Larian Studios
Posted By: alice_ashpool Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 10/11/20 04:43 PM
So you think you're tough because you made a solo dumpstat cheese-wizz via some constructive nautiloid tank throwing? You used an invisible imp to push some minotaurs off a cliff? You stealth-chipped the spider matriarch to pieces? You spent 10 minutes stacking barrels to kill the red dragon? You needed to get to level 4 before you could fight your own battles? Heh, you are a child.

This thread is for challenge runs - any constructive restriction to make the game harder. Beacuse the harder something is the better it is - this is known.

Inspired by Dark Souls, here is my ongoing SL1 BG3 EA run. No barrels, no stealth cheese, no scrub tier bs like leveling up.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Hit me up with your best challenge runs.
Posted By: Ellenhard Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 10/11/20 04:57 PM
You are cheesing it anyway, by using left-hand damage modificator which is bugged right now and applies where it shouldn't be; an overpowered (by design) for this level Magic Missile amulet :p
Posted By: Tzelanit Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 10/11/20 05:01 PM
Some suggested reading for you, because this ain't it, fam.

[Linked Image]
Originally Posted by Tzelanit
Some suggested reading for you, because this ain't it, fam.

i cant read
Posted By: Nyanko Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 10/11/20 05:20 PM
The naked challenge sounds fun. No gear at all. Only spells, fists and throwing stuff at the enemy. (borrowed from the witcher 3).
Originally Posted by Ellenhard
You are cheesing it anyway, by using left-hand damage modificator which is bugged right now and applies where it shouldn't be; an overpowered (by design) for this level Magic Missile amulet :p

Ok i re-did it only using a main hand weapon only and without an amulet. What now?
Originally Posted by Nyanko
The naked challenge sounds fun. No gear at all. Only spells, fists and throwing stuff at the enemy. (borrowed from the witcher 3).

Yeah, I want to do a poverty run, which was one of the highlight of BG1 and 2.
Posted By: Ellenhard Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 10/11/20 05:25 PM
Originally Posted by alice_ashpool
Originally Posted by Ellenhard
You are cheesing it anyway, by using left-hand damage modificator which is bugged right now and applies where it shouldn't be; an overpowered (by design) for this level Magic Missile amulet :p

Ok i re-did it only using a main hand weapon only and without an amulet. What now?


Let me kiss you! You are my hero now.

Now, naked, no saves and load, in a bugged and unstable EA?
Posted By: Verte Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 10/11/20 05:34 PM
Killing enemies with potatoes could be cool.
Posted By: Sadurian Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 10/11/20 05:36 PM
Originally Posted by Verte
Killing enemies with potatoes could be cool.

"It's the monster mash".
Originally Posted by Ellenhard
Originally Posted by alice_ashpool
Originally Posted by Ellenhard
You are cheesing it anyway, by using left-hand damage modificator which is bugged right now and applies where it shouldn't be; an overpowered (by design) for this level Magic Missile amulet :p

Ok i re-did it only using a main hand weapon only and without an amulet. What now?

Now, naked,

Just for you, I've now done this with nothing on but my underwear and the axe in my hand.
Posted By: vometia Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 10/11/20 06:25 PM
Originally Posted by Sadurian
Originally Posted by Verte
Killing enemies with potatoes could be cool.

"It's the monster mash".

"With mash get Smash" (or was it the other way round? It's been over 40 years).
Posted By: Sadurian Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 10/11/20 06:27 PM
Loved those robots. We had a toy one.
Posted By: Ellenhard Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 10/11/20 06:44 PM
Originally Posted by alice_ashpool
Originally Posted by Ellenhard
Originally Posted by alice_ashpool
Originally Posted by Ellenhard
You are cheesing it anyway, by using left-hand damage modificator which is bugged right now and applies where it shouldn't be; an overpowered (by design) for this level Magic Missile amulet :p

Ok i re-did it only using a main hand weapon only and without an amulet. What now?

Now, naked,

Just for you, I've now done this with nothing on but my underwear and the axe in my hand.


Wait, just this one fight? It's certainly an accomplishment, but I thought you were talking about the whole challenge run!

I'll confess - my fetish right now is Guts' style walkthrough: blood- pumping, vengeance-fueled melee dance, whoosh-whoosh, clank-clank - who isn't dead yet, is shocked by sheer brutality and surrenders. But to get these emotions, I need to cheese. And no, ARPGs aren't better for that for me, it looks better in a tactical game where you can admire the art of melee precision and it's effect in your own tempo.
Survival-style runs are too consuming on an unpolished game. May lose patience in the process, with all the bugs.
Ok I did the stupid duergar fight at lvl 1 solo - what a boring chore.

