Larian Studios
Posted By: Viper why did she leave me?? - 03/06/05 06:57 PM
I'm so sad and troubled <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/puppyeyes.gif" alt="" />

Ok here's my story... it's one that really happened and just very recently too.
I met someone through this forum, and I liked her very much. We started PM'ing and after some time we added each other on MSN. She was a very joyfull person, we chit-chatted a lot and had LOTS of laughs <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/alien.gif" alt="" />

Over time we become very close friends.

but now..... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cry.gif" alt="" />

i'm sorry, I'm having a really difficult time with it because she was such a good friend...

She kinda just vanished. She ignores me (I'm guessing she blocked me on MSN because I don't see her online anymore) and broke all contact. I REALLY miss her and her laughs and stories <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />
Apparentely she heard some stuff about me via PM's on this forum that appear to be total lies and absolutely untrue. Even stuff has been made up to make me look bad. I heard this through other people that also know her.
I'm really saddened now because this friendship has been broken by some [nocando] (him or her, I don't know) and I can't seem to make her think otherwise (I send messages via the people that also know her).

Anyway, bottomline is: I lost a friend through gossips and lies (hence my reply in 'forum news' thread) and I thought this was a nice community. Apparentely it also has some very rotten apples.

I just wanted all of you people to hear about it. I always considered myself a respected member of this community (which how I think about most other people as well), turns out I'm not. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />

A very saddened Viper <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cry.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Barta Re: why did she leave me?? - 03/06/05 07:12 PM
Quote
I just wanted all of you people to hear about it. I always considered myself a respected member of this community (which how I think about most other people as well), turns out I'm not. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />

A very saddened Viper <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/cry.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />

I feel sorry for you Viper.
Yes you are a respected member of this community ! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/XmasJump.gif" alt="" />
If this person left you because of gossips, she is completely wrong. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />
Please anonymous come back !

Barta
Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 03/06/05 07:53 PM
Viper, honestly there is nothing that annoys or disturbes me of you in anyway, you've been a perfect community member and I don't know why ppl would gossip about you. I never cared much for gossip and I'll never take part of any such backstabbing. I hear a lot about gossip lately and it saddens me, any gossip coming my way will simply be ignored.

What made her leave, and break contact with you is unclear and it would be sad if it were to be the gossip, I hope she realizes what she did is foolish for the both of you.

To all who do gossip, stop beeing a bunch of schoolgirls! let your tail rise from between your legs and face the ones whatever problems you may have with. This should be easier here than in real life, wich makes gossip on forums even worse.
Posted By: Shantara Re: why did she leave me?? - 03/06/05 09:56 PM
Viper, I am really sorry to hear about all of the trouble you are having and that
you've lost a very close friend because of some things that have happened on the
forum. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />

I know how you feel because I have lost some friends that meant alot to me because
of some things that have happened too. I hope that some how, some way that the
two of you will be able to work through the problem and that one day soon that
you and your friend will be able to put all of this behind you and be friends
again.

Take care and know that you are not alone and that people do care about you. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Shan <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: AlrikFassbauer Re: why did she leave me?? - 03/06/05 10:27 PM
Quote
I always considered myself a respected member of this community (which how I think about most other people as well), turns out I'm not. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />


I can reassure that you still are. You only were away a bit. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

But apart from that I'm currently more or less clueless - so I cannot give any advice ... (Who can give advice about a thing he doesn't understand ? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> )

Alrik.
Posted By: janggut Re: why did she leave me?? - 04/06/05 02:02 AM
hey Viper,

u have my friendship & support, if they mean anything to u.

i think your friend is still somewhat traumatised by the whole thing (i think)so u need to give her some time & space to recover.

i know this is very hard for u but please hang on. as your friendship is as strong as u described, she will come back to be your friend again. because u care so much, u are a true friend. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

so keep your chin up. smile with hope. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Ubereil Re: why did she leave me?? - 04/06/05 02:12 PM
I agree with whan everyone else has written. I know how hard friends are to get, so when you loose someone because of someone else gossiping about you to her, that rea su... that's not very funny...

Übereil
Posted By: Barta Re: why did she leave me?? - 04/06/05 03:17 PM
Quote
i think your friend is still somewhat traumatised by the whole thing (i think)so u need to give her some time & space to recover.

i know this is very hard for u but please hang on. as your friendship is as strong as u described, she will come back to be your friend again. because u care so much, u are a true friend. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

I completely agree with janggut.
Be patient. Time always help to solve this kind of problem.

Barta
Posted By: spick Re: why did she leave me?? - 04/06/05 10:17 PM
Eh? What? Who?
One thing i can guarantee you Vip' is that the person you were friendly with will be more confused than you !
Gossip is a horrible thing, knowing what to do about it is even worse, but sharing your worries is a good thing, you will get lots of advice, some good some bad, mull it over and take your time...time is a good healer,one thing i would advise is don't name names even if think you are sure who is the culprit, deal with it on a personal level otherwise you will succombe to their standards.
Anyway I'm prattaling on here a bit here....good luck to ya mate. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: galadriel Re: why did she leave me?? - 05/06/05 12:26 PM
@ Viper
I'm sorry to hear that. But you have all my support.
I know what gossips can do to people. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 06/06/05 06:49 AM
Viper as far as I am concerned you still are a respectable member of the forum. And I agree with Barta. If someone believes the bad things other people say for you, then it is not realy your friend. However I am very sorry that there are people in here that speak bad about people that are members for years and they have proven good people. I wish this would stop.
You have my support and my sympathy.
Your friend
Luc
Posted By: MeaCulpa Re: why did she leave me?? - 06/06/05 01:08 PM
As always I feel the need to say something, to help you out, however it has all been said in the previous posts, thus I can only add my support to your feelings and assure you that eventually all will turn out OK, you will learn a few things the person in question will learn a few things and above all, the Malingerer will have lost as it must, since Good always prevails over evil.

That said and of my chest *checks front in mirror to ensure it is indeed of* I realize that you have been around for a long time now and never seem to cause any problems, ergo thou must be "respected" for this as it is really easy to succumb to the darkness [Linked Image].

Endure and persist and thou shall embrace the power of light <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 06/06/05 01:46 PM
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/offtopic.gif" alt="" />
Mea have you been reading W.S. latelly? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/badsmile2.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: NeroJB Re: why did she leave me?? - 06/06/05 06:37 PM
In what has become my forum manner...viper blast em with sarcasm!...I mean at least now you and I can start a club!
Posted By: janggut Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 03:20 AM
if only faile is here then we can go crazy fun! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: HandEFood Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 04:11 AM
I think faile doesn't have much Internet access or time any more. I haven't seen her for a very long time and she has barely any time to write.
Posted By: LewsTherinKinslayer13 Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 05:58 AM
I think she's busy, but, I wonder who it is Viper thinks is gone. I had 2 very good friends from these forums, one alot more then other though. Both of them have disappeared from msn and the forums, so I wonder if it was just about Viper of they just decided to leave the forums.

It may be someone totally different though, so, I donno.

Vipe's always seemed cool to me, why'd anyone make us some thing?


[/back into hiding]
Posted By: Viper Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 07:00 AM
it isn't faile if that's what you think, she left because of another person and with good reason. She isn't on MSN anymore because (that's what she said) she has wireless internet accees in the basement of her parents right now and the connection is too weak to handle MSN...

dunno if it's true, haven't seen her in ages now.

but i was tlking about someone else
Posted By: Plowking Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 08:41 AM
It's disturbing to think that stuff like this happens on this forum...

Don't leave because of it though...sort out this gossiper!
Posted By: Ubereil Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 09:14 AM
But Lews, I'm still here <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/suspicion.gif" alt="" />...

An where are you, I thought I never see YOU around here very often nowadays...

And if anyone ever get to talk to failie, tell her to draw a temporal wire 24/7. That's what I did <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />.

Oh, and to be just a little on topic: It still su... it is still very saddening, that this kind of thing happens on our forum... It is!

Übereil
Posted By: Viper Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 09:37 AM
lews has got exams and detantion for the rest of theyear.. he just told me

and faile... well, she's moving to seattle at hte end of this motnh, she just told me as well. so hopefully she'll have internet there
Posted By: Egin Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 09:48 AM
It's sad to hear that Viper.

Hope your friend will see this thread, all these posts of your good old friends here.

She will read this and stop to listen to some backdoor gossips that try to blackmail good peeps. Bah! Disgusting.

Hope everything will be fine at the end <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/kitty.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 11:06 AM
yeah we miss or good ol piroite
Posted By: Lowkey Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 06:08 PM
I'll argue the opposite side, because I think it needs to be said.

Viper is scum.

Now that is an odd thing to say, given that I don't know "viper" and I'm not involved in these back-side /non forum discussions that are playing a role here, but Viper has just given us all enough information to make this determination.

If someone here is being irresponsible, misunderstanding something terribly and telling people unfortunate or ugly rumors, or outright being malicious and evil, for Viper not to warn others and discuss what is happening openly allows this evil to fester and hurt others. In effect, since Viper claims to know factually that this wrong is happening (since it happened to Viper directly, so it's not "gossip" by addressing it), Viper is contributing to it, and we have to wonder, who is going to be hurt next by this/these people? How long is this going to keep happening because Viper won't take action to stop it, and tragically in this case, it seems to be as simple as admitting who the players are and honestly discussing it.

For a lack of honesty Viper is prepared to have other people here, even Viper "itself", hurt in the future in similar ways because someone here is misbehaving but won't ever be called to task? The makes Viper complicit in this persons evil (and granted I am assuming the Viper is in the right in qualifying someone else that way, and that it's not just a complex series of misunderstandings which in themselves could be lanced in the same way) and the next person to be hurt by such behavior will have Viper to thank, because the community hasn't been warned about the real snake in our midst - people like Viper, who encourage evil, even if they themselves do not perpetrate it directly.


So while Viper is scum, I appreciate that Viper at least has warned me that Viper "itself" isn't to be trusted.

Thanks Viper
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/suspicion.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: NeroJB Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 06:11 PM
Quote
I'll argue the opposite side, because I think it needs to be said.

Viper is scum.

Now that is an odd thing to say, given that I don't know "viper" and I'm not involved in these back-side /non forum discussions that are playing a role here, but Viper has just given us all enough information to make this determination.

If someone here is being irresponsible, misunderstanding something terribly and telling people unfortunate or ugly rumors, or outright being malicious and evil, for Viper not to warn others and discuss what is happening openly allows this evil to fester and hurt others. In effect, since Viper claims to know factually that this wrong is happening (since it happened to Viper directly, so it's not "gossip" by addressing it), Viper is contributing to it, and we have to wonder, who is going to be hurt next by this/these people? How long is this going to keep happening because Viper won't take action to stop it, and tragically in this case, it seems to be as simple as admitting who the players are and honestly discussing it.

For a lack of honesty Viper is prepared to have other people here, even Viper "itself", hurt in the future in similar ways because someone here is misbehaving but won't ever be called to task? The makes Viper complicit in this persons evil (and granted I am assuming the Viper is in the right in qualifying someone else that way, and that it's not just a complex series of misunderstandings which in themselves could be lanced in the same way) and the next person to be hurt by such behavior will have Viper to thank, because the community hasn't been warned about the real snake in our midst - people like Viper, who encourage evil, even if they themselves do not perpetrate it directly.


So while Viper is scum, I appreciate that Viper at least has warned me that Viper "itself" isn't to be trusted.

Thanks Viper
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/suspicion.gif" alt="" />


um...yeah dude...be careful...id watch my knees if i were you, mind you this is coming from one of the most mellow people on the forum...just a friendly warning
Posted By: Viper Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 06:52 PM
Quote
... originally posted by lowkey (or whatever)


man you're stupid... seriously you are. You're not here long enough to know me so do SHUT UP and you don't know what you're talking about.

anyway, My contact has taken up contact with me again, and if you like I can tell you the name of the fuck_ing ass_hole.

thing is, that lots of people contacted me about this and that they have problems with the same damn person. Also some of them are willing to go public and confront this ass_ with it. SO i'm just waiting for them right now really.


@lowkey... if you'd known me a bit better (i'm here more than 4-5 years now) you'd know better than to take ME on.
Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 07:51 PM
Please Viper, you know better. Some things are better left ignored, you've always been a good friendly guy, no need to ruin all that now. Beeing new doesn't mean ignorant, no-one here has the right to call anyone scum. especially not over facts like these that are unclear to most.

Lowkey, you should be carefull what you say, this is a direct attack to Viper. If his methods are wrong it may be mentioned, but you shouldn't call ppl scum, or evil...
Posted By: Barta Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 08:13 PM
Quote
In effect, since Viper claims to know factually that this wrong is happening (since it happened to Viper directly, so it's not "gossip" by addressing it), Viper is contributing to it, and we have to wonder, who is going to be hurt next by this/these people? How long is this going to keep happening because Viper won't take action to stop it, and tragically in this case, it seems to be as simple as admitting who the players are and honestly discussing it.

@ Lowkey

How do you know that Viper did not take action to stop these gossips ?
You can't judge someone without knowing all the facts.

Barta
Posted By: galadriel Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 09:04 PM
I think this will all be left behind us, if Lowkey could just send an apology to Viper? Not in public, but through PM perhaps? It's enough that one person is ruining the atmosphere here on the forum, we cannot use another one.
I like Viper and I hope the truth will come out very soon.
Hang in there, Viper!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/up.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/up.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: AlrikFassbauer Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 09:23 PM
Quote
Viper is scum.


I am worse :

I am [color:"red"]Rebel Scum.[/color]
Posted By: Barta Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 09:26 PM
Quote
Quote
Viper is scum.


I am worse :

I am Rebel Scum.

I am an Insane Rebel Scum <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/XmasJump.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 07/06/05 09:37 PM
Quote
Quote
Quote
Viper is scum.


I am worse :

I am Rebel Scum.

I am an Insane Rebel Scum <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/XmasJump.gif" alt="" />


I am lord of the insane rebel scums, the one scum that rules them all.
Posted By: Lowkey Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 02:52 AM
I will apologize about the length but I wanted to respond directly to the last few posts before continuing with part 2 of my post. Some responses were so candid and open that they deserve the respect an answer shows.

Nero - Your overprotectiveness doesn't do you credit given the sig you are using - a hostile encultured reaction to a perceived insult to a friend tells me you need to work on your deconstruction. You would be more supportive by mailing Viper in private and gossiping about what a jerk I am in suggesting that Viper maybe isn't so great after Viper went to trouble to establish a pat-on-the-back thread in a public forum where another interpretation, and, horror and shock, a potential discussion might take place.

Viper - Does it hurt when it touches a nerve? Quite a reaction, and I think great misunderstanding, of my post. Though I do appreciate and respect that you seemed to show emotion directly, immediately, and honestly - I also hope for a more thoughtful reaction later. On an unrelated note - you don't know how long I've been a member here or what names I'm using, but it isn't relevant, as personally I don't measure someone's worth by their post count (or their knowledge of the forum and it's members given that, after all, it's recorded and available for past reading). Another -1 prestige points for you.

