Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback The Dark Urge needs to be fixed

I answered you in the other thread: it's about the scene in the temple, not afterwards.

And generally, companions are often very unfazed in Durge scenes.

Very well explained, I couldn't agree more with this comment. In this part, the lack of reaction is very noticeable to the point of completely breaking the immersion. It's a too important revelation in the plot, implying that something shady is going on with our character, and it is not understood why any of our companions say anything here.

I would actually argue that it is bad. Really bad, at least for me, because it's the most important scene in the entire Durge's storyline and it's written so poorly compared to other scenes, to the point of breaking people's immersion.

Sure, but we're mostly talking about the lack of reaction DURING the moment Durge gets killed. The companions basically just stand there without any reaction before Withers shuffles his bony ass over to rez you. The emotional weight of Durge's death gets resolved so quickly, it's just...weird, especially when you compare it to the earlier, more polished parts of the game. In act 1, if you so much as sneeze, everyone has something to say about it, but come act 3, one of the most important moments to Durge's arc is met with silence and apathy.

I wouldn't even be opposed to Withers not showing up immediately as he kinda feels like an ex machina in that instance. Maybe they have to physically drag Durge's dead body back to camp. Maybe show us Gale using the only revival scroll he has and his face falling when it doesn't work. Shadowheart being the healer, desperately expending all her energy to bring you back to life as a last hail mary. Minthara not caring that Bhaal is a god, vowing to make him pay. Lae'zel threatening you to wake up, and the devastation that follows when she realizes you won't. Wyll thinking of bargaining his very soul to Mizora just for the chance she could bring Durge back. Astarion and Karlach praying to whatever gods they can think of even though they don't believe in them anymore. Show the grief, the exhaustion. Then, finally, Withers appears.

Even the post-death dialogue you get from the companions is lukewarm at best and basically amount to "oh hey good job, so proud of you for standing up to daddy bhaal". Like that's it? I just died in front of your eyes and that's all you have to say?

It's an issue all across the game tbh. Why do the companions have no reaction to Kressa's reveal that she tortured Durge? Why are there no consequences to your relationships when they find out you were behind the Absolute plan? One or two instances of these, fine. But eventually they add up and suddenly it becomes a lot more apparent that Durge doesn't feel quite finished.

What you've just written is sooo beautiful! Great idea to wait a little bit with Withers arrival and give some time for grief. All companions should be devastated, after all we were travelling for weeks or months together and most of us became friends. And our love interest should be broken and in tears, not believing in our death.

After that Withers' intervention would be much more intensive and rewarding. And of course dialogues after revival should be more intense, to match our companions reactions during the whole scene.

CelestialDraconi This is genius. This is brilliant.
Well, of course, I'm not a writer to judge, but you just described what could have been my favorite scene in the entire game.
Makes me even more sad to return to what we have now in the game. Such a missed opportunity, it hurts.

Omg, I love CelestialDraconi's comment too, a scene like that would be perfect. It's a shame they didn't give more attention to such an important moment, it would add a lot of emotional impact to Redemption Durge's story.

And I totally agree that the lack of reactivity is very noticeable compared to the first act. I remember when right after escaping the nautiloid, on the beach, Durge finds a body in the sand and a dialogue appears after register it, in which our character struggles to contain a smile. I thought it was a brilliant moment that raised a lot of expectations for Durge's story...that's why it's so disappointing that in much more relevant moments there is no reaction at all.

thank you to everyone who has echoed my disappointment & frustration - reading this thread has been very therapeutic and has also allowed me to acknowledge all the ways in which the game is SO fantastic that the low points hit harder than they maybe would in a lesser game because of the high standard that has been set

i'm a new player - i've just finished up my first run. durge is in many ways my favourite type of character to play (a fucked up little guy(gender neutral)) and the scene in act 2 where you have to resist murdering your love interest was one of my absolute highlights. i also really appreciated the additional stakes in the plot and with orin & gortash. overall, i really enjoyed the game and i hope that comes across.

