Hey guys,

Anyone else want respawning monsters? I'd love it. It doesn't have to be for the whole game, maybe just for one map, or one area. I'd love one map that had respawning monsters that scaled to the player's level. Anyone else?

What do you say Larian? It can be an expansion, it doesn't have to be an area in the base game.

On that subject, who else would love to get some official expansions for this game with new areas, henchmen, spells, monsters, etc? Personally I can't get enough of this game.

As far as respawns, I'd have to respectfully disagree. I like the fact that "character building" resources are finite; it urges the player to make decisions instead of saying "oh well I'll just go level up some more and fix it".

That's why I like the respec option because even though you can respec, you still only have a limited number of points from leveling to spread out across everything. Now, of course, those resources are still limited by the overall leveling system/game progression mechanic, in ways - but one level difference makes a HUGE difference in difficulty. I would hate to see encounters become trivial because of respawns.

However - as far as expansions or even DLC (I think DLC fits better here than expansion, for once), I would definitely invest more money for content. I know a lot of developers will release some free content (as long as it isn't F2P to begin with), but I would throw my money at the devs to keep DOS fresh and new.

Just my thoughts - don't crucify me!

dunno could be abused by farming low level monsters

Sorry Diabolus_Musica, but there are 3 Things that i do not like in C-RPG.

1- Levelscaling.
2- Respawning Monsters.
3- Random Loot (unfortunately, D:OS has this kind of Lootsystem)

Best
ZG

The story, leveling and quests are all perfectly synced as you progress through the game. It's a crpg. What you're describing isn't.

no need for respawning monsters here

Instead of respawning monsters, I'd rather have random encounters a-la Fallout 1&2 where you can bump into interesting scenarios while you traverse the map.

So even if you cleared out a map of all enemies, there's a chance that you'll meet a random stranger needing rescue, clumsy bad guys getting caught plotting something, bandits, etc. Not that this game really needs any more XP. It's easy to become OP from low levels.

Larian has made it clear that this epic game won't be some mindless grinding process. Every encounter will be vital because you only get to do it once.

For the sake of immersion: NO RESPAWNING MONSTERS

The last thing I want is another Diablo clone.

No.

I think that idea would make more sense and work better than respawning.

However a special combat zone (arena? testing ground? Larian QA office?) where players could practice their skills against a variety of opponents multiple times (getting experience for the first battles, but not for repeats) could be one way for hack-happy players to notch their swords.

No-go for respawning monsters here. I quite like the fact that whatever I kill stays dead, unless I'm fighting resurrecting zombies or the likes

If you want more combat, there's always the 'new game' button... show your new skills! Or try a different setup. Infinite combat!

(Yeah, no respawning monster fan here. If you can't beat a fight, learn, not grind some and then rofl-stomp it here thank you very much)

Yes, respawn monsters TO A DEGREE.

A barren dead landscape is much more immersion breaking for me, than running into some random encounters where there used to be other monsters.

Respawning monsters work better in games where the battles don't take long. I don't really feel like fighting the same three groups of enemies three times because I forgot to bring some important quest item.

I suppose it could be a tick box in settings, to enable or disable random encounters in cleared areas. That way everyone can play as they like

No respawning and no it's not just a tick box to enable it, all difficulty management has to be redesigned and this is a lot of work.


This element is far to be in a polished state. Ie if there's work on this matter it's not to make it more complex, it's to polish it and eventually add another difficulty level. Currently at normal difficulty, with a lot of care of avoiding any exploits like leech, the difficulty suddenly drop down after first chapter, and that's quite an anomaly.

Not really interested.

Hopefully, no one.

While I don't want respawning monsters, there could be a place for wandering random encounters.

Respawning monsters? Absolutely not.

A little bit more RNG in terms of which monsters you face, so that each playthrough is a little different? That sounds like a good idea, if done in moderation.

Absolutely not

NO!

What I would advocate, which is what I did with Torment: Tides of Numinara (or something like that), was that mobs do respawn unless certain goals are met. My example was that of a giant wasp hive. Until you kill the hive the wasps should respawn. The idea that mobs don't come back is ridiculous.

Another example I used were highway robbers. Sure you killed those bastard last time you came through, but unless you helped the the city watch in this one quest they don't have the men to patrol the roads and another group of robbers take the place of the ones you killed.

If you worry about people farming them, then why not have a flag on the mob indicating how many times its been killed. Each time the XP and gold return is diminished (potentially to zero after just one kill).

