Larian Studios
I finally bought Divinity 2: Dragon Knight Saga after seeing it go on special on Steam and also that the DRM (SecuRom *spit*) was removed (yay, Larian!).

Well, truth be told, I first bought the Anthology on GOG and THEN saw it was on special on Steam. And then three hours into it, I went a little crazy and bought it up for a small army too.

Long story short: I love Divinity 2 (and loved Divine and Beyond Divinity as well).

But I was expecting an epic saga that would last "100+ hours." 35-hours later and I'm done with the Ego Draconis portion of the game and I did everything.

I would be merrily raging away in Flames of Vengeance right now, but unfortunately I get the 'black screen of death' immediately after the cutscene; so I can't carry my character over and I really have no intention of starting Flames of Vengeance with a new character.

But I was wondering... How long did it take you guys to finish Divinity 2: Dragon Knight Saga?

35-hours is really sad

Some people had a problem entering FoV which could be resolved by updating an audio codec.

[PC] Support FAQ - The Dragon Knight Saga


What difficulty level are you playing on? That can make a significant different.

Anyone Played For 100 Hours?
Apparently (as in, according to the conversation log) 30 hours for ED and 10 for FoV. Strange, I thought it was longer than that: if I'd been asked without checking, I'd have said up to twice as much! I think I padded it out a bit with my adventure into modding the game a bit (I mean in addition to the time I mentioned), and I imagine in my first play-through I probably played a bit longer as I explored everywhere probably multiple times. Even though there was still stuff I missed, as it turns out.
According to Steam counter, Ego Draconis 84 hours and DKS with trying to find everything 107 hours. Some of that time may have been when the game was sat on the menu screen whilst I answered the phone, made some food etc and came back to it later.

Yeah, Steam's not very intelligent about counting game time, I've found: I thought I'd clocked up some surprising playing times until I realised it even counted the time it was sat minimised overnight, which you'd think it would check for...

The time in the conversation log may not reflect the actual playtime. At least in the Xbox version there was a bug with some of the cutscenes which could be triggered if an excessive amount of playtime was taken to get to that point (40 hours to get to the battle tower, for example). The solution (at least with MS' very restrictive patch policies in the Xbox) was to change how the game kept track of time.
Originally Posted by Raze

Some people had a problem entering FoV which could be resolved by updating an audio codec.

[PC] Support FAQ - The Dragon Knight Saga


What difficulty level are you playing on? That can make a significant different.

Anyone Played For 100 Hours?


Thanks, Raze, but yeah, I spent about two hours last night trying to get it to work and Googling myself silly. I've tried updating the codecs and pretty much every other solution I could come across... Nothing helped frown

I always play games at normal difficulty. I figure it's "as the devs intended."

Originally Posted by Vometia
Apparently (as in, according to the conversation log) 30 hours for ED and 10 for FoV. Strange, I thought it was longer than that: if I'd been asked without checking, I'd have said up to twice as much! I think I padded it out a bit with my adventure into modding the game a bit (I mean in addition to the time I mentioned), and I imagine in my first play-through I probably played a bit longer as I explored everywhere probably multiple times. Even though there was still stuff I missed, as it turns out.


I like to think of myself as a completionist of sorts. I like to enjoy games, explore every nook and cranny, chat up every NPC, kill everything in sight, etc and clear my quest log before proceeding with main quests.

I have no idea how much more time Flames of Vengeance would add, but I've read marketing gobbledygook claiming that it adds 20-hours of content. Assuming I believe that, it will still only bring my total playtime to 55-hours.

I'm still really hoping I can figure out why I can't get Flames of Vengeance to work... Bloody irritating.

Originally Posted by Arokh
According to Steam counter, Ego Draconis 84 hours and DKS with trying to find everything 107 hours. Some of that time may have been when the game was sat on the menu screen whilst I answered the phone, made some food etc and came back to it later.



haha... Yeah, I'm terribly anal about my game time. If I have to go AFK, I quit. I like those statistics to be as accurate and as relevant to me as possible (long live OCD!).

85-hours is good though. I'd be happy with 85-hours for a single playthrough.

I think my biggest gripe is that I was expecting so much more content only to sort of... feel like it ran out much too soon.

I really loved Divinity 2 though. I was amazed by what Larian did with it. It still felt like the original Divine Divinity, that same "old school" RPG feel, the same humour (I loved the existential skeletons reference :D). And while it felt unbelievably short, the amount of padding, polish and content in every area was fantastic.

I loved talking to NPCs, I loved the mindreading ability, I loved the combat. I WANT MORE, DAMNIT!

Originally Posted by Vometia
Yeah, Steam's not very intelligent about counting game time, I've found: I thought I'd clocked up some surprising playing times until I realised it even counted the time it was sat minimised overnight, which you'd think it would check for...


Steam tracks time like every other game tracker out there (Raptr, XFire, etc) and simply tracks how long the process (i.e. Divinity2.exe) runs. Which is essentially the best effort such a service can do.

Its accuracy, however, depends largely on you and alt-tabbing/minimising certainly doesn't end the process :p
Originally Posted by Lycanthrope
I have no idea how much more time Flames of Vengeance would add, but I've read marketing gobbledygook claiming that it adds 20-hours of content. Assuming I believe that, it will still only bring my total playtime to 55-hours.