i agree with everyone else about the big places where the reactivity is so lacking as to break immersion (after rejecting bhaal, meeting gortash, meeting ketheric and kressa, finding your pod). my gut feeling is that i would prioritise the death scene, then act 2 with ketheric/kressa if there were only certain parts that could be improved. as others have said, the death scene could be improved even without additional dialogue if that is a roadblock.

the gortash meeting DOES have minor reactions from your companions. it would be nice to have more but i'd be happy if larian fixed the bug that stops even these reactions from firing - it was wild to talk to karlach immediately afterwards when she doesn't at any point reference your past relationship w/ gortash. IMO these should be unmissable and prioritised over other comments.

a more minor moment that isn't at all as urgent to fix, but maybe does gesture at how many small immersion-breaking moments there are currently - talking to raphael about the crown of karsus and having no opportunity to mention you were involved in its theft? and there seemingly being no indication raphael knows this?

i was planning to recommend this route to a couple of my friends who i felt would really enjoy playing durge specifically - but rn i'm a little reluctant to do so if there are no plans to fix these problem areas. like everyone else, i thought the patch notes about additional durge reactivity meant more than just what is essentially meaningless flavour text.

oh yes, seconding this part as well! it was really immersion-breaking for me when karlach got so righteously angry that durge was gortash's conspirator in the coronation cut scene, but then afterwards, the "!" reaction i got from her was the one that's like "so that's gortash. what do you think?" as though she was speaking to tav (instead of durge)/ hadn't had that big revelation just dropped on her. seems like there's some kind of bug there.

Since I won't kill Astarion or Minthara for a Bhaal ending, I have to betray Bhaal. What makes me extremely sad about this route is losing Sceleritas. You should be able to convince Sceleritas of your own dark plans to become a god without Bhaal and he will still stay with his beloved master and then follow him as a companion such as Scratch.

The fact that companions often react so little to the Durge is often strange. Nobody questions what Raphael says

Same. It made me very sad to see him go. I actually quite liked this silly unhinged little guy. Well, maybe it is better for the story to have big differences between resist and embrace Durge. But it's still sad.

Not only that, but they even yell at you for "hiding" things from them even if you're completely honest from the start about your dark urges. 🙄

I'd like to argue that it makes no sense for durge to kill their lover, especially based on what was told in the game.



I was going to attempt to do a truly evil durge run (even though it would break my heart) when the new patch came out but I then decided not to bc I don't want kill my partner lol. BUT I would love Sceleritas to still be alive if durge rejects bhaal. I love him so much & hes so goofy. But it also makes sense that he dies with a redeemed durge bc he was essentially only there to make sure durge stays on the correct path bhaal wanted them on, bhaal is the one that created sceleritas after all so him staying alive would not make sense even though I wish he could

Well, in my opinion, it's logical that DU, if you accept Baal, will kill his love one way or another. Because such DU only has love for his dad. There is also a note under the Moon Towers in which DU writes This is literally his origin story. He does not need offspring, he does not need anything except the implementation of the plan, which he has already developed a long time ago. And the ending shows this perfectly.
Love with DU makes sense only if he rejected his dad, and therefore his past plans.

sceleritas's reaction if durge loses the duel to orin is sooo devastating, lowkey he's more upset over it than any of the companions are over durge literally dying lmao and i love him for that!! my #1 motivation for playing Embrace Durge on my next run is just to make sceleritas proud of me.

I think that jessiemeows was talking about
I also like Sceleritas a little bit. But let's not forget, that he may seem goofy but he is cruel projection of his master, god of murder.

But it's true that Sceleritas is more invested in our fight with Orin than our companions. That's another missing scene - Durge should be able to talk with companions and especially love interest just before the duel. They should comfort and support Durge in such important moment. And maybe it could be some type of goodbye with their partner - just in case things went wrong.

I agree with everything that’s been said here wholeheartedly. I too only made this account to respond with feedback based on the post from Reddit.

I’m playing as an embrace Bhaal/evil Dark Urge sort of like Michael Langdon from AHS, and the lack of reactions from companion is astonishing. I first noticed it in one of my files where I and I was truly baffled that Wyll and Karlach simply just left without a word. Didn’t try to fight me, didn’t verbally object to the truly reprehensible act… just left quietly to presumably That felt very out of character for these two.