Draghermosran - I wasn't attacking "Viper", this post will explain what I meant in a bit more detail, I think. As my post clearly stated up front, I don't enough information to directly condemn Viper, therefore I must have intended something else, hmm? And it would be unfair and counterproductive, though a bit entertaining <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> , to drag this out longer than the requisite knee jerk reactions, and perhaps see who might be afraid of a public airing and resolution of these mysterious and sad events.

Barta - Thank you, a thoughtful response and, at first glance, a reasonable question, however, we never know "all" of the facts, only those we are provided and then we settle upon as sufficient to justify or require a response. Viper provided us with enough information to warrant a discussion, as a conceptual case, at least.

Galadriel - Great Lady of the Elves, when you traveled to the west I wept, but I would not apologize to Melkor nor Sauron, but call them to task were they, or a single orc, to permit any harm to what remained of your golden wood. Evil exists because good people do nothing, a simple saying, and yet it contains some truth. You of all people, by your namesake, should know this.

And with respect to dealing with it privately...I was not the one who created a public post complaining about how I was being deliberately mistreated by someone, and then appeared to be taking no action to end the situation while protecting others, which would require a public discussion and community resolution - and warning.

Alrik~ - I do not speak German, to my shame, but I know the quote you sign with by Einstein - cheers.

================================================
Secrets and Lies

It is really quite exhausting, for those that really care, to see these whining posts keep cropping up, as though many here are determined not to learn from history. Mystery person x gossipped and lied, but I will keep it a secret, so that it can continue with others, and it can fester... (sue me, I like the word "fester")

How many times do we have to see posts about people being hurt, even leaving, and we are told that there was some unpleasantness, gossips, lies about people, there was bad behavior... And many of you lament this repeatedly, and I do not here intend to criticize or minimize your feelings of loss, but to claim concern about these things and lay claim to a community has started, nay, past, begun ringing hollow.

Delicious Irony

A website by a company whose products revolve largely around simple good and evil themes, populated by people who repeatedly conceal things they describe as deliberate lies and harmful gossip campaigns. Many of you remind me of the villagers in Divine Divinity, you suspected things, or knew things about Doctor, I think the name was Elrath?, but rather than act to work together...you know, community?, you keep your secrets and protect the lies and the plague kills members, driving them away. The villagers will stand around clucking like chickens and hope someone else actually resolves the situation, or just hope and pray it goes away, give the rats long enough, they will eat away the moldy hay.

But it's not your problem is it? Some of you only appreciate concepts of honor, honesty, openness, and community in a game, it seems.

So my question, as I stated in my first post, because I don't know Viper, but because this issue, in general, is a pretty constant theme here, is how many of you can claim to admire or respect, conceptually, Larian's products, while given a chance to, okay it's a bit dramatic, fight evil in your own lives, to expose wrongdoing (or correct mistakes and misunderstandings), to set things right - instead you have a love fest for a self admitted concealer of evil. In my experience, ok, I'm 3 days old, but it's all relative, problems exist in the world because ordinary people, you and me, create and maintain them.


From a generic perspective, I think it's a valid question, certainly there are specific cases of this gossiping/hurting/leaving situation where the criticism wouldn't apply - but then, I'm not the one whose angry now, just curious about how you all justify these conflicting attitudes and behavior.

Viper can obviously be mature enough to not treat me like a fragile doll, and respond in a direct and honest emotional way, an admirable trait - but can some of you look at your own behavior over these years and say that you could have prevented problems and did nothing instead, that you have nothing to learn from what I am suggesting, nothing to think about at least? If another 5 or 10 pleasant members are driven away, will that change your mind, or will it take an invasion of poland, because the other countries didn't count?

Disclaimer - if you are all under the age of 13 and my questions, comments, and approach are simply more than you deal with, then I should apologize, though I will not, as I did not, contrary to the opinion of some, intend to harm anyone, but trying to lance a festering boil in any community is going to generate some bad feeling. You are welcome to hate me and attack away, I'll give you my address and real name should you desire to shoot me, because my sense of self preservation is a very small price if you would stop this bloody whining and address these problems, these few bad eggs that seem to poison the community here, and we can get on with waiting impatiently for Larian's next product and the damn patch.
Posted By: spick Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 04:07 AM
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />...errrr, I'll get me coat.
Posted By: LewsTherinKinslayer13 Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 05:19 AM
Wazzat?

I know lowkey from another forum, and he was alright there. Though I will admit he had several discions there that made me mad, and a tad angry, but I kept it to myself. If he has a problem with Viper though, he can just leave for all I care.

Posted By: janggut Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 06:16 AM
@ Al -> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ROFL.gif" alt="" /> u're very amazing with that post! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/up.gif" alt="" />

@ everyone -> before we go down to funky town & have Lowkey on disco inferno, let's examine & re-examine his words. he means well though poorly worded (but that's just my [nocando]- i mean opinion!) to make it seem scathing, though the caustic effect may be what he intends to achieve (for what purpose? to wake the mind up to certain facts?).

what i think, & i may be wrong here so help me somebody, Lowkey is saying that when Viper talked of the gossip/backstab that happens here, he has open an avenue to take this baddie out in the open & deal with him/her. but Viper did not, & that makes him one of the baddie for not finishing what he has started & also making more & more people speculate as to whom this baddie is, thus rumour begets rumour. correct me if i'm wrong, Lowkey, as i am trying to understand your words & to put them in simpler forms for myself & others to understand.

@ Lowkey, well thanks for turning the other side of the linen into the open. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

i appreciate your gesture though it's a bit too much (like a slap in the face of a victim). maybe that is your intent? or maybe u want to make people realise about their lack of action in this? why must action be of utmost emphasis when INaction can be as effective? must aggressive undertaking be the only avenue when passive resolute can be as good a path to take?

as for those who reminisce(spelling?) on the past, thinking of their past friends, why is it whining when it may be just us missing them thus stating it in the open? i miss some online buddies because they are good people who are no longer here. i don't make connection of that emotion to the ongoing gossip & somehow blame a baddie for making my friends go away. but i am speaking for myself of course.

a friend is a friend. what he or she does behind my back which i do not know is not something i would spend time thinking about, speculating what may be there & not there. therefore giving my support to Viper or whichever friend when it comes to this isn't really a love fest for a self admitted concealer of evil. as far as i know, he does no harm to me nor to people that i know. if his action has potential to hurt, & when i know, i may advise but i will not tell him what to do & pass judgement on him. i am & never will be good enough to do so.

we all deal with things, situations, people in our own way. i deal with rumours, falling out of friends, backstab in my own way. if it's less righteous to u, if it's cowardly compared to your courage, if it's insidious compared to your openess, if it's sitting on hands compared to your uplifting morals - geez, dude, sorry to disappoint u but i am who i am & u are who u are. u live up to your principle & i to mine. but please, other than turning the linen, don't choke us with it.

but thank u nevertheless for making such a daring point in this. it's something i haven't thought of & yet it's not something i agree to. i'll act when i find it necessary & prudent but not because action is the only way.

life's too short & beautiful to linger upon little freckles like rumours & backstabbing. it is always inevitable that we will get hurt. that we can't change. but we can change ourselves. so let's move on & live on. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: kiya Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 07:31 AM
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/exclamation.gif" alt="" />WARNINGS
1. One of the dreaded long kiya posts - those with a short attention span... don't read <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
2. Not going to be a nice post, because I am going to name names!
3. Viper, I'm high-jacking your thread for the...

HISTORY OF GOSSIP - by kiya

Old forum: I joined there - Setharmon joined after me. I liked one gamer very much, a French one, called Jove. He tracked down my help posts faithfully (I mix up east/west). Setharmon disliked him, we had discussions about that on chat lvl. Well, one of the spam waves came - I left the forum silently. A few weeks later I returned and read to my horror that Setharmon had insinuated I had left because of the last posts Jove wrote. I was shocked. I apologized in public to Jove and wrote him a mail. Jove believed me, but didn't return. From that day on, I knew => DON'T TRUST SETHARMON. I have the CD of the old forum and can prove this ongoing. I blocked my chat account and blocked one of my mail addresses.

New forum - 2003: I kept distance to Setharmon - and started to keep copies of PM I sent/received. Not all, but those I considered important for my own security. Yes... this is what gossip does - causes distrust. I was engaged heavily in the first spam waves here, caused trouble - and maybe you remember, Viper: wiht you amongst others <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> - next spam wave came. I had learned a lesson that spam belongs to a forum like the tide. Setharmon wanted me to engage in yet another wave. I refused. And as I refused to let him manipulate me into this, it eventually lead to one of the few chat threads I initiated:

Request for honesty and openness

Needless to say, I never got a response if I manipulate people or not. Several possibilities => no one said it and Setharmon was up on his tricks again to divide and rule. The persons didn't want to talk to me about it. this incident increased my distrust.

And here you pop in, Viper, dealt with you being a spammer - let me refresh your memory <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> - you asked me via PM if the bad stuff I had said about you was true. Original words were from Setharmon. I clarified by sending you my PM, so you could make your own picture. We both found out => the old trickster was playing his pranks again. Spreading rumours, wanting to pull strings and thus gain power. You and I were at peace again. I thanked my lucky stars about keeping copies. You had been a spammer, but my opinion was that of the past, you had changed during the time.

A bit later.... I watch the forum closely, so I saw there was something cooking up. There was a wall between a female member and myself. I kept silent. Female Member A contacted me and told me to inform Female member B about my XP with Setharmon. I was wary at first, because I didn't want to get involved. Member B contacted me - well... to cut this long tale short, he had spread the rumour he had to back me off because I wanted more than friendship, tsktsk. I was disgusted - very digusted, felt the old dirt again. She had believed him, trusted him, gave him personal information about herself - and now she was hurt. Giving female member B mails and PM info, she learned that he is not trustworthy. Female member A had already made her XP with Setharmon herself, but she is a strong female, she had listened to her inner self - female member B... was vulnerable and hurt.

Time passed on... Setharmon seemed to lose interest in the forum. I could breathe again. No one to prowl upon females here, not that I knew of. No one to trick and manipulate females, tell bad stories about (male) members to tickle his ego and pull strings.

How many females I know of? 6.

Time passed on - I left the forum last year (2004) because of vacation and job project. In January 2005 I saw to my horror that he had come back. And by reading some posts I got the strong impression that he was up to his old tricks again. I kept away - was easy, as my personal life was very busy at that time and now I play WoW <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> . NO, I didn't want to be informed again if I would return - I didn't want to comfort a broken heart again or be confronted with his manipulations or maybe even lies he once spread about me or others, or having to clarify over and over again - I didn't want my PM box to grow large again with copies. I didn't want to feel the poison of distrust rising in my heart - not knowing whom I can trust about discretion or not. I detest manipulators, people who seek power and do a lot to strengthen their own ego.

And... Lynn had given him the helper title. A title holding credit for new members. No, I didn't want to be involved again. And now? I was informed by another female - was asked for help again. I thought about it, was still wary. Yes, distrust was rising again - raised its ugly head. And then I read your post, Viper. And I've had enough now - therefore I name, therefore I inform.

Readers, it's your choice to believe me or not. It's your choice to think everything is a big misunderstanding. come to your own opinion.

Female members, I write my XP for you - make your own choice, be careful, decide whom you want to trust or not. We are a minority here on the internet in general - and there are some male prowlers. They feed upon your vulnerability, your yearning to trust, they give you what you might lack: attention. Not all, most are very nice and supported me during the dark time here on this forum. BUT! this goes for both genders => NEVER take second hand gossip for granted! NEVER! Confront the person - and if the name isn't given to you => ASK, prod, investigate. Gossip can only grow in the darkness, it gains power by silence and retreat. Don't give in - don't.

Don't forget - create a female network - we have to protect each other. We are sensitive and vulnerable at times, let's use a quality a lot of females have => solidarity. don't remain silent and retreat for the sake of peace and friendly atmosphere. Speak up! Stand up for yourself!
Kiya

My post might cause grief and anger - I don't care. I don't consider myself an active member here anymore. But I still feel for females who get hurt or might keep away from this forum because they are filled with distrust, because they are kept away from other members by gossip, insinuations and rumours. So, the old shepherd dog is growling again <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

Posted By: Viper Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 07:58 AM
Quote
Viper - Does it hurt when it touches a nerve? Quite a reaction, and I think great misunderstanding, of my post. Though I do appreciate and respect that you seemed to show emotion directly, immediately, and honestly - I also hope for a more thoughtful reaction later. On an unrelated note - you don't know how long I've been a member here or what names I'm using, but it isn't relevant, as personally I don't measure someone's worth by their post count (or their knowledge of the forum and it's members given that, after all, it's recorded and available for past reading). Another -1 prestige points for you.


it doesn't hurt, but you just don't have the right to attack me personally and esp. not like that since I haven't even heard about you/seen you in here.

and about your
Quote
On an unrelated note - you don't know how long I've been a member here or what names I'm using

that's sad... this just shows that you are SO immature that you can't even hold an identity and come out with it. imho you ARE setharmon.

for now on, I'm just gonna ignora whatever it is you have to say about me. I can't stand you, never will. I've got a wife, am happily married so what do I care about this virtual environment. just don't get personal if you don't know me.
Posted By: Lynn Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 08:20 AM
Good! At last, a public forum, where discussions happen openly! Facts and names need to be thrown on the table!

I have read all of it, and no action can be taken right now: I am waiting for the public reaction of Setharmon and who else is involved in this matter.

And another thing I wanted to say: I am working for Larian Studios in the first place for its games, not to solve problems between people, problems that mainly grow behind the screens. But I can't let nobody ruine the forum community either...

Thanks,
Lynn
Posted By: Barta Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 08:34 AM
Thanks Lynn for your wise reaction.
I am going to quote you because you forgot to say this :

Quote
Discussions are normal in life and having different opinions too. It's up to you to keep it polite.


Barta
Posted By: AlrikFassbauer Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 09:11 AM
www.rebelscum.com (No, I don't work there ... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> But I'm active in the forums there. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> )


Quote
Alrik~ - I do not speak German, to my shame, but I know the quote you sign with by Einstein - cheers.


From the fact that you have relatively few top say about me I deduce that you cannot see through me or are even irritated by me.

That's what I want.


I'm currently working on a thought-model (a Theory, to be exact), that says that EVERY action / reaction gives the possibility to deduce from it to the thought-patterns of the person which outworked that action/reaction.

For example, following this theory, I might be able to deduce from sentences/formulations towards the thought-pattern that created these sentences - on a logical basis. There are still a *lot* of variables, but given a certain arrangement of logical operators, a certain development towards the given sentence/formulation should be deducable.

For example : If I write "I like chocolate", you can not only deduce that I like chocolate, but you can also deduce that I'm interested in giving away my opinion about chocolate. Goind a bit further on, you can also pose the assumption that my self-confidence is high enough to say what I actually like - chocolate - and not to care about what people say about chocolate.

