modders are in touch with the players. Now we only need the bite kiss to be fixed and we can fully enjoy the game again.
I hope you are wrong about Larian. As things stand the romance with A.Astarion is so inconsistent, it is really frustrating trying to play through the romance and RP as a Tav who wasn't just into some kinky vamp sex and who doesn't bitterly regret the ascension. That isn't a story I'm interested in at all, I just want a classic Dark Romance.
I too hope Tav's face is a gross mistake, a clumsiness. Because I don't have a single logical reason to think that the kisses were recast for February 14 to make you feel bad, to show a story of abuse rather than love.
Larian wanted to do it so badly that 7-8 months, the kiss with AA was completely with happy faces. And in the ending and epilogue there are a total of 10 positive lines, when about 3 (counting the “let's break up”) are allotted for the abuse story with the vampire
Literally took a kiss that had previously been enjoyable for the character and the players who play this way. And made it appropriate for a minority of lines in the game. Why? What for? For February 14.
And even a 6 patch “finally showing what kind of story this is, it's abusive and not love” (for Feb. 14) Gives Tav a line: Player: I'm sorry I kind of disappeared. I didn't mean to leave you like that.
Not to mention the other 9. Who, in what world, would walk up and tell someone whose kisses are scary and disliked, “I'm sorry, I didn't mean to leave you like that”. Oh, or is Tav lying and choosing the right words so the one they're afraid of doesn't get angry. That's fantastic.
Patch 6 showed nothing but that Larian is a complete disaster about this character. This clumsy mess will continue too 7-8 months, Larian will show their attitude for in the september. This is too serious a thing for story to leave it like this, on the shoulders of the moders, who incidentally deal with harassment by putting what was in the story for back in place.
I realize this isn't on the topic of fixing romance, but I'd really like to ask for a fix for this cruel bug in Astarion's overall story - the ability to pick up a slain and tortured Astarion as a zombie, take him to camp, and bully his corpse.
Please, dear developers, fix this bug!
Originally Posted by Mirmi
I'm not sure, but I think it's a bug. Because by analogy, after passing the temple of Shar - I could not resurrect killed in the first act on the shore Shadowhart (her quest, one of the main points, without her was executed) and similarly, could not resurrect Laezel, after the destruction of the Git temple. Given that you can't talk to him and he's reading a book...
If it's not possible to taunt Shadowheart and Lae'zel who died, then please fix the bug that gives the ability to taunt Astarion even after his death. Especially since his death in this “story”, which gives the opportunity to do so, is the most horrible and agonizing, there is nothing like it for any companion in the game:
Originally Posted by Ametris
"There were some notes in the kennels saying that Cazador got pissed because he couldn’t control Astarion, so he flayed Astarion alive over and over again until Astarion couldn’t be put together in human form anymore."
They're fantastic. It's a damn shame that they're not able to be triggered in the game. I hope they get put in / restored at some point. I love the Wyll one too, also the one with Minthara as it shows he only wants to give the 'gift' of immortality to his darling (us!). The Halsin one was very interesting too. What he said to Lae'zel was eye-opening to me, and what Karlach said was really sweet. 
![[Linked Image from i.ibb.co]](https://i.ibb.co/wJZn4m6/image.png)
![[Linked Image from i.ibb.co]](https://i.ibb.co/DgvStVW/image.png)
![[Linked Image from i.ibb.co]](https://i.ibb.co/qF4HWZL/image.png)
His facial expressions are also changed in the old kiss (now Spawn exclusive) to fit his evil lord mannerism.
This mod is beautiful. 