Duergar party
Gekh Coal (Lvl 5) - 55 HP, casts mirror image, uses invisibility. Big 'ol Battleaxe which can one-shot
Lurgan (Lvl 4) - Cleric, 34HP. uses invisibility. 2 casts of Aid, 3 of guiding bolt, any one of which can one-shot
Novice Garmor (Lvl 4) - 19 Str, 43HP beast, will one-shot
Holvik (Lvl 4) - Crossbow asshole, 32HP, uses invisibility
5x Reanimated Corpses (Lvl 4), 22HP each

Total of 274HP to my 11 (+5 from armor of agathys)

Max damage for single one off round with mainhand dragon's grasp and offhand handax + 1 seems to be something like 2d6 + 3 + 4 + 1d4 fire + 1d4 poison (or is it 2d4 poison?, idk how this game works) (also since I forgot to bring a potion of strength,whoops) - with maybe an extra 1d6 + 3 + 1d4 fire + 1d4 poison if I have a potion of speed up, but the timings are difficult to get right.

Arbitrary rules: let Gekh Coal reanimate the corpses (i.e. don't open with punting him off the ledge), don't destroy any ladders until fight starts, no stealth-ing about once the fight starts, no wyvern poison, no ogres or spectators, no barrels or other HE, no mid-fight saving, anything else goes.

Strat:
Armor of agathys up, drink potion of fire resistance, coat weapons with poison, eat an apple for 1 round bless. Attack Holvik and one-shot him. Cast web from scroll in front of lurgan, arrow of roaring thunder Ghek into the abyss, punt lurgan down into the pit, destroy the only rigging ladder up from the bottom. cast blur from scroll and hope lurgans 3 guiding bolts miss you while you spend forever shooting them with your light crossbow + 1. job done. Sounds easy right
MVP in this fight goes to Gekh who on one of my early attempts used pro-gamer strats to misty-step up to the sussar tree level were no one could get to him.
Posted By: whalesecrets Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 11/11/20 04:09 AM
How do you one shot Holvik? assuming you hit for max damage (very unlkely) by your math you get 2d6+3+4+4 = 12 +3 + 4 +4 = 23 < 32 hp.
Now this, I like. Arbitrary rules challenge runs are super fun!

Healing food, though? Cheese. (Sometimes literally.)

I'm gonna do a Scribe of Death run eventually, where I kill everything just by throwing Quills at them. #ThePenIsMightierThanTheSword
Posted By: Ellenhard Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 11/11/20 08:06 AM
Originally Posted by alice_ashpool
Ok I did the stupid duergar fight at lvl 1 solo - what a boring chore.

Duergar party
Gekh Coal (Lvl 5) - 55 HP, casts mirror image, uses invisibility. Big 'ol Battleaxe which can one-shot
Lurgan (Lvl 4) - Cleric, 34HP. uses invisibility. 2 casts of Aid, 3 of guiding bolt, any one of which can one-shot
Novice Garmor (Lvl 4) - 19 Str, 43HP beast, will one-shot
Holvik (Lvl 4) - Crossbow asshole, 32HP, uses invisibility
5x Reanimated Corpses (Lvl 4), 22HP each

Total of 274HP to my 11 (+5 from armor of agathys)

Max damage for single one off round with mainhand dragon's grasp and offhand handax + 1 seems to be something like 2d6 + 3 + 4 + 1d4 fire + 1d4 poison (or is it 2d4 poison?, idk how this game works) (also since I forgot to bring a potion of strength,whoops) - with maybe an extra 1d6 + 3 + 1d4 fire + 1d4 poison if I have a potion of speed up, but the timings are difficult to get right.

Arbitrary rules: let Gekh Coal reanimate the corpses (i.e. don't open with punting him off the ledge), don't destroy any ladders until fight starts, no stealth-ing about once the fight starts, no wyvern poison, no ogres or spectators, no barrels or other HE, no mid-fight saving, anything else goes.

Strat:
Armor of agathys up, drink potion of fire resistance, coat weapons with poison, eat an apple for 1 round bless. Attack Holvik and one-shot him. Cast web from scroll in front of lurgan, arrow of roaring thunder Ghek into the abyss, punt lurgan down into the pit, destroy the only rigging ladder up from the bottom. cast blur from scroll and hope lurgans 3 guiding bolts miss you while you spend forever shooting them with your light crossbow + 1. job done. Sounds easy right


I wasn't able to get poison damage stacked above fire damage (fire Dip+poison bottle), by the way, on a non-Dragon Grasp weapon. It is just d4 for a regular poison. Nice job! With what did you one-shot Holvik with his 32 hp's?
Originally Posted by whalesecrets
How do you one shot Holvik? assuming you hit for max damage (very unlkely) by your math you get 2d6+3+4+4 = 12 +3 + 4 +4 = 23 < 32 hp.