I'm not sure if the 10 hours my chat log suggests is correct (I'm on the PC, for the record) but it certainly felt like a decent expansion. I mean as opposed to those for certain other games I won't mention. laugh

Good luck getting it to work. smile

Originally Posted by Lycanthrope
Steam tracks time like every other game tracker out there (Raptr, XFire, etc) and simply tracks how long the process (i.e. Divinity2.exe) runs. Which is essentially the best effort such a service can do.

Its accuracy, however, depends largely on you and alt-tabbing/minimising certainly doesn't end the process :p

True, the only way Steam would know otherwise is if the application actually tells it it's in a menu or something, and I'm not even sure there's a mechanism for doing that; I thought it might be able to tell if the game's not even running in the foreground, though...
Originally Posted by Vometia
I'm not sure if the 10 hours my chat log suggests is correct (I'm on the PC, for the record) but it certainly felt like a decent expansion. I mean as opposed to those for certain other games I won't mention. laugh

Good luck getting it to work. smile


Thanks. I keep trying but it keeps black-screening me smirk

I think I'll probably just have to start over with a new character in the end, but I'll have to work myself up for that. Right now the idea of a "new character" bugs me after all the TLC I gave my proper one (who happens to have hit level 37, in case anyone was wondering).

Also, I don't doubt that it's a decent expansion. I'm really looking forward to it. I'm just all frustrated out about the black screen issue right now.

Will probably get around to it soon enough. I must find out what happens next! laugh

On a semi-related note, I'm actually pretty surprised that Larian is going back to isometric after this one. They did a really fantastic job and I have to admit that I hoped that they'd keep at it.

What I was trying to say earlier (but my train of thought totally ended up derailed) is that I found it amazing what Larian did with Divinity 2.

To elaborate, if you look at many old isometric games that become "modernised" they lose a lot of their charm because of all sorts of excuses hinging mostly off of the fact that they're too resource intensive.

But Larian still kept the feel of the original Divinity in Divinity 2. I love that. And the best part is that they're largely an "unknown" developer and certainly not a triple-A developer (not the same marketing or development budget) but they have by large pulled off a triple-A quality title and that in itself is astounding.

It really makes you look at developers like BioWare and wonder... They have a massive budget (we're talking in excess of $10,000,000 USD here) and most of that goes to paying "famous" voice actors, composers, etc and the cost is that the games are far less detailed and have far less content than that same amount of money would otherwise have bought.

My point is that I just found it so breath-taking that Divinity 2 managed to be so detailed and still managed to keep that nostalgic feel of its predecessors without sacrificing too much. Sure, you can argue that the world was much smaller than it could've been and that it was far shorter than its predecessors but they did so much with what they had.

Apart from my infuriating end-game bug, I really am hugely impressed with Divinity 2. As an old school gamer, it really managed to give me that special "I can't put this down!" feeling that I crave. Which is why I went on a "MUST BUY IT FOR EVERYONE" spree that my bank account now totally regrets laugh

Oh well... I'm just in a rant mode. I want more. Lots more.
I agree with pretty much everything you say there. I think there's a certain nostalgic view of isometric games which has brought them back into vogue; I'm not sure how much of a good idea it is when considering the average gamer, but I think that's the thing about Larian, they're not afraid to take risks, which is why their games work so well, I think. There's been a few major-league AAA releases in the past year where the developer (or publisher) has played it a bit too safe and I think they've suffered as a result. I'd rather see more companies do what Larian does even if it means that not everything is to my personal taste.

Divinity 2 does have a real sort of "handmade" charm to it which is why I think I've enjoyed it so much and it hasn't become old and tired with multiple play-throughs. They also have a really good attitude to their customers: how many of the big developers can you email about a particular problem you've found and have someone get back to you quickly with an idea, a solution and sometimes even a patch?
Originally Posted by Vometia
I agree with pretty much everything you say there. I think there's a certain nostalgic view of isometric games which has brought them back into vogue; I'm not sure how much of a good idea it is when considering the average gamer, but I think that's the thing about Larian, they're not afraid to take risks, which is why their games work so well, I think. There's been a few major-league AAA releases in the past year where the developer (or publisher) has played it a bit too safe and I think they've suffered as a result. I'd rather see more companies do what Larian does even if it means that not everything is to my personal taste.

I completely agree with you.

I'm very sad that I didn't support Divinity 2 from day one, but when I see "SecuRom" I switch off to a game completely; same thing happened with every single one of Ubisoft's games when they tried to force permanent internet connectivity. Screw that. I refuse to be treated like a bloody criminal >.<'

See? This is how I go off on a tangent.

I like risks, I like "new" and I like "original." I miss the days of gems like Planescape: Torment. The ones that have so much spirit, charm and "specialness" to them.

Divinity 2 really had that for me, it's really "up there" in terms of games I have a soft spot for.

Quote
Divinity 2 does have a real sort of "handmade" charm to it which is why I think I've enjoyed it so much and it hasn't become old and tired with multiple play-throughs. They also have a really good attitude to their customers: how many of the big developers can you email about a particular problem you've found and have someone get back to you quickly with an idea, a solution and sometimes even a patch?


That it does. I don't know if I'll replay it any time soon. I did everything there was to do and explored every nook and cranny. Well, I lie, I missed the bit with the white bunny and the creature mage in Broken Valley (my significant other was kind enough to point that out for me :p).

But it'll be a while before I replay it. I have to admit that it doesn't strike me as having much replayability in the sense that the content is unlikely to change significantly depending on your choices. It'll definitely be a game I play again though, just not any time soon.