This adds to a living world that you have an impact on through your quests, and not just through slaughtering mobs whole-sale.

I think depending on the way a CRPG is made very limited respawning is ok.

But in D:OS I really think it would be not very fitting.
The combat scenarios are fairly well though out and therefore fun. More Combat would probably lessen the experience.

Also combat mods are probably one of the first bigger mods to pop up.

Original Sin is neither Skyrim nor an MMO and it's also not a real time action game. A "living world" is only needed if you travel through the same regions over and over and over. Original Sin is more a classic "linear" experience with hand-crafted encounters for turn-basedc combat. Respawning mobs would just be a huge annoyance. Nothing is worse being forced to fight against a level 10 mob while you yourself are on level 20 for no apparent reason. That would seriously devalue the core idea of this game and on top of that it's absolutely unnecesary.

If you guys want to have more combat replay the game or wait for mods/expansions with new content.

I agree with you with some of your points, but you mention that it would be an annoyance to fight against low lvl mobs, but I find this no worse than being forced into a linear game that forces you down a particular route. This to me is a bigger issue than fighting against low level mobs.

I wasn't suggesting it for combat replay, but rather for a sense of impact. Also, I've never actually played a game that implimented this idea.

Also, I wish people would stop comparing D:OS to Skyrim, they are nothing alike. Also, neither Skyrim, nor any MMO have what I would call a "living world". By this I mean one that changes with you. You know, so you can see the impact you make on the world.

Still I can see how this would be wasted effort. As you said, LordCrash, the game is set up in such a way as to ensure this sort of situation doesn't occur in the first place. While it might be a nice idea, there wouldn't be much point.

Hmm, no don't want to see this. As others have pointed out this isn't really a similar world to Skyrim as it's quest is more linear. I think what I'd like to see is maybe an expansion or dlc that offer new maps and quests for your party to undertake and I suspect modders will eventually be offering new content as well in that vein.

I agree with you with some of your points, but you mention that it would be an annoyance to fight against low lvl mobs, but I find this no worse than being forced into a linear game that forces you down a particular route. This to me is a bigger issue than fighting against low level mobs. [/quote]

For me that is awesome. I hate open world games for the sake of being open world. "Real" open world almost means fucked up balancing.

Linear progression in an open world environment is the only option to deliver challenge and balancing, especially in a tactical turn-based game.

I'm a fan of linearity.

I am loving the combat so far. I wouldn't mind having more enemies to fight but I don't want mindless trash combat. that would spoil the game IMO but an arena for example if it makes sense would be kind of cool especially if you could respec and try out different builds and stuff.

Anyway DD and D2 IIRC did not have any respawn so not expecting anything different with D:OS

Respawning Monsters of the same type? No. But I always thought it'd be cool, if there were different mobs after a certain amount of time in an area I cleared, like eg. wild animals resettling in a wilderness area that I freed from undead before and so on.

As long as you feel like there is good progression you shouldn't need respawns. Now that being said, it would be kind of cool to come back to an area and find some harder enemies feasting on the corpses you have left behind... Maybe just a few really difficult encounters to test your mettle, not enough to sway the balance of the progression through the game.

That's what the tool set is for, so people can either change to enable respawn or add something like a specific place which would have respawns or none at all.

I guess for me, I don't want to constantly run into fights if I've cleared an area. On the other hand some form for people to get some XP on the side wouldn't be a bad thing, maybe an arena or something which you can participate in would be a solution.

Generally I don't like respawning monsters.

But I did like the approach they had in Might & Magic VI. There monsters would respawn after 6-12 months (!!) game time - basically simulating that new monsters would move back into the areas again.

Yea don't get me wrong I'm enjoying the pacing of the game, just sometimes it feels that we are being pushed down a very tight corridor, I love how some quests can be completed in various different ways, would like to be able to explore in different ways too..... but in the end we all have different opinions.

I would only agree to respawnable monsters if

A) they give no experience
B) they drop no loot
C) they are ridiculously high levelled like 23+

Ok to all those saying no. What about a option for it? Aka a check in the options menu for "Respawning Monsters"

There are almost no wild animals in D:OS. The only wild animals I can remember of are a bunch of wolves in Cyseal and a gang of vermin west of Hunter's Edge. Ok, and maybe the spiders, although they are connected with a spider cult...

You could include a button for everything? Why not letting players choose to fight against scaling enemies as well?

It's just not how this game is designed and this game has its design for a reason.

Don't forget the zombie boars.

Zombies are wild animals?

Ok...