Yeah, so its not really a "one-shot" - you need to attack from stealth with main and offhand or with slash, surprise then attack once with mainhand, drink a potion of speed. This should leave you with one action, with Gehk yet to raise the corpses so then move east to cast web. Tbh I'm not very happy with this "run", since it relies on Gehk failing his save against the roaring thunder arrow which is pretty hit or miss.

Here's a log:

[Linked Image]

I'm not very happy with this build since it relies on bonus action for damage too much and armor of agathys is now useless in these higher level fights where things will one-shot you- so I have restarted with what I think is going to be a nice OP lvl 1 cleric
What's the build for the new cleric?
Posted By: virion Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 11/11/20 10:34 AM
Lv1 through the whole game, sadomasochism at it's finest. Good luck on next run. Personally, I will wait for the complete game to give it a try ;P

You can theoretically try it with lv 1 cleric archer, with coat weapon + cleric spells for saving and attack throws and maxed out dexterity. Not too sure how it will work on lv 1 (: Usually not much hits you though if you're a cleric.
Posted By: RumRunner151 Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 11/11/20 10:58 AM
OK I officially hate you. I have 387 hours in this game. Every Class/Subclass. Thought I was cool with 4 solo run-throughs. If you have seen any of my posts, you know I have no problem if others Cheese Wiz, Barrelmancy, etc. Just not my thing. Now you come along. I usually do Minthara at level 3 and Duegar at 4. Yer doing them w/ a level 1??? GTFO. I am not worthy. Those fights can easily go south at levels 3 and 4. 1??? 1!!! F me.

I was just thinking after this run I might stop and wait for updates. Now I may have to accept this challenge. Damn you.

Edit: I do have 1 question. I notice you ran a dwarf. I have had a B of a time if I dont run Elf/HE because I get Sleep-F'ed. How do you pull that off?
Originally Posted by Firesnakearies
What's the build for the new cleric?

I'll put it up once I've proved its as OP as I know it's going to be.

[Linked Image]
Crush your enemies, see them driven before you, and hear the lamentation of the women, in Vlaakith's name.
Originally Posted by RumRunner151
Edit: I do have 1 question. I notice you ran a dwarf. I have had a B of a time if I dont run Elf/HE because I get Sleep-F'ed. How do you pull that off?

Always kill the spellcasters 1st if possible. Hope you get woken up via damage without dying. The only fight so far where sleep has been a big issue is the undead in the ruins but if you pop a potion of fire resistance and retreat back into the final room they come at you one at a time.
Posted By: RumRunner151 Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 12/11/20 02:45 AM
This is not a knock, but I am surprised your definition of no-cheese does not include stealing Lae'zels armor.
Posted By: vometia Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 12/11/20 02:52 AM
Originally Posted by RumRunner151
This is not a knock, but I am surprised your definition of no-cheese does not include stealing Lae'zels armor.

Is it hers? (I mean I dunno, I wasn't paying attention). There's another set that can be picked up from the githyanki patrol.
Originally Posted by RumRunner151
This is not a knock, but I am surprised your definition of no-cheese does not include stealing Lae'zels armor.

Since you can buy 15AC scalemail + 1 in the grove I don't really think it matters. The only fight that seems compulsory before getting this half-plate equivalent is the one outside the grove, and maybe the 3 intellect devourers if you're not using stealth, neither of which require super high AC. Though I did a run through the nautiloid today and not one of the imps attacked me; which I guessed was due to having 21AC..., unless it was just a fluke glitch.
If you have high AC in this game, enemies tend to be like "Nope" when it comes to targeting you.

It could be an interesting discussion, what is the definition of "cheese"? Or more likely, what is each person's definition of it. I think nearly everyone agrees that barrelmancy is cheese, or exploiting bad AI with repeated Hiding is cheese, but where do people draw the line? What is, and isn't, cheese in Baldur's Gate 3?
Posted By: RumRunner151 Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 12/11/20 05:58 AM
Originally Posted by Firesnakearies
If you have high AC in this game, enemies tend to be like "Nope" when it comes to targeting you.

It could be an interesting discussion, what is the definition of "cheese"? Or more likely, what is each person's definition of it. I think nearly everyone agrees that barrelmancy is cheese, or exploiting bad AI with repeated Hiding is cheese, but where do people draw the line? What is, and isn't, cheese in Baldur's Gate 3?


