I don't know how you're going to convince people that human or Tiefling racials are anywhere near the same degree of useful as elven and shield dwarf racials.

Let's look at Tiefling racials:

2 charisma, 1 intelligence
Darkvision
Fire resistance.

A useless non-combat cantrip or the even more useless mage hand that requires concentration and doesn't even have the strength for its single only use which would be to push enemies off elevation.

Lv3 a melee range fire cone spell that is not even guaranteed to land despite being single use per long rest.

Now let's look at Elven racials:

2 DEX
weapon proficiencies
1 wisdom/intellect or superior dark vision dependind on high elf/wood elf/drow
Immunity to sleep spell, saving throw against charm.
1.5m extra as wood elf and bonus to stealth
Perception bonus.


Now Shield Dwarf racial:

Light & medium armor proficiency. Spellcasters love this, especially when you get a circlet that gives you 18 intellect in EA and can start a caster with 1h+shield.
Bonus HP per level.
Poison resistance and saving throws against poison attacks (Tiefling only has fire resistance, no saving throws against flame attacks).
Weapon proficiencies
+2 constitution, +2 strength
-1.5m speed.

Remind me again why anyone would touch Tiefling or Humans when these other races are overloaded with far more benefits?

Charisma is virtually useful to a single class in EA, while DEX and Constitution are universally useful to all classes, and incredibly powerful since higher initiative and 1 more AC is pretty big and flexible. Even Strength on shield dwarf is more universal than Charisma, because it also functions in whether you can push targets off walls, increases your carrying capacity to deal with inventory clutter as this game showers you with grey items for sale, it allows you to jump further, etc (which mitigates the lesser movement speed of dwarf, since you cover more distance with jump).

They need to do something about racials balance.

Humans are the worst race possible! Just couple of ability points more and nothing else. That couple of points won't benefit you in any way because they would go to abilities that you don't even really need. Also all the male human face models are ugly as hell.

I disagree. I like 16 dext /16 constitution /16 int/cha/wis with casters or 16 str with paladins and such classes.

Maybe not "the best", but I like.

On the other hand fire resistance and poison resistance are only "OP" in a world designed by Larian.

For some reason the male elf gets the face option with the best, manliest statuesque jawline while ironically the humans get mostly baby faces. I'm also envious of the faux hawk hairstyle Githyanki get. Too bad Githyanki males look awful like Betty Spaghetti, you can't take it seriously as a warrior race when they're built like noodles.


Poison resistance is actually pretty useful, because at least in the first act many enemies use poison, and poison carries the additional debuff of debuffing your attack rolls.

Fire resistance is mostly useless because other than halving the damage it does nothing else, and few creatures use fire attacks in Act 1. Even then, halved fire damage but no saving roll bonus against burning is pretty dumb.

I liked male elf faces the most too. There was just one half elf face that was just ok for me but it sucks if your not happy with the way your character looks.

Elves can't grow beards and therefore have the worst faces.

1.) Charisma is useful for persuasion/intimidate checks, and presumably you want your MC to be the Face when talking to NPCs.
2.) As you said, Charisma is incredibly important for Warlocks
2b.) Charisma will be important for Sorcerers and Bards when implemented. Larian shouldn't change racial traits now, just to change them back when these classes are introduced.
3.) Enemies have fire arrows and vials of alchemist fire, so the fire resistance is pretty good. Especially since AI in BG3 focuses on low-AC characters, of which your Tiefling Warlock is probably one of.
4.) Larian has implemented mage hand incredibly poorly. It shouldn't be concentration and you should be able to have it and other summons out. The solution is to fix mage hand, not necessarily buff tieflings.

...but yeah, humans are a bit underpowered. Or maybe not underpowered, but at least less flashy.
Larian should implement the Variant Human, where you get +1/+1 and a feat.

I have beard irl and I'm a fan of beards, but for some reason I don't like any beard style on any face in BG3. Can Larian give every race the option to wear face mask so you don't have to see those ugly faces? Let's pretend that COVID has infected forgotten realms too, mm'kay?

Charisma is a must have for all my characters. I like to do the talking, all the time. I don't want to send a npc in for that. Plus tieflings are cool. So yeah, I probably played more tieflings than any other race.

1) Charisma is totally irrelevant with Guidance and save scumming dialogue rolls anyways. There's not a single persuasion/intimidation check my elven druid had trouble passing, and it would have been even easier if I was Drow.

2) To a single class, and maybe 2 more down the line. That's still out of druid+fighter+rogue+wizard+cleric+sorcerer+warlock+paladin = 3/8 classes it is only relevant for. Dexterity is relevant for all of those.

2b) Let's change the racials, because the result of this racial is you pigeonhole a race to 3 single classes or have your stats go to waste because charisma is worthless in combat if you're not 3/8 of those classes as it currently stands.

3) These are almost never used, and when they are, higher AC is more valuable anyways since you can end up dodging the attack altogether. Furthermore, there are potions which grant you fire resistance, plenty easy to acquire, and these don't stack with the Tiefling racial. There are no potions of dexterity or initiative, and the thing about Dexterity is that it never becomes redundant or has diminishing returns, unlike the fire resistance which has a stack limit.

4) Even if it didn't require concentration, what would it do? Doesn't have enough base strength to even push enemies, and at best you'll be dropping some items on the ground next to your character and have the hand toss it. There's really not much in term of interaction the hand can do for you. Not remotely activate buttons safely or deactivate traps, etc.

