Larian Studios
Posted By: Nyanko Add random encounters please - 19/10/20 10:06 AM
I feel the game would benefit a lot from random encounters in act 1. There are some areas like the underdark, the hag swamp or the gnoll territory which could be the theater of interesting ambushes. Even the areas surrounding the ship could potentially have had some creatures from avernus lurking in the shadows.

It would add unpredictability, thus more challenge than just scooting ahead and prepare. Cause in most cases, it makes the combat far too easy, especially for veteran of DOS and turn based combat in general. So far, the only times my party has been surprised is when the battle starts from a dialogue. And it's kind of saddening. I would like the AI to use more stealth and be more cunning.

And secondly, it would make replays much more exciting in my opinion.
Posted By: endolex Re: Add random encounters please - 19/10/20 10:28 AM
The only place where I could see this happening would be when traveling on the world map (if that is going to be a thing, but looks that way).
Generally I'm not a fan.
Posted By: FatePeddler Re: Add random encounters please - 19/10/20 10:36 AM
Random encounters makes me think of old JRPGs, where they needed to save resources by not displaying the monster encounters. So I'm not a fan of this idea.
Posted By: Dulany67 Re: Add random encounters please - 19/10/20 11:06 AM
In general, Larian does a good job with designing combat encounters. Random encounters negates their ability to design interesting encounters.
Posted By: Black_Elk Re: Add random encounters please - 19/10/20 11:22 AM
Even the most brilliantly designed combat encounter is undermined by metagaming once you've seen it the first time. I was surprised at how little changed in my second playthrough. Every combat interaction so far is scripted. The enemies are always the same, and they always appear in the same location and in the exact same position. To me this diminishes interest far more than it enhances it.

Why shouldn't they be able to design interesting random encounters?

I think they should absolutely add random encounters, at least to fast travel on the map. Its a huge missed opportunity, and frankly a needed offset to the already overpowered waypoint/fast travel system. Right now there is no downside or risk associated with fast travel or camping.

"You have been waylaid by enemies" was a defining feature of the original games.

And not every random encounter needs to be a combat encounter. There could be NPCs with special quests or barter options. They have already introduced a discrete area with the "camp." They could easily create a few dozen similar areas that are only accessible as random encounters from fast traveling.


+1
Posted By: Savuyar Re: Add random encounters please - 20/10/20 11:12 PM
Originally Posted by Black_Elk
Even the most brilliantly designed combat encounter is undermined by metagaming once you've seen it the first time. I was surprised at how little changed in my second playthrough. Every combat interaction so far is scripted. The enemies are always the same, and they always appear in the same location and in the exact same position. To me this diminishes interest far more than it enhances it.


This is very true. I think it would be interesting to at least prepare a roster of characters that would be randomly selected for a given encounter. You know that there's an enemy party in a ruin you're exploring, but suddenly the mage is replaced with a barbarian and you have to adjust your strategy accordingly. Perhaps it would even be possible to have 3 or 4 encounters per dungeon area, so that with each playthrough you have to be on the lookout for new challenges. You expect an enemy party in a deserted library, but what you find is an owlbear etc.

Originally Posted by Black_Elk
Why shouldn't they be able to design interesting random encounters?

Originally Posted by Black_Elk
There could be NPCs with special quests or barter options.


I think Skyrim handled that pretty well, spawning NPC encounters on the road in random places around the map, though it quickly became predictable. Much less predictable than static, scripted encounters though.

Originally Posted by Black_Elk
"You have been waylaid by enemies" was a defining feature of the original games.

I concur, yet I think it's sadly high time to stop referring to the Baldur's Gate games when looking for inspiration to improve upon this new game and just treat it as a new D&D game set in Forgotten Realms.
Posted By: WarBaby2 Re: Add random encounters please - 20/10/20 11:18 PM
Originally Posted by Savuyar
I concur, yet I think it's sadly high time to stop referring to the Baldur's Gate games when looking for inspiration to improve upon this new game and just treat it as a new D&D game set in Forgotten Realms.


Other games do it to this day: POE, Kingmaker, Solasta. Then again, resource management and world map travel aren't really a thing in BG3 right now, so why have random encounters/respawning enemies?
Posted By: Savuyar Re: Add random encounters please - 20/10/20 11:34 PM
Originally Posted by WarBaby2
Originally Posted by Savuyar
I concur, yet I think it's sadly high time to stop referring to the Baldur's Gate games when looking for inspiration to improve upon this new game and just treat it as a new D&D game set in Forgotten Realms.


Other games do it to this day: POE, Kingmaker, Solasta. Then again, resource management and world map travel aren't really a thing in BG3 right now, so why have random encounters/respawning enemies?


