Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Story & Character Discussion POLL: Tweaks to make the good ending less of a downer? (ENDING SPOILERS)

For that to be satisfying, they would also have to rewrite Gale a bit, so that his story doesn't seem like that of someone struggling with depression and suicidal ideation. He socially isolates himself after he gets the orb. There's explicit possible dialogue at the circus where we find out he thinks that he, and the world, might be better off if he were dead.

If the player picks the dialogue that pushes him away from suicide in his stargazing scene, his dialogue the next day sounds like someone who was contemplating suicide (for non-wold saving reasons). The non-romantic version is:

"I wanted to... to thank you. I was sinking into a dark place, but you reminded me there is still light in the world, if I should care to look for it. You... you may well have prevented me from doing something very rash in the near future. I count myself lucky to call you a friend."

Even if he isn't literally depressed in universe (I personally think he is), his story invokes the idea and feelings of depression and suicidality. In light of that, I think having the main "good" ending being a depressed man deciding that suicide was the answer would be icky.

This interpretation is on my mind because I recently watched the truly terrible Sci Fi adaptation of the Wizard of Earthsea (don't! it's sooo bad! but do read the books if you haven't) and have been realizing how many parallels there are between Ged, Wizard of Earthsea and Gale, Wizard of Waterdeep.

Like Ged, Gale was progidy, a golden child. When Ged went to university he learned the secret names at an astonishingly fast rate, his memory was far superior to other students. And, of course, this earned him the enmity of his peers. And yet Ged felt inferior to them because he came from a poor village and because he had been trained by a woman. (Earthsea being a patriarchal culture where women's magic was thought to be wicked and weak) Goaded on by a playground duel Ged sought to prove his superiority to the other students. Like Gale, Ged found a book of forbidden secrets that contained a spell that he was warned was far above his ability to cast. But Ged was the star student, the valedictorian, perhaps even the chosen one - no spell was above his abilities! Suffused with Hubris he cast the spell, and successfully summoned a dead spirit. Only to be attacked by a shadow. His shadow. A being that nearly killed him and that destroyed much of his magical acumen. The shadow stole many of Ged's skills, he learned at a far slower rate and had to quietly depart the college as a C student, not the valedictorian.

He is hounded by his shadow for years and he tries to face it, unsuccessfully, a number to times. Until he finally realizes that he can no longer run from it. He will come to terms with it even if doing so kills him.

For me the bomb moment parallels the moment when Ged turns to face his shadow. He looks his failures in the face and no longer seeks to blame his misfortunes on his ex. With both characters it's hard to say where the feelings of inferiority end and feelings of superiority begin, they are twin traits that eat each other's tails and feed on the other. BUT for all the good things about the Gale romance he still pins his failures on Mystra and not himself. Don't ask him about Mystra! You won't like the answer. In the romance has wrestled with his shadow but not yet defeated it.

Gale only defeats his shadow when he offers to detonate. He has learned to care something other than his personal ambition. This, IMO, is best ending of romance because there is no greater love. His act not only saves his friends but destroys the object that could have made him a god. Love achieved, Hubris destroyed. Success.

Gale is a wizard, he gets his power from study and using his intellect to solve problems. While he is generally very cordial to clerics and bards, he's competitive with other wizards and somewhat dismissive of sorcerers who just got talent. He also points out how important study is at every opportunity, a lot of his banter resolves around this, especially with Lae'zel who seems to be a fellow nerd.

So, during the first act of Gale's folly, when his girlfriend shows him what magic is possible and beyond his reach, he gets a spot of imposter syndrome and, instead of being inspired to study harder, asks her for a leg up. She says no, he pleads and pouts (framed as the wrong thing to do by Gale himself) and eventually sets out to get her a very over the top present, a lost part of herself. This of course backfires and in Act 1 Gale believes that he was punished for trying to push to hard. This differs from the story you told about Ged, because Gale never tried to get himself a powerful spell from a forbidden book, he tried to get a present for Mystra to sort of guilt-trip her into letting him in on some of her secrets. His assumption that he got punished for his transgression is also wrong. It does show that he only blames himself for everything though, leading to depression as @SteelTempest pointed out above.

In act 3 Gale learns that the orb was something completely different from what he thought it was and that Mystra did not punish him at all. She just severed their connection, because he suddenly became very dangerous to her and - this is my interpretation - she didn't quite know what his intentions towards her were. I say this because she instantly reaches out to Gale if he shows good will in the Shadow-cursed Land, and her dialogue during the audience to me also sounds like she trying to suss out where he's standing. After the audience, Gale is furious with himself that he made such a rookie mistake and - at least on the forgiveness route - is mostly furious with himself for having been so stupid. Gale's "facing his shadow" moment is meeting Mystra because really everything hinges on this conversation. If he tries to ascend without having spoken to her, he will explode because he wasn't "armed with the truth".

The irony is, that in his desire to become an even more powerful wizard, he ignored what makes a good wizard in the first place: Research and study, two things he holds dear. The moral of the tale isn't that power or even ambition is bad, but that throwing your ideals in the wind to get somewhere quickly leads to ruin - even God-Gale needs to have learned this lesson in order to succeed.

Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2 and Return of the Jedi.

I think we've hit a keystone if not *the* keystone of our different readings. I don't believe Gale when he says he went to get Mystra a present, I think he's lying to himself.

Borrowing some relationship dynamics from my family for a silly example. Dad - really likes fishing / Mom - really likes books and reading.

Dad: "So I went to the new bait and tackle shop because I heard that your mom's favorite author likes to hang out there - an autograph would have been the best present ever! Unfortunately the author was a no show. But the trip wasn't wasted, I did get this new fishing rod"

KillerRabbit (internally): Sure dad you went to the bait and tackle shop to get a present for mom

...

Gale: "I know, I'll get Mystra the best present ever in a manipulative grand romantic gesture. Who knows, perhaps such an effort would persuade her to relent and show me what she is hiding. And if I happen to see some arcane secrets that Mystra hadn't managed to hide away that wouldn't the worst outcome would it? But that's not why I'm doing it! Nope, I'm not trying to manipulate her and/or find a way to uncover some secrets. This is an innocent romantic gesture like . . . like . . . proposing to someone in the middle of a sports stadium!

. . .

I think Gale went in search of arcane knowledge. The gift would either persuaded Mystra to reveal her secrets or the book itself would include some of Mystryl's secrets that she hadn't secured.

While I like the "needed to return to research and study" interpretation I think he did intend to do what an adventuring researcher does - look for knowledge in a dungeon and study it. Making his failure one based in hubris and not in failure to remember what makes a wizard a wizard.

Because my Tav was multiclassed as Cleric of Mystra / Wizard I got to see both conversational options when finding Karsus' book. From memory the wizard option was something like "you need to uncover these secrets that's what wizards do" and the cleric options were something along the lines of "you are contemplating a blasphemous act, put it out of you mind immediately"

So in Larian's view a proper wizard should seek to defy the gods and becoming their equal. Perhaps you are smarter than Karus, Gale? (and I sooo hate that they changed the ending to make this work in a way players could feel good about)