That would be an interesting topic or even a survey. Alice and I are similar from what I see yet we still differ on a few things. And I don't think some people think things like barrelmancy is cheese. It's clearly an intended game mechanic where as I do agree the AI can be exploited with stealth which is not an intended game mechanic.

And I have said it before, but I'll add it here. While I call it cheese and that may sound derogatory, it is only meant to be things I disagree with. It is not meant to insult anyone who doesn't play as I do. You paid your $$...play it however you enjoy it with no ill will from me. How you choose to play your game has ZERO impact on my game, so why would I care?
For me, the measure of whether or not something is cheese is, "Would this actually work in a realistic world that isn't run by a computer AI?" or "Would this fly if you were playing D&D with a real Dungeon Master?" If it fails one test, it's moderately cheesy, if it fails both then it's super cheese.

Most of the things you can "get away with" in these games that end up giving you an unfair advantage or trivializing content only work because the game programming is limited and cannot react or adapt to what you are doing. When you are no longer using the rules of the system, but instead abusing the limitations of programming, I think it's cheese.

That being said, people can play their game however they want. As you said. But for many people, knowing that they did something "legit" is important to them.
Posted By: RumRunner151 Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 12/11/20 08:44 AM
Level 1? Screw that and much respect to you. Way too easy to get 1-shoted.
Alice's Super Survivable and Murderous Halfling Priestess of Bhaal with a Dangerous Potion of Hill Giant Strength Addiction
OP build for novelty lvl 1 solo bossmurder

Race: Strongheart Halfling
Class: Cleric of Light
Str: 10
Dex: 16
Con: 16
Int: 8
Wis: 15
Cha: 8
(all that really matters for the stats are at least 14 Dex for +2 AC in medium armor and I guess Con of 14 for 10HP, you can go 16 for a whopping 11HP if you want. You can dump Wis if you want higher str without strength potion abuse. I think you could do an str8, dex14, con14, int8, wis8, cha8 Lvl 1 solo bossrun with not much more difficulty, just buff-sourcing tedium, but im not actually sure if the game lets you not allocate all your statpoints)

Weapon: Burning Axe/Shattered Flail
Shield: Absolute's Warboard
Armor: Scale Male + 1
Helmet: Leather Helm or whatever looks cool
Boots: Boots of Speed
Gloves: Hellrider's Pride
Rings: Whispering Promise and Crusher's Ring
Amulet: Broodmother's Revenge

Max lvl 1 AC of 21
+ Warding Flare, Lucky & Strongheart Resilience
Make sure to stock up on Potions of Hill Giant Strength, Potions of Fire Resistance, and Potions of Speed and regular healthpots to proc your on-heal effects every round; plus stuff for specialist difficult fights.

I'm going to wait for patch 3 to drop now,
Originally Posted by Firesnakearies
For me, the measure of whether or not something is cheese is, "Would this actually work in a realistic world that isn't run by a computer AI?" or "Would this fly if you were playing D&D with a real Dungeon Master?" If it fails one test, it's moderately cheesy, if it fails both then it's super cheese.

Most of the things you can "get away with" in these games that end up giving you an unfair advantage or trivializing content only work because the game programming is limited and cannot react o.r adapt to what you are doing. When you are no longer using the rules of the system, but instead abusing the limitations of programming, I think it's cheese.

Part of the fun of these d&d computer games for me is in breaking them in creative ways - because its just a computer program rather than a living human DM. Like poverty runs, or soloing full tactics mod BGII, or HoF IWD2. Its just fun breaking a mechanical puzzle.
Cursed by her Goddess to relive a neverending hell where every time she dies she reappears in a wilderness camp on the Sword Coast, trapped in a pastiche land of looping npc dialogue and repetitive routines where time stands still at an eternal midday, the lowly priestess alice420blazeit is forced to prove to Vlaakith that this world of pixelated flesh is beneath her, that even creatures mysterious and magical can fall to a single level 1 character. Only once every challenge is defeated will Vlaakith release her from her glitch-prison. But Vlaakith is not easy to please, and has some pretty specific definitions of what counts as "cheese" - somehow alice420blazeit knows that Vlaakith abhors the use of DoS barrels and repetitive stealthy kills: a true champion of Vlaakith fights with the fury of her Goddess.

[Linked Image]
Life has no value except in service of Vlaakith, even Gods will serve or die.

[Linked Image]
My faith in her is my shield

[Linked Image]
And if it bleeds, I will kill it, god or not

[Linked Image]
Even this "god" was as nothing to Vlaakith's servant

[Linked Image]
Death cannot stop me.