It has been designed, but it does not mean Larian won't listen to the player base, also whole point of these forums is to discuss the game, both what is in the game & what is not.


I agree you cant have buttons for every option, but I think re spawning mobs splits the community. I think if there was to be a poll it would be quite even.

As for the amount of work involved, I have no idea. Maybe this is simply to difficult or time consuming to code in.

I don't think it would be even. I think that most people don't want respawning enemies and are quite happy how Larian handled the whole issue.

I'm also still waiting for any reasonable argument why there should be respawning enemies in this game (and not in general, I'm not interested in overall design theory)...

The devs would have to allocate the manpower to reprogram the game to do this. I'd rather they save their resources for more interesting features. If you want to create a mod for this to happen though, I'm all for it

1. At present there is a finite amount of mobs, once you get near the end of the game, in theory you should be still accumulating gear, I can see a situation where by you get an epic new item..... and then he game ends with out you seeing how epic that item was......

We all play this game for different reasons, & I agree I dont play this for the loot grind, but if I've invested 100+ hours I would like to see how my party works outs.

2. Some people might not feel like starting form scratch when they have completed the game..... but might still want to do some fights, when all the mobs are gone then they are left will no choice but to restart...

This is not me saying that the game is bad how it is, I love it how it is..... I'm just offering an opinion.

Well, basically you want Larian to change basic game design. That's like saying "Hm, I think CoD is a nice FPS but I think Activision should give the player an option to play it as third person shooter.

There are reasons why Larian designed the game how it is designed. That maybe doesn't appeal to everyone but everything which is in the game is there because Larian had a certain vision for the game.

We don't talk about certain usability improvements or bugfixing or stuff like that, we talk about basic game design. Of course we have all different reasons to play this game but you want actually something else which isn't in line with the vision for this game. It's imo a little bit pretentious to demand something like that from a developer tbh...

I want a checkbox turning the TBS experience into "Real time with Pause" like Baldur's Gate.
Should be easy no, not a major investment or total change of the entire experience, right?

I'm certainly not demanding anything from anyone.... Its a forum, which is a place to exchange ideas, that's all.

I purchased the game way back when it was in Alpha (Like most I assume), without any idea what the final product would be like, & what we have is great, but it does not mean that its perfect so discussing this is a good way to gauge opinions.

I gave you two valid points why respawning might benefit the game I would like to know your thoughts on the two points?

The fact also remains that visions can change, because they did not have respawning does not mean it was not part of their concepts? just like Night/ day cycle was originally 'vision' for the game but we did not get it..... (sad face)

Neither of your points is convincing imo:

1) You don't need more epic loot after the game is over. That's how a game with a start and a finish works.

2) And again it's a game with a start and an end.


You basically want a neverending game. That is just not the focus and the idea of this game. This game wants to tell a story and and offer a certain "closed" but well crafted experience.

If you want to change or expand that feel free to make a mod. That's why Larian offered mod tools for free. But don't expect Larian to change their vision and idea for the game just because some people might prefer another experience.

You don't have to be sorry, that's why I asked for your opinion in the first place.

Oh believe me, I know, I've pressed it like 30 times now. I guess what I really want is more *content*, which of course I'm happy to pay for.

That's why I'm really suggesting to do it in an OPTIONAL area of the game. For the whole game no, I agree, I like it the way it is. But once you've done everything there is to do then it would be nice to have an area you can go to with respawning monsters. They don't even have to be worth XP for all I care, I just want more stuff to kill without restarting the game.

So...you're opposed to having MORE options? If they were to add it and you don't like it maybe don't enable it?

I think you are misunderstanding my sentiments. I am not demanding or expecting that Larian change anything...... please understand I know the concept of the game, a start & a finish... the point that we are discussing is whether people would like the option.. there is no right on wrong opinion, its a forum to express ideas & see what other people say or feel.

Like you say, mods are ideal, I have no idea how to do such a thing.... don't have time either ( to busy hording every barrel)

Let me give you an example, The witcher 2.. it has a start & a finish, it is also linear.... but after a few months they introduced an arena that simply provided a different experience.

This would be ideal for a mod, so Larian can spend their time on other things....Night & Day (Cough cough)

Well, CDPR offered indeed an arena but they never changed their basic game. That's a different thing.

I don't have anything against additional content. But they should stay away from changing the game at it is on a basic design level. It's imo not a "more options" question since enemy encounter design is too deeply embedded in the overall game design of D:OS. It's a turn-based game with handcrafted encounters fitting to both story and player progression. That's typcial for a story- or progression-driven RPG. This is how all the old Infinity engine games worked. Instead of constant random encounters each encounter is hand-crafted but also a real challenge each. You fight and you proceed. That's the design of the game.