Tiefling racials are hot trash. I could understand if the lv3 skill compensated, but it's utterly unreliable, so another Guiding Bolt gimmick in the grand scheme of things. Shield dwarf gets a total of 4 skill points. The least they could do for Tiefling is add +1DEX and bump dark vision to superior dark vision if they're not going to make the lv3 racial spell worthwhile.

1.) I mean, okay, if you bring in savescumming then skills check bonuses don't really matter. But the goal should be to not savescum, right?
2.) Out of 6 stats, 3/8 Charisma classes is overrepresented. I agree that dexterity is an uber-stat that is too OP in 5e, so the classes that don't get it are usually worse (except for Heavy Armor characters). But D&D isn't entirely combat, and especially given BG3's binary pass vs fail of dialogue checks, Charisma is decently important (again, ignoring savescumming because games shouldn't be balanced assuming it)
2b.) If Larian goes the way of Tasha's, where any race can get any +2/+1 bonus, then I could agree that tieflings should be buffed a bit.
3.) I think there should be less consumables in BG3, which somewhat addresses this. But yes, there are no potions of Dex +2
4.) Mage hand should be able to remotely activate traps or pick up items from far away. That's a HUGE use for it in PnP. Stand around the corner and have the mage hand open the chest. Or open barred doors from the other side

X.) Burning hands is a bit useless for a ranged caster I'll admit. Hellish rebuke or darkness would be better.
Edit: Totally forgot about Paladins. They need Charisma too

Dunno ... it seem to me like racials are so far closest to DnD from everything we get ...
So i would like this to stay intact. :-/

All abilities, skills, etc. are irrelevant if you're relying on save scumming. If you roll enough times, you can get what you want. Why is that even part of the conversation?

Four classes use charisma as one of their primary abilities: bard, paladin, sorcerer, and warlock. That's a third of the classes in the PHB. Several subclasses (e.g. swashbuckler, berserker, several martial archetypes) also use it a fair amount. Dexterity is generally not relevant for melee characters that wear heavy armor (mostly clerics, fighters, and paladins). Also, having high dex and high chr are not mutually exclusive.

Not everything is going to be useful in combat. Fighting is part of the game - not the whole game. You can play any race with any class - not getting that +1 to a specific ability modifier out of the gate is such a small deal; it amounts to a 5% lower chance to succeed at any particular check (which, if you're relying on save scumming, isn't relevant anyway) and is easily boosted with ASIs if you want when you hit later levels.

Mage hand is a utility cantrip; it isn't intended for use in combat. There's no reason it should be able to push enemies or throw things at them to deal damage. It should be able to push buttons and pick up light objects. For arcane tricksters, it should be able to pick locks and disarm traps and even distract enemies in combat. It sucks that the implementation of Mage Hand in BG3 is so bad; it's incredibly useful in tabletop D&D.

Dwarves get some decent boosts, but they pay for it with reduced speed, which would actually be really important in combat if positioning were relevant. RAW tieflings are quite good, even if some of the details have been implemented poorly here.

- It's part of the conversation because save scumming a dialogue choice is asymmetrical to save scumming an entire fight. When you say it gives you an advantage to have charisma, it's a marginal advantage to begin with thanks to Guidance. Thus, the non-combat use of Charisma is marginal, and particularly so in Act 1 where resolution without violence usually means letting the psychopath go without a fight.

- Dexterity gives you initiative, and first turn advantage is far more useful than you're pretending it is not. Do the Githyanki patrol fight without first turn advantage and then another one where Beretha and the Raider get first move on your group and then get back to me. Besides, AC is never going to be redundant. 2 DEX is still 1AC and a lesser chance to be hit, heavy armor or not.

- Fighting is virtually the main aspect of the game. The largest difficulty checks in the game involve fighting, so aspects that involve fighting are as a result the most important for a character to have. Often to not fight means either sparing a villain or foregoing a valuable item that mob might have had.

- We can go about how it should have been implemented according to your ideals of a table top game, but the fact is I'm more interested with how it's actually implemented in a videogame that actually takes resources to build and create cohesion with instead of just imagining things and writing them down to pen and paper.

-Reduced speed doesn't matter at all to dwarves if you bothered to read because a) There's amulet of misty step, and b) Jump with +2 strength and athletic boots gives you an immense amount of mobility to address all your closing distance needs. And in case that isn't enough, you have boots of speed to give you a metric ton of movement. And that's the thing with utility/movement, you only need so much of it, in this case the only one necessary to land behind an enemy.





Even in a dedicated warlock build, the famed master of solo's and uber-optimized gameplay, sin tee, doesn't even use a Tiefling. Surprise, it's yet another elf. Who knew, with the incredibly trove of advantages sunk into one race, that +2 stats to a relevant attribute would be hardly worth the trade. It's also why come lv4 most people are not even taking the extra 2 bonus attributes, but instead picking up wizard/warlock initiate or grabbing medium armor proficiency.

I can see why you might take a Tiefling over an Elf depending on class. I don't really see why you would take one over a half-elf. The +2 CHA and +1 to any of the 5 other stats, plus weapon proficiencies, plus skill proficiencies seems like a no-brainer to me...