[Linked Image]
The final Koa-toa fall. A passable offering to Vlaakith.

[Linked Image]
Pitiful

[Linked Image]
All such altars will be burned. Glory to Vlaakith.


Build:
[Linked Image]
(warding flame seems to glitch out when survival instinct resurrects you. idk why else it might have disapeared from the toggle bar)
Posted By: RumRunner151 Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 12/11/20 10:23 PM
Brag, Brag Brag. LoL Nice work!!
Originally Posted by alice_ashpool

Part of the fun of these d&d computer games for me is in breaking them in creative ways - because its just a computer program rather than a living human DM. Like poverty runs, or soloing full tactics mod BGII, or HoF IWD2. Its just fun breaking a mechanical puzzle.



Yeah, I can see that. I'm not as hardcore into that as you are, but I do like finding ways to limit myself so I can see what can be accomplished within set parameters. It will be really interesting when we get difficulty options, I hope they give us a lot of variation.
Posted By: Ellenhard Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 13/11/20 10:54 AM
I like your cleric run, it's hard soloing without abusing the stealth mechanic.
Did you consider Teahouse' well drinking to add to survivability?

Also, your character being a true fanatic of Vlaakith, do you think she is aware she is actually cheesing it by using Yeenoghu's-imbued weapon? Or you are roleplaying it is as a measure of self-deception, saying to herself it's Frodo/The Ring style?
Originally Posted by Ellenhard
I like your cleric run, it's hard soloing without abusing the stealth mechanic.
Did you consider Teahouse' well drinking to add to survivability?

Also, your character being a true fanatic of Vlaakith, do you think she is aware she is actually cheesing it by using Yeenoghu's-imbued weapon? Or you are roleplaying it is as a measure of self-deception, saying to herself it's Frodo/The Ring style?

I think it could have been done with longsword + 1 with oil of sharpness (gives + 3 damage and + 3 to hit for 100(?) rounds?) which gives cleave as a pretty fun opener. at + 7. No heal on hit though which is a lifesaver even with 15HP. So there would be a lot more potion drinking, which means needing better positioning.

You don't actually need the absolute's warboard since you could just use a scroll if an extra armor of faith was needed. Gloves of Power... probably possible without if you work more to have bless up from heal.

My big mistake in this run was not taking the enemies down in the right order which I now know would be Pooldripp, Hunters & Booal, Fishfodder. I got Pooldripp first but forgot about the hunters, and they will always go for height advantage making your 21AC not so hot any more. With the correct order you might not need to rely on survival instinct to bring me back to life.

So you could try and eliminate flayerpower, absolute gear and the club for a purity priestess version.

I mean I can keep refining it until I eliminate more and more ease of use stuff, but I'm pretty happy with this since i tend to come back to the absurdity of a level 1 character wandering around the underdark walking into a pit filled with fanatical fishpeople surrounded by archers in the first place? Then telling them she is going to fuck them up...? that ain't smart.

Edit: and the teahouse well. Yeah, that would work.
That githyanki post is fire.
Posted By: Ellenhard Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 13/11/20 02:25 PM
Originally Posted by alice_ashpool
Originally Posted by Ellenhard
I like your cleric run, it's hard soloing without abusing the stealth mechanic.
Did you consider Teahouse' well drinking to add to survivability?

Also, your character being a true fanatic of Vlaakith, do you think she is aware she is actually cheesing it by using Yeenoghu's-imbued weapon? Or you are roleplaying it is as a measure of self-deception, saying to herself it's Frodo/The Ring style?

I think it could have been done with longsword + 1 with oil of sharpness (gives + 3 damage and + 3 to hit for 100(?) rounds?) which gives cleave as a pretty fun opener. at + 7. No heal on hit though which is a lifesaver even with 15HP. So there would be a lot more potion drinking, which means needing better positioning.

You don't actually need the absolute's warboard since you could just use a scroll if an extra armor of faith was needed. Gloves of Power... probably possible without if you work more to have bless up from heal.

My big mistake in this run was not taking the enemies down in the right order which I now know would be Pooldripp, Hunters & Booal, Fishfodder. I got Pooldripp first but forgot about the hunters, and they will always go for height advantage making your 21AC not so hot any more. With the correct order you might not need to rely on survival instinct to bring me back to life.

So you could try and eliminate flayerpower, absolute gear and the club for a purity priestess version.

I mean I can keep refining it until I eliminate more and more ease of use stuff, but I'm pretty happy with this since i tend to come back to the absurdity of a level 1 character wandering around the underdark walking into a pit filled with fanatical fishpeople surrounded by archers in the first place? Then telling them she is going to fuck them up...? that ain't smart.