Put it this way, as long as Larian keeps their DRM in future games limited to Steam (gimme Steam achievements!) I'll be happy to support them from day one every time smile
Originally Posted by Raze


I just saw this now. Woops... I didn't realise that there was a Dragon Knight Saga section...

In my defence, my head is totally in the clouds lately -.-'
Originally Posted by Lycanthrope
Originally Posted by Raze


I just saw this now. Woops... I didn't realise that there was a Dragon Knight Saga section...

In my defence, my head is totally in the clouds lately -.-'



No problem hug

You're welcome wink
Originally Posted by Joram
Originally Posted by Lycanthrope
Originally Posted by Raze


I just saw this now. Woops... I didn't realise that there was a Dragon Knight Saga section...

In my defence, my head is totally in the clouds lately -.-'



No problem hug

You're welcome wink


Thanks smile

GUESS WHAT?!

It worked! It took four-billion tries and I can pretty much recite the end cutscene by heart but it finally went through and loaded up Flames of Vengeance!

I'm back, baby!

WOOHOO!

Will be back to vote when I'm done. Here's hoping it'll be a long while laugh

Congratulations. party

I was going to offer to try your save when D2:DC is released in a couple days, if you hadn't gotten it resolved.
For those who are interested in keeping track of how much time you are spending on a particular game, I use a freeware program called Manic Time that's easy to use and keeps track of everything you do on your computer. It provides a detailed breakdown of time spent on every application, document, etc.

When I compare my times as recorded in Steam as opposed to the actual times recorded by the time tracker I find that Steam is not accurate but not that far off either. Steam says my time spent on my 2nd playthrough of DKS is 120 hours, actually it's 117 hours. In both cases that includes time AFK.
Honestly, it felt a little short for me but for good reason.

It made me look forward for the sequel, and I was DESPERATE for a sequel after such a horrifyingly awesome ending.



I think it took me about 40-50 hours for my first playthrough... (Ego Draconis, not including Flames of Vengeance.)
Oh, and I think it also depends on how you play, difficulty level, how much time you spend just bouncing mindlessly all over the place, etc.

I can finish the game much quicker with my original mage build or dark-knight build, but since I began with a tank this time, it is proving to be quite the hell during the very early stages of the game, yet slowly gets easier and easier as I become more and more invincible. Who knows how long it'll take me this time.
I seriously doubt you did "everything" in only 35 hours. I've played this game 4 times, for a total of 332 hours, and it took about 60 hours each time for me to do everything. Plus, almost every quest has more than one solution, so there is definitely more than 100 hours worth of game here.
Originally Posted by Stabbey
almost every quest has more than one solution, so there is definitely more than 100 hours worth of game here.




Yes, definitely. This is one of the things that makes the game awesome.
I voted +101 hours !
I'm totally sure I spend +120 hours to become a L45 hero (FoV ending) ... !
But it was worth my time ... smile

Okay, I always take my time and each new level I now do my TTTTT : a Trading Tour of the Ten Thousand Traders hahaha
I remember starting the game, do the TTTTT I was busy for 1 hour playtime checking all the merchants inventories ! That was long, I know, but I was "learning" how to travel & teleporting the best way to make a TTTCTTT, or : Travel Teleporting Trading Circle of the Then Thousand Traders smile
But at least I spend many hours (minimum 20 min each level X 45 = 15 hour) doing my TNT (Trading Navigation Tour) during a whole playthrough

Can you still follow ?
@OP

35 hours is good for an RPG and you are getting your money's worth for that. FOV might should another 10-15 hours onto that and that will give you either 45-50 hours of gameplay which is typical of most RPG's. Still, when the back-cover is saying "one hundred hours" then you expect one hundred hours. However I guess Larian said that statement based on the average finish time of testers and based on the comments in thread, most people got 100 hours out of the game in one play-through. I guess me and you are just faster at games than other people.

Divinity 2 isn't the only game I've played where I've beat it quicker than the time it's said to last for. Dragon's Dogma was supposed to be a 200 hour game and I beat it in 70 hours. Dragon Age: Origins was supposed to be a 70 hour game and I beat it in 30 hours first go (my quickest time is 17 hours).

I've learned to realize that when someone says "100 hours in content" it's either 40 or 30 for me. Difficulty does increase the time though. Halo games on normal difficulty are around 7-8 hours long first go. Play on Legendary and each level will take around 1-2 hours giving you 15-17 hours in total by the end. I think my nightmare difficulty playthrough of DKS will end at the counter of 55 hours (as opposed to the 38 hours I got on normal difficulty first go but it should be noted that I had previously played through the original game - before DKS - twice and thus I knew how everything could be done).
I suppose I'm surprised that it only took me 30 hours to do the ED component: it felt longer, and I'm not normally a very fast player since getting side-tracked and trying to find new secret things is what I do. Maybe the times on the chat log just weren't very accurate. DA:O for instance I found myself getting nearly 100 hours out of; FO3 was typically about 200 hours, Oblivion over 300.

Actually, Larian was more conservative, with their official estimates as 40 and 20 hours for D2:ED and FoV. The publisher went with a (still reasonable) 100 hour estimate.
I don't get it... I spent 100 hours or so with DKS. Maybe i tried to unblock as many content as possible..., but I never tried hard to do it. 35 hours... wow, you probably rushed your way in laugh
I don't get it either. It took me a little over 100 hours for the base game both times,first on normal then on Hard, as opposed to around 80 hours for DA:O and FO:NV, and around 50 hours for ME2 and FO3. There are around 70 side quests in the base game, some with alternative outcomes. Remember there are "wanted" boards where you can pick up long lists of bad guys to track down, and your enchanter, alchemist, etc., all give quests. I think the people who are saying they did it in around 35 hours may have missed a few things. Maybe on casual, but it's difficult to see it on higher levels. Either way, rushing through it kind of seems to defeat the purpose of an RPG.