Which is a shame, because they aesthetically implemented tieflings so well, they look amazing. But their racials are trash can.

Zenith is right that racial abilities in this game aren't perfectly balanced at all.

And that's totally OK.

Part of the issue is the proliferation of spell scrolls and consumables + Larian's Homebrew. If shove only made the minotaur go prone, that fight would have been quite different.

Dex was already a potent stat in 5e and with Larian's homebrew it's even more valuable in Baldur's Gate 3.

So what? Any kind of save scumming is an "I decide to win" button. No one should be designing around that - if they want that to be a feature, they should just add the button and be done with it. If they're not adding the button, it's difficult to care that one kind of save scumming is harder than another. As to the second part, it's a marginal advantage because +1 is a marginal difference - it has nothing to do with Guidance.

Again, we're talking about a +1 difference in your initiative. It's not going to bump you from last to first. At best, you might swap places with a couple of enemies that rolled the same as you. It's almost never going to matter.

Again, my point is that the racial stat bonuses create marginal differences. I play a tiefling when the character that I want to play happens to be a tiefling, not when I want better charisma. The racial bonuses just add a bit of flavor. You're treating them like they're the end of the world.

That you believe this is evident. I disagree - combat is the most boring aspect of the game.

It's a video game that's ostensibly based on a tabletop game that was designed with substantially more rigor and eye towards balance. This isn't about my ideals, it's about WotC having already done the work and Larian making a hash of it.

Humans are great.

I like my human Wizard with 9 / 14 / 14 / 16 / 14 / 12. I like to be good at many different things and have saves that don't suck.

It's a role playing game people. And combat is so easy and exploitable you don't need to milk every little bonus ability and min / max anyway.

I always pick my race based on the stat bonus, and if I could select my stat bonus I'd almost always be a Wood Elf. Tiefling's could use love because Wood Half Elves are so much better as a CHA race, Humans could definitely do with Variant humans being added. So yeah the balance isn't super great. On the other hand racial imbalances kind of pale next to the elephants in the room. Jump, backstab, high ground, shove, barrelmancy. While those exist the tactical layer is so broken as to make other balance concerns irrelevant.

Lets just let it be 5e and mod it from there ya?

This game has some problems, but balances between races is definitively not the biggest problem.

- If you accept save scumming as a reason why one thing is better than the other, then nothing matters at all because there is almost always a small chance of success.
Who cares about class, race, skills, spells or equipment when you reload every time you do not like the result.

- DnD and similar games are never really balanced and that is not a big problem. Most stuff in the game is so easy that almost any char can make it and there are many ways to solve most situations. Play whatever char you like and play them however you like. Having a +1 bonus or not will not make an easy game incredibly hard.

- From my point of view, the problem is not classes or races, but Larians changes to the rules. Stuff like jumping for backstab advantage or missing fire arrows cause a fire surface and damage.

If you do accept save scumming as a reason, then it still matters. A +1 or +2 bonus means you'll have to save scum 5 or 10% less often.

If by mod you mean tweak then yeah I think that makes sense. If you mean mod as in to leave balancing to modders I can't really back you up. BG3 has no GM and is relentlessly played on a battle map. Some abilities in D&D don't translate well to BG3 while others translate extremely well. Also 5E from the players guide is a bit "first draft" but using all the supplemental content is impractical so some choice adjustments make sense. Tieflings received substantial buffs from Mordenkainen and Sword Coast Adventurers after all.

There is definitely a hierarchy when it comes to race power-levels (variant human has sat at S tier for most of 5e Table Top's existence. Whereas in BG3, the highest tier race is probably the Half-Elf). But I don't think the balance has ever been so off that certain races are obsolete.


I think you're underselling Fire Resistance a bit. Fire resistance tends to scale far better than Poison resistance into the late game.

1. Throughout a full campaign, fire damage is generally more common and deadly than poison damage.

Consider this - of all the spells available in the PHB and DMG, there are 22 spells that does fire damage, while only 6 of them do poison damage.

Also note the relatively lower deadliness of the poison spells. Only 3 of 6 of the poison spells are higher than level 1. 2 of the 6 entries for Poison damage are the Prismatic spells (meaning damage type is somewhat randomized / partial). The lvl 5 Cloudkill's is probably the most "deadly" common poison damage spell you'd face, and it's usually far more effective against a dumb AI than a human player that knows to move. Even then, it's only a whopping 5d8 (22.5 average) per round (a level 3 fireball is 6d8 @ 28 avg damage).

In terms of # of monster damage source, the general number is roughly the same 46 for fire vs. 43 for poison. In my experience, those sources of fire damage is usually deadlier (i.e high level fiends), but let's call it a draw in this regard because I only have anecdotal evidence.


2. It's simply easier to get/maintain the Dwarf's Poison resistance vs. a Tiefling's Fire Resistance.

Think of it this way. Mimicking a Dwarve's poison resistance (save + resistance) costs you a level 2 spell slot via Protection Against Poison. It's a non-concentration spell that lasts 1 hour in 5E RAW but until rest in BG3.

Gaining fire resistance like a Tiefling's requires a 3rd level spell called Protection from Energy. It's also 1 hour in RAW 5E, Duration TBD in BG3 - however, it requires concentration to maintain.

