Larian Studios
I've played through all of the classes in EA and so far the weakest has been the strength based fighter.
As a heavy armour user, Strength based fighters tend to use Dexterity as a dump stat. Since our Dex adjustment is -1 or 0 bows are not a viable distance weapon.

Some nice throwing axes would go a long way towards giving a strength fighter something to do other than run towards enemies and swing.
Magical throwing axes of returning are always nice too.
Throwing axes and javelins should be included. I don't particularly like it but it does save on micro-managing so since arrows are unlimited, axes and javelins should be unlimited too.
Originally Posted by Alodar
I've played through all of the classes in EA and so far the weakest has been the strength based fighter.

Wholeheartedly disagree!

I play SOLO with 656/1 hours and counting and I assure you, Fighter, specifically Battlemaster, is one of the strongest SOLO builds currently in the game. And if one can solo the current game with a Battlemaster, in full party, Battlemaster is beastmode. The ability to place Frightened on a target/enemy is just so incredible and devastating if it lands. Don't need no throwing weapons when you have the outright ability to use a +1 Heavy Crossbow, one of the best ranged weapons currently in the game, hands down.
+1 I want to be able to RP a hoplite.
Just so you're aware, Bullse, Crossbows, regardless of category, all use your Dexterity. So even your strength-based fighter would benefit from having weapons with the thrown property (Daggers, hand axes, javelins, light hammers, spears and tridents) actually work properly as throwable attack weapons. A video game concession giving them 'returning' for free, or making the returning enchantment common on them would be perfectly acceptable in my opinion.
Agree about more thrown weapons, would love to have a net. Disagree about Dex being a dump stat though. :P
+1
So many interesting options (net, javelin, dagger, hammer, spear, chairs etc.) and we already have throw so it would be nice to improve on this
For strength based character i would like to see them act more with the enviroment (a strong character can pick up a huge rock and throw it to the enemy) - It would fit to larians use the environment to your advantage concept
Originally Posted by Mat22
+1
So many interesting options (net, javelin, dagger, hammer, spear, chairs etc.) and we already have throw so it would be nice to improve on this
For strength based character i would like to see them act more with the enviroment (a strong character can pick up a huge rock and throw it to the enemy) - It would fit to larians use the environment to your advantage concept

Once they are available as NPC's, strength based characters should ALWAYS make sure one or more halflings are in the party, this constitutes proper use of the environment - rocks unnecessary.
True Story.
Originally Posted by Alodar
I've played through all of the classes in EA and so far the weakest has been the strength based fighter.

Meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeh. At least their hitchance is relatively okay.
This dex-bs with the "finesse" weapon seems to be way less effective.
But hey my braindmg is way too high to understand all this wierd mechanics anyway.
+1
Originally Posted by bullse
Originally Posted by Alodar
I've played through all of the classes in EA and so far the weakest has been the strength based fighter.

Wholeheartedly disagree!

I play SOLO with 656/1 hours and counting and I assure you, Fighter, specifically Battlemaster, is one of the strongest SOLO builds currently in the game. And if one can solo the current game with a Battlemaster, in full party, Battlemaster is beastmode. The ability to place Frightened on a target/enemy is just so incredible and devastating if it lands. Don't need no throwing weapons when you have the outright ability to use a +1 Heavy Crossbow, one of the best ranged weapons currently in the game, hands down.

You don't get Battlemaster until level 3 and Heavy crossbow is Dex based.
Running up to things to swing at them for first two levels is dull.

Also long resting after every battle so you always have action surge and full superiority dice isn't how I play the game. Infinite long rests and starting every combat from stealth just make the fights trivial. My first long rest usually isn't until after I've done the Bugbear assassin and the harpies in the Druid Grove and then as sporadically as possible after that.

Regardless, strength based throwing weapons would be a good addition to the game.
If it were up to me I'd make teamwork abilites. Characters would have to be a certain distance between each other and it would cost an action and a bonus action, but you'd get an ability to use depending on the class combination. Like say a wizard and a fighter could get a ability where the wizard can take a spell and put it into the fighters weapon and with the swing you unleash a magic blast depending on the spell and weapon for aoe shape, damage output, and damage type. Another example could be two fighters where one is sword and shield and the other is using a two hander. Sword and shield fighter makes a spring board with a shield to launch the other fighter in the air for a big damage swing that could double as a jump.