This in-depths analysis could be used to deduce thought-patterns from posts, I suppose. I'm working on it, but don't know how far I might succeed.

On the other hand, it is - according to that theory - possible to distrurb thought-patterns trying to deduce the thought-patterns of a poster by explicitely posting sentences/formulations which make it more difficult to judge/estimate a poster. That's what I did.

Alrik.

Posted By: Egin Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 10:10 AM
Spick,

...do you have a spare coat for me mate? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/freak.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: janggut Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 10:10 AM
this is really the most shocking thing i have ever read recently.

this makes me wonder if i have ever been a victim all these while without knowing it? may i ask; has anyone heard of anything about me that is really bad - please let me know as i am getting more & more worried about all these.

@ Kiya -> all these while, i thought Seth has been one of your closest online friend. i am sorry to hear about this. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />

@ Viper -> be at ease now that u see who your real friend is. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

@ Lynn -> thanks for letting this thread run its course & have events unfold as they should.

@ Seth -> u have a lot to answer for, my friend. please, if u are an honest man as i thought & hope u are, come forward. who & what are u? are u going to contest or counter Kiya's thoughts on this?

@ all ladies of the forum -> what Kiya highlighted is something very serious. i hope all of u will come together (make sure they're real females) to help & protect one another from now on.

@ Barta -> since u are the president, will u lead the ladies of the forum?

@ everyone -> i feel a panic attack coming. if u don't see me around in a few days time, hope u will understand.

please take care, everyone.
Posted By: Viper Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 12:07 PM
@Janggut: I haven't heard anything about you.... afaik you are a well respected member here.. at least on my account.
Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 12:23 PM
this makes me feel happy about not having an envelope nex to main index every day.

I kinda feel blind for not seeing there were such things going along, didn't hae a clue something was wrong.
Posted By: NeroJB Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 01:13 PM
@ Kiya....yeah thanks for making me realize that I was being a tard back in the day when this version of the forum had just started...spam is bad...but at least then Lews came and made everybody forget about me! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/delight.gif" alt="" />

@ Lowkey...man I wasnt threatening you...because lets face it this is a freaking forum and I dont have any control over it what could I do except be really annoying and I dont really like being that guy. No it was just a friendly warning that you are attacking a longtime well liked member...maybe unintentionally but either way...second...keep your weak attempt at giving me some psycoanalysis to yourself...I can think of about two people on this forum that know me at all and one is an MIA pirate!
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 02:11 PM
Could someone bring me a bucket? I need to empty my stomach.

I am not an active meber in here anymore too. But I knew what I was saying when I said Kiya = Dragon = A wise person.
I am glad that someone that I think of very high, had the same opinion with me and talked about such things openly. It was about time.
I am sorry I do not want to discuss it further though. As most of you probably know (by contacting with me during that period I am away -thanks for the friendship by the way-), I am in a state of mind this period that does not permit me to involve in such things. And to be honest, there are so many things that I want to say but I am afraid that if I do this forum will blow up. I need some time to think about the recent events and decide what to do.
There are though some things that I am certain of and they are going to remain such whatever happens :

A. When I count a person as a friend -and I do that only by my own judgment- I do not listen to whatever other people say about him/her. Thank Gods I am old enough and I think that there are some remains of brain in my head to decide by myself.

B. When I joined this forum I said several times that I took this decision because I saw how nice are with each other the forum members. Now, after almost 2 years in here, I realise that in some cases there is this kindness between members that reaches only surface. Underground a lot of things happen. Or should I say [nocando]? (Mind my language).

C. There are certain people I met here that make me feel glad that I joined at the first place. People with extremely nice minds, good heart, beautiful people who I wish to keep contact for the rest of my life and make me pray to have the strength to be there for them whenever they need me. Virtually or RL does not matter. For that I think it was worth it. However with those people I can keep contact via mail or e-mail as I do the past few months. Friendship is not infected by the environment or the way of comunication.

And one last request to the old forum members :
I have met Lowkey in an other forum and I think that he is a nice person. Please people, consider, Lowkey is not this forum's problem. Someone else is.
Sometimes I dont understand him either (Luc laughs), his English are very difficult for me but trust me on this one will you? Give him a chance to get to know him. Dont let the dark age some people wanted to bring in this forum, rule.

Side note : Sometimes things happen that I do not quite understand. Is it perhaps I become from a different culture? Or is it because I am the person I am? Really I do not know. I wish sometimes people could explain to me why some things happen. And sometimes I think that it is better that I do not understand...
Luc
Posted By: AlrikFassbauer Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 02:23 PM
*gives Luc a bucket*

*equips himself with cleaning tools*

When everythings over, I'll clean up ... at least someone must do it ...

Posted By: NeroJB Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 03:07 PM
Well said Luc...good to see you BTW
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 03:37 PM
It is good to see you back too Nero <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Plowking Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 03:38 PM
I don't use PM's that often, and don't engage in personal problem discussions in them. Its not that I dont trust anyone here, I simply dont feel the need, and after reading this I'm quite glad that I don't.

But when 2 people agree to converse with one another on a personal level between themselves it should stay that way. When someone betrays that, and starts telling others lies (or even truths they should keep to themselves) to others for manipulative purposes, then they should be named.

Naming two-faced people who are causing problems will help protect the others who may be unaware of someones underhanded dealings, protecting both new and old users of the forum. And making the people in question cop the hell on to themselves. They think it's fun because they cant be physically reached, or they could change their name, or just move on - smug in their having achieved causing a rift.

This kind of behaviour really makes me mad, and I'm not even one involved...so I can only imaging the wealth of anger for you Viper, or anyone else a victim of some two-faced $£%@"$!

Oh, and great to see you're back around for a bit Luc... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 05:11 PM
I wonder some PM's contained irregulary the word "Gollem!"?
Posted By: Viper Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 06:03 PM
you know, I've read all the reactions now, and I'm lauging by myself becaus.... the only person TOTALLY absent in THIS thread, but VERY active in others (and he complains about people not participating in serious threads btw) is SETHARMON himself...

how cowardly, not even coming out
Posted By: Ubereil Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 06:19 PM
Quote
you know, I've read all the reactions now, and I'm lauging by myself becaus.... the only person TOTALLY absent in THIS thread, but VERY active in others (and he complains about people not participating in serious threads btw) is SETHARMON himself...

how cowardly, not even coming out


Yeah, now that you know, and think of it, he never replied on this kind of topics (I've checked <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />). When you brought it up in the news, he was talking about everything BUT gossips...

And we're ALL eager to hear his reply. How can he possiblly defend himself from this? (Oh, and it'll get whorse for him, there are OTHERS too <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin1.gif" alt="" />.)

Übereil
Posted By: AlrikFassbauer Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 06:28 PM
Quote
When you brought it up in the news, he was talking about everything BUT gossips...


When you check it, you might fimnd out that I tend to do the same. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

It is my method to try to calm down things before they escalate. I don't want war.
Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 06:30 PM
War
What is it good for
Absolutely nothing
Say it again
War
What is it good for
Absolutely nothing
Posted By: Egin Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 06:43 PM
Quote
B. When I joined this forum I said several times that I took this decision because I saw how nice are with each other the forum members. Now, after almost 2 years in here, I realise that in some cases there is this kindness between members that reaches only surface. Underground a lot of things happen. Or should I say [nocando]? (Mind my language).

Well said Luc, well said. That's the reason I left this forum twice. I have seen several times a situation when: today a person is very nice and kind with you and,... tomorrow, he/she just ignores you as you are absent. Then you start to question yourself, was that kindness real or just an illusion. Or maybe be you are that rude or dumb people are stopping to speak with you.

As they say... - Just my two cents. I had to let it go and now can go back into shadows.

Eg

PS War is good for making everyone listen to you.
Posted By: Lynx Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 06:56 PM
I never heard about this gossips in the german forum part. I hope it won´t swap over.
I can only say for me, i never played with the emotions of any humans here. I was sad, ´cause Kiye left without an info. We PMed sometimes, and she cut of this without any chance for me to ask: Why !
No chance to reach her anymore. Sad but true.

I don´t care if anybody tries to feed the forum with lies about me. I know whom i can trust, few members here i have more contact with i can trust, the others: Who knows ? But who cares ? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

I can only say poor guy that has to do this !
Posted By: Barta Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 07:26 PM
I have already said everything i think about gossips and lies in 2 other topics : "Forum news" and "About lies".
I will not bother the people by repeating the same things.

I just want to say that i have a lot of admiration for Kiya who had the courage to tell everything in a public post.
I would never had this courage.
I am also happy to see that nobody tried to begin a war in this topic.
I hope that Viper's friend will be back soon.

Barta
Posted By: galadriel Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 07:28 PM
Allthought my hands are shaking and my knees are weak, I have decided to follow Kiya's brave example and to tell you the truth to you all.
I have talked to several members that I considered my friends. You all helped me to decide what I should do, you said it was better to drop this subject, but then I contacted Kiya. We started to talk and and I found out what I already knew.
Setharmon used to be a helpfull guy, he build that image so that no one would believe anyone of us if we talked. I even defended him in the "Pope" thread. Johannes Paulus II, just because I thought he was right and we get along very well.
Now, we started to exchange msn and we talked. Not that often, because I didn't trust him enough, maybe three times or so, but the last time we spoke, he told me that he got several pm's with complaints from other members. According to these pm's I was too silly on forum, almost pathetic and I should participate to more serious topics. First I was very shocked, sad and angry. I thought I was ok, and that most of you liked me the way I was.
So, I started to write pm's and asking very carefully what they thought of me. When someone asked me why I wanted to know that, I never mentioned any names because I thought Setharmon was very respected here on forum.
I was thinking of letting it go, and just not tell anyone, but I knew if I didn't do anything to stop this things could get out of control. When I heard that Kiya had been throught the same, and another friend has suffered also by his doing, I wanted to take actions. Kiya gave me permission to send out her pm to everyone who was involved or must been warned. I knew that I couldn't do a thing all by myself, so I was glad with the help of a strong and mighty dragon as Kiya.
I would be honored if Barta would lead us, ladies. But maybe Kiya would be a better leader since she has gone throught this already.
And with this, I want to openly apologise to Barta for my behavior last on the "Pope" thread. I hope you are not mad at me for that anymore.

I also wanted to say, that allthough I intended to leave this forum, that I'm glad that I did some investigations and that I found out the truth.

Setharmon, as you might have noticed, I'm not the weak, lonely or naieve girl that you maybe thought I was. You can't play with me like you did with all the other girls. I'm not afraid of you, even not after your treat to hack into my computer. Your reign over this forum is finished.

@ Kiya
Thank you, it was very brave to come out with the truth.
Thanks to all my friends that I talked to, for believing in me and giving me the time to investigate the matter. Thank you for your trust in me.
@ Lynn
Thank you for not shutting this thread down, I'm glad we got the chance to talk about this.
To all the members that I didn't contacted throught pm, don't be mad at me for that. I didn't know who to talk to and I also didn't wanna put a burden on your shoulders, like it has been on mine for the last few weeks.

I also want to say, if you have any questions at all, send me a pm. I will try to answer them as soon as possible.
Posted By: Viper Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 07:38 PM
Quote
I hope that Viper's friend will be back soon.


thanks.. and she's back alright.
Posted By: Barta Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 07:40 PM
Quote
thanks.. and she's back alright.

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/XmasJump.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/XmasJump.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/XmasJump.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: MeaCulpa Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 07:51 PM
Yes!!!

Victory <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
and as my lady mage in NWN would say: "This calls for a celebration" <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/XmasJump.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 08:26 PM
I'm wondering how much of this gossip that is been talked about actually did happen and how much is merely made up to provoke certain things.

Hey person D "person A, Person B is silly and needs to be more serious..." isn't something I would cass as harmfull gossip, I would class it as idiotic and irrelevant comments.

Tho person E:" Hey Person B, person person A and person C say you are silly and need to be more serious" seems odd, my anwser would be if I were person B, Yeah SO WHAT? what ere you trying to tell me. It does seem as an attempt to stirr up comotion.

So to make things clear wouldn't it better for everyone that a been involved in gossip like this to come clean? to iluminate the exact situation? If You can't be honest on something that is still very anonymous like a forum... If you fear you could lose friends by coming clean you don't deserve them.

Either everyone drops it, or everyone comes clean, doesn't seem to any other sollution to me. I'm sure i'm outside the whole issue hope you don't mind me buggering in. I just want to see the forum go back to the peacefull thing it used to be, a long time ago. Maybe then we would see some more old friends coming back.
Posted By: Stone Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 08:31 PM
After i read all the post from a outstanding position i think i have to say something.

First
Thank you Kiya and Galadriel for this outcoming. This is what i mean with my post in the Forum News thread.
Second
Lynn, i think it is not necessary to close a thread like this. We can say, thats life. And things like this will happen again and then? Close the next thread like this one? Maybe the Members will think it is better if they do not throw the facts on the table becouse is it like a punishment if a thread is closed. Sure, you dont mean it in a way like this <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> But like you said, you cannot solve the problems of the people here. So, i think, it is a good start to let the Member try to solve the problems in a active and open way like the Posts from Kiya and Galadirel.
Third
Why from a outstanding Position.
I dont have many good friends in the english part of the forum, and nobody have try to start gossip with me. So i was really surprised if i hear the problems. Like Lynx said, in the german part we dont have these problems. And in the german Part i have some good friends so i think that i will know it if there is such things start. But i can say, i want to know who and what is (if <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> ) gossiping about me. I think it is a false care not to say these things, i want to know who i can thrust and who not.
Sure, maybe its someone who i like, and maybe its hurts. But what is better, to think i have a friend, or to know i have a friend?
I can only say again. If, and i dont care who, someone try to start gossip with me over other Member i will do it like Kiya and bring it on the table. This is, even if its hurts, the best thing a friend can do.

So, after all, i think this Thread has turnd in a good way i never had expected. And this is the only reason for me to post here.
Posted By: bigclaw6 Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 08:57 PM
I read this Thread since him existed and have to say following in addition, if I do the nearer acquaintance with somebody in this forum, find out the only people which I really trust. If this friendship should go for which reasons also always *I asks there always after *, catches fire go, then I resign myself to it. This is like in the real life, one meets and separates.
There are with us Germans a saying: "Talking badly from you, if it is permitted to him, however, you, you lives in such a way that nobody believes it him."
I hope, it is effective into English as well.
Here in the anonymity it is simple to influence somebody.
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 08:58 PM
@ Plowking
It is nice to see you too and smell some Irish fresh air <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

@ Al
Thank you for the bucket. But you do not have to clean up. Why do you always have to clean up? Drop this role. You can do better. (I am sorry I am not pming these lines but I am starting to have a dislike in pms recently...).

@ Egine
True friends do not ignore each other dear Moldavian friend. In no case. That is my opinion. So do not worry. People who ignored you are -always in my opinion- not true friends. Either Virtual or RL friends.