Edit: and the teahouse well. Yeah, that would work.


By the way, when I'm soloing, I'm using my companions which stay in the camp, to provide me with two buffs requiring a Concentration: Shield of Faith and Protection from Evil/Good (and Longstrider to save your own spell slots, if you are leveling them to 4th). Yes, that's cheesing, but it frees up your own concentration, which is huge.

Concerning the absurdity - don't worry, miss M. Sue, you are perfectly fine:P
Originally Posted by Ellenhard

By the way, when I'm soloing, I'm using my companions which stay in the camp, to provide me with two buffs requiring a Concentration: Shield of Faith and Protection from Evil/Good (and Longstrider to save your own spell slots, if you are leveling them to 4th). Yes, that's cheesing, but it frees up your own concentration, which is huge.

lol yeah I think that would trivialize it, since then you could just have another party member concentrate blur on you as well. With 21AC and warding flare you can already go through a round of 12 attacks and none of them hitting you - with blur as well it would be pretty funny + Cast blade ward every other round and stand middle of a fight indefinatly. Aid to increase hp to 15 so you that even if damage gets through you don't get 1 shotted.
Posted By: Ellenhard Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 13/11/20 02:41 PM
Originally Posted by alice_ashpool
Originally Posted by Ellenhard

By the way, when I'm soloing, I'm using my companions which stay in the camp, to provide me with two buffs requiring a Concentration: Shield of Faith and Protection from Evil/Good (and Longstrider to save your own spell slots, if you are leveling them to 4th). Yes, that's cheesing, but it frees up your own concentration, which is huge.

lol yeah I think that would trivialize it, since then you could just have another party member concentrate blur on you as well. With 21AC and warding flare you can already go through a round of 12 attacks and none of them hitting you - with blur as well it would be pretty funny + Cast blade ward every other round and stand middle of a fight indefinably. Aid to increase hp to 15 so you that even if damage gets through you don't get 1 shorted.


Blur won't work - just 10 rounds of fighting, so only as a pre-cast to the fight.
Oh ok, that makes sense.So i think you would just have the combatant concentrate on blur and recast from scroll. Same effect really.
Another cool thing I found is that potion of fire breath attack is bonus action not action, so you can start any fight with three attacks if you want, even if you are not dual wielding.
Posted By: Mezbarrena Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 13/11/20 09:23 PM
I mean, it's cool and all. But you're still cheesing mechanics. Looks a lot like thievery cheese and you're still setting up fights. Cudos to you for doing it and not leveling up. I did a solo run with an Eld Knight and not dump stating. Just enjoy the game how you like and quit sounding like an elites.
Originally Posted by Mezbarrena
But you're still cheesing mechanics. Looks a lot like thievery cheese and you're still setting up fights.

Of course I am, that's part of the joke. the other part is this games joke difficulty har har amirite ladies
The stupidest run yet

2 Person Lvl 1 Poverty Run - Goblin's Camp Assassination Squad

Kill Minthara, Priestess Gut and Dror Razlin because you have a hankering for a party

"Rules"
Must remain level 1 and never level up.
May not abuse concentration to have camp dwellers buff you.
Full Poverty: May not equip use or even pick up any equipment, scrolls, throwables, consumables, nothing at all. Inventory must remain empty.
Equipment Allowed: A robe to protect your modesty, A plain quarterstaff.
May not buy, sell or pickpocket
May not learn spells from scrolls
2 person team. I'm using Shadowheart (with a plain robe and quarterstaff obviously) because she dies constantly but has guiding bolt
No Stealth once you make your first attack

Managed to do Minthara and Gut but Razlin is haaaaard; havent managed to come up with a decent strategy except for stealth yeet off throne which feels very cheap. I can kill him but can't escape before the rest of the squad merk me. If anyone is a top-tier masochist with a fetish for reloading then let me know how you managed this.

Edit: I was running half-wood elf wizard.
Posted By: Lavaeolus Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 13/11/20 10:46 PM
Didn't see this thread! Mentioned elsewhere that I'd done a no-kill run, generally avoiding fights but using KOs to complete quests where some fighting was necessary. (The latter are very few in number, so it's possible to skip fighting altogether if you have some metagame knowledge and don't mind leaving some quests undone.) I think the only "unnecessary" KO I did was on Wyll, who for unknowable reasons turned hostile after the initial goblin raid; after resting off his subsequent head-wound he went back to his normal NPC behaviour. I've since posted a big write-up elsewhere on the forum.