I mean you have a team but they don't work together from what I've seen. It would make all classes more fun and make class choice more meaning full. Would indirectly solve the range problem. Maybe. Probably not. Sorry.
As pointed out above STR fighters are very powerful, fighter battlemasters are incredible. Maybe only ambi thieves do more average dps with their 4 attacks/round. Who cares if battlemaster doesn't come til level 3, I am always 3 before I get in the grove. Kill the two cambion adds on the nautiloid and you're level 2 before crashing, grab Shadowheart/Gale, Astarion and Lae'zel and do Jergals temple first and then the gate battle and you're level 3 before entering the grove, 95%+ of act 1 still to go.
Originally Posted by BraveSirRobin
As pointed out above STR fighters are very powerful, fighter battlemasters are incredible. Maybe only ambi thieves do more average dps with their 4 attacks/round. Who cares if battlemaster doesn't come til level 3, I am always 3 before I get in the grove. Kill the two cambion adds on the nautiloid and you're level 2 before crashing, grab Shadowheart/Gale, Astarion and Lae'zel and do Jergals temple first and then the gate battle and you're level 3 before entering the grove, 95%+ of act 1 still to go.

All of which is irrelevant to the request to give strength based warriors an effective distance attack. (one based off strength and not dexterity)
Originally Posted by Alodar
All of which is irrelevant to the request to give strength based warriors an effective distance attack. (one based off strength and not dexterity)

Have you actually played Battlemaster? A properly built Battlemaster, in most cases has 14-16 STR and 14-16 Dex. followed by a high CON. As such, you already have an effective distance attack, it's called Pushing Attack, one for Melee and one for ranged (coupled with a heavy crossbow). Hello? Yeah, that is all we need, more backline fighters/Battlemasters playing ranged verses their true roles, to front line and wreck stuff.........
Originally Posted by bullse
Originally Posted by Alodar
All of which is irrelevant to the request to give strength based warriors an effective distance attack. (one based off strength and not dexterity)

Have you actually played Battlemaster? A properly built Battlemaster, in most cases has 14-16 STR and 14-16 Dex. followed by a high CON. As such, you already have an effective distance attack, it's called Pushing Attack, one for Melee and one for ranged (coupled with a heavy crossbow). Hello? Yeah, that is all we need, more backline fighters/Battlemasters playing ranged verses their true roles, to front line and wreck stuff.........

Thrown weapons generally only have an effective range of 20 with up to 60 at disadvantage. Larian would shorten that like they have the rest of ranged attacks. Why are you against STR characters being able to do something they should be able to?
Originally Posted by bullse
Originally Posted by Alodar
All of which is irrelevant to the request to give strength based warriors an effective distance attack. (one based off strength and not dexterity)

Have you actually played Battlemaster? A properly built Battlemaster, in most cases has 14-16 STR and 14-16 Dex. followed by a high CON. As such, you already have an effective distance attack, it's called Pushing Attack, one for Melee and one for ranged (coupled with a heavy crossbow). Hello? Yeah, that is all we need, more backline fighters/Battlemasters playing ranged verses their true roles, to front line and wreck stuff.........

Have you actually played a Strength based character?
A properly built Strength base character has a Strength of 18 and Con of 18. They wear heavy armor and use Dex as a dump stat(10) as it doesn't add to their armor class.


It would be nice if Strength based characters had an effective distance attack with thrown weapons like they do in D&D.
Originally Posted by Alodar
Originally Posted by bullse
Originally Posted by Alodar
All of which is irrelevant to the request to give strength based warriors an effective distance attack. (one based off strength and not dexterity)

Have you actually played Battlemaster? A properly built Battlemaster, in most cases has 14-16 STR and 14-16 Dex. followed by a high CON. As such, you already have an effective distance attack, it's called Pushing Attack, one for Melee and one for ranged (coupled with a heavy crossbow). Hello? Yeah, that is all we need, more backline fighters/Battlemasters playing ranged verses their true roles, to front line and wreck stuff.........

Have you actually played a Strength based character?
A properly built Strength base character has a Strength of 18 and Con of 18. They wear heavy armor and use Dex as a dump stat(10) as it doesn't add to their armor class.


It would be nice if Strength based characters had an effective distance attack with thrown weapons like they do in D&D.

Played STR based all day long.....solo, you? And I, among others, definitely do NOT need 18 STR to wreck the game......solo. Potions of Hill Giant STR are the bomb and loads of them can be obtained.
Again, you are deflecting from that which has been stated, Fighter class does not need throwing weapons, it already has an effective ranged capability.
Originally Posted by bullse
Originally Posted by Alodar
Originally Posted by bullse
Originally Posted by Alodar
All of which is irrelevant to the request to give strength based warriors an effective distance attack. (one based off strength and not dexterity)

Have you actually played Battlemaster? A properly built Battlemaster, in most cases has 14-16 STR and 14-16 Dex. followed by a high CON. As such, you already have an effective distance attack, it's called Pushing Attack, one for Melee and one for ranged (coupled with a heavy crossbow). Hello? Yeah, that is all we need, more backline fighters/Battlemasters playing ranged verses their true roles, to front line and wreck stuff.........