And I am not sure that I understood what happened between Galadriel and Seth. It seemed to me that they were close friends.

[color:"orange"]Anyway I am glad that Viper's friend is back. At least something good came up from all this.
[/color]
*Luc is scratching her head thinking that she chose a bad time to drop by <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/think.gif" alt="" />*
Posted By: AlrikFassbauer Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 09:00 PM
Quote
I'm wondering how much of this gossip that is been talked about actually did happen and how much is merely made up to provoke certain things.


I absolutely trust Kiya, and I don't see any reaason not to believe her.

I'm still irritated about anything else, but I know Kiya as a most trustful person. I think she is right in everything she has written, although it sounds quite weird - and irritating (to me).

Alrik.


Quote
@ Al
Thank you for the bucket. But you do not have to clean up. Why do you always have to clean up? Drop this role. You can do better. (I am sorry I am not pming these lines but I am starting to have a dislike in pms recently...).


Hm, maybe you're right. I think I should try something else, one day. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

The reason is that I feel as a kind of moderator and healer, feeling responsible for the community process. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

But maybe it is the time to do something else, you might be right. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />


Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 09:09 PM
Honestly I don't know who to trust, everyone of the involved seemed very respectable members to me, this kinda shattered this for everyone. I hope honesty takes the upper hand of this soon.
Posted By: bernhard Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 09:11 PM
Quote

Hm, maybe you're right. I think I should try something else, one day. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

The reason is that I feel as a kind of moderator and healer, feeling responsible for the community process. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

But maybe it is the time to do something else, you might be right. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />


No that´s incorrect. I believe that there never was a time when the community needed a moderator and healer more badly.
Posted By: Stone Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 09:15 PM
Quote
Honestly I don't know who to trust, everyone of the involved seemed very respectable members to me, this kinda shattered this for everyone. I hope honesty takes the upper hand of this soon.

How did you know in the real life who you can trust?
Just try, and dont give up. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
After all i can say, the sun will shine tomorrow again, maybe not where you live ok, but the wish is counting <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

Sure, these are not really words of comfort. But live is still go on. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 09:20 PM
If the sun shines tomorrow like it did today, I'm sure I'm going to miss much of it beeing stuck behind a pc in an unlit room :s

I hope there will still be a sun when I get my month off this summer. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Barta Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 09:22 PM
Quote
And with this, I want to openly apologise to Barta for my behavior last on the "Pope" thread. I hope you are not mad at me for that anymore.

@ Galadriel
It's an old thread. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />
No i was not mad at you.
I am catholic, i like the Pope !


Quote
I have seen several times a situation when: today a person is very nice and kind with you and,... tomorrow, he/she just ignores you as you are absent. Then you start to question yourself, was that kindness real or just an illusion. Or maybe be you are that rude or dumb people are stopping to speak with you.


@ Egin

Sometimes i do not open all the topics in the forum because i do not have time.
Then i forgot the topics in which i have already posted.
It could happen that someone writes something for me in the topic and i do not answer.
I am sorry if some people could think that i ignore them.

The friendship in the forum is something special.
In real life i don't easely trust the people but in the virtual life it's worse !
I don't want to be friend with people i can't really trust.
We discussed about that a long time ago : some people say they are male/female and it is untrue or worse some people use several nicknames (male and female) in the same forum.

Barta
Posted By: galadriel Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 09:33 PM
Quote
Hey person D "person A, Person B is silly and needs to be more serious..." isn't something I would cass as harmfull gossip, I would class it as idiotic and irrelevant comments.

Tho person E:" Hey Person B, person person A and person C say you are silly and need to be more serious" seems odd, my anwser would be if I were person B, Yeah SO WHAT? what ere you trying to tell me. It does seem as an attempt to stirr up comotion.


Dear Dragh,
I know that you are Flemmish like me, but I still will answer your post in English, so that everyone will understand it.

If those things are "complaints" from one member to the other, I would classify it as gossip. The more because the others never complained about me, but Seth invented all this stuff up, to make me feel miserable. And saying that it comes from other members is still gossip, if you ask me?
I made one big mistake with him, and he used that against me.
If what he said was soo true, where are all the pm's he should have from the "complainers"? So, don't jump into conclusions yet, Seth is like they call a wolf in sheeps clothes. It's sad to learn that a fellow countrymen has betrayed soo many people on forum.
I'm ashamed in his place. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Polgara Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 10:20 PM
Well , I don't know if my opinion will help but I've noticed trough my years of Internet Experience that you
just has to take it for what it is . 'Internet'. If you enter a forum , don't start with the intention to find
good , thrustworty friends but with the intention of talking with people about the same intrests. Maybe you'll meet
someone who could become a very close friend (mostly you won't) but don't start forum-things with that intention in the first place.

Internet is so dangerous for us people. It is so easy to find someone you think is special
but if you try to look deeper you mostly get dissappointed because with all this protection you get from the internet
you don't see the bad sites from a person if you don't want to see them for a very long time.

If you don't take your forum-friendships to serious you wont be hurt that easy because you have a
sharper look on the thing when your feelings aren't involved so it would be easier to find the bad apple in the basket.
And afther years foruming (and Interneting) you will exactly know who is a friend and who is just a nice forum-camerade <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
(And yes I do believe that a good friendship needs his time to establish )

The dark side of all this is that foruming isn't so much fun any more if you
talk with strangers. ^-^

Anyway these are my personal thoughs. You can read them , you can agree , you can disagree, you can start gossiping
with it but whatever you do , it wont't change my view on this whole internet thing . (Or you have to come with earthshocking facts , I am
always open for new points of view , but very stubborn to change my own point of view :P )

I still think this forum is special altough I am not active in it anymore and I am glad that so many people try to keep it special by not allowing it to die easily .


Greetings

Pol who spends some Coffee from the wereldwinkel (Or beer):P and some Appelflappen <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />.

Ps : Kiya , my female feminism supports you !!!
Posted By: LewsTherinKinslayer13 Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 10:31 PM
Wow, long read. Intresting too. Why am I only mentioned as a spammer in here!? Meh, aah well.

I know most of you for 2,2 and half years now, and everyones been nice, and mean, at times. I don't think we should keep grudges for several years, but I don't think we need to gossip about people either. I've received pm's from many people informing me about certain things, or trying to get my side on things, and I just like to stay out of it.
What good is arguing on an internet site? It won't actually help anything.

Why hasn't Seth posted anywhere he?
I was suprised thouygh to here Kiya, lets say, 'attacking' him here. He's been friendly to me, and also mean, and manipulative ( ha ) but I still consider him a good person, and I think he deserves the 'angel' title. Why? Because he is helpful.

Oh, ps: I think I deserve it too! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Man, when did the fun times go? When Lynn would actually post in fun threads, and we'd enjoy things like the inn, and the island. =(

Lews, missing the old times, slinks off again.
Posted By: bernhard Re: why did she leave me?? - 08/06/05 10:37 PM
Lews, I definitely feel the same way you do, and that makes me scared... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />

No, I´m glad that at least you are still around, and <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/offtopic.gif" alt="" />, we definitely should make a guild wars session one time together... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shhh.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: janggut Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 02:10 AM
hey people! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />

somebody suggested to me some medicationto help with my anxiety attacks so i'm ok now. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

i am glad to see many familiar faces around & i'm sorry to be so selfish in my earlier post to ask if anyone has heard of anything bad about me. actually i shouldn't do that. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" />

what Kiya & Gal have done in coming out of the closet & take out the linen cloth, i will not say what they do is right or wrong but it does take a whole lot of courage to do so not to mention the risk of having people looking at them differently due to their actions.

as for how we deal with things like this, situations like this one will show our true colour, which mine is more of a passive approach. but i cannot deny the effectiveness of an aggressive action in this case.

as for Lews, Viper, Nero; what's in the past is in the past. what u were back then & what u are right now are different & u guys are proven to be good people. & thanks for the vote of confidence, Viper.

@ Egin -> i know the feeling of being ignored at times but please don't generalise it that u sideline friends who care; me for example.

@ Luc -> i am always glad to have u as my friend. but please don't let a few bad fruits ruin the fact that there are more good people than bad here in this forum. or am i just too blind? & this is never a bad time to drop in. i'm here, Egin is here, & Bernhard is back! your D2 gang is also itching for action, i hear. if only Shyon is around.

@ Polgara -> your words are wise indeed but for those who are very new, they may not know about online safety. take me for example, this forum is my very first online interaction so i interact without experience & wisdom. it was only through those that i now consider friends that i have learnt of online safety & ethics which i wasn't aware of before.

if anyone were to be so willing to tell u almost everything about them, what would u do? embrace them & let them spill everything out? or stop them immediately & warn them of the dangers in doing that? take the trust or keep them at arms length & warn them?

@ bigclaw -> those are good words. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/up.gif" alt="" />

@ Draggy -> me too, i hope truth will prevail.

@ Gal -> u are not responsible for what your countrymen have done/will do, so please don't feel guilt for them. & as for leaders for women, u ladies have to sort that one out.

@ Lews -> my young friend, don't be disillusioned but at the same time i know u have realised that all is not rosy. keep a firm footing on reality, have faith in God & keep smiling. it may not be so good now but it's also not that bad either.

@ Stone -> u are the man! there is good in all these & it's up to us to learn from it all.

@ Bern -> for the first time i hear a dragon has fear. what is this? look on the bright side; Luc is here, so be happy!

man, where is Jurak when u need him? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" /> we certainly need that funny guy right now.
Posted By: Lowkey Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 02:13 AM
Damn. I had a nice third post simmering around in the back of my mind but you all went and spoilt it by being, ugh, decent and admirable. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/kitty.gif" alt="" />
And then you are conspired to ruin a perfectly nice rant about the nature of community and friendship, and opportunity, by secretly collaborating to discuss it beforehand. Well, sigh, I'll have to, ergh, be brief. (no, I still don't know what it means) Thank you all for not using the my word, fester. I'm taking it with me.

Lol. All so serious, we only get to do this once you know, we can laugh at ourselves and not make it worse. My first 2 posts here had a tongue in cheek and very generic tone, if overdramatic - this post is not, and it will be my opinion, rather than an idea, or questions.

janggut - I have no principles, or morals, I was asking a question about the concept of having a community on the Larian site, there was no judgment from my perspective, though I can understand why you might think so. I presented some things in a very dramatic way, because not knowing the situation specifically or players involved, rattling the cage for an answer about an odd human nature question required, to my mind, that level of emotional incitement. Incitation?

I tried to be clear with my disclaimers, but stylistically there was room for confusion - I never sought to injure anyone, even in the short term, I will not apologize, however, I do hope that anyone hurt can forgive my role and style to the extent you think a positive result could have been achieved in another way. (I will, out of sheer hubris, declare this positive, though with no personal base of reference...ow, headache, headache)

Kiya - Sorry, I didn't know you were reading the thread, nor would I have expected participation, though not because you couldn't or wouldn't. You're always surprising, that's why we love you.

This post isn't just to respond to everyone though, actually it was to point something out about this event.

What Viper, Kiya, and Galadriel have done is perhaps far more extraordinary than you may realize...because now this is a community - and whether it continues and strengthens will depend on each of you. A community - and friends, support each other, in good and bad times, and a lot of secrets were being kept, a lot of private relationships, the opposite of what many said they wanted for the social part of the forum.

Kiya mentioned once how nice it was that the German members had a friendly community, not just "nice" behavior on the surface, but real friendships. People you could share things, even difficult personal issues with, and they would be supportive, they listened and cared. But the English speaking forums never quite congealed into the same thing, IMO there was a bud, but the flower never quite bloomed, though there have been attempts.

Recently it seemed headed in a downward spiral, a splintering of a once beautiful idea that only asked for, lol, simple things like honesty and openness, a willingness to trust people and get trust back. No one person can be blamed for this, for people here, special and valuable people, not quite consistently treating others as they might "real" friends. Not everyone wants this for their experience here, but for those that do - it is possible and takes only your willingness to make it so, to create something magical, something I think a lot of people in life really want- a collection of readily accessible genuine friends.

The cost is effort and potential pain, but the result, I think, is more than worth it. Do you see what we have discovered recently, lessons, and more importantly, information about our friends that can deepen that friendship - about how great their courage is.

janggut mentioned something about active vs passive approaches, my response would be, the pyramids were not build by waiting for them to stack themselves. Relationships take some effort and motivation, I think many people here have the motivation but haven't quite sensed the opportunity where effort would pay off, where lots of real and deep friendships could flower and deeply root.

There is no time like the present. Think carefully about it, if you are reluctant, would you pass up the chance to have a better friendship with a ray of sunshine, like Lucretia, only to find out that the next day she had been in some fatal accident, and you lost something infinitely valuable. Why wait, be passive, janggut? Ah, you know why.

Barta should definitely lead the Larian Amazons, because Kiya has to be the spiritual advisor <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> . But Barta, and others, have to promise to not encourage "polite" or artificial behavior too often. Sadness and fleeing isn't the only option either - though often our society encourages people to fit into barbie-doll molds and hide our anger, or fears, and other, "darker", emotions, this only results in seeing, or being, half of a person. Dealing with these things takes practice too, and it would be nice to have a community where you might pick up pointers.

It's ok to be angry, to be flippant, to tell your friends your passing thoughts, to be funny, even mean sometimes, because after all.... they are friends.


On another note, Lews~ is right about something - if I have a problem with Viper I can leave - and I should, not just for Viper alone, but the sword of vengeance always strikes two victims. One seems to be Seth~, but the bad taste left by my style in these matters is not easily forgotten and will be a source of discomfort. Since I have stated/implied that helping and not disrupting the community is my goal, logically then, I have to remove myself, not merely being inactive, but not visiting either. Though as some pointed out, not being seen as a member, makes it kind of a moot point. I'll give you one or two days to insult me though, but you have to be funny or really offensive, or I'll be bored. And Viper, I want some more original curses, I suspect you haven't fully expressed yourself. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />
Loki
[color:"orange"] Associate member of the Viper, Kiya, Barta, Tsel, and NeroJB fan clubs [/color] Hmmm, my cards aren't letting me in the door, I think I sat on a magnet.

P.S. Thanks Lynn, for the thread
P.P.S. Alrik~, I deduced that you were off topic... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
P.P.. um, whatever comes next, NeroJB - MIA the group or MIA as in missing <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />, hey, PWA Lives Forever, don't shoot the courier <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/delight.gif" alt="" />

Viper - No, just Lowkey here, I was just pointing out the danger of assumptions, though I am one of those shifty males. Besides, my avatar is often a wolf, so I certainly wouldn't have a avatar tagline that read, "stealing the souls of wolves", would I?

Seth~ - I have no vested interest in you, though that you found it necessary or even fun to hurt people here I find more bizarre and pitiful than anything else, but if this is a community you want to be a part of, granted many won't trust you significantly for a very, very long time, but I don't know that fleeing is the only option. But with no explanation, apology, or response, I think your address(es) should be banned. And if you can successfully apologize and explain, I will regret missing them, because, boy, they better be good.