Originally Posted by DocSmith59
I don't get it either. It took me a little over 100 hours for the base game both times,first on normal then on Hard, as opposed to around 80 hours for DA:O and FO:NV, and around 50 hours for ME2 and FO3. There are around 70 side quests in the base game, some with alternative outcomes. Remember there are "wanted" boards where you can pick up long lists of bad guys to track down, and your enchanter, alchemist, etc., all give quests. I think the people who are saying they did it in around 35 hours may have missed a few things. Maybe on casual, but it's difficult to see it on higher levels. Either way, rushing through it kind of seems to defeat the purpose of an RPG.

I'm my case, I did every quest I could find, including those you mentioned, as well as a fair bit of exploration (edit: "a fair bit" meaning wandering everywhere I could find often multiple times!) I specifically dislike rushing games, so I can only guess that the quest log's counter was a bit off.

Edit 2: in fact I'm certain it is. No way did I do FoV in just 10 hours: probably over twice that.
I just think ...
I love the skill "Rush Attack" ...
But I don't love "rushing" through the Dragon Knight Saga ...
(and none of the RPG's I play)


How funny contradictory grin
Originally Posted by Raze

Congratulations. party

I was going to offer to try your save when D2:DC is released in a couple days, if you hadn't gotten it resolved.


Thanks, Raze smile

Originally Posted by Stabbey
I seriously doubt you did "everything" in only 35 hours. I've played this game 4 times, for a total of 332 hours, and it took about 60 hours each time for me to do everything. Plus, almost every quest has more than one solution, so there is definitely more than 100 hours worth of game here.


Well I just finished the game (including Flames of Vengeance) and clocked 45-hours.

You're welcome to doubt as much as you like but that's a fact: I did everything that there was to do, I explored every nook and cranny, cleared my quest log, mindread every NPC I could possibly mindread and finished with a level-47 character.

I don't know what you guys who got more than 50-hours out of it spent so much time doing in one playthrough but it certainly wasn't playing laugh

I'm waiting for my significant other to finish, then we'll compare. We're both heavy RPG fans and we are both completionists.

Originally Posted by Joram
I just think ...
I love the skill "Rush Attack" ...
But I don't love "rushing" through the Dragon Knight Saga ...
(and none of the RPG's I play)


How funny contradictory grin


Haha laugh Well, my build was very spell-heavy. I tend to play as close to a summoning/pet class as possible and that's what I did for the most part. Had my beloved creature as a mage, the demon spell, fireball and magic missle for most of the game. Towards the end I used fire wall a bit but it wasn't much use and I only grabbed it because there wasn't anything else I felt I needed or wanted (at this point pretty much everything useful--mindread, mana conservation, lockpick, demon, fireball, magic missile--were all at 15 or their max equivalent.)

As I said, I have no idea how some of you managed to get so much more time out of it than I did but c'est la vie.

The ending was great and I really loved Divinity 2. Fantastic game and I look forward to what Larian does next laugh
Originally Posted by Joram
I just think ...
I love the skill "Rush Attack" ...
But I don't love "rushing" through the Dragon Knight Saga ...
(and none of the RPG's I play)


How funny contradictory grin


Just finished my second playthrough, on Hard, 128 hours total, about 108 for the base game and about 20 hours for FoV. I don't like rushing either. I'm a real tourist, wandering around looking at scenery, taking pictures, checking out eyerything in the shops, trying to get Kirill to play Rambler from Slavs just one more time. If there was a place in Riwellon where I could buy t-shirts and little flags for my pack, maybe little souvenir statuettes, that would be great. Thank you to everyone at Larian,I'm not a young guy and this has given me a lot of happy hours, which at my age is something special. biggrin
No really, you must have missed a lot of things to be done both Ego Draconis and Flames of Vengeance in 45 hours. I know where everything is (part of that was form beating Ego Draconis 3 times before DKS came out), so I didn't need to wander around looking aimlessly, and it takes me about 60 hours per playthrough.
Originally Posted by Stabbey
No really, you must have missed a lot of things to be done both Ego Draconis and Flames of Vengeance in 45 hours. I know where everything is (part of that was form beating Ego Draconis 3 times before DKS came out), so I didn't need to wander around looking aimlessly, and it takes me about 60 hours per playthrough.


Well unfortunately I have no idea how to prove it to you beyond the fact that I'm only missing maybe five secret achievements. Ask me and let's see if I've done it or not? smile

My next playthrough would likely be much shorter as well because I'd be skipping through most of the dialogue having read and heard it before.

The thing is that however you cut it, there's much less than 100+ hours of content I see marketed everywhere.
Originally Posted by Lycanthrope

Well unfortunately I have no idea how to prove it to you beyond the fact that I'm only missing maybe five secret achievements. Ask me and let's see if I've done it or not? smile




Do you know ... you can having a "free fall" without becoming a dragon yet ?
Do you know ... how to let appear the Amulet of Slantwig ?
Do you know ... finding & killing a Green Chicken you summon a Spider level 22 ? :hihi:
Do you know ... a dungeon where two sisters are in discussion with eachother ?
Do you know ... the password of the teleporter in Broken Valley, nearby the Chapel Scrine and their is another teleporter too ?
Do you know ... how to open the dungeon that is on the right side of the Chapel in Broken Valley Village ?
Just a small part of the many secrets ...