Overall, I won't lie, a lot of times this challenge run isn't amazingly, er, challenging. At least in principle. If you're avoiding combat, your chances of dying in combat go way down! And you can traipse into the Underdark and wrap things up mostly whenever.

Where things get a little more tricky, though, is if you do go into combat. Ranged attacks -- lethal. Opportunity attacks -- lethal. Any damage aside from the Knock Unconscious action -- lethal. When it comes to finishing enemies off, or when they just enter into low enough health for it to be risky, you've got to start tying your hands behind your back. So the harpies were a lot tougher, since they could just fly away at their leisure, and in the big gnoll fight I had to deal with archers slowly walking away during their turns. The fiends! So the fights you commit to become a little trickier.

Aside from that, it's just doing what you can to swing ability checks in your favour or bypass them if possible. Disguise Self is great with the goblins and with the gith, for instance. I got really lucky on this one; I didn't have to save scum much, and the one time I accidentally risked a 20 Target check I just-so-conveniently rolled a 20.
Posted By: RumRunner151 Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 13/11/20 10:46 PM
Originally Posted by Mezbarrena
I mean, it's cool and all. But you're still cheesing mechanics. Looks a lot like thievery cheese and you're still setting up fights. Cudos to you for doing it and not leveling up. I did a solo run with an Eld Knight and not dump stating. Just enjoy the game how you like and quit sounding like an elites.


1) "cheese" is totally subjective.
2) Show me where Alice even implied something elitist.

Just because someone chooses to impose a set of rules to make things more challenging and discuss their accomplishments, does not make them an elitist even if it makes them elite.
Posted By: RumRunner151 Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 13/11/20 10:48 PM
Lavaeolus, you should check out this thread: https://forums.larian.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=731686#Post731686
Originally Posted by alice_ashpool
The stupidest run yet

2 Person Lvl 1 Poverty Run - Goblin's Camp Assassination Squad

Kill Minthara, Priestess Gut and Dror Razlin because you have a hankering for a party

"Rules"
Must remain level 1 and never level up.
May not abuse concentration to have camp dwellers buff you.
Full Poverty: May not equip use or even pick up any equipment, scrolls, throwables, consumables, nothing at all. Inventory must remain empty.
Equipment Allowed: A robe to protect your modesty, A plain quarterstaff.
May not buy, sell or pickpocket
May not learn spells from scrolls
2 person team. I'm using Shadowheart (with a plain robe and quarterstaff obviously) because she dies constantly but has guiding bolt
No Stealth once you make your first attack

Managed to do Minthara and Gut but Razlin is haaaaard; havent managed to come up with a decent strategy except for stealth yeet off throne which feels very cheap. I can kill him but can't escape before the rest of the squad merk me. If anyone is a top-tier masochist with a fetish for reloading then let me know how you managed this.

Edit: I was running half-wood elf wizard.



That sounds really difficult. I'd be interested in doing a full poverty run, but not without leveling up.
Posted By: Illusive Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 15/11/20 05:52 PM
I haven't seen the "well" rested buff (I think the dev's pun was intended) noted or used. Is that considered cheese for lvl 1 runs?
Originally Posted by Illusive
I haven't seen the "well" rested buff (I think the dev's pun was intended) noted or used. Is that considered cheese for lvl 1 runs?

A poster reminded me about it earlier but then I forgot again -_- - Are they temporary HP (false life style) or added HP (Aid style) and if so do they stack with aid?

Personally I don't think its "cheesy" since its a deliberate feature put in the game. Might make my lvl 1 poverty run easier/doable.
Posted By: Illusive Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 15/11/20 06:29 PM
the +10 from Well rested and +5 from Aid stack for a total of +15 hp. Pretty darn OP when I fist discovered it. False life and armor of Agathys overwrite well rested.

Also to note the Well rested buff does bug out, seems to be related to camp dialogue and its a big bummer when it bugs out because you have to reload a much earlier save or it wont apply for the rest of the game.
So for the Lvl1 Poverty run, you could use well + false life/armour of agathys if you have them as spells. For the non poverty run you could add in aid as well from scroll. With a 16CON cleric that looks like it would give you 11 base + 10 well + 5 aid + either 5 armor of agathys or 7 false life. for a max of 26 + 7. That extra 10 from the well might actually trivialize the Lvl 1 "all equipment/consumables allowed" run since since the well + aid HP can be healed with pots.
Posted By: Illusive Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 15/11/20 06:50 PM
Negative false life and agathys overwrite well rested, as in remove it, aka do not stack. They only stack with aid.