HEY - janggut, you slipped in a new post and avatar, I like the avatar, just as well I won't be using one <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> .
Posted By: kiya Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 03:01 AM
Thank you very much, Galadriel for contacting me - thank you very much for speaking up clearly and in public. Actually you gave me courage to lay open what was burdening me for a long time - in fact since end of 2002.

Maybe I should have done it earlier - maybe now was the right time, who knows? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

In any case, you're courageous enough to break the silence. A silence I kept myself. Long years of distrust and caution popping up every now and then. Draining me.

Thank you, Dear <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/kissyou.gif" alt="" />
Kiya

I understand it if some refuse to believe - emotional abuse is something making one feel filthy all over. And sadly... it's a topic a lot of females are far more familiar with than males - yep. Sad but true.
Posted By: janggut Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 03:23 AM
it may have been my poorly worded staements. or that u have taken my words out of context. or both or neither.

whatever case that is, plus the fact that i am too lazy to go back & pore over too meticulously the words, i would liek to start with your most recent post. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

when i mentioned inaction as virtuous & valourous as action, it is not to be taken generally as that total inaction bears the effect of desired result everytime. to the situation of rumours & backstabs, there are times & places where inaction is always better, or delayed action is best. why react to every little bump? why must we resort to act act act when there are times sitting back & observe can bear better fruit?

in this case, yes, i cannot deny that cleaning the linen out in the open has the desired effect. but at the same time, please do not discount & generalise the fact that inaction can be as effective; only that wisdom is needed to know the difference.

from my side, action is very much useless as i have absolutely nothing to do with all these except for the interactions with the people involved, whose private intercourse has nothing to do with me. so i hope u understand my shock upon learning the soiled side of the linen that's out of my view.

& in the subject of friendship, yes, i agree action is a must but rumours & backstabs & lies? come on, action without wisdom & information will only perpetuate speculation, as how u described Viper's action. so let's not put things too generally?

how i see things; your true self, our true selves will only show by trial of fire. no amount of professing our principles, no matter how high & mighty they may be, means anything when actions/inaction tell otherwise. this is why i dare not pass judgement even when things now have unfolded. i can't say what Kiya & Gal did were right or wrong. i see it as what they did that they felt necessary.

feel proud for being a catalyst, if u must or will, mr Lowkey, but don't get too giddy on playing god; riling people up & telling them it's for their own good. as i always say with my fav word: TACT.

as for Seth, i am still willing to listen so please if u still care for the people here, come forward.
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 08:43 AM
@ Al
"Healer" is a totally different thing than "Cleaner"
You can be a "Healer" as much as you want (I permit it to you *Luc laughs with her "dimocratic" behaviour*). Stay a "Healer" not a "Cleaner" please. A "Healer" is pretty much needed and in my opinion this is a role that suits you better <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />

As far as Lowkey is concerned :
There! I told you he is a nice guy. I really need to get a dictionary though <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

As far as the recent events :

I know one thing : I trust Kiya very much in whatever she says. And considering she is away from the forum for a long time, she has no gain to say the things she said about Seth. I will try to find some time ans search my inbox. Then I will come back again and say the things I have to say. If I have the pms I have in mind that is.
Posted By: Lynn Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 09:27 AM
Waw! There's still a community! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/up.gif" alt="" />

And Stone:

Lynn, i think it is not necessary to close a thread like this. We can say, thats life. And things like this will happen again and then? Close the next thread like this one? Maybe the Members will think it is better if they do not throw the facts on the table becouse is it like a punishment if a thread is closed.

That's why I wrote: <Facts and names need to be thrown on the table!> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
Because I didn't want to close this thread. Things need to be cleared out, otherwise the problem gets worse and more people will be a victim.

Euh... just wanted to let you know. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

And I am still waiting for someone's explanation. Guilty until proven innocent...
Posted By: AlrikFassbauer Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 10:36 AM
Quote
i'm sorry to be so selfish in my earlier post to ask if anyone has heard of anything bad about me. actually i shouldn't do that.


@janggut : No problem. It's natural to me wanting to know what people talk about my self. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

I have experienced mobbing at school - so I almost always expect some sort of gossipt about me ... it's like swarms of flies flying around me ... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> I don't care nowadays. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

Quote
@ Egin -> i know the feeling of being ignored at times


Welcome to the Club ! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

Quote
@ Al
"Healer" is a totally different thing than "Cleaner"
You can be a "Healer" as much as you want (I permit it to you *Luc laughs with her "dimocratic" behaviour*). Stay a "Healer" not a "Cleaner" please. A "Healer" is pretty much needed and in my opinion this is a role that suits you better


Thanks. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />


Quote
P.P.S. Alrik~, I deduced that you were off topic...


Okay, here's something serious.


Personally, I partly feel actually responsible to get this community "up and running". I think that this forum needs people who take care on the community.

Currently looking for ways how to express what I mean ... I partly feel guilty because I feel responsible for this forum but couldn't do anything.

The reason is clear : I never got any news about this "affair". I was never involved.

But nevertheless I feel as if I should've acted - because I feel responsible.

My ratio says to me that I should feel guilty because I have failed. My intuition instead says to me that I shouldn't because i couldn't do anything - because I didn't know.

I think it's something I've got to learn. Watch Star Wars Episode III and you'll learn a bit more about manipulation of people.


Quote
P.P.S. Alrik~, I deduced that you were off topic...



That's the role I play. I feel responsible for this forum, so I take the role of a jester, fool, clown, off-topic - poster whenever I feel tension increasing. It's my way of trying to keep this community alive, to keep it "up & running".

I actually might appear as a fool sometimes. I often place posts that say nothing except jokes, just to keep the morale high, and not to let "bad vibes" grow up.


I have read that in some north american native tribes jesters, fun-makers, clowns are even sacred. They have an important role to play within their society. A role that has been partly forgotten some countries.

I see the role of a fool essential to a community - not too much, not too openly, but very subtle. I play for the community service.

I know that this might create a false impression of me. Some people might see me as a weak person, then, not capable of doing other things than ... being a fool.


However, I've learned that sometimes it might not be good to calm down tension. In this discussion it might well be tht it was necessary that the tension built up - for clearing. Every volcano must erupt some time when the tension is too high. Then, for the next years after that eruption, it might be safer to live there. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />


As a last word, I'll quote a saying I have recently read in a totally different forum (there was a discussion about friendships) :

"A close friend might also become a close fiend."

Closing,

Alrik.
Posted By: Stone Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 12:03 PM
Quote
"A close friend might also become a close fiend."

Or, like Popeye said, "A good fiend is better than a bad friend, you know allways what you have in a good fiend" <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />

Lynn, i thought that your writing
[color:"orange"] I have read all of it, and no action can be taken right now [/color]
mean that there comes a action from you <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
This was the reason for me to post my opinion about this.
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Morbo Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 12:43 PM
Long reading thread. When reading it makes me wonder "What Would Brian Boitano Do?" <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: NeroJB Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 01:20 PM
Quote
Waw! There's still a community! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/up.gif" alt="" />


I think we made lynn cry!

and as you all know that I am a movie junkie...a quote comes to mind...

"Wow, isnt it great that were all better people...FISHY!!!!"

-Mike Meyers, Waynes World - Possibly the best comedy ever...
Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 01:23 PM
Quote

-Mike Meyers, Waynes World - Possibly the best comedy ever...


Waynestock is.
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 03:24 PM
Ok I had a look to my inbox but unfortunatelly most of the correspondence I had in mind is in ICQ and of course, I DO NOT HAVE ANY COPIES. Why? Because Luc is naive and never keeps copies. But I have a post in my inbox which can be evidence if it is needed for any forum member and most important for any Larian member.

@ Lynn is it true that Seth was in touch with you constantly and that he informed you about things concerning forum members? (This was said to me by Seth in ICQ). And is it truth that he was "behind the sceenes" as he said with you and Marian in the case of DAD in order to be banned? (This I have it in my inbox and it is at your disposal). Do not get me wrong here. I do not want to blame anyone. It is just that I feel that it is not moral someone gather information for the members and then pass it on to you. I have told that to Seth. He said to me that you asked it. I am saying this not because I want to make worse things worst but as Lynn said things must be put on the table. So I need to know. Seth also told me that in some cases he asked you to name some members Angels. And that you did this having in mind his opinion about those members. Is that truth?

Lynn you do not have to answer to any of this. After all you said it yourself, you work for the Larian Studios, and your work does not include solving our problems. The reason I would like to have an answer is only because I want to learn the truth and because this is something that I have kept in my mind during all the time I was in here considering it as a negative thing of the forum. Plus I think that you should be aware of what it is said.

Many people would think that I am wrong doing it. Some others will think I am not. For the people who will think that I am wrong, I need to say that I have given a great thought before I post this. People who know me, also know that I do not usually gossip, I do not make any questions -or at least I ask permition to ask. However people who are close to me, know my e-mail address and they know where to find me in case that this post will be the cause of my leaving the Larian forum.
Ok I am done.
Luc
Posted By: Plowking Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 03:48 PM
@Luc - I dont think there's anything wrong with what you said...I'd like to know all this. I think everyone has a right to know whats actually going on, and if there's some deceit on the part of seth (or anyone else).

I've never had a PM from seth, but I'm a man, so not his usual target perhaps.

Either way...I know who I believe in all this...and it's you ladies, luc, kiya, galadriel etc...
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 04:00 PM
Thank you Plowking about the trust. The thing is that I could say some more but I do not have any proof. And I never permit to myself to say things without proofs. In any case I feel better that I have wrote this. It was in my mind for a long time and made me sometimes wonder about Lynn. But only sometimes. On one hand I could not believe that this could be true. On the other I was new here and I was not sure for anyone.
The only thing that troubles me is that Lynn will be very disapointed. I know I would feel that way. I am really sorry.
Posted By: Lynn Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 04:05 PM
Normally I would never do this, but in this case I make an exception…

@ Lynn is it true that Seth was in touch with you constantly and that he informed you about things concerning forum members? (This was said to me by Seth in ICQ).

He did send me a few PM’s, not that much and on a very irregular base. I didn’t always reply to them... Honestly, I can’t recall all the PM’s (some were personal towards me, so I stopped replying) because usually I clean my PM’s, but by accident I still have two PM’s from him and yes, that was about two forum members. Because it was too personal and it was none of my business, I told him that I won’t react, and so I didn’t. He did understand.

And is it truth that he was "behind the sceenes" as he said with you and Marian in the case of DAD in order to be banned?

That’s a long time ago and I don’t remember that… But DAD has never been banned.
I would never ban someone because another person asks me, never.

He said to me that you asked it.
That’s completey wrong!

Seth also told me that in some cases he asked you to name some members Angels.
I did this once yes, but not because he asked me. On the other hand, I did check if that person deserved the title, and she did, so I made her a Helper.

Hope that helps a little to clear things up.

And still I hope he shows up here, because I (and you too I guess) want to hear his version too.
Posted By: AlrikFassbauer Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 06:17 PM
Quote
Long reading thread. When reading it makes me wonder "What Would Brian Boitano Do?" <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />


Who's that ?
Posted By: Morbo Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 06:25 PM
It's just a sdentance like "What would jesus do" but the southpark version.

What Would Brian Boitano Do? press the heads <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

just some comic relief in the thread. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: MeaCulpa Re: *DELETED* - 09/06/05 07:32 PM
There done ... over and out <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Post deleted by MeaCulpa
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 08:01 PM
@ Lynn
Thank you for replying. I guess I knew what the answers would be. The pm I have for DAD is old that is true. But I still have it and you can ask it whenever you want. I am glad you decided to reply because silence is not good in these cases. I am also glad that this is clear now.

As far as the Angels concerned I am not referring to that person you wrote in your post. If we are talking about the same person, I know her and I believe too that she deserved to be named like this.
Seth told me not only for that person but for almost all Angels who were named like that after his proposals. Let me make clear that I am not asking you anymore. I am just informing you ok?. Many times while I was in here I wanted to ask you personally but I always changed my mind. Why? Because even if I did not like that, I thought that it was none of my business.
Why I did not like that? Because I think this is not moral. But that is just what I think and my point of view might sound weird to other people. I am really sorry I do not have any copies from the conversations I had with Seth in ICQ. I do not have any ICQ account now. Why? I had to close it down because I did not want any messages from Seth.

However, I am sorry for any trouble my post may have caused to you because I know you are bussy and I suppose that the last thing you need in your work among others is problems like this.
I thank you again for your reply.
Luc
Posted By: galadriel Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 08:58 PM
Thank you, Lucretia for your investigations too. The more days go by the more filth that poors out the drain. I told Lynn that Seth had build an image of being a great helper around the forum, but the more I get through his pm's, the more I see that he likes that other people lean on him for support and strenght.

But when you go through his posts, you can also read the contempt for females. He doesn't like them at all. You can check it if you want.

And Kiya, you're welcome girl. Glad that I could help you and you also helped me. It was a burden on my shoulders as well. I hope we can be friends?

Barta, I know that we didn't get along that well, but we don't have to agree with everything, don't we?
According to Seth, your title of Fallen Angel, was his idea. You should be thankful to him for that <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" /> (I have it in one of his pm's)
But what do you think of the title of Larian Ambassador? That title is only yours to be thankfull for!! And Kiya as your spiritual advisor? Maybe Lucretia for your right hand? What a strong female section this could be!!
Long live our ambassador!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/XmasJump.gif" alt="" />

O yes, and Plowking, thanks for your trust in us. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: LewsTherinKinslayer13 Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 10:35 PM
Odd, I've heard the same from Seth, that he was helping out with the whole DAD mess, and that he pm's Lynn alot, that he is 'eyes and ears' for her while she's away and they keep close contact.

On MSN mind, and I don't keep copies either.

I still think he's a good person though. Alot of people were helping with the DAD case.
Posted By: Barta Re: why did she leave me?? - 09/06/05 11:59 PM
@ Polgara

I really like your post. I agree with everything, specially with this part :

Quote
If you don't take your forum-friendships to serious you wont be hurt that easy because you have a
sharper look on the thing when your feelings aren't involved so it would be easier to find the bad apple in the basket.
And afther years foruming (and Interneting) you will exactly know who is a friend and who is just a nice forum-camerade <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
(And yes I do believe that a good friendship needs his time to establish )

Yes a good friendship needs time to establish


@ Lowkey

Why do you write so long posts !
Think about the people who have difficulties with the english language !

Quote
But Barta, and others, have to promise to not encourage "polite" or artificial behavior too often.

I have encouraged a polite behaviour because i was pretty sure that this topic would have turn very soon in a very big war with agressive people insulting each other.
I was completely wrong
Everybody cares about the feelings of the other people even when they don't agree.

