Originally Posted by Silver/
Rogue is missing too many core features to be a stand alone class. I'm not sure if it was always this way, or if Larian backed out of more stealth gaming based on the early access complains (they've changed many things for the worse based on even vaguely related issues -- I wouldn't put it past them).

Fundamentally, melee rogue is suffering from a lack of extra attack to an extent where only one subclass can halfass it. It's difficult to rebalance as currently all roads lead to stealth archer. Greater invis + pass without trace. The rogue class fantasy sees its full potential only when heavily supported by ally spellcasters, which is weird, but where we're at.

They're not missing any core features though. They are almost entirely RaW. With extra bonuses due to Larian's stealth being grossly OP compared to TT (As well as Fast Hands enabling an extra attack, though this often is simply used by multi-class Rogue, especially since Rogue doesn't get TWF)

Rogue doesn't get any extra attack, they instead use their Sneak Attack to make up for it. The only reason this isn't as equivalent in BG3 is because Larian buffed Haste for some reason so Extra Attack classes (Especially Fighter and Paladin/Warlock with their 2 extra attacks) get obscene amounts more damage from being Hasted due to getting multiple bonus attacks, while Rogues are stuck with their 1 Sneak Attack per round (Homebrew to have Sneak Attack being once per Standard Action would help alleviate this, allowing Rogues to scale with Haste)

As far as supporting Rogue... Cloak of Cunning Brume and Eversight Ring makes a melee Rogue completely self sufficient. As it means Cunning Action: Disengage can be used to create a fog cloud to provide blindness at will (Also, enable other magic item bonuses in regards to obscurity. Namely various Dark Justicar items)

Outside of that, Rogue subclasses are kind of borked.

Assassin was nerfed so it's much more limited in how it can utilize Ambush (It used to work when initiating combat with an attack, which combined with Assassin's Alacrity allowed an Assassin to stealth into combat and get 2 turns of guaranteed crits - One from their initial attack that started combat and then their first turn in combat) this is technically more accurate to RaW but doesn't compete with the rest of Larian's homebrew (I.e. Haste being so powerful and Rogue dips to get Fast Hands for extra attacks with classes that get TWF or unarmed Monks).

While Trickster is gimped by Mage Hand being horrendously limited in the game compared to TT.

Last edited by Taril; 10/07/24 09:02 PM.