What I meant here is that the fact that something is part of the Baldur's Gate games doesn't necessarily mean it will appear in this new game.

With regard to your reply, world map travel meaning travel between load screens may not be a thing here, but you can still have random encounters when your party is travelling within a large area of the overworld. I don't think the idea is to force resource management, it could simply spice up the experience and prevent it from becoming too predictable too soon.
Posted By: JDCrenton Re: Add random encounters please - 20/10/20 11:38 PM
This could be fixed by adding better A.I. and randomizing enemy placement and skillset for all their scripted stuff but i know i'm asking too much from them, lol.
Posted By: Mezbarrena Re: Add random encounters please - 20/10/20 11:42 PM
I think it could be a neat thing to do. Once you have cleared an encounter *a smaller* encounter could occur there again or have any part of the road be an ambush area for bandits/wolves etc. It could be done but would eventually be predictable.
You could even put a bit more randomized magical weapons and armor.
Posted By: Savuyar Re: Add random encounters please - 20/10/20 11:44 PM
Originally Posted by JDCrenton
This could be fixed by adding better A.I. and randomizing enemy placement and skillset for all their scripted stuff but i know i'm asking too much from them, lol.


Why would you consider this to be too much? The benefits for gameplay would be well worth the effort.
Posted By: nation Re: Add random encounters please - 20/10/20 11:47 PM
Originally Posted by Savuyar

Originally Posted by Black_Elk
"You have been waylaid by enemies" was a defining feature of the original games.

I concur, yet I think it's sadly high time to stop referring to the Baldur's Gate games when looking for inspiration to improve upon this new game and just treat it as a new D&D game set in Forgotten Realms.
this, unfortunately - it was always an oh shit moment when you heard the narrator go 'you have been waylaid by enemies and must defend yourself'

there was always the risk of stumbling across a random mob of monsters, or getting caught while fast traveling that required you to manage your resources and learn that certain areas contained more dangerous enemies that were best avoided, particularly at low level. i think the nature of act maps and some of the early balance work larian has implemented works against the idea of random encounters being a thing tho as larian has scripted most events and seems to be balancing around those - frankly, these are two things that also frustrate me in terms of game design. it may not be the final case, but not being able to travel back to the act 1 area seems overly restrictive and the og games never imposed such zones of play that i recall. also, in terms of scripted encounters, i feel like most dialogue interactions have at most 3/4 outcomes regardless of what companion is with you, what pc you create, or what your end goal for the encounter is, with one of those options normally just being attack and fight it out
Posted By: WarBaby2 Re: Add random encounters please - 20/10/20 11:55 PM
Originally Posted by nation
Originally Posted by Savuyar

Originally Posted by Black_Elk
"You have been waylaid by enemies" was a defining feature of the original games.

I concur, yet I think it's sadly high time to stop referring to the Baldur's Gate games when looking for inspiration to improve upon this new game and just treat it as a new D&D game set in Forgotten Realms.
this, unfortunately - it was always an oh shit moment when you heard the narrator go 'you have been waylaid by enemies and must defend yourself'

there was always the risk of stumbling across a random mob of monsters, or getting caught while fast traveling that required you to manage your resources and learn that certain areas contained more dangerous enemies that were best avoided, particularly at low level. i think the nature of act maps and some of the early balance work larian has implemented works against the idea of random encounters being a thing tho as larian has scripted most events and seems to be balancing around those - frankly, these are two things that also frustrate me in terms of game design. it may not be the final case, but not being able to travel back to the act 1 area seems overly restrictive and the og games never imposed such zones of play that i recall. also, in terms of scripted encounters, i feel like most dialogue interactions have at most 3/4 outcomes regardless of what companion is with you, what pc you create, or what your end goal for the encounter is, with one of those options normally just being attack and fight it out


That's because, right now, Larian's idea of a D&D RPG is guided storytelling between setpiece battles... so, not really a RPG in the classical sense at all.
Posted By: Okidoki Re: Add random encounters please - 21/10/20 12:01 AM
Random encounters, oh boy. Are we talking about Roaming enemies?

I wouldn't mind scripted encounters which you can trigger if hidden requirements are met. Like DaO.

Then the trouble is deciding what actually ambushes you. Edit (RNG would determine if it triggers when you walk by the multiple trigger points) Cause in EA, a good portion would be...RANGED GOBLINS AND GNOLLS. HAHAHAHA

Astarion in party could be attacked by Guls, vamp hunters. Ambush starts with a psuedo surprise round where astarion is snared.
Owlbear ambush if killed both baby and owlbear.
Cows in the road "mmOOOOOOOOO?" red caps in disguise.
Steal soul coin (make it so the tieflings dont aggro you automatically) horned devils appear with imps to take it from you.
If you kill goblin camp - true sight and a few goblins ambush you in the name of the absolute.
Shadow druids fought - Rats/animals in the middle of the road. Ambush you when you begin to move away.