You really found all the secrets ?
I haven't fount all the achievements, Xbox version and still wonder which secret achievement I have to find, but I believe they're part of the add-on FoV I haven't played much because I always start again in Farglow with another hero grin ...

Conclusion:
Like I always say:
As long as you've Fun playing a game
You've reason to be happy,
No matter the way You play,
It's of course for nobody the same !
Originally Posted by Joram
Do you know ... you can having a "free fall" without becoming a dragon yet ?

I'm afraid I have no idea what you mean :p
Quote
Do you know ... how to let appear the Amulet of Slantwig ?

I do now, after looking it up but I never did that. I did, however, get the blood echelon shield from Naberius' Storage.
Quote
Do you know ... finding & killing a Green Chicken you summon a Spider level 22 ? :hihi:

Nope, I didn't know that.
Quote
Do you know ... a dungeon where two sisters are in discussion with eachother ?

Yes smile
Quote
Do you know ... the password of the teleporter in Broken Valley, nearby the Chapel Scrine and their is another teleporter too ?

This is the Bellegar one for Naberius' Storage? Then yes :p
Quote
Do you know ... how to open the dungeon that is on the right side of the Chapel in Broken Valley Village ?

This is the one to get to the Amulet of Slantwig? I was in there but as I say, never got the amulet :p

Quote
Just a small part of the many secrets ...


You really found all the secrets ?
I haven't fount all the achievements, Xbox version and still wonder which secret achievement I have to find, but I believe they're part of the add-on FoV I haven't played much because I always start again in Farglow with another hero grin ...

As I say, in my achievement list I'm missing about five "secret achievements." So I'm obviously missing some of the less obvious ones frown

Quote
Conclusion:
Like I always say:
As long as you've Fun playing a game
You've reason to be happy,
No matter the way You play,
It's of course for nobody the same !


I completely agree. Gaming is all about having fun and enjoying the experience and that is something Divinity 2 completely lives up to.

Which is precisely why I wish there was far more to it--I didn't want it to come to an end so quickly. But I loved it, and that's the important thing smile
Do you remember running to the Maxos Temple area (coming from the field where Lovis Tower is) a man named Bellegar appeared ? And what happened after he said his poetry words ?
But this only happens if you met Sosostra and let her read your future in the palm of your hand for 50 gold coins a few times ! wink

The Amulet of Slantwig with a skillboost +1 point to Rush Attack you can let appear in the dungeon right next to the Chapel Scrine . A book you can find there is called "Elvish Tales" & tells you more about the Amulet of Slantwig . But only after finding other Amulets and using one of them (Amulet of the East, West or South).

The dungeon nearby the Chapel in Broken Valley Village you only can go in IF you spare the drunken Seekers in the Black Boar Inn so you can persuade one of them in the Barracks afterwards so he tells you a "secret" about Louis ... love this dungeon, nice atmosphere with a secret room to discover !

Never seen a Level 22 Spider ?!?
LOL ... this was a "secret" joke of my ... I specially placed a " :hihi: " emoticon behind this "Do you know ..." wink

Have Fun with DKS ..
It's an Amazing Gem !





Originally Posted by Joram
Do you know ... a dungeon where two sisters are in discussion with eachother ?

Hmm, that one doesn't ring a bell. I'll probably kick myself when you say it, but where is it?

Edit: oh, just remembered:
the two sisters vying for Laiken's favour.


Originally Posted by Joram
Do you know ... the password of the teleporter in Broken Valley, nearby the Chapel Scrine and their is another teleporter too ?

I only just discovered the other teleporter on this play-through! And I thought I'd been over every inch of Broken Valley.

I also only recently discovered I can jump higher if I do backflips, which aids some further mostly pointless climbing-based exploration. Sadly, still unable to find my way to that frustratingly inaccessible chest sitting in the archway on Sentinel Island!
Hey Vometia,
I strongly believe the chest you mentioned on Sentinel Island is also accessible after you take over the Battle Tower ! You can fly as a dragon and don't be afraid of landing on all possible places that are "higher" walking on Sentinel Island in humanform earlier on !

If a place is ful of poisonous gaz I always fast run/jump and then immediately transform back into dragonform .

Good luck & enjoy your DKS time !
In my second playthrough I discovered a lot of stuff I overlooked the first time, like the area under the Miller's house and the location of the Doctor who cures Eugene/Clyde, the quest involving Sir Robin, Bellegar's "moral choices" cave, and a lot more. I also accidentally killed the chicken that NPC in Broken Valley got soul-forged with, which was kind of funny.I checked a few walkthroughs just to make sure I'd picked up all the quests, but there are a few things the walkthroughs don't include as quests, like the 3 sleepers. I also found that there are areas you can swim to around Sentinel Island and gather a lot of loot if you can deal with the wyverns.

But I see from some of the responses here that there may still be a few things I missed, so all the more reason to do another playthrough sometime. I don't think anyone can really say they've done it all, achievements or not, who hasn't actually played it quite a few times because how would you know ? It isn't all contained in the walkthroughs or in lists of achievements.

But mostly I think it's a difference of approach. It isn't supposed to be a competitive kind of game with online leadaerboards for best speed run through Orobas Fjords. On hard difficulty I got slowed down a lot by a few annoying boss fights, like Raze, and also because I experimented with my character. The only skill I increased past five was fireball and I only increased that to ten. And none of my weapons did more than around 350 damage. I felt that the game was not tactical enough in a lot of ways which seemed unusual for the kind of game it is, and there are other balance issues. So I made changes to make the combat more tactically challenging and tried to make my character more versatile to see if the game would support that, and it does, and that really made for some great battles, particularly the final battles in both ED and FoV.