I don’t know if it’s a bug or not, but I also find it strange that since the update, my Dark Urge is now randomly voicing lines that would indicate he’s aware of his lineage despite me being in Act 1. Aren’t we supposed to be an amnesiac?

As I said before, fully agree with the lack of reaction from the companions regarding the revelations found through Moonrise Towers and Gortash. Shouldn’t they be angry about this news? Shocked? In denial? Attempt to turn on you? Leave your party? It just feels so odd from a story telling standpoint . Or how they don’t say much in general for choosing actions where you succumb to the urge.

Also for storytelling purposes, please let us have the option to explore our past relationship with Gortash, both platonically and intimately. IMO, Gortash as a LI for the DU makes most sense for evil players and That way, players who want this content can enjoy their ship without it affecting the plot, establishing a canon, or imposing it on other Durge players who don’t want it. For example, if there’s a dialogue choice to flirt, he’d reveal a romantic past, but the other dialogue choice would reveal a platonic partnership of mutual respect. Just from a RP perspective of an evil Durge player, if I’m an amnesiac and I found the one person who arguably knows me better than anyone else alive and is the best shot of me , why wouldn’t I take advantage of that? Even if you’re not into the romance aspect of Durgetash, it makes sense from a manipulation standpoint. Even before Durge lost their memories,

Finally, there are things in DU’s background that just doesn’t make sense. Blood in Baldur’s Gate takes place in 1477, but isn’t Bhaal not fully resurrected until 1482 after all of his children are dead? I could see the DU having unusual aging given his lineage (again, very similar to Langdon in AHS), but then how could Bhaal have been resurrected?

Overall, the DU to me is the most compelling origin character and I don’t know if I’ll ever play as Tav again. But for both redemption and evil Durge, the story could use some polish to fully round it out.

Great point. I expected some type of verbal reaction to it. And the voice lines sound like a bug to me, or makes no sense at all if it's intentional.

We are supposed to be, but unfortunately these lines (which until now were missing for most voices) are very poorly implemented so they end up breaking immersion and portraying us as a deranged psychopath instead. Although they're fun to listen to, trying to roleplay a resisting Dark Urge with amnesia now as a High Priestess that is the epitome of kindness is extremely hard when she goes; "Hihihi hahaha one down, thousand more to murder! Father they will DIE FOR YOUUUU"

They're awesome lines, but poorly implemented. Especially the Father one which triggers immediately within the prologue. If it were up to me I would've implemented flagged records for these idle lines, so that they trigger more appropriately. For example the lines where the Father is mentioned could only trigger in ACT III after the Durge discovers his true heritage (and if they resist Father then they'd stop playing). While the other more murderous cackles and lines would only trigger if the player truly delved into their Urge.

For example if a Dark Urge player intentionally commits to their Urge or fails to resist them such as biting Gale's hand off, breaking Pandirna's legs, kicking the squirrel into the tree, punting the Gith egg off the cliff, murdering Isobel, murdering their love interest etc... then from that moment onward these murderous lines would play to appropriately represent their murderously uncontrollable state of mind since they couldn't resist the Urge (not counting harmless Urge actions like ogling Remira's wound at the Grove or unintentional deaths like Alfira/Quil that are out of our hands).

And if the player successfully keeps resisting the Urge then naturally these lines would not be playing since they're fully in control of their actions. For now it's gonna be extremely awkward getting to ACT III and still hearing "Father they will die for you" after refusing Bhaal

Oh, absolutely agree here. It was super immersion breaking having the father line come out right after the prologue. I had to do a double take. And it must be super frustrating playing a redemption urge only to have them praising their father or shouting out their murderous impulses. Yikes. These absolutely should only be tagged for succumbing to your urges or embracing Bhaal as you said.

To add to that, if the DU is running around verbally fantasizing their psychopathic murder fantasies, wouldn’t that also cause their companions to question even more who it really is they’re following?

Seems like quite the oversight and immersion breaking for both types of DU players.