In general, it's simply harder to gain and maintain the fire resistance a Tiefling gets. The 4th level Fireshield spell can give you non-concentration fire resistance, but that only lasts 10 minutes (TBD in BG3).


In regards to overall Racial Balance:

The bog standard +1 int / +2 Cha Tiefling is definitely a weaker variant, because their stats do not line up with a single class's needs. However, the Zariel Tiefling (+1 STR / +2 CHA) is a pretty solid choice for Paladins.

Standard Human are definitely one of the weaker races too. Their spread out +1s mainly make them decent choices for multi-attribute dependent classes like Monks or Paladins, or some kind of stat demanding demanding multi-class.

After what I've seen so far from the devs? No, I mean 'mod'. As in, let us decide.

If you compare stats in early access races will feel unbalanced to an extent cause your capped at level 4. Weighting out later play it checks in line more so.

Fire resistance is very strong through later play when you factor spells like fireball ect. Early access thats less of a factor also more tiefling subraces will eventually provide more options and the class choices are more valued in EA. Hopefully we will see racial feats and more half feats as well which will counter balance this.

Shield Dwarves and Githyanki are over powered in early access where there racial benefits make the non melee classes feel much more powerful. Later play that tones down so its less of a factor. Though having stat rolls would also make this feel less important later. Loosing movement is a big set back for dwarves and other small races.

Humans are less wow overall unless you can roll stats that +6 stats overall is kinda meh I do think they should add varient human but its less powerful without the feat choices however it is the only way youll see people play humans more frequently than other races.

Wood Elf has always been a strong choice because 1 extra thing of movement is powerful. That is there biggest + however a +2 dex and +1 wis does give you alot of options class wise currently as not all the races are implimented but in comparison half elf does give alot of options as well. Tieflings are the least appealing personally to me just because I dont really enjoy the race but overall there racials are not bad depending on concept fire damage is the most common damage element overall. Even in bg 3 you see alot of sources of fire damage.

In comparison with other race options with the other races its really matter of class in alot of cases if your not playing and INT based character unless you really want that cantrip or INT based skill checks most likely the Wood Elf will outweigh the High Elf. Same for unless your using a WIS based character shield dwarf in alot of cases will out weight your other option.

Gith and shield dwarves will carry to alot of classes because of armor benefits in early access for power building even with the stat loss. Id even make a shield dwarf mage with as low of an int score as possible because you can off set it with the head band. Halflings you do have the luck trait which is very powerful as an ability there is a reason it is a feat in 5E DND because its powerful.

The biggest push back currently is that wizards being able to cast any spell and being able to change weapons in combat without requiring an action or bonus action takes away from balance I am still hoping to see this fixed as if you let a wizard cast every druid and cleric spell it kinda of takes away from those 2 classes having a purpose. Because if you can just equip an off hand after your attacks in combat consistantly then basically you take away any benefits for someone who wants to Duel wield you just use a 2 hander or bow and change freely at will for the extra attack when you can do it and same goes for a wizard you just cast your spells equip 2 weapons make an attack or cast a damage spell then cast healing word as you need it taking away from those healing classes having alot of bonus action spells that help balance there loss of some of the powerful wizard damage spells. As you do get to higher tiers losing + int or + wis ect for armor becomes less great as your burning feats and stat buffs get that extra stat score racial bonuses are less of a factor at higher levels depending on feats available.

Side note having rolled stats would also play a much larger Impact on classes like monk and barbarian on the melee classes because a barbarian with high str dex con is going to be a powerhouse without armor same with a monk who has high dex wis and con is going to be stronger overall for there unarmored bonus. In case of a fighter having that charisma score to be a factor in conversations while still having a decient range of abilitys for combat becomes important. Adding rolled stats would benefit alot more than changing racials racials are just a minute factor as power increases to higher levels correcting the other things would counter balance this as once you hit 6-8 alot of those racial bonuses start to fade off with the right feat choices. Shadow Touched and Fey Touched Feats can off set alot of ability score losses for casters and feats like slasher, piercer, Medium armor expert ect can off set ability score issues for alot of the melee classes these are things that would make big difference overall in game play and choice for races without min maxing every last thing it would also make adding varient human alot more appealing in early access.

Side note i think that level capping full game release at level 12 - 16 as well would also be a better balance when multi-classing is present currently as the game right now would see more variety with this currently level 20 does hedge out some builds and encourages less multiclassing without alot of thought put into multi-classing though there are some strong builds. Paladin/Hexblade for example or Fighter/Barbarian mixes for critical bonus. Everyone right now is heavy favoring races because low level and other things that need to be corrected to make the game more like 5E DND the largest issues being spell restrictions and weapon swapping which are a much larger issue and should be corrected before the game goes full release or it will cause a much larger imbalance.

You can get resistence against X from potions and you find a lot of those in the game and they last until you rest.

Things are different because of Larians obsession with surfaces.
- If you miss with a fire arrow there will be a fire surface and the target takes damage and burns.
- If you attack a spider it will bleed poison and your melee char suddenly stands in a poison pool.
- I would bet that fire elementals will bleed lava.

I really hate this nonsense.
Jumping close to enemies should provoke AoO and not give advantage.
The game has several abilities that cause ground effects (grease, web, spike groth, . . .) so there is no need to add it to almost everything.