So maybe this was indeed some sort of miscommunication. I personally think mods which offer a combat arena or just new content to fright trough would be awesome. Maybe even Larian decide to make something similar for an expansion/DLC. But that shouldn't change how the main game/campaign is designed.

Wow I guess I should have stressed more in my original post that I was talking about an extra, optional area. I'm not at all suggesting that they redesign the whole game and mess with "their vision of what the game should be". I wasn't suggesting that at all.

One thing's for sure, I can't get enough of this game and I welcome any extra content that they can provide.

Quite frankly, random encounters and respawning monsters never really work in a single player or story driven RPG. (the only game that managed to pull this off THAT I PLAYED is Diablo).

The thing is, each battle is designed and scripted individually to be a unique challenge. The amount of monsters, and with that the amount exp there is to obtain, is highly tested and tweaked up until this point.

For instance: players shouldn't be lvl 10 by the time they try the lighthouse battle or it would just be too easy and thus not fun or challenging at all. Respawning monsters could lead to grinding, players being OP at bosses and by doing so taking away most of the challenges that are within the combats.

Wandering monsters make sense.

Limiting player XP gain, so that they are an appropriate level for certain encounters = stupid. Because in an OPEN RPG like D:OS players can simply skip particularly hard fights and then come back and kick ass later.

Otherwise, the game could just as well be a corridor fighter where you MUST face each encounter in a queue style experience.

Respawning monsters never made much sense to me, tbh. If you kill off the entire population of something in an area, then it just doesn't magically respawn a few days later.

That being said, the example given earlier with a beehive does make some sense, but in this game random encounters would grind the game pace to a halt. At least if the encounters are to be challenging, and if they aren't, then what's the point in having them in the game?

Sure, for story, it would be cool if there were enemies that moved into areas that you had already cleared, but only if it made sense. However, those encounters would have to be as well thought out as the current encounters, meaning they'd have to be handcrafted.

Also, I'm not sure I'm a huge fan of that whole arena idea. But maybe that's just because I've never been the type of player that wants to minmax my builds, so to be able to quickly try out a ton of builds doesn't really appeal to me. I want to play and be challenged, I don't want to play and roflstomp everything from the first level.

Anyway, that's just my poorly thought out 5 cents.

Cheers!

Respawning mobs.. possibly not, although I wouldn't particularly mind them.

I do like the combat, and to level though (another disappointment about this game is the low level cap) so maybe some sort of Arena would be a better bet.(I don't believe I'm actually proposing something as lame as an Arena for an RPG.. but strangely enough I think it would have been a real addition here.)

Considering that it's the norm for RPG's to have respawns and wandering mobs I don't know how in hell you can possibly say "it never really works in single player~..." It would have been the dumbest thing I'd read if I hadn't read the second part of your comment.

Diablo, a story driven RPG.. WTF??????????

well I think its been established that most of us DONT want respawns?

Do you see that little 2 letter word there? the "or". This is an english word that means that it either the one, or the other case.
Diablo is indeed not a story driven game, but it is considered a single player game

And I wan't talking about Diablo 3 btw, that game is an insult to it precessors

So you mention Diablo as an example of a single player game that "pulled it of". Pulling of single player that is...

Occasional random encounters could be OK, I guess, but respawns belong nowhere near a Divinity game.

I liked how it was done in Baldur's Gate (and all of the other Infinity Engine D&D titles). No respawns, but resting in an area or fast traveling had a chance to trigger an ambush. You could use these to grind if you chose, but otherwise they served merely as a deterrent to excessive use of rest breaks (without save scumming, anyway).

D:OS doesn't really have a need for "rest breaks," however, so the main reason for such a system's existing is notably absent here...

I vote against. I really don't like respawning. I don't get that very sought after feeling of fulfilment with respawns. Except of course, trees, plants, herbs, etc... (would be good to have a poll on this)

I dont much care for grinding but if you have been following latest videos which show you how to create triggers. Create script trigger that rolls against your perception and summon enemies if fail. Robin waiting you on bushes because you didn't let him steal fish

Thank god that's not true...

The Old Republic made me hate respawning foes with a zealous passion...

I would like respawns of some description. I value immersion above all, and in my game I keep wondering why everyone is going on about this undead plague that doesn't exist as I have killed them all. I also keep hearing about these marauding orcs.... I killed a few and never saw any again. I'm starting to wonder if all the NPCs are just lying to me!!