But it all takes a lot longer than if you have level 15 fireball, Magic Missile, etc., and weapons that do great damage and that's how I eventually end up with a little over 100 hours in the base game, by experimenting then going back and making changes if things don't work out. I could still go back to any key point in may last playthrough and make any number of changes, or just start all over again from scratch.

So that's the difference between the two points of view here. There are obvious ways you can beat it fairly quickly, but I see it more as an interesting system that you can play around with and experiment with a lot and get a very different experience every time. It's up to the individual how he/she wants to play it. I don't really care about achivements, I'm more interested in exploring the overall design of the game, and what that tells me about the mindset of the people who made it.
Originally Posted by Vometia
Sadly, still unable to find my way to that frustratingly inaccessible chest sitting in the archway on Sentinel Island!


From DKS - Chest on Sentinel Island

Originally Posted by SauronSLO
I finally found the way to the chest. It's nothing special inside.

http://www.shrani.si/f/2V/7G/2W7WqDBK/waytothechest.jpg
That's something else I didn't know, along with the idea that you can kill Markthum and change back into a Dragon to kill the DTP. But it shouldn't be a surprise that there's nothing worthwhile in a chest. Nearly all the chests are only random loot if generic quality.
O yeah, I've listen & looked at the video that's just coming on the Newspage of LS side today ...
always find it very handy and good there is no "anti-dragon-zone" at the Dragon Cliff Castle ... but never thought deeper about it : to change into a dragon during that, indeed, very hard battle !!
So first killing Markthum ...and then, yes then ... :hihi: ... I really wish to try that next time ! grin
That battle involving Markthum and the others is bugged. Markthum does over 1600 damage per hit, which really doesn't make sense. He's so overpowered he makes Behrlinn and Ygerna look like a couple of imps. There's no reason for it, even doing half that damage he would still one-shot anyone, and there is no other character that does damage like that. I was more than six levels above him but it was still a time-consuming chokepoint. It's something I wished they had fixed, there's actually a few chokepoints like that. Zagan is also unusually tough and to beat him I had to fly up to the exit then shoot arrows for a long time. Small things they could have polished a little.

@Stabbey,

"you can kill Markthum and change back into a Dragon to kill the DTP"

DTP ? Not sure what your'e talking about. I know you can fly in that area but I don't remember killing anything in Dragon form there.
No boss should be doing 1600 a hit, it sounds like you've found the persistent bug with crazy boss damage in DKS.

Zagan himself isn't actually hard, it's the Demon Bosses that spawn in from the nests which have the Dragon Blast spell that are the real threat. That's because there's no room to avoid that spell in the small cave and the Dragon has no good healing options.

DTP = Dragon Terror Patrol.
Originally Posted by Stabbey
No boss should be doing 1600 a hit, it sounds like you've found the persistent bug with crazy boss damage in DKS.

Zagan himself isn't actually hard, it's the Demon Bosses that spawn in from the nests which have the Dragon Blast spell that are the real threat. That's because there's no room to avoid that spell in the small cave and the Dragon has no good healing options.

DTP = Dragon Terror Patrol.



Thanks. When I encountered Markthum and the others I was above level 30, and he's level 22. I almost couldn't believe it when he instantly one-shotted me but I checked my combat log and sure enough, 1600 + damage every time,and one of the others was also doing almost as much damage. There were also a few other fights that seemed almost as imbalanced.

As for changing into dragon form to kill the DTP I found that I could change into dragon form in that area but couldn't kill anything that isn't flying. At no point in he game could I kill enemies on the ground while in dragon form, in fact I can't even see anyone on the ground in dragon form.

You're right about Zagan. I took out the nest towers right away but trying to fly around and kill those Demon Bosses was almost impossible, I would just get killed in a few seconds.I got through it by flying up to the exit area to heal, then doing as much shooting as possible. Some of them fly into arrow range when you stand there, but to finish the fight I had to jump in, score one or two hits, then quickly fly back to the ledge to heal, then repeat over and over. It took a very long time.

This is why it puzzles me when people say they breezed through this game in 40 hours or less. It was some of these imbalanced fights that I found to be serious chokepoints, and it's not entirely because of the way I designed my character because if your character is doing well you shouldn't just instantly get one-shotted suddenly by some surprisingly overpowered enemy. If my character was adequately prepared for some of those bossfights the rest of the battles would be so easy that I probably would get through it in a lot less time but it would be a pretty dull playthrough. That's what I mean by balance problems that could have used a little more work.

OK I just went back to a savegame just before the DTP fight and did it again. Check out this screenshot. Combat log

Just did it again. Almost impossible because Tobelisk one-shots me too, but I did find that I can't shape-shift while the fight is going on, not before or after I kill Markthum. Only after the fight is completed.
Originally Posted by DocSmith59
In my second playthrough I discovered a lot of stuff I overlooked the first time, like the area under the Miller's house and the location of the Doctor who cures Eugene/Clyde, the quest involving Sir Robin, Bellegar's "moral choices" cave, and a lot more. I also accidentally killed the chicken that NPC in Broken Valley got soul-forged with, which was kind of funny.I checked a few walkthroughs just to make sure I'd picked up all the quests, but there are a few things the walkthroughs don't include as quests, like the 3 sleepers. I also found that there are areas you can swim to around Sentinel Island and gather a lot of loot if you can deal with the wyverns.