No, you're wrong here in your last statement. The very fact that you are arguing with Zenith who is saying they should prioritise this as a videogame first and foremost, should alert you to the fact that it's not just about slavishly recreating a game that reflects 5e's rules but also appealing to a market who quite frankly aren't that bothered by how accurately they are followed, as long as the game plays well.

What he's saying is undoubtable true too. If you want to optimise your character, certain race/class combinations are clearly better than others. The only real answer to this is you don't have to optimise your character. Tasha's changed this but who knows if they'll add this. He points out the elf and dwarf but in fact for the vast majority of classes that will be introduced the half elf is the obvious go to race for getting the best character.

People seem to think 5e is this perfectly balanced system while forgetting that it is the dm's application of this system that actually balances it. A dm who applies the encounters he uses for a party of intelligent, rules savvy powergamers to a bunch of unoptimized clueless rp'ers will soon find balance issues. Laraian is the dm as well as the developer. And has to make a game that appeals to a massive swathe of people. A lot of whom will want to spend a minimal amount of time learning the intricacies of 5e. And also keep their Larianisms, because believe it or not, they do have actual fans of these. A certain amount of people will expect the cheese in the game and be disappointed if it's not there.

There was even talk about adding a lone wolf mode ffs!

Keeping everybody happy is a lose/lose situation. It can't work, compromises have to be made to appeal to the biggest market possible. I have two big gamer friends one of whom says he'll play BG3 on release. I asked both of them if they would play an rpg where it's baked into the system that even the most optimised character will miss 33% of the time on average. Both said Hell No.

Based on this post, there appears to be 8 in the game. In my current Patch 4 "100%" save I have 6. I likely missed a couple, or there may be a degree to RNG when it comes to loot. Regardless, it's a decent amount if you're only using it for 1 character, but 8 potions will only last the party for 2 rests.

Note, you also cannot stack the resistance potions (but it does work with the spell). So in the EA right now, you can cast the level 2 Protection from Poison spell and drink any other Elemental potion to have 2 resistances.

Yup, I've suggested shoving only make a target prone.

Wouldn't change much, though. In sin tee's solo wizard (shield dwarf wizard) video he goes battlemage and with a 2H hammer since the Minotaurs are weak to bludgeoning damage, he consumes an oil of sharpness and potion of hill giant strength and proceeds to one shot the minotaur with a single swing.

Consumables in this game are hilariously busted.



These people don't care about the market or the game being widely successful and profitable for the company so it gains enough profits to reliably grow. They care about a 3D rendering of their pen and paper game, however much it alienates a large swath of gamers.

And the fact they're even acknowledging all these obnoxious aspects will get modded out, so the game should be left as is happens to tell you everything you need to know.

I may be wrong but I'm pretty sure vendor potions restock after every long rest. I haven't counted who has what at any stage but that basically allows a steady supply if the vendor has the common potions.

Right. I just took a look - the only vendor I can find having fire resistance potion is the Gnome lady in the Underdark (at the Myconid Colony), and she'll restock 1 potion on every long rest.

To be fair, I wouldn't be surprised if the later vendors (i.e. at Baldur's Gate) restocks 3-4 resistance potion that will essentially let the party have resistance to 1 type of elemental damage at all time.



That's because he's using a High Half Elf, who gets +2 CHA and 2x +1 to Any stats (including DEX and CON which a Warlock needs more than INT). Half-Elves are the S-Tier race choice for any CHA-based character, in PnP and this game.



As an unrelated side-note, it's not that Minotaur's are actually weak vs. bludgeoning - one of the two minotaur actually wears a magical necklace (Amulet of the Unworthy) that grants slashing resistance and bludgeoning vulnerability. The other takes normal damage. I guess it's supposed to be the "trick" to the encounter.

....No.
Heavy armor prevents dex from affecting AC. If you have 20 Dex and heavy armor worth X AC, you still only have X AC, no dex boost.
Medium limits you to +2 and Light gives all.
The idea is that everyone gets roughly (but not exactly) the same AC after the dex heavy classes wear light armor, middleground classes wear medium armor, and dex=dump stat classes wear heavy.

Yes, variant human PLEASE!!!!

Just give Tiefling the 2 charisma, a choice of 2 stat allocation, and superior dark vision. Half elf would probably still be better because Fey Ancestry is OP and wood elf 10.5m is also OP, but at least Tiefling wouldn't be so awful.

Humans just need a racial overhaul.

Humans with varient human trait could be argued better than most other races because the extra feat is very very valuable with all feats available I would consider it over other races with the extra feat if you had access to every feat. Secondly fire resistance has a high value stat block. Since fire is again the most common source of damage and does remove the need for consumables in the same way. I mean if you look at consumables in the same aspect light spells compensate for dark vision which they do all have base dark vision and they do gain an additional ability at 5th level for all the tiefling races which is not present in game currently because the level cap is 4...

So your weighting +1 additional stat with a half elf mind you you do have choice currently vs tieflings which do not get full choice currently as all the subraces are not unlocked.
So +1 stat
+save vs charm, immune to sleep (which is less effective later on)
1.5 m movement or a cantrip of your choice

vs

fire resistance - Most common damage type in general.
1 additional spell like ability and another spell like ability you dont have access to at 5th level

Seperate downside note you dont get to chose your 1 ability boost very highly as a tiefling because you lose out on full racial options currently for tieflings as not all subraces are available.