Have you actually played a Strength based character?
A properly built Strength base character has a Strength of 18 and Con of 18. They wear heavy armor and use Dex as a dump stat(10) as it doesn't add to their armor class.


It would be nice if Strength based characters had an effective distance attack with thrown weapons like they do in D&D.

Played STR based all day long.....solo, you? And I, among others, definitely do NOT need 18 STR to wreck the game......solo. Potions of Hill Giant STR are the bomb and loads of them can be obtained.
Again, you are deflecting from that which has been stated, Fighter class does not need throwing weapons, it already has an effective ranged capability.

That's cool. What if I wanna play a barbarian that chucks axes at people while laughing maniacally? Or a paladin that stands his ground in the center of the battlefield and chucks spears at his enemies, so that he can still run to his wizard to Lay on Hands if he needs to?

Using Strength to throw things is a pretty common strategy. All strength based characters can and should benefit from it. The only argument you've brought to the table is that battle masters are good at fighting, which they are, but they sacrifice other pillars of gameplay for battle superiority. They have access to throwing weapons in 5e, and no one complains that they are OP.
Evandir, you are comparing or equivocating a possible Barbarian class mechanic to justify an all around throw weapon mechanic for all fighter-type classes? Really?
For all classes. Just like all other classes can use any weapon they are proficient with.
Ah, yeah, ok. I am not sure who comes up with these things but I do wonder if the people who are coming up with these things actually think things through.

For example: Battlemaster can solo wreck EA Act 1 with relative ease with either a two-handed weapon (Great Weapons Master) or dual-wielding weapons (Dual wielding master) AND can use a heavy crossbow (easily obtained given one is laying on a table in Druids Grove for the taking) too boot, which in turn, gives the Battlemaster a very effective ranged attack because said class can use Pushing attack at range. Now, let's throw in the ability for the very same class to ALSO be able to use throwing weapons too. Talk about making an already powerful class ..... even more powerful. And if a throwing weapon attack is indeed a mechanic for the Barbarian class, which no other class currently has, but then you give ALL classes the ability to throw weapons, that unique mechanic for the Barbarian class becomes what then? I could go on and on.

Again, who comes up with these things cause assuredly, they are not thinking things through, at all.
Bullse.... again, no-one is talking about a specific class mechanic. No-one mentioned any such thing, except you. They're talking about something which is a base standard part of the game in 5e. Some weapons (as mentioned: Daggers, hand axes, javelins, light hammers, spears and tridents) have a property tag called 'thrown' - this means any character can use them as a throwing weapon by the base rules (generally with fairly short ranges).

The effect of this is that these weapons can be used with your Strength, even at range.
A heavy crossbow, as with all ranged weapons, uses Dexterity.

This is a basic core function of 5e that hasn't, as yet, made it into BG3. It gives characters with higher strength than dexterity a way to fight at range, using their higher score.

So, in terms of 'who comes up with these things', that would be Wizards of the Coast.

Any strength-based character, if they do indeed have higher strength than dex, would stand to benefit from this being put into the game - though in particular it benefits characters that have higher strength, but use heavy armour and leave their dex low

You're saying that the class that you have actively proclaimed as the most powerful class currently in the game, doesn't need that. Maybe not. It also doesn't need armour of any description, but that's not a valid reason to not have it in the game.

You're saying that this isn't necessary if we play the game exactly like you say... perhaps, but most people aren't going to want to play the game exactly as you say - they'll want to play it thousands of other different ways.

So again - why are you against this? "I can wreck house with this particular class and subclass combination, which by the way is the most powerful build choice in the current version of the game, so the fact that I can stomp things with it isn't really saying very much anyway." is not a meaningful argument against the feature.
Originally Posted by bullse
Originally Posted by Alodar
Originally Posted by bullse
Originally Posted by Alodar
All of which is irrelevant to the request to give strength based warriors an effective distance attack. (one based off strength and not dexterity)

Have you actually played Battlemaster? A properly built Battlemaster, in most cases has 14-16 STR and 14-16 Dex. followed by a high CON. As such, you already have an effective distance attack, it's called Pushing Attack, one for Melee and one for ranged (coupled with a heavy crossbow). Hello? Yeah, that is all we need, more backline fighters/Battlemasters playing ranged verses their true roles, to front line and wreck stuff.........