Not saying I want the same mobs respawning all the time, but after a certain amount of time, having a chance(based on a stat maybe) for some kind of mob to appear would enhance the game imo.

Aureus: "Well you halted the spread of the undead, so we thank you. Unfortunately there's still the existing undead so our situation hasn't really changed much yet. But this is a glimmer of hope."

...

What undead, I literally killed every single undead in Cyseal. There are no more. They are extinct.

No offense,but why not simply GIVE THEM (including me) the OPTION to do so by mods/updates?I hate linear games HOWEVER I really liked this game,in ego draconis for instance I loved the game as well,but the linearity made it quite an annoyance,besides,once the game was over...poof,no extra dungeons,and you don't feel like ever playing the game anymore because everything will go down as the very way it did before,sure,exchange playing way,classes,etc...but in my honest opnion (an opnion of whom has played early castlevanias,legend of mana,skyrim,oblivion,larian games,megaman (although it's not related at all except command mission),infinite undiscovery,tales of series,lost odyssey,final fantasy series,xenosaga,crash series,enchanted arms,diablo,dungeon siege,racing games in general and so on).

Look,ok if you won't change your opnion,but lets set an example: you started the game,and the only low (2~3) leveled enemies you see near/in the town are either guards or very few others,everything smashes you even at easy and many quests request items/npcs from way more strong areas.I would really,really enjoy more ways to play it,even an alternative route for being in the other side of the plot,against source hunters,guilds (will you say it's lore-unfriendly,really?),extra dungeons...I wanted to have at least the tools and help to achieve such,or others to do so because I'm very sure I'm not the only one who thinks like this.

Besides,just saying "NO" in a thread is quite ridiculous,aim to help and satisfy a little bit,if Larian didn't want it to be and it will likely ruin the gameplay,let them do it anyway,it will be our problem,not yours,geez can't people be more open minded towards EVEN games?

Feel free to contact me by d.nightmare@hotmail.com or skype : randomguy0981237,ANYONE.Because honestly I just created this account for this thread,for the while at least.

??? go mod the game, nobody is gonna to stop you.

not just BG; many old school CRPGs don't have farming xp as game feature. basically, when you clear one area, it's done.
the fast travel encounters in Fallout sometimes are even deadly~~"

even now, Bioware pretty much stick to the no respawn tradition (though I think DA games still get too much grinding)

it's not about single-player or mmo game types; respawning enemy is a norm in Action RPGs (Diablo type) and JRPG, that's about it.

You can argue a button for anything, really. Open world is fun in when handled well in an open world game. In such games, where you revisit areas over and over, respawn has a point. Or in a game where leveling has its own merits
such as many MMOs.

In D:OS, nah.

As I've said,I'd have no modding experience with this game nor lua/other programmings,could you or someone point out how to do it?Even if a separated world cell with a spawning machina,somewhat as an arena.

There is a giant thread in the mod section of this forum with the respawning mod already working...

Not me. I would hate having to defeat a boss all again at a choke point for 5-10 minutes xD

Yes! DEFINITELY! Aside from building up an inhuman kill tally simply being satisfying in a general way, I would appreciate being able to play the game in such a way that I don't feel pressured to connect the proverbial dots of progression and can instead soothe my anxiety with some good old wilderness-cleansing!

I also really don't like the idea of there being limited... well... resources and experience from slain beasties. I feel pressured to perfectionism when it's like that, and to make every single thing count, and it's very stressful.

I like it but only when it makes sense. Clearing an area means you killed all that you found. Surely there are others that can breed or wonder in from off map. Not so many as to be worth grinding but enough to keep you on your toes when you pass through again.

Now the undead (in OS); since you killed the makers of them and all others, there really shouldn't be any regeneration in time. Perhaps there are one or two off map but the guard can take care of that.

Only if this is scripted as a part of a quest or something that makes sense like Caninelegion mentions.
But as a general rule I prefer when there is not respawning monsters because it will not have the same quality of the tailored encounters made by Larian level designers (or whatever is the title of the persons making the encounters at Larian).

If you want respawning monster to have unlimited loots and/or xp it's better to have some kind of arena or a constrained feature instead of having a generic respawn everywhere.

I'll pass on it. The game would get too grindy. Also feels good to return to somewhere you were before and see the corpses of enemies you've slain weeks ago. Makes it feel like each battle is meaningful and more memorable.