Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback Patch 7 Ascended Astarion's kisses goes against his story as written

"You're right to be afraid."



I believe this dialog demonstrates that Astarion does have something to fear:

Player: I promise I'll keep you safe always. You'll never need the powers of an Ascendant.
Astarion: It would be nice not to have to rely on you as my great protector, but... well, I do appreciate the thought.

Doesn't Tav literally say, “You're right to be afraid”?

While Ascended Astarion says that he will protect Tav and that Tav will no longer have to fear anything. He also protects her from the sun and the debilitating vampire hunger by sharing his blood with her. So these are not empty promises.


Neil and Smith explicitly said that AA is Astarion as is. But many anti-AA people still argue that AA has lost itself, its soul, etc So, are the writers' opinions canon or not?

Neil Newbon: With Lord Astarion, we talked a lot about the idea that the cover is now off completely. So that you see him at his most terrible, and it's completely honest and he doesn't have to pretend anymore.

Adam Smith: So with Astarion, his evil ending is actually him...

Rooney and Smith deliberately avoid saying “bad ending”, they say “evil”. Because for people who know RPGs, there's a difference between evil ending and bad ending. Evil characters aren't miserable by default. Only Welch said that. But I can chalk it up to the fact that Welch was only 23 years old at the time and not much experience.

Welch thought the AA ending was “bad” because they attributed specific motivation to the players. They claimed that if you ascend him, you are doing it for the sake of sleeping with him. It's very presumptuous to impose motivation on a player as if they've personally gotten inside everyone's head. There are far better reasons to ascend him, and sex..... is far from the most obvious motivation for players. Honestly, they were just trying to cram an idea they took from their previous game into the game, but tied sexualization to the evil ending on completely empty grounds. Whereas in their previous game the player could gain sexualization points by choosing certain dialogues, thus coming to a “bad ending”, in the case of bg3 it just decided that if the player is evil = doesn't see Astarion as a person just by default. This narrative imposed is extremely mediocre, it's also extremely bad from a roleplaying perspective.

He's literally looking down on you because you are someone in that situation who believes you deserve sex as a reward. He will give it to you, but he won't respect you.

What if I don't play this scenario? What if I don't choose the “I want your body” line? Would the AA ending be “bad” in that case? Not to mention there may not be a bed scene with AA at all. Also, the script for the intimate scene says that AA and Tav look at each other with love: “Player and Astarion standing facing each other. They gaze lovingly at one another.” I.e. it's a normal bed scene between people who love each other.

I always see the reason he treats you so badly as a Vampire Ascendant unfortunately coming from the heart of his own insecurity: 'The fact that they were willing to let me kill all these people… it's by no means a forgivable thing to do. They must be simply so much hoping that I'll be willing to sleep with them if the cause of my trauma is gone, they'd even be willing to commit such an atrocity... At least that's how I interpret him.

What if my character is evil and has been committing mass murders the whole game? Like killing everyone in the Emerald Grove? Why would Astarion even be surprised that I let him kill spawns? “I can't believe you let me do that. Killing all those people.” What if I spent the entire game supporting Astarion in his quest for power and world domination? This narrative doesn't stand up to criticism because it fails to take into account so many nuances. Welch says it's their personal interpretation. It is not an unquestioned truth.


Not everything spawn says dictates narrative. Otherwise, let us then recognize that refusing to ascend was not his personal choice, but a sacrifice:

Astarion: How dare you! After all I've done for you - after everything I've sacrificed!

Which he could potentially regret.

Or that deep down inside he is very scared and feels vulnerable, “nothing.”:

Astarion: I'm still nothing, aren't I? Just an expandable frail spawn who will burn to a crisp soon enough.

That being said, AA is much more confident:

Astarion: All right. Fine. Give me the worm. I will take every weapon I can, damn it all.


One of Velioth's basic rules is that strength is born from loneliness. Sharing with others is weakness. The first thing AA does is share his blood and Mephistopheles gifts with Tav. In the epilogue he also expresses bitterness, because of his loneliness (If Tav broke up with him). AA seriously deviates from the principles of Cazador and Velioth. AA - This is Astarion 2.0.