Have you actually played a Strength based character?
A properly built Strength base character has a Strength of 18 and Con of 18. They wear heavy armor and use Dex as a dump stat(10) as it doesn't add to their armor class.


It would be nice if Strength based characters had an effective distance attack with thrown weapons like they do in D&D.

Played STR based all day long.....solo, you? And I, among others, definitely do NOT need 18 STR to wreck the game......solo. Potions of Hill Giant STR are the bomb and loads of them can be obtained.
Again, you are deflecting from that which has been stated, Fighter class does not need throwing weapons, it already has an effective ranged capability.

A Str 14 Dex 14 fighter really isnt a "strength based fighter"...
Originally Posted by Bossk_Hogg
A Str 14 Dex 14 fighter really isnt a "strength based fighter"...

I like the way you low-ended that one too.
14-16, did you miss that? Furthermore, I typically build virtually all my solo Ranger and Fighter builds with 16 STR. But because I have spent 670+ hours testing a sh*tload of SOLO builds, guess what, Boss? I can wreck everything in the current game with 14 STR, have done it with both a fighter and Ranger......again, SOLO!
Originally Posted by bullse
Originally Posted by Bossk_Hogg
A Str 14 Dex 14 fighter really isnt a "strength based fighter"...

I like the way you low-ended that one too.
14-16, did you miss that? Furthermore, I typically build virtually all my solo Ranger and Fighter builds with 16 STR. But because I have spent 670+ hours testing a sh*tload of SOLO builds, guess what, Boss? I can wreck everything in the current game with 14 STR, have done it with both a fighter and Ranger......again, SOLO!

So the answer is no. You have not played a strength based fighter. You play a Battlemaster with a good Dex so you can hit with Dexterity based ranged weapons.
That you can and others can solo with a STR/DEX Battlemaster build is irrelevant to this conversation.

I am asking Larian to implement Strength based throwing weapons so strength based characters have effective options at range.
These options already exist in D&D 5e for all classes and are particularly useful for Strength based fighters, Strength Based Barbarians, Strength based Paladins, and strength based clerics.
Actually, just giving certain weapons the thrown property would be pretty good. A barbarian stacking up on Handaxes to throw as a weapon attack against enemies is in line with 5e, scale with STR or DEX depending on weapon or whichever is higher and it'd translate well to BG3 I think
Originally Posted by Alodar
Originally Posted by bullse
Originally Posted by Bossk_Hogg
A Str 14 Dex 14 fighter really isnt a "strength based fighter"...

I like the way you low-ended that one too.
14-16, did you miss that? Furthermore, I typically build virtually all my solo Ranger and Fighter builds with 16 STR. But because I have spent 670+ hours testing a sh*tload of SOLO builds, guess what, Boss? I can wreck everything in the current game with 14 STR, have done it with both a fighter and Ranger......again, SOLO!

So the answer is no. You have not played a strength based fighter. You play a Battlemaster with a good Dex so you can hit with Dexterity based ranged weapons.
That you can and others can solo with a STR/DEX Battlemaster build is irrelevant to this conversation.

I am asking Larian to implement Strength based throwing weapons so strength based characters have effective options at range.
These options already exist in D&D 5e for all classes and are particularly useful for Strength based fighters, Strength Based Barbarians, Strength based Paladins, and strength based clerics.

W T F are you smoking dude?
I challenge you any day to run SOLO with your alleged STR fighter verses mine, any day. Bet.
When I am stomping literally everything into the dirt with a MAUL how the frak am I a DEX based fighter. About as idiotic of an argument I have ever ever seen on these forums, much appreciated in witnessing, Alodar.
Geezus frakin Christ, do you even remotely understand what is meant by Strength BASED? OMFG.
Originally Posted by bullse
W T F are you smoking dude?
I challenge you any day to run SOLO with your alleged STR fighter verses mine, any day. Bet.
When I am stomping literally everything into the dirt with a MAUL how the frak am I a DEX based fighter. About as idiotic of an argument I have ever ever seen on these forums, much appreciated in witnessing, Alodar.
Geezus frakin Christ, do you even remotely understand what is meant by Strength BASED? OMFG.

Keep it civil, please. This is not the first time your conduct in this regard has been seen lacking.

In addition, this topic was not intended as a podium for bragging.
Since the thread has gotten off track I will repeat my request:

As a heavy armour user, Strength based fighters tend to use Dexterity as a dump stat. Since our Dex adjustment is -1 or 0 bows are not a viable distance weapon.

Some nice throwing axes (or daggers or spears or hammers) would go a long way towards giving a strength fighter something to do other than run towards enemies and swing.
Magical throwing axes of returning are always nice too.
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