But i never encouraged an artificial behaviour.
In some groups, all the people seem to have the same opinion because they are scared of being throwned out of the group if they don't agree with the majority.
In this forum everybody feels free to give his own opinion.


@ MeaCulpa

I don't understand anything in you post !


@ Galadriel

Quote
Barta, I know that we didn't get along that well, but we don't have to agree with everything, don't we?

I agree that we don't have to agree with everything.
But please stop thinking that there is something wrong between us.

It is not because i don't send PM to the people or because i don't talk a lot with them that they could think that i am ignoring them.
When my PM box was full of PM i was completely disturbed.
Now i just choose the topics in which i want to post, i take my time and i feel free.
Like Kiya i need to get a life !

BTW about gossips about me Seth told me :
"I received tons of PM of people thinking that you have a love affair in real life with [nocando] (a well known french member)".
I guess he told this gossip to some other people and i have to say : no i don't have a love affair with anybody !"


Quote
According to Seth, your title of Fallen Angel, was his idea. You should be thankful to him for that (I have it in one of his pm's)

Yes it was his idea but i did not agree with it.
Lews had the same idea several months before Seth and i told him : "Thanks but don't ask anything for me".
I am not a great helper in the english section but i am a good helper in the french section.
It's easy i just have to translate in french the good answers from Raze or Kiya. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/badsmile2.gif" alt="" />


@ Lews

Quote
I still think he's a good person though. Alot of people were helping with the DAD case.

Each of us has a good side and a bad side even you !
Seth helped me a lot. He explained me a lot of things. He was a good online friend and he never hurted me.
But when Kiya told me that he has hurted her i could not stay his friend.
It was impossible.
I understand your feelings and i will still like you the same way if you don't agree with Kiya.

Barta
Posted By: kiya Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 12:08 AM
True, I got a mail from Setharmon dealing with the DAD incident as well - my reaction was to close down the 2nd mail account (didn't have that one in end of 2002/beginning 2003, so it was not blocked).

I wished no intervention from him dealing with myself at NO time (for new members, unfamiliar with this case => I had trouble with a member here, dealt with manipulation, the attack of my best female friend and her husband. I left the forum, because I thought my absence would cool things down - and because I have a very strong allergy against being possessed. No one forces me into friendship - I choose alone).

I was out of Setharmon's claws and I intended to keep that so. I watched if members seemed to have a trustful contact with him and was cautious in revealing my personal info then. Why? Gossip is common, one of the methods to create nearness. And I knew he liked to point out how important he is on the board and supported by Larians. Not that it was true - but added to the image he created here: grey eminence, puppeteer, spider in the centre of the web.

I only warned when I was asked by females about him. Told my story then - AFTER asking a lot of questions to find out the reason for their query. Wondered about the tip of the iceberg - how many had contact. How many he had told he had to back me off because I wanted more than friendship. How many believed that and therefore kept away from me, thus maybe becoming easy prey.

[color:"yellow"]@Janggut[/color] => how come you had the impression Setharmon and I are on close, good terms? Where did I give this impression, please? What lead to your conclusion? You read carefully? Where did I, kiya, give the impression actively?
kiya

The more I read here, specially Luc (poor lady <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/kissyou.gif" alt="" /> ) the more I see how cleverly Setharmon built and spread his spider web. But your inner self warned you, hm?

Ach, Barta - so he used the love affair weapon in your case as well? ARGH!
Posted By: Barta Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 12:33 AM
Quote
@Janggut => how come you had the impression Setharmon and I are on close, good terms? Where did I give this impression, please? What lead to your conclusion? You read carefully? Where did I, kiya, give the impression?
kiya

Like Janggut i never thought that you could be in bad terms with Seth.
You are both very old forum members and i thought that everybody in the old forum were good friends.
I was very surprised when you told me about the gossips.
I was not expecting this kind of answer.
What i can say it is that you are very good to hide your feelings. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shhh.gif" alt="" />

Barta
Posted By: kiya Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 12:46 AM
Quote
Barta:
What i can say it is that you are very good to hide your feelings


True - being in the combat zone for several years leads to caution. I don't trust easily, strong streak in my personality - strong self-protective adder. Strong allergy against manipulation and emotional abuse. I wait until I'm asked - as you did, ma chère amie <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/kissyou.gif" alt="" /> - and if I trust enough then, I'm open, I tell my story and warn. Hope, I'm believed - hope, the female is careful then - hope, she was not hurt.
Kiya
Posted By: LadySarah Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 12:58 AM
I just read this thread start to finish and am greatly distrubed by the lack of sensitivity of people. Can't you see that this has turned into a witch hunt? It is completely out of line and totally off topic.

I don't care who you dislike or why, it is completely inappropriate to drag person out into a public forum and embarass them in front of other people. Geez! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/memad.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Lurker Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 02:42 AM
I've also just read this thread, and I totally disagree with you. This is not about embarassing someone without reason. If someone manipulates members of a community, thus harming the community, this person should be expelled, and for that, those manipulations should be made public. Besides, threatening someone to hack their computer is a criminal offence (at least where I live) and should not be tolerated. It's not about liking or disliking someone.

In a witch hunt, the accused doesn't get a chance to properly defend him/herself. As several forum members have stated, they're still willing to listen and waiting for a statement.

The victims of any such manipulations have my respect. It certainly takes courage to go public with those things.
Posted By: Stone Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 04:19 AM
I can understand you Lady Sarah, in some vantage point you are right, but some thing have to stop. And in this case is the only way to stop this obvious. We cannot clear those things via PM. It is impossible becouse the only way to get the truth is to speak open, so that everybody can see whats going on.
And i know Kiya as a honest Member which i can thrust completly. I know that this step is not easy for her, becouse she dont like it to stay in the middle of the puplik interest. And i think for the other involved Member is the situation similar, even if i dont know them like i Kiya know.

I think this thread is now reaching a point where we all have to be more carefull. It is importand to say our opinion.
But before we can say it was right, or it was not right to handle these thing in this way, we have to wait for Setharmons statement.


Posted By: LaFille Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 04:52 AM
I agree with what Stone said on that last point, and I would like to expose a point that concerns me before all this evolves.
Please remember what opinions are; beware of the vengeance desire and bloodthirst such situations may awake.
Posted By: bernhard Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 06:22 AM
Quote
@Janggut => how come you had the impression Setharmon and I are on close, good terms? Where did I give this impression, please? What lead to your conclusion? You read carefully? Where did I, kiya, give the impression actively?
kiya


I´m not Janggut, but I also hat the impression that you were in contact with Setharmon all the time. Not because of something you said or did, but because of him. Seth and I have also been in quite a close contact. It happened when Kyra went home. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />

Seth wrote me a PM that some other person here had the Idea of something like a condolance E-mail to Fafnir. I wrote him back that I wouldn´t participate because I didn´t knew Fafnir very well and didn´t wanted to be too personal, to interupt and disturb him in this situation. Seth wrote me back that he would had just spoken with you Kiya and you and he himself would have the same opinion. He also wrote that he would be in close contact with Lynn in order to prevent other forum members of doing good will damage in this case.

At his time I thought that he is a most sensible and trustful person. Maybe I´m naive.

@Barta: If I understood Meas post correctely she recieved a PM from Fafnir in which he accused Mea of having said something bad to Kyra. Mea sais that she had absolutely no idea what happened at that time. (so - it was probably gossip once agian.)
Posted By: Lynn Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 07:41 AM
He also wrote that he would be in close contact with Lynn in order to prevent other forum members of doing good will damage in this case.

Yes, that's true. He contacted me once about this, only once. And we had the same opinion indeed.

When someone claims he/she has close contact to me, or whatever, being it untrue, then I don't really mind. That's not a problem, is it? The problem here is in what we have read earlier, about the manipulations, that's what it is about, right?

Let's hope we can sort this out soon.
Posted By: janggut Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 07:54 AM
dear Kiya,

the reason i thought that u are close to Seth is that he told me he is close to u as a friend. as for details, if u want to know more, u can PM me, but for both u & him, i won't say anything more in public.

i can never understand your distress, Mea. because somehow i am fortunate not to be in such a situation as u. i'm sorry to know that bad things like that happened to u.

though i understand the need to clear things up, i am very sad to see both Kyra's & Fafnir's names beinf dragged out here. memories. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />

so let's talk only necessary stuff & not drag any other names that should stay in the past; like DAD. that was resolved a long time ago so please, let it stay there.

once again; Seth, come forward please & let's deal with this issue once & for all. i am not going to judge u, nor others except those involved.

@ Lady Sarah -> we will have to wait for Seth to come out then this can be resolved.

as for others, again i say let's not drag any names out unnecessarily which can open old wounds. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: bernhard Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 07:58 AM
Yep, that´s true Lynn. However I made that post only because I wanted to give Kiya a proof why at least I had had the Impression of her beeing a close friend to Setharmon. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Edit: @Janggut: you´re right bearded friend. As always. But although I haven´t been here for quite a while I feel a bit responsible too for this situation. I was in close contact to Seth for quite a while and I really cannot remember what I said to him. I know at least one female person here, with whom I am in good contact too, Setharmon was in a way interested in. Of course I told only good things about her, but as it looks now I should have shut down completely.

I just can´t remember how many PM´s Seth and I exchanged so it might be the case that one time I did say something leading a bit too this situation. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: kiya Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 09:01 AM
@Bernhard => at that time my PM box was closed, I needed to concentrate on my job project and didn't want to have gamers in need of help for the game wait endlessly. So... it was untrue. Setharmon had no opportunity to contact me.
******************

In general about witch hunt => true, I saw that happen to gamer Jove on the old forum. And my name was used to start it. That not only embarassed me, it aggravated me highly.

In general about blood thirst and vengeance => true. I had phases like that at times in 2003. Specially when I learned my name was used to achieve something. But mostly I felt helpless anger, leading to more caution on my behalf. And now? Nope - distance is too large. There is one thing though I feel clearly and strongly => determination to clarify that I have absolutely NO contact to Setharmon, no agreements or discussions about actions here on the forum, none at all.

Embarass Setharmon? I'd call it clarification - to demask. If he used my name to achieve something from 2003 on, it was done on his own behalf - solely.

I fully know the meaning of the word "witch hunt" - I sadly don't know an Anglo-American phrase of repeatedly abusing my name and person to achieve something. But I certainly DO know which emotions this knowledge raises in myself.
Kiya

@Janggut => thank you. I don't think details are necessary. I only wanted to know if I had given an impression I don't know of.

[color:"yellow"]Edit:[/color] Results of my research =>
I closed my PM box at the end of October 2004, reopened middle of March 2005. Was in the USA for vacancy from 27th December 2004 on until 20/21st January 2005.

The last mail I got from Setharmon, where I reacted with closing down my mail account totally was 1st quartal 2003.

His last PM towards me was end of June 2003. Since then no PM contact from either side.
Posted By: Kejero Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 09:35 AM
Quote
Embarass Setharmon? I'd call it clarification - to demask.

I agree. And I think it's a good thing that all this behind the scene stuff is reaching the surface, and that's what this is about.
Needless to say, it probably IS embarrassing for the man in the spotlights to be exposed like this, but the way I see it he has only himself to thank for that. I hope he'll be able to put aside that embarrassment and still has some pride left to at least face the confrontation and give us his side of the story...
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 09:38 AM
Some points of view I want to share with you :

A. Barta => even if you HAD a love affair with a certain member, this is NOT our business. (I am really sick with Seth now. This is pathetic!) Barta, and everybody else in here have the right to do what they want with their personal life and this is not our business.

B. This is not a witch hunt. This is -as far as I am concerned- a civilized OPEN conversation in order to sort things out. I am more than willing to listen to Seth's answers to all those accusations. There is a saying here that is -pretty poor translated- "Listen to me first and then hit me". However I know who I trust. My opinion is that this open conversation was necessary -as Stone pointed out- because via pms the only thing we would achieve is to continue a sick situation in which someone told someone, told someone, told someone.... etc. Clear questions and clear answers will sort things out.

C. Nobody is FORCING nobody to decide or take sides in here. Everybody is free to read and judge by his/her own free will. This is not bad. I think here we call it dimocracy. Again as far as I am concerned this is not a war, nor a witch hunt and I know that most of the members will agree with me. Read how many misunderstandings are cleared up in this thread. This is healthy I think. And perhaps this will make the community stronger -not against Seth- but towards each other.

D. Yes we must be carefull to what we write in this thread from now on -as LaFille said- because it is very easy to let unger get over us. Plus it is easy to get over the boredom we might feel by using this thread with the juicy details and exposures. This should not happen by no means. Lets sort things out and move on.

C. Bernhard => you have mentioned a female that Seth was interested in and since you do not remember what info you shared with him, you should either name her or warn her via pm if you do not wish to tell her name in public. Some would think that she would be hurt. Some others will not. IMHO she should know about that.

E. Kiya => Yeap this sensor still works <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Luc <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: AlrikFassbauer Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 09:48 AM
Quote
I have encouraged a polite behaviour because i was pretty sure that this topic would have turn very soon in a very big war with agressive people insulting each other.
I was completely wrong
Everybody cares about the feelings of the other people even when they don't agree.


I do totally agree !

You cannot imagine how worried I was when I saw this thread !

Posted By: bernhard Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 10:34 AM
Quote


C. Bernhard => you have mentioned a female that Seth was interested in and since you do not remember what info you shared with him, you should either name her or warn her via pm if you do not wish to tell her name in public. Some would think that she would be hurt. Some others will not. IMHO she should know about that.


I´m still in contact with this person and so there is no danger at all. She was warned by somebody else month ago she told me btw.
Posted By: elgi Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 10:48 AM
Quote
by Lowkey:

Kiya mentioned once how nice it was that the German members had a friendly community, not just "nice" behavior on the surface, but real friendships. People you could share things, even difficult personal issues with, and they would be supportive, they listened and cared. But the English speaking forums never quite congealed into the same thing, IMO there was a bud, but the flower never quite bloomed, though there have been attempts.


Well, I wouldn't say it's that simple in the German forum. First of all, there are less people... and less posts... that's the main difference.

Another difference is that the community there is still based on the forum "characters" and not entirely on the real persons.

Generally, I am really surprised by the problems mentioned here. How can one person cause such troubles? How gullible have people to be in order to believe stupid PMs by such a person (or any other, for that matter)? I mean, sure, I can try to tell [nocando] to people in PMs, but why would anyone believe that?

Personally, I don't have anything against talking in PM but if someone tells me negative details about anyone else, I don't just believe that... if I care, I try to find out more. And if I don't care, I shrug and don't do anything.

I think some people here should do the same instead of getting emotionally involved this much.

With that, I don't want to say that I don't regard the community here as nice thing... but after all, it's only an online community. Even in "real" communities, you have various problems, so why wouldn't there be such in online ones? However, I have to agree a bit with Lowkey there. I don't have the time to check the English part every day or even post regularly. But when I come here, I often see a thread in which these problems are the topic. Someone leaves, comes back, leaves again, sulks, cries, is mad, leaves again, is mean and whatnot.