Its not as lacking in balance as you might think if i didnt not like tieflings I could see a reason to consider playing one fairly easily especially with 5th level abilities however i do like the +1.5 m movement a lot because I do prefer playing melee classes and movement matters in that case. In same aspect there are alot of fights in balders gate where everthing around you gets lit up like a xmas tree with fire because well larion likes to use alot of explosive fire items on characters though its tone down from patch 2 pretty deciently its still pretty common.

If your cross compairing them vs shield dwarves currently shield dwarf is going to win because 1 stats are not rolled which they do get that extra +1 overall stat and armor which is pretty big vs losing 1.5 m speed. Depending what you want to do however 16 str and 16 con vs 17 and 17 there is no difference unless if your not taking the feat for +1 to 2 ability scores. If you are well then the dwarf has an edge for that which is where rolling stats would have a larger factor as the game goes futhers because that stat buff could be off set with a half feat well placed.

In the same perspective you do get the +2 cha which as a cha based class the dwarf does not. There are alot of things to weight in there as well as the fact not all sub-races for the classes are present and that does give more options in how you build your setup.

If you really like tieflings well that would weight in and you picking them for there utility and you would be looking more at what subrace is missing that would fill that gap. Additionally humans are op if they add varient human if they do not well yeah humans are not so hot overall for most classes as +2 +1 +1 over weights +1 to all stats. varient humans case your taking it because you want the feat which is a good reason in a lot of cases to take the race early power spikes and stat allocation in a way you want. Much better on caster classes i might consider the default human class slightly better if you were playing paladin / bard or you needed a lot of mid tier ability scores and maybe 1 high score.

Also early access shield dwarf mages are overpowered currently because of the headband of intellect available at low levels a lack of ability score rolling and a lack of levels present. Ability score rolling would negate alot of the benefits to playing the shield dwarf as levels increased. As you could counter balance it with a feat and the default stat block would be even in alot of cases.

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In conclusion
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There is a lot being overlooked. As noted fire resistance is the most common source of damage in dnd and in the bg3 game outside physical damage itself and if your talking pure stats your weighting an ability score diversity not present currently because not all tiefling races are currently available.

This should be the actual discussion.

Character building has definitely taken a back seat while Larian's house rules basically run tactical combat. Which is not very tactical but doing backstabs and getting high ground on repeat. Or cheesing with Stealth.

I mean I want to argue with this but Larian aren't making it particularly easy for me. If Larian can't demonstrate a better understanding of the games balance than they have thus far then it might be better to change as little as possible so as to make modders lives easier. That said they'll have to make some changes to get the interface working so implementing a few extra tweaks via adding existing optional rules and splat is probably still worthwhile.

I tend to always go Wood Elf for rogues, because I can get up to 8 skill proficiencies at level 1. I don't see why humans can't at least get 1 extra skill. An extra feat might be pushing it.

You also have an insanely cheat item very early which is the 18 int circlet and a lot of cheat builds plan around that and since it's insanely easy to cheese everything in this gimmickfest... I still wouldn't pick a shield dwarf even if i wanted to have better AC and Constitution as a min-max mage, i just don't like them for mages lorewise and visualwise. And you can already hp stack like a madman with any race and if you're a wizard.

I mean racial is the least of our problems when you have at least over 9000 homebrew gimmicks that already break the game like crazy and can be abused to infinity and beyond.

There is also dialogue options; if any of the Tiefling stuff in the grove is to go by, being a Tiefling in baldur's gate might have some issues, which a human might not.

Guys, for the 100th time, it's up to the individual to decide whether they want to abuse the game or not. This is same in real life, you want to be a crook and a cheater then so be it, it's your own choice, it's not Larian Studios or Gods fault. In BG1 and 2 you could roll for god like abilities and in BG2 you didn't even have to, you could get perfect god like ability scores right at the start of the game by discarding your strength and charisma and getting two items that max out your strength and charisma right at the beginning of the game.

So because BioWare broke their game 20 years ago with homebrew rule changes and unlimited stat rolling, Larian has carte blanche to do the same now?

Sound logic professor.

That is not true at all.

The game is VERY hard if you don't use any cheats (including backstab, highground bonuses).
Those cheese are EVERYWHERE and the whole game is based arround them. Our job as players is not to try the game 34 times to understand everything and choose what to use or not to custom our playthrough.

Things HAVE to be balanced even if WTF things aren't a problem. Barrelmancy is really a choice for fun. Everything else is not and really matter in the balance of difficulty.

I agree. As someone who looks at stats as a shorthand description of my character, as well as gameplay enablers, I find Sin Tee's build videos useful sources of information, but the prospect of my party leader being of below average intelligence and likeability because her class requires dexterity and wisdom is just not on. Combat bonuses are only one reason to play a particular race. That said, I really look forward to the implementation of stat rolling which may make it easier for folks to make the character they want to play.

As far as i know, Humans was allways weakest Race in all fantasy i know ... maybe except Dragon Age, where city elves seem to be even weaker ...
Human power is not in stats, since individual human is in any matter worse than litteraly any other race, their strength is in numbers.