Haven't tested battle master rally but that would require toting Lazel around due to short duration of the buff and seems to hinder the solo spirit of the challenge.
Posted By: Lavaeolus Re: Challege RunThread [Pro-gamer zone] - 15/11/20 07:53 PM
So, decided to give a no-items run a quick go, in the simplest terms. Specifically: no using any items, no buying or selling anything, and never equipping anything beyond unenhanced clothing. Look, it was funny running around in my underpants, but it was making the cutscenes a little weird. These rules applied to both PC and companions.

Exceptions:
  • Sometimes items are forced onto you by NPCs, usually as quest rewards. By-and-large, these were quickly dropped on the floor shortly after enterring my inventory, usually directly in front of the NPC.
  • To free Volo, I convinced a goblin to hand me a key and used it to unlock his cage, before discarding it forever. Similarly, the Staff of Crones was picked up so as to be immediately fed to Gale. A dowry ring was picked up to be returned to its owner. Etc. Essentially, the bare minimum of item-interaction to get through quests. I was mostly fine 'using' items like this, although I tried to keep it to a minimum.
  • If you drop Shadowheart's mysterious box, she doesn't say anything, but it seems to keep mysteriously reappearing in your inventory. Spooky.

Enter Anna, wood elf and Cleric of Ilmater. Good Ilmater follower that she is, Anna long-ago swore a vow of poverty. She's a Light Cleric, which seems a little odd given that Ilmater's portfolio is the Life domain, but such are the mysteries of the divine. Other mysteries to ponder: why a Forgotten Realms elf is called Anna.

("Anna the Wood Elf Cleric, lvl 4")
[Linked Image]

Or, for a better look at her face:
[Linked Image]

The first discovery of the run was that the game's female underwear looks kinda weird. As I ran into companions, I was a little unsure how some of the mechanics would shake out. Would Astarion be worth bringing around for Sneak Attack? Nope: Sneak Attack *does* check for if you've got a melee weapon equipped, so no killer-punching allowed. Alas. Less gamechangingly, I also noticed that the Knock Unconscious button had been taken from me.

Unsurprisingly, I ultimately settled on a pretty caster-heavy party: Gale, Shadowheart, and a Wyll spec'd around Eldritch Blast. For the most part, party members were unfortunately left in the nud. I'm gonna be frank: at camp, at night, I felt bad for them. It looked cold. In fact, until I looted a tiefling corpse for some extra robes, I initially introduced myself to Gale by nicking his clothes.

("Gale I'm So So Sorry")
[Linked Image]
I felt a little accused during this cutscene.

[Linked Image]
But I think it was at this point I decided to break my Vow of Abstinence and commit to romancing Gale later.

Since I couldn't use thieves' tools and generally wasn't picking up keys, Gale and Wyll became our new lockpickers -- in as much as blowing up a door counts as unlocking it. In general, my approach to combat involved trying to stay at range and using stealth to start combat in advantageous positions. Otherwise, I didn't do *too much* in the way of cheese, beyond shoving the hag and some goblin leaders into bottomless chasms when given the chance. Hey, if Mithara tries to run up and melee me when I'm standing next to the abyss, can you deny me my Shove? Invisibility was used once, to pickpocket the githyanki creche and solve things 'peacefully'. Otherwise I tried to avoid just outright skipping combat, although I (non-magically) stealthed past some enemies in the Underdark.

In the end, I didn't use the ithilid tadpole at any point. As a Cleric of Ilmater I was, in general, a total goody two-shoes, and took on the goblin leaders personally to relieve the tieflings of having to fight. Having royally pissed off the goblins and not wanting to teleport into a giant fight, I enterred the Underdark through the Whispering Depth. Also, to take the goblin camp pathway I think I'd have to pick up a key and then, like, use the key? That's sort of against my vow, probably.

Overall, build in the right ways and this challenge wasn't as hard as I thought it might be. I thought the low AC might bite me, but two Clerics with Healing Word backed up with sheer offensive blasting made this pretty workable. That said, I might load up the save and do some more in the Underdark, which should have some of the tougher fights; I did some quests there, and I did pretty much everything topside, but when you're in the Underdark, have been at the level cap for half your gametime, and the exit is right there, it's a little tempting to just waltz over and leave. You can do it pretty quickly as well, if you know where you're going.

Originally Posted by RumRunner151

Yep, looked through the thread. It's maybe a little more interesting than what I did in some ways: if you're completing eschewing combat I don't think you really need that many items, so I mostly just stuck with quest completion and following those little non-tracked stories (owlbear cub, etc.) -- but if you're going after all the loot you have a bigger reason to explore around and get involved beyond the bare mimimum.
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