One thing I only discovered about the three sleepers in this play-through is that they do actually turn up in Broken Valley village after all: I'd expected them to be in the Black Boar like every other wanderer, but they hang around at the back of the village between the chapel and the talking vendor's cart thing, and reveal that their ordeal started when a bottle of wine was provided by a "weird rhyming fellow"!
Originally Posted by DocSmith59
That battle involving Markthum and the others is bugged. Markthum does over 1600 damage per hit, which really doesn't make sense. He's so overpowered he makes Behrlinn and Ygerna look like a couple of imps.

Originally Posted by DocSmith59
Thanks. When I encountered Markthum and the others I was above level 30, and he's level 22. I almost couldn't believe it when he instantly one-shotted me but I checked my combat log and sure enough, 1600 + damage every time,and one of the others was also doing almost as much damage.

Oh, I didn't realise this was a known "feature". I had a real sulk when I took them on at level 25 or 26 and repeatedly had my bottom handed to me, eventually having to settle for running into one of the towers and sniping.
Originally Posted by Raze
From DKS - Chest on Sentinel Island

Originally Posted by SauronSLO
I finally found the way to the chest. It's nothing special inside.

http://www.shrani.si/f/2V/7G/2W7WqDBK/waytothechest.jpg

I knew someone had posted a solution! Tricky, but I just managed to follow it. Frustrating in a way as I'd used a similar method to get to the area right above the exit where you first arrive on Sentinel Island, but I guess I wouldn't have had the idea to continue running along the invisible walls even if I'd tried that other tree.
Originally Posted by Vometia
Oh, I didn't realise this was a known "feature". I had a real sulk when I took them on at level 25 or 26 and repeatedly had my bottom handed to me, eventually having to settle for running into one of the towers and sniping.


Lol, the only way I could kill them was to get them to chase me down that long flight of stairs to that open area in front of the castle, I guess it's the Zeppelin dock. Thanks to no fall damage I could jump straight down then pelt them with fireballs and exploding arrows when they ran down the stairs.

But the point is that this is why it's confusing when people talk about getting through DKS quickly. I wonder if we're talking about the same version of the game. Because I have it on Steam I know I have the latest patched version, and this is what you get, sudden chokepoints with vastly overpowered bosses. I'm wondering now if there are other patches or fixes for specific issues I may not know about.
For me it is still going, still haven't played FoV.
Don't feel like playing for some reason.
sudden chokepoints with vastly overpowered bosses.

That isn't a consistent bug. Some people have run into over-powered bosses, most do not.
Originally Posted by Raze
sudden chokepoints with vastly overpowered bosses.

That isn't a consistent bug. Some people have run into over-powered bosses, most do not.


I made a short video to show you what I'm talking about. This isn't the entire DTP battle, just a brief demo of how challenging some parts of this game can be on Hard difficulty, at least in my version. At this point my character is level 32, nine levels above the DTP. Check it out. hahaha
That is a BUG. It is NOT. Intentional. It is NOT supposed to happen. It is not related to the difficulty. Not even the final boss on Nightmare skill does that much damage.

I have encountered that bug once before, with my Geishneiz on my Warrior.

That fight is suppose to be challenging, minus the one hit kills.

In the video you don't have your creature active. They can target your creature, rather than you, giving you time to Rush Attack or use a Stun Arrow or Hide in Shadows, etc. Even if they target you, your creature (or a summon) may block an attack if it is in the way.
Running around in full view of all of the DTP probably wasn't helping much, either, and isn't the best strategy even without the damage bug.

I started that fight off with a Splitting Arrow (Way of the Ranger would have helped, if I had known it then), then after a few hits jumped back onto the ground behind that raised section to heal. Two of them ran around either side, with one taking longer than the other, while two concentrated on my creature. Once I took out the first couple (much easier one on one) the other two were not difficult.
Originally Posted by DocSmith59
But the point is that this is why it's confusing when people talk about getting through DKS quickly. I wonder if we're talking about the same version of the game. Because I have it on Steam I know I have the latest patched version, and this is what you get, sudden chokepoints with vastly overpowered bosses. I'm wondering now if there are other patches or fixes for specific issues I may not know about.

In my case all I have to go on is the chat log, which claims I did it in about 40 hours, but as I mentioned, I'm pretty certain that figure has to be wrong.

Just looked at my achievements and there are still two that are locked: I dunno what they are, though, because it says they're a secret. I imagine one of them is the bunny (or is it chicken?) killer one, which I don't want to do because it's mean, not sure about the other though.

If you really want to know you can look through a list of the Dragon Knight Saga Achievements. There is one for the killer bunny and the white chicken, so that could account for the two you don't have.
Originally Posted by Raze
If you really want to know you can look through a list of the Dragon Knight Saga Achievements. There is one for the killer bunny and the white chicken, so that could account for the two you don't have.

Thanks! Fortunately I found the other one quite quickly: "You sided with Behrlihn." Which I didn't, and don't intend to, so I guess that'll remain locked! I dealt with the white chicken on a previous play-through as I didn't want to leave the quest unresolved, but it didn't feel quite right... I left it alone this time, alongside the chap with two personalities.
Originally Posted by Kein
For me it is still going, still haven't played FoV.
Don't feel like playing for some reason.

Well, I invite you to give it a try!