Posted By: Vile Re: Add random encounters please - 21/10/20 12:08 AM
Thinking back to the armor system of Divinity Original Sin 2, how the general consensus of feedback was to alter/remove it, and yet it stayed in; I have a sinking feeling that a lot of the fundamental design decisions will yet remain. I doubt there will be random encounters, and that the game will indeed consist of guided storytelling along scripted encounters with a lot of areas that we will see once, then never return to (Once you proceed to the next "act" the entire previous one is completely unavailable).

I do hope to be wrong, I would like to see Larian move outside of their previous designs and expand. I think the game will still be decent for what it is.
Posted By: JDCrenton Re: Add random encounters please - 21/10/20 12:09 AM
Originally Posted by Vile
Thinking back to the armor system of Divinity Original Sin 2, how the general consensus of feedback was to alter/remove it, and yet it stayed in; I have a sinking feeling that a lot of the fundamental design decisions will yet remain. I doubt there will be random encounters, and that the game will indeed consist of guided storytelling along scripted encounters with a lot of areas that we will see once, then never return to (Once you proceed to the next "act" the entire previous one is completely unavailable).

I do hope to be wrong, I would like to see Larian move outside of their previous designs and expand. I think the game will still be decent for what it is.


That's why i wonder why they would want feedback in the first place.
Posted By: vel Re: Add random encounters please - 21/10/20 12:17 AM
A couple of things to be real about:

1. No random encounters is clearly a major design decision, consistent with DOS, and unlikely to change even if Larian is listening.

2. Random encounters almost always just annoy, slowing you from what you want to do, especially in a game with anytime save/load. In an RPG where you grind for levels or gear, e.g. FF or Diablo, it's core to the game.


Changing mob positions, patrols, or other AI strategies would spice things up for replay value.
Posted By: Symphonnarra Re: Add random encounters please - 21/10/20 12:20 AM
whats stopping people from grinding xp threw random encounters, and throwing off the balance of quest and monsters per area. Random encounters would just allow u to out level an area, and should be a penalty like during a long rest. Ive made a post about that titled "suggestion: long resting with no penalty?" if u like to check that out. Moving over long distances would also be a place for random encounters but again should be a bad thing not something to go looking for.
Posted By: JDCrenton Re: Add random encounters please - 21/10/20 12:21 AM
Originally Posted by Symphonnarra
whats stopping people from grinding xp threw random encounters, and throwing off the balance of quest and monsters per area. random encounters would just allow u to out level an area


The same as killing everything without entering battles. You want all those abuses and cheeses but not the other, so funny.
Posted By: IAmPageicus Re: Add random encounters please - 22/10/20 12:05 PM
Random Encounters feel like they are missing. I do not look at it in any other fashion. Skyrim and most RPG's take advantage of this. It makes the world feel lived in like there is something random going on outside of us. Random encounters can be anything. Skyrim has like something new happen every so many feet and a list of over 100 things to choose from that can happen. Every other BG had this and the games that tried to emulate it's success.

Its not a question of "Do we need it." it is a question of "how do we make it refreshing new."

I think the best way is to tie is to not only player choices but character creation and party makeup. So some things are more likely to happen if I am a certain background like criminal. (Bounty hunters appear in the zone)
Posted By: Sadurian Re: Add random encounters please - 22/10/20 12:10 PM
I've never been in favour of random encounters.
Posted By: Mister Monster Re: Add random encounters please - 22/10/20 12:12 PM
+1 bring back random encounters; travelling to another worldspace/to camp/between fast-travel points? %chance to get a random encounter mini-area!
Posted By: Rhobar121 Re: Add random encounters please - 22/10/20 12:31 PM
A random encounters have never been an interesting mechanic.
If they are hard, you feel like you need to rest again.
If they are easy, it's just waste of time.
In the worst case, it will quickly become F5 + F8 before every rest or fast-travel.
Posted By: cgexile Re: Add random encounters please - 22/10/20 12:42 PM
I agree with you. I asked for this when I played DoS games and that never happened because: RPG?

In BG you could get ambushed while trying to rest and and that was about as close to a random encounter as you could get. In BG3 they basically eliminated that (for now so maybe they will fix resting/long resting) because the whole camp idea is just silly in how it's implemented. Camp needs to be where you are in the world and there are multiple threads on that topic.

As much as I'd love to have some ARPG elements inside of these games, I don't think it will ever happen (unless, like I said, they bring back ambush or something like it).
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