I am not a great fan of such threads at all... mostly it looks like this one. Viper posts something bad/unfair which happened to him, and then everyone feels the urge to assure him that he is nice and that they feel with him and such things. That might be correct, I don't want to say Viper sucks (even though I don't like the car), but I don't like such threads. It's not really productive and represents rather a giant group hug.

A group hug can be nice of course... but not in a forum in my opinion. And the worst part is: If you dare to break the vicious circle of hugging and assuring and post something remotely criticizing - even if you don't mean any harm but just want to provoke some thoughts - you get the evil eye.

I might be exaggerating a bit, but it's a recurring pattern for sure.
Posted By: AlrikFassbauer Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 10:54 AM
Quote
Another difference is that the community there is still based on the forum "characters" and not entirely on the real persons.


Yes, that's the main difference.
Posted By: LadySarah Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 03:02 PM
Please don't misunderstand me. I am not trying to defend Seth. I don't know him or anyone else well enough to judge whether he/she is right or wrong. I was just disturbed that people would be so harsh to a member on our forum in such a public place.

All is ok now. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: NeroJB Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 03:23 PM
I dont know how well the term overkill translates but I think we may be at that point...I think enough dirty laundry has been aired and though things are civil at the moment I think we may be poking the sleeping giant one too many times...

with that I bow out continue as you will... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shhh.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 03:52 PM
@ LadySarah
No no you were not misunderstood. At least not from me. You are an Adept which means you are new here and you do not know many people. And of course you are free to express your opinion! And up to one point you are right. Public exposure is very hard, even in a virtual community. I just think that in this case this was necessary because many members were disturbed.

Anyway I welcome you in the forum (I did not have the chance to do this) and I hope that you will enjoy your stay in these -as Jurak says- "Funny pages".
Luc <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: LadySarah Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 03:55 PM
Thank you Lucretia <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: galadriel Re: why did she leave me?? - 10/06/05 06:20 PM
First I would like to say, I'm sorry for naming people here earlier, I have deleted that part of my post. I really don't wanna drag this to far.

@ Lady Sarah
It's really sweet of you to say those things, it shows that you are a honest and good in your heart.
But our intentions are also good. We don't want to embarrass Seth, but we want to put an end on the manupulation, especially for the new members.

@ Alrik
Don't worry, friend, I told you not to worry. This will not be a rage of blood. We will disolve this in a polite and humaine manner.

@ Nero JB
I wont say anything anymore about this. I just wanted to tell my side of the story, because I looked up to Kiya and I promised her to stand next to her in this.

@ Lurker
Quote
Besides, threatening someone to hack their computer is a criminal offence (at least where I live) and should not be tolerated.

Thank you for noticing that. I was wondering when someone would say anything about that. I'm not so familiar with those things, so I don't know if it was indeed a criminal offence. He said it between the lines you know. Like this: " You know, I could get in to your computer if I would, but I don't do this anymore these days." To me, it was a hint so I wouldn't talk about all this.

@ Stone
Like it was a big step for Kiya, it was also a big step for me. I'm glad I said it, but I also want everything back to normal.
We just have to wait now for Seth's reaction on all this. Allthough, I'm wondering where he is at the moment? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />

@ Barta
You still didn't agree to lead the female section of this forum? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: LewsTherinKinslayer13 Re: why did she leave me?? - 11/06/05 01:00 AM
I thought I was the reason Kiya closed her mail. . . <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shame.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: faile Re: why did she leave me?? - 11/06/05 06:38 PM
hi all! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />
i was alerted to this thread through a friend on msn, and i decided to come forward and share my experience with setharmon.

when i was still fairly new to the forum, setharmon contaced me through pm and made me feel very welcome. we started to be friends, but then i felt his pm's were getting a little forward. he would tell me how other girls would never leave him alone, and how they would give him naked pictures of themselves. i thought he was full of s***, but i kept talking to him and didn't say anything about it. then he asked me to do a favor for him, he wanted me to make an international phone call to a girl in europe who he said was stalking him. he wanted me to pretend to be his girlfriend and tell the other girl to back off. i told him i wouldn't do it, and began to stop talking to him. at some point after that, i don't remember when, but i talked to kiya and got her story. when a female contacted me and asked me what i thought about him, i told her my opinion and asked kiya to help me make her understand he was not trustworthy. i am very thankful she believed us.

so, thats my input.
Posted By: LewsTherinKinslayer13 Re: why did she leave me?? - 11/06/05 06:52 PM
Hey Faile! WB, for the time anyways.


Seth said something like that to me once, that girls wouldn't leave him alone and how now he wouldn't even give anyone his picture because everyone who saw it went insane for him.
I thought he must have been lying, and now this just kinda confirms it.
Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 11/06/05 07:14 PM
If seth never gave a picture of himself It's prolly not because of stalkers but because he's ashamed?
Posted By: galadriel Re: why did she leave me?? - 12/06/05 09:07 AM
Quote
If seth never gave a picture of himself It's prolly not because of stalkers but because he's ashamed?


Oh no, he certainly wasn't afraid or ashamed! I still have a picture of him.

And what Faile told us can only confirm his ego-tripping head. He really thinks of himself that he is irresistable, but if you ask me, I wasn't impressed by his looks <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif" alt="" />

Thank you Faile for also telling your story.

You see Seth? We are not afraid of you anymore, or impressed by you or whatever. We are all independant women, and together we will make sure not to step into those traps anymore!!
We have a Flemmish singer that has a very nice song that also fits the situation, but it's in Dutch. I will try to translate it the best I can. Please check the fav. lyric section.
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 12/06/05 09:20 AM
@ Falister
it is good to see you! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/kissyou.gif" alt="" />
You will be happy to know that I did my first tattoo <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/XmasJump.gif" alt="" /> (sorry that was off topic).

@ Al
Pass that bucket again. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/suspicion.gif" alt="" />

If Seth is not left alone by girls then imagine what is going on to HandEFood, Dragh and Bernhard who are REALLY handsome!
Posted By: galadriel Re: why did she leave me?? - 12/06/05 10:17 AM
Quote
If Seth is not left alone by girls then imagine what is going on to HandEFood, Dragh and Bernhard who are REALLY handsome!


Touché <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ouch.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: AlrikFassbauer Re: why did she leave me?? - 12/06/05 10:34 AM
Quote
He really thinks of himself that he is irresistable [...]


I'm the exact opposite ! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/delight.gif" alt="" />

Even if I was the dream of women I would think that I'm totally crap. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/delight.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 12/06/05 10:51 AM
*Luc is violently taking the bucket from Al and throws it on his head*
[color:"orange"]Step out of it! [/color]
(Democratic procedures again <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/badsmile2.gif" alt="" /> (...) and this time I have spelled it correctly <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" />)
Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 12/06/05 11:08 AM
I have a bodyguard and an armored car. You never know what methods these crazy women use to get inside...
Posted By: kiya Re: why did she leave me?? - 12/06/05 07:13 PM
Quote
Faile:
he would tell me how other girls would never leave him alone, and how they would give him naked pictures of themselves


I can confirm that, got a mail from him in 2002 with one of these pics. Was disgusting. I recall, I was insecure how to react - as my internet experience was low and up to today I have never visited flirt chat rooms.

Sure, I believed you, Faile - and I recall my searing anger that there is one prowler here in the forum.
Kiya

Thanks for coming back to tell your story, pirate <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Barta Re: why did she leave me?? - 12/06/05 07:51 PM
@ Galadriel

Quote
You still didn't agree to lead the female section of this forum? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

I thank you but i am already the PIF Pres and it's a lot of work on my shoulders. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />
I can't be the Queen of the Amazons.
Bus as the Pres i would like to nominate Lucretia for being the Queen of the Amazons.
I guess some people would not agree with this nomination and if it is necessary i will organise a referendum.


Back on topic :
At the beginning i was scared that Kiya and Viper would be alone to tell their story and that the people could not believe them.
But with Gal and Faile there are now 4 persons who have been deeply hurted.
I realise afterward that i had a lot of luck because he was not really interested by me.
Too old ? Too crasy ? Too secret ? I don't know !
I would have had a heart attack if i would have received a porn picture from a forum member. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/eek.gif" alt="" />

Barta
Posted By: Ubereil Re: why did she leave me?? - 12/06/05 08:29 PM
And still no reply from the accused...

Übereil
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 12/06/05 08:50 PM
"I would have had a heart attack if i would have received a porn picture from a forum member."
Barta

Me too and I was going to be sick.

Edit : I just saw it. I would agree with those who wouldn't like me and wouldn't agree with you Barta. For different reasons though. However I thank you <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/kissyou.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/kissyou.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: LewsTherinKinslayer13 Re: why did she leave me?? - 12/06/05 10:30 PM
Ube, this is where you go 'ew, porn, I don't like that.' <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: janggut Re: why did she leave me?? - 13/06/05 06:58 AM
Queen of Amazon? i don't think i want Luc to become one as amazons are such man-haters. & used men as sex objects. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" /> come to think of it, i don't mind. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/delight.gif" alt="" />

but i daresay let Luc be Athena, goddess of justice! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/XmasJump.gif" alt="" />

Luc not only will protect women of the forum, also very young members too (especially from themselves if they aren't wise enough).

@ Elgi -> true enough. but in our case here in the english section, how we seem to be quite stupid & very silly; that's just how we are. the best protection is total detachment. & that means no way to be intimate enough even to be cordial or friends.

to have or make friends, one has to go out & be willing to take the risk of getting hurt. but no, i don't think i will let one bad fruit ruin every good ones here. there is still a lot of good here. a lot of good people. we are learning. we are growing.

@ Faile -> ...... this is really sad. so sad i feel like apologising on Seth's behalf for such unbecoming behaviour. most men are not like that! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: faile Re: why did she leave me?? - 13/06/05 07:23 AM
Quote
@ Faile -> ...... this is really sad. so sad i feel like apologising on Seth's behalf for such unbecoming behaviour. most men are not like that! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/disagree.gif" alt="" />


haha, no biggie. i'm really not all that bothered about it, i deal with a lot worse where i work. i had to kick out some disgusting pervert guy the other day for being in a teen chatroom... this guy was at least thirty. then a crackhead made me miss my bus.

as i say, the only thing you can truely control in your life is your reaction, and i choose to see the humor in the whole thing.
Posted By: Plowking Re: why did she leave me?? - 13/06/05 08:30 AM
Wow, Seth has even more to answer for than ever before.

However I get the feeling he's already seen or read all this and knows the jig is up. Maybe he wont be showing his face (avatar) 'round here any more!

Posted By: Lynn Re: why did she leave me?? - 13/06/05 08:52 AM
Yes, exactly my thoughts. He won't show up here anymore. Well, if he doesn't by the end of the week, then we know enough...

I still would like to leave his account open for a while, to give him a chance to defend himself. Afterwards I will close it down for obvious reasons.
Posted By: Ubereil Re: why did she leave me?? - 13/06/05 10:51 AM
Couldn't you ban his ip too? Just a thought. I wouldn't prevent him from being at the forum on public computers, but at least it would make it more difficult for him. IF this is possible, and IF he doesn't show up by the end of the week and we've decided that this means he's guilty (there is still a SLIM chance that this is the case!). Just a thought.

Ew, porn, I don't like that.

Happy now, Lews? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />

Übereil
Posted By: HandEFood Re: why did she leave me?? - 13/06/05 01:19 PM
You really only need an IP ban if they try to breech their ban.
Posted By: NeroJB Re: why did she leave me?? - 13/06/05 01:23 PM
Lets leave Seth alone...how would any of us enjoy being publicly painted...
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 13/06/05 01:58 PM
Yes I would say that if someone has anything important to report to this topic to do it. Lets concentrate on the facts and let Lynn do what she has to do. There is no need to add comments of how bad Seth is over and over again etc. Everything is over now. Everyone knows what has to know and everyone can make his own decisions now. Lets move on. Always IMHO.
Posted By: galadriel Re: why did she leave me?? - 13/06/05 05:26 PM
Quote
Lets leave Seth alone...how would any of us enjoy being publicly painted...


I'm very sorry to say, Nero, but what would you have done if you met someone like him, a manipulator that uses his internetknowledge to hurt others that are innocent and naieve? You must look at this like a trial, Lynn is the judge here and we are all witnesses, victims or jury.
Don't defend the criminal here, Nero, remember the power of Galadriel <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

Once this is all over we can return to peace, friendship, trust and fun here!
Let's now celebrate our new Queen of Justice Lucretia!!!!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/party.gif" alt="" /> (At least if she accepts <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> )
Posted By: elgi Re: why did she leave me?? - 13/06/05 05:29 PM
Quote
You must look at this like a trial, Lynn is the judge here and we are all witnesses, victims or jury.
Don't defend the criminal here, Nero, remember the power of Galadriel <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/biggrin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

Well, if it is like a jury, the accused has the right of a defense. So, one must be able to defend the accused (not criminal). <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: NeroJB Re: why did she leave me?? - 13/06/05 05:39 PM
Im not defending anyone and I have nothing personal against Seth its just that I think enough is enough...besides your feeble elf powers dont frighten me...anymore (I changed my pants!)
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 13/06/05 07:17 PM
Please people be careful, do not make this thread one more battlefield. I know you are teasing each other but still I am not sure Lynn would like the "judge" role very much.

Hm... this thread starts to smell "bad" if you know what I mean... I puke, Nero changed his pants... [Linked Image]

*Luc is trying to be funny because she is so serious lately*
Posted By: AlrikFassbauer Re: why did she leave me?? - 13/06/05 09:04 PM
So let's just move on ... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

(Letting this topic stay open for ... )

Alrik.
Posted By: galadriel Re: why did she leave me?? - 13/06/05 11:11 PM
Quote
So, one must be able to defend the accused (not criminal).

That is what I ment Elgi, the accused. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Barta Re: why did she leave me?? - 13/06/05 11:40 PM
Quote
Quote
So, one must be able to defend the accused (not criminal).

That is what I ment Elgi, the accused. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

Yep i agree Seth has the right to be helped and defended.
If i had a problem i would like that one of my forum friends could help me.
Who will be Seth's advocate ?

Barta
Posted By: LewsTherinKinslayer13 Re: why did she leave me?? - 14/06/05 12:25 AM
I'll do it, if I can be one of those lawyers who thinks his client is guilty. If I can, I will be. I think he's guilty, but no reason for us to ban him or anything. Just warn him, and tell him to not to do it anymore. If he does, ban him then.
Posted By: LaFille Re: why did she leave me?? - 14/06/05 01:23 AM
I agree with Nero, Elgi, Alrik and Lucretia; try to keep this thread on facts instead of fermenting opinions. There is no point in adding anything as long as there's nothing new.
And remember that you're supposed to do that so that it doesn't happen anymore, not for the perverse pleasure of hitting back the one who've hit you, gaining sympathy or spend time. Enough is enough, get over it and don't stay stuck on that. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />

@Lews
Of course you can defend an accused even when you think he/she's guilty; after all, an advocate may provide his services for anyone that pays for. And that offer honors you, by the way; thinking that someone is guilty doesn't imply acting towards him/her as you'd act with trash.