Despite us having to cut the area outside of the city and therefore leaving the player somewhat cooped up in Aleroth, Flames of Vengeance is in my opinion a really tasty slice of RPG gameplay. Sure Iím biased, but as far as dialogs and quest design is concerned, I think we did some of our best work here. After creating the rather more encounter-based Orobas Fjords, it was great to think up characters and write dialog for a more confined setting, for a more thematically bonded whole. RPG-wise that paid off.

Anyway, you definitely donít have to take my word for it, but yeah, give it a shot I say! smile
Originally Posted by Raze

That fight is suppose to be challenging, minus the one hit kills.


I found that the creature doesn't do a lot, it's just a very tricky fight when two of them can one-shot you, and they're also difficult to see, at times invisible, another glitch. But it is doable without taking any significant damage. Check out this video in which I did summon the creature.
Originally Posted by Macbeth
Well, I invite you to give it a try!

Despite us having to cut the area outside of the city and therefore leaving the player somewhat cooped up in Aleroth, Flames of Vengeance is in my opinion a really tasty slice of RPG gameplay. Sure Iím biased, but as far as dialogs and quest design is concerned, I think we did some of our best work here. After creating the rather more encounter-based Orobas Fjords, it was great to think up characters and write dialog for a more confined setting, for a more thematically bonded whole. RPG-wise that paid off.

Anyway, you definitely donít have to take my word for it, but yeah, give it a shot I say! smile

I loved FoV: I thought it would feel too claustrophobic but it actually worked really well. Reminded me somewhat of Morrowind's Tribunal in that regard: both existed in fairly limited spaces, but were strongly story-driven. It was nice seeing a bit more of Aleroth after the "teaser" we got near the end of ED.

I'd still like to visit its surroundings, though. Is it too late to ask for another expansion...? laugh
Originally Posted by Vometia
I'd still like to visit its surroundings, though. Is it too late to ask for another expansion...? laugh

Iím afraid it is. disagree

Believe me, the design team (no more than four brave musketeers!) was heartbroken when we had to let go of this area. We had several quests already in place and we were really trying to create another Broken Valley, only more coherent and story-driven. We were rather well on our way, but it became clear at some point we would never be able to finish it properly and fill a city like Aleroth as well. Quite a shame really, it did look fantastic ... The swamp with warring goblin tribes; the wizard tower; the witchís fort; the Black Ring battlements ...

Alas!
Flames of Vengeance is indeed a very great part !!! So great and addictive I almost darf not to start playing that part afraid I will forget I live in Belgium and not in Aleroth city :hihi:

With the Dragon Terror Patrol, try this :
after the video, on the moment they start to attack ... jump/run fast behind on of the towers (I always choose the tower most close by the teleporter platform) and if you have still the Amulet of the North with you you can use Hide in Shadows* or find another yewellery item with this skill on or invest at least 1 point wink ...

After this (you're now behind the tower and with Hide in Shadows used the chance the enemies followed you is almost nihil !) you can first make a seperate save game !
Then I always summon my Creature and the Summon Ghost**
A Creature with a Ghoulish Head (Rush Attack & Fatality) I find really helpful !

I use Priest skills like Charm, Blind & Fear ... really powerfull skills if you know how to make best use of them wink

* but know that if you going to use this skill NO arrow or spell is going to strike you while you "use" this skill ( so just before the Hide in Shadow spell is started to work you're still visible !)

** a fantastic helpful Ghost who can heal you and shoot fireballs, but know that it is important to upgrate Summon Ghost to the highest level you can because then the Ghost is a higher level, stronger and also can heal you a lot more (HP point) in one time !!

Originally Posted by Macbeth
Believe me, the design team (no more than four brave musketeers!) was heartbroken when we had to let go of this area. We had several quests already in place and we were really trying to create another Broken Valley, only more coherent and story-driven. We were rather well on our way, but it became clear at some point we would never be able to finish it properly and fill a city like Aleroth as well. Quite a shame really, it did look fantastic ... The swamp with warring goblin tribes; the wizard tower; the witchís fort; the Black Ring battlements ...

Alas!

That's such a shame! It sounds like it would've been wonderful, even more so now that I've seen the concept described as "another Broken Valley"...
Quote
I would be merrily raging away in Flames of Vengeance right now, but unfortunately I get the 'black screen of death' immediately after the cutscene; so I can't carry my character over and I really have no intention of starting Flames of Vengeance with a new character.


2 possible fixes:
- set your desktop resolution to the same resolution as your ingame resolution
- install ac3 codec (ac3filter.net)

if these 2 don't work, simply send your savegame to support@larian.com and i'll transfer your character to FoV !
Just finished Ego Draconis in a bit under 40 hours, level 37, doing "everything". I'll admit that I may have missed some small things, I don't know, but certainly not 60 hours of content hahaha
I had a great time though and really enjoyed it. Look forward to playing Flames of Vengeance once I get it working.

Levels seem to come in big jumps. I went from about 20 to 30 doing my first flying fortress and breezed through the rest of the fjords after that. Killed the Dragon Terror Patrol with a single fireball :p

I think it's great the some of you can get 100+ hours from a playthrough, but I must say that I have no idea how you do it o.O

Anyway, onward! To Flames of Vengeance! ..I hope.
Originally Posted by Vometia
One thing I only discovered [...]

Another thing I just discovered is that the location of Kali's fortress uses the same landscape as Orobas Fjords where the Red Hammer Tribe lurks. Okay, lurked. Never noticed that before. Er anyway, sorry if that was a bit random, and not really news.
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