Humans are actually very powerful when you give them the extra feat at 1st level. But most classes like Wizard, Sorcerer, Barbarian need 3 good ability scores to be stong at high levels and 1 mediorce ability score so you can sacrifice 2 ability scores. So having +6 stats doesnt really do that much for a class overall because 2-3 of those ability score increases do nothing for you at all or not enough to matter at later levels. Varient humam in same aspect getting a +1 to 2 key ability scores and a feat of there choice as well as skill of there choice is tooled to customize to any class and spec making them more useful in overall. I mean at level 1 having duel wielding / great weapon fighting or shadow touched for example and starting the game with a 1st and 2nd level spell would basically make you strong enough to off set any other class option from a flavor perspective and free you up to take more ability score increases later as well. Which is basically +2 +2 to 2 ability scores of your choice basically. which makes varient human stronger than most races.

At least if they are going to pidgeonhole tieflings into caster play, they could have done a +2 CHA/INT/WIS to cover the caster specs, and they would still probably come out worse than a wood elf or any elf for that matter in any of the caster classes because it's hard to beat 1.5 extra movement and better stealth on top of sleep immunity/charm saving throw or superior dark vision for landing spells in the underdark or the extra perception, or the extra proficiencies.

Tieflings needs something more than just fire resistance because CHA +2 is nowhere near enough to not make them a trap race.

And it's always this garbage argument of "you don't need to optimize, this is an RPG", and the answer to that asinine retort is, it's hard to RP freely when you know you're handicapped and notice the handicaps in the gameplay. Besides, if you're so nonchalant about not optimizing, then don't do it yourself; but why do you care if other players want to be able to have many alternative races to be similarly optimized?

It's almost this cultish, religious attachment to "well, these racials are what is in the rule book right now, which means they should remain this way because I want the game to be a 3D rulebook because it's the rulebook". Just because something IS does not mean it OUGHT to be.

Not sure about other settings but Humans dominated D&D through 3.5e. Not sure about 4e. 5e is the edition where humans got the shaft.

Early editions, only humans had unlimited levels in any class. In 3e, they got a free feat and bonuses to skill points and no restrictions to multiclass.

5e humans are pretty weak. It’s like the developers wanted people to move away from humans. Very odd.

Not really, in this game humans seem especially weak because we don't have variant yet. Plenty of people are drawn to the stat flexibility that Human offers, and all the most outrageous character builds I've ever seen actually played have all been Human or Variant Human. Elves got the most 5e love, because the boys at WoTC love Drizzt and want to suck on his toes.

We don't even have Gnomes yet, and I consider them to have stronger racial abilities than Elves.

But Drizzt is a drow, and drow are the worst elf race in terms of racials, so that makes no sense.

Wood elf, half elf, shield dwarf, and githyanki just leave all the other races in the dust.

I'l also say that despite all the talk about charisma's non-combat uses, DEX gives you increased sleight of hand, which is huge for pickpocketing and stealing. This removes a lot of the early difficulty of the game because you can get scale armor +1 and studded leather armor +1 and the Greatsword/Shortbow/Crossbow +1's really early by just pickpocketing the vendors trivially instead of saving up in between quests for the disorbitant prices they ask (I'll also say, as a Tiefling I found it really annoying that the druid halfling gave me a better attitude/discount for being a druid, but the damn Tiefling blacksmith offers me no such racial alignment bonus, and even when I save their sorry asses from the druid, his attitude and price ranges stay the same).

You would think Charisma would also factor into prices offered by vendors, etc, not that it matters because you can just pickpocket and keep all your gold.

Basically, any race without built in proficiencies and DEX, and particularly those saddled with charisma end up worse than the elven counterparts, and for the martial classes wood elf/shield dwarf/githyanki stand head and shoulders over the competition.

Buff Human and Tiefling racials, and maybe also look at Halfling racials as well. Drow also seems ruined by the random Charisma, and you'd think a race who mastered the underdark would be as adept as wood elves in traversing terrain and stealth.

Em .... Hexblade/Paladin also dex is not a huge factor if you were wearing heavy armor. Which can off set the low armor from a lack of dex. If your wearing plate then the bonus to dex means little to nighting you forget not all the classes / subraces are availilable. Drow as hexblades would be a very strong option. Also your talking about pick pocketing they do give you npcs to cover missing skills. Basic human +1 all stats is kinda meh being honest thats true there is a reason varient human was introduced to replace it. Tiefling racials are fine especially once you factor in all the sub-races for class variety. Halfling racials are fine as well the luck racial is really strong.

Races are geared to be preferable to different tool kits. Drow make good rangers, decient dex fighters. Strong Hexblades, above average paladins depending how you want to play a paladin.

Talking basic statistics Wood Elf and Shield dwarf edge alot of the races in early access currently with classes and subclasses available also because they allow weapon swapping for classes and wizards to cast cleric spells which I am sure they do not plan to keep for live release its probably a matter for the spells of just making sure all the stuff is implimented first. same for weapon swapping im sure at some point a bonus action or action will be required to weapon swap as otherwise its unbalanced in favor of shield dwarf mage significantly because it would just be broken they are basically good at everything currently because of those 2 abilities. I disagree with tiefling racials being bad as the game progresses that is less of a factor as well as the fact that fire resistance is alot stronger than most other abilities on net as a default ability however without all the subraces and access to there level 5 spell like abilities they are slightly weaker in early play and for class selection. If your focused on min maxing there is always going to be slight edges based on specific ability score boosts. The non-varient human will be slightly better if your building a jack of all trades style of bard or min maxing on a paladin but will be weaker with classes like fighter and classes that do not need more than 3 decient ability scores to be good. In the same perspective if they add the ability to roll ability scores that + bonus would be less impactful than additional racial benefits as you would only really be looking for 1 - 2 high ability scores 1 decient abilty score and 3 average scores on net for a character.