But I don't think that "trial" vision of things is a good thing at all. Everyone here speaks, acts and thinks by himself; if there are measures to be taken, then it's to Lynn to decide and act. No jury neither advocate things are appropriate, imho.
Posted By: Barta Re: why did she leave me?? - 14/06/05 01:50 AM
@ Lafille

Lews just gave his opinion exactely like you gave your opinion.

Quote
And remember that you're supposed to do that so that it doesn't happen anymore

Don't dream too much, it will happen again.


It is my last post in this topic.

Barta
Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 14/06/05 06:30 AM
Quote

Who will be Seth's advocate ?


The devil? oh that's the other way around...

on more serious note, yes seth should be able to defend himself and should do so, his absence only confirms the accusions, not coming back will label him the way he's remembered now, without any possibility to redeem himself.
Posted By: LewsTherinKinslayer13 Re: why did she leave me?? - 25/06/05 10:13 PM
Just bringing this back. Seth contacted me today via MSN.

In case anyone wants to read it:



Quote
guy4cuty says:
hey lews
Idiot Savant #2 says:
Haven't seen you on for a while.
guy4cuty says:
I seenforum
Idiot Savant #2 says:
Pretty much mauled.
guy4cuty says:
you believe that?
guy4cuty says:
lol
Idiot Savant #2 says:
Do I believe what? What they said.
Idiot Savant #2 says:
?
guy4cuty says:
I seen
Idiot Savant #2 says:
What do you think?
guy4cuty says:
actually
guy4cuty says:
not being there anymore
guy4cuty says:
is load of my shoulders
guy4cuty says:
and all "new women" still pm
Idiot Savant #2 says:
I'm sure they do.
guy4cuty says:
no matter what kita says
guy4cuty says:
lol
guy4cuty says:
think bro
Idiot Savant #2 says:
Your typing is off Seth, are you drunk?
guy4cuty says:
lol
guy4cuty says:
typical
guy4cuty says:
just happy
guy4cuty says:
your friend kiya claims she's not a member
guy4cuty says:
but strangely
guy4cuty says:
kept a log about set
guy4cuty says:
strangely
guy4cuty says:
warned all women about seth
guy4cuty says:
very strange
guy4cuty says:
if you don't care about the guy
guy4cuty says:
pretty obsessive
guy4cuty says:
even stalking
guy4cuty says:
lol
guy4cuty says:
but I don't mind
guy4cuty says:
glad to be rit of all stupid members
Idiot Savant #2 says:
mhm
guy4cuty says:
ask bernhard, bigclaw, ladysarah, Fille
guy4cuty says:
all
Idiot Savant #2 says:
What about them?
guy4cuty says:
I have prove enough
guy4cuty says:
just
guy4cuty says:
won't return
guy4cuty says:
let kiya enjoy it
Idiot Savant #2 says:
I think they will.
guy4cuty says:
next male victim will reaxt
guy4cuty says:
prolly
Idiot Savant #2 says:
Since no one liked you it seems.
guy4cuty says:
after that
guy4cuty says:
lol
guy4cuty says:
but pm's they still did
guy4cuty says:
that's why I'm so happy to leave
guy4cuty says:
bunch of lieing good for nothing jerks
Idiot Savant #2 says:
Yep.
Idiot Savant #2 says:
Why were you ever there if you didn't like everyone?
guy4cuty says:
tried to help
guy4cuty says:
even lynn lied
guy4cuty says:
about Barta
Idiot Savant #2 says:
What about Barta?
guy4cuty says:
nm
Idiot Savant #2 says:
What about Barta and Lynn?
guy4cuty says:
if you stay on that forum
guy4cuty says:
be you
guy4cuty says:
and don't get involved
guy4cuty says:
with nothing
Idiot Savant #2 says:
Well, I think they're both better people then you are.
guy4cuty says:
lol
guy4cuty says:
ty
Idiot Savant #2 says:
Its not a compliment.
Idiot Savant #2 says:
You aren't even an Idiot Savant Just an idiot who got fun from messing with people.
Idiot Savant #2 says:
Once I thought you were a decent person.
guy4cuty says:
see
guy4cuty says:
there you go
guy4cuty says:
looking for the obvious
Idiot Savant #2 says:
You saying they all lied about you? Ha
guy4cuty says:
but not reeding between lines
guy4cuty says:
all?
guy4cuty says:
who ?
Idiot Savant #2 says:
The people on the forum.
guy4cuty says:
it's just a few
Idiot Savant #2 says:
who
guy4cuty says:
the ones I told truth about
Idiot Savant #2 says:
why would they lie about you.
guy4cuty says:
the others said nothing
guy4cuty says:
becouse they don't like me telling thruth?
Idiot Savant #2 says:
So you said the truth and the 'liers' all didn't like that.
Idiot Savant #2 says:
I see.
guy4cuty says:
talk to all who never reacted
guy4cuty says:
and really
guy4cuty says:
I don't care
guy4cuty says:
just talking to you outside forum
guy4cuty says:
you think and do as you please
guy4cuty says:
but you been there
guy4cuty says:
remember dragon and kiya and me
guy4cuty says:
lol
guy4cuty says:
think as you please
guy4cuty says:
bye bye


My sumary: [nocando].
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 26/06/05 09:39 AM
my comments :
You are the Idiot Servant Lews?
1. you are not an idiot.
2. you are not a servant also.
3. I need my bucket again cause I am going to be sick.
4. Alcohol is not good for you. I know you do not drink but still I HAVE to write it just in case... Now that I come to think of it... internet is not good also. Very dangerous people in it.
5. I LIKE Kiya period.
6. Barta ALWAYS says the truth. No matter what.
7. No other comments from me.

Luc -> Really, really pissed off <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/memad.gif" alt="" />

Edit : Don't f*@$# mess with Bernhard <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/memad.gif" alt="" /> (Sorry Lynn).
Still and more pissed off
Posted By: Ubereil Re: why did she leave me?? - 26/06/05 01:26 PM
Quote
4. Alcohol is not good for you. I know you do not drink but still I HAVE to write it just in case... Now that I come to think of it... internet is not good also. Very dangerous people in it.


And remember not to cross the street. There are some dangerous pepole with drivers licenses out there. And don't eat, you might get foodpoisoned.

Übereil
Posted By: Lynx Re: why did she leave me?? - 26/06/05 02:46 PM
And don´t breath, there is too much pollution in the air ! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Immortal Re: why did she leave me?? - 26/06/05 02:50 PM
I must say - Wow.

I was bored so I read the whole topic..made popcorn and some soda..

I can't bother to post my reaction right now because It would be like 2 pages long..

Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 26/06/05 03:05 PM
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4. Alcohol is not good for you. I know you do not drink but still I HAVE to write it just in case... Now that I come to think of it... internet is not good also. Very dangerous people in it.


And remember not to cross the street. There are some dangerous pepole with drivers licenses out there. And don't eat, you might get foodpoisoned.

Übereil


Knock it off Ube ok?
Jesus what did you wanted me to say to Lews? Well done, drinking is good, go on take an example from Seth? He was talking with someone who was drunk in the ICQ for crying out loud! Of course it is everyone's decision what he/she is going to do with their life but I have to tell, you know? And if this sounds funny to you, well then allow me to wish you NEVER know the results that alcohol can bring to someone's life.
Luc pissed off with Ube too
Posted By: Ubereil Re: why did she leave me?? - 26/06/05 04:18 PM
I just think he realized that by himself. I'm fully aware of what alcohol can do to people in general, that's why I don't drink. And about Seth, it felt pretty much like he was just hitting air with his accusations. And at least now it's settled, he is kind of guilty (or maybe Kiya and Gal is lying <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/think.gif" alt="" />...). At least that's settled.

Übereil
Posted By: LewsTherinKinslayer13 Re: why did she leave me?? - 26/06/05 07:30 PM
Ube, you want to shut the [nocando] up about Kiya and Gal right now?


Luc, Idiot Savant. Someone with below average intelligence, eh, spelled right, but very good at some things.

Thank you for your comments Luc. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Ubereil Re: why did she leave me?? - 26/06/05 08:16 PM
Lews, don't ye worry, I was just kidding. As allways, no offence meant.

Übereil
Posted By: AlrikFassbauer Re: why did she leave me?? - 26/06/05 09:23 PM
Übereil, maybe you should include more smileys ? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Ubereil Re: why did she leave me?? - 26/06/05 10:30 PM
Smilies are for whuses!

Übereil
Posted By: LUCRETIA Re: why did she leave me?? - 27/06/05 01:18 PM
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Ube, you want to shut the [nocando] up about Kiya and Gal right now?


Luc, Idiot Savant. Someone with below average intelligence, eh, spelled right, but very good at some things.

Thank you for your comments Luc. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

Um... yes Lews I have spelled it wrong sorry. You are not a Savant anyway <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Oh and don't mention it. You are so cute <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/kissyou.gif" alt="" />

Oh and Ube.... I am whuse <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin1.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin1.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin1.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin1.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin1.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin1.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/evilgrin1.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 27/06/05 01:45 PM
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mage.gif" alt="" /> the wise man would have shut up to anyone instead of claiming It's all lies ask ********** <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mage.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: NeroJB Re: why did she leave me?? - 27/06/05 02:08 PM
<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/ROFL.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Viper Re: why did she leave me?? - 29/06/05 01:46 PM
just read the log... it late I know.. man that's 1 screwed up man... seriously, he needs psychological help... the way he keeps on rambling about himself, ...

wow, it's deep with that guy... even then he tried to set people up with lies.. what a twisted sick bas**rd
Posted By: Lynn Re: why did she leave me?? - 29/06/05 02:07 PM
Can I close this thread? I don't know if anybody still wants to add something here?... Things are clear, if you ask me.
I'll leave the thread open till the end of the week and then close it.
Posted By: Stone Re: why did she leave me?? - 29/06/05 02:53 PM
I think everything is said, the only thing who can follow is that the opinions in the Forum are going into new differences.
The reaktions of some jokes show how deep the feeling of some members are hurted, and so, i think, it is the best to close this thread.
And this is not a judgement about the jokes, i will not say that they are bad, or not bad. The only thing is that they are not appropriately here in this thread.

At last i hope that this will never happen again, and if, that all the involved Members say it open again like this time <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />



Posted By: galadriel Re: why did she leave me?? - 29/06/05 08:32 PM
I agree to close this thread, but Lynn should also expel Setharmon from the forum, like she promised. As you can see, Lynn, he is not interested anymore. He should be banned of this forum.

I also wanna use this thread once more, to thank all of you guys, who believed in me, it was hard to believe and for some, very dubious too, but thanks again.
Also wanna thank Kiya, for having the courage to tell her story, thank you Viper, for being the pillar in all this, to those that don't like their names said out loud, thank you all very much, you gave me and Kiya, and the rest of the girls, who got victimized by Setharmon the strength for this. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/kissyou.gif" alt="" />

@ Lynn
Now you can close this thread. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Jurak Re: why did she leave me?? - 29/06/05 09:42 PM
Wait, I wanna have the last word,
I think [color:"pink"]ALL you girls here in this Forum rock[/color],
and in future if ever a situation like this arises again....
call the big green one....... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/stupid.gif" alt="" />

and I'll squash him like a pea! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/badsmile2.gif" alt="" />


<img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />


O.K. Now you can close this thread! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: spick Re: why did she leave me?? - 30/06/05 12:06 AM
Lynn can i press the button?...Oh go on P L E A S E. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/kissyou.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Draghermosran Re: why did she leave me?? - 30/06/05 06:25 AM
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[color:"pink"]ALL you girls here in this Forum rock[/color]


couldn't agree more
Posted By: jvb Re: why did she leave me?? - 30/06/05 10:51 AM
Allow me, as one of the elder members of this forum, to give my opinion. I have to say I didn't read everything, since it's quite a lot <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/rolleyes.gif" alt="" />
But I remember coming on this board, which had a great atmosphere.
I'm sure many of you don't even know or remember it, but a long time ago, this forum got a new layout, that was just after I joined.
Seth had been a respected member for a long time then.
I don't see why he would have changed so much, aren't we overexxagerating a little bit?
When I peeked back on this forum after being away for a long time, seeing many old friends were still around.. He was the ONLY one who pmmed me, asked how I was doing and made me feel welcome again.
I did not feel anything bad or 'evil' coming from him.
And if someone wants to leave the forum, like seth said he had done.. then it's in my opinion unneccesairy (sp?) to ban him also, don't see the need for that one.

1 other point I have: pmming and chatting is completely PRIVATE. I would be really upset if someone would start to post their conversations with me on the net. Or our pms.
It's a circle of trust which you break when you do that.
No matter what seth said in his msn conversation with lews, I feel like it shouldn't have been put online!

Just to be clear, I am not taking sides or anything.
I have just been away for a while, to come back and see that 1 of my old friends is totally being, well, vomited over.

I hope you people can understand that no matter what seth did, I feel a bit sorry for him.

I hope this post is not too unclear, I graduated not to long ago and I have been partying almost everyday since then <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/party.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Viper Re: why did she leave me?? - 30/06/05 11:08 AM
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1 other point I have: pmming and chatting is completely PRIVATE. I would be really upset if someone would start to post their conversations with me on the net. Or our pms.
It's a circle of trust which you break when you do that.


that's not true, it's also about sharing necessary info with others so that everybody knows what he's like. it wasn't a private conversation imho, it was an outing of what kind of person he is and that shouldn't have been kept private.

sharing conversation about truly private things is another thing, but this is harmless and informative
Posted By: jvb Re: why did she leave me?? - 30/06/05 11:10 AM
judging from all of your posts, you all exactly know what seth is like, so the posting of the msn conversation wouldn't be needed anymore.
Posted By: Ubereil Re: why did she leave me?? - 30/06/05 11:46 AM
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judging from all of your posts, you all exactly know what seth is like, so the posting of the msn conversation wouldn't be needed anymore.


Oh, but the MSN conversation proved it <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />. Now we don't have to speculate anymore.

Oh, and wellcome back <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wave.gif" alt="" />!

Übereil
Posted By: NeroJB Re: why did she leave me?? - 30/06/05 02:45 PM
Enough!! the term beating a dead horse comes to mind...No matter how a person acts one trial is enough, Lynn for the love of God please close this thread.

Posted By: Jurak Re: why did she leave me?? - 30/06/05 05:49 PM
how about beating a live mouse.... [Linked Image]


Thanks K, for that one! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
Posted By: Lynn Re: why did she leave me?? - 30/06/05 06:38 PM
I was about to close it down anyway, but one day sooner doesn't harm.

Amen <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/winkwink.gif" alt="" />
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