I will never agree that fire resistance is not a useful ability score as suprised ect your going to benefit from resistance when fire attacks go off taking 5 damage vs taking 10 damage could be the difference in dying and not dying at low levels with all the fire damage currently present even if your using potions constantly the fire resistance still does reduce the incoming damage and there are a limited number of fire resistance potions less than the number of fights where fire damage is present. At the same time most races with key ability score increases are going to be slightly better at lower levels.

For example assuming they fix duel wielding shield dwarf vs half elf as a fighter or human as a fighter ability score wise having 17 str and 17 con at level 4 there is no benefit over having 16 / 16 because the stat bonus is dead even duel wielding. same for great weapon fighting at level 4 the bonus is no difference your still getting +3 / + 3 however if your going to 18 / 18 then the dwarf is slightly better but gives up 1.5 meters movement meaning its going to take longer to reach the target which movement can be an issue playing melee classes. Another reason why weapon swapping should require a action / bonus action to do as other wise ranged weapons do not have a downside which they should vs melee. You should not be able to use a two handed weapon change to 2 1 handed weapons and then change to a weapon and shield before you end your turn all in 1 turn that is a much larger issue than racial benefits allowed those swaps makes racial choice favor races significantly more with different traits same with different classes have more benefits.

A shield dwarf wizard right now in early access is over powered because oh lets take 17 str 14 dex 17 con 8 int 8 wis and whatevers left for cha because you only need the +2 ac you do not need the int because you can just go get the headband of intellect and off set it. You can use better armor and weapons than any other race early out. You can use your 2 hander change to 2 1 handed weapons change to weapon and shield and you take 0 draw backs. so your looking at base ac 19, 21 with shield of faith. You can cast every spell, you can use great weapon fighting, cast 2 spells every turn and just generally out stat any other character. As levels progress that drops off by early levels and with access to all spells and weapon swapping why would you play anything else if you wanted to min max. Extra attack and other features later help off set this but early out its just busted broken overpowered because of level cap and broken mechanics that havent been fixed. Not purely the racials as the power levels of characters increase.

There is no situation in which a Tiefling regardless of subrace doesn't carry a dead 2 charisma stats. The lv3 Racial spell? Does 11-12 damage, about the same as a Shillelagh autoattack with my 1h club, it's pathetic.

I can count on my hand the amount of times fire has been relevant, and it's almost never useful to have the resistance when having more AC and initiative to avoid the attack altogether or get to go first and kill threats quicker produces a far better result.

In fact, that extra 1.5m native to wood elf is pretty damn big for getting into position and eliminating threat, and with how powerful stealth in this game is if you don't abuse invis pots, the proficiency is just the cherry on top.

I'm glad you can pinpoint a few select classes where charisma is relevant, but that's completely ignoring the point that the classes without dedicated charisma/int and more universal stats like DEX/CONST/STR with more widespread out and in combat benefits edge out the rest, and failing that races who can flex around stat allocation follow close.

I mean, unless you literally stood clumped in a barrel, there's not been a single fire threat in early access whatsoever. By comparison, for poison resistance, you have the goblin shamans, the spiders, several mobs in the Underdark including Bulette, the Githyanki raider, the Gnolls. And more relevant than the damage is the attack roll debuff poison applies, which dwarven racials negate.

Drow won't excel in anything besides Hexblade over wood elf, and if you're playing a Hexblade, you'll grab a half elf drow anyways. But that's the smallest gap. The gap between an elf race flexing a CHA class and a Tiefling flexing a non-CHA class is far larger. In the case of a Tiefling druid, you gain nothing of use to your class. In the case of a Wood/High Elf warlock, you still get DEX, immunity to sleep and resistance to charm, Perception, and in the case of wood elf more base movement and stealth, which all classes benefit from.

if the cantrips and acquired spells remotely compensated for Tiefling racials, that might be one thing, but thaumaturgy and mage hand are such a joke of cantrips, and the lv3 spells aren't any better. To add insult to injury, the lv3 spell you get as a Tiefling uses DEXTERITY as the attack/save.

Tiefling's +2 to Charisma is not even Close to Dead as a stat.
Charisma is the casting stat for Bards, Sorcerers, and Warlocks, and helps to make all three of these good face characters.
By a similar logic, Dwarves are horrible because +2 to dex does not work well for a Strength based fighter or heavy armored character.
Or a Gnome's +2 to Intelligence is dead because it doesn't work well for Barbarians.
And in 5e edition, and something I am hoping will be added to BG3, the stats are just recommendations and every race will have a +2 and a +1 they can move anywhere, and even before that there was the Feral Tiefling variant which explicitly increased Dexterity and Int.
(This is more an argument assuming all PHB races and classes get added to BG3)

HOWEVER, I do agree some things are a little broken. First of all, the casting is not supposed to use Dex at all, it is supposed to be a dex save against you charisma spell save DC so if it does actually scale off of the caster's dex, that needs fixing. Furthermore, enemy casters have rarely used firebolt against me or other fire abilities, varying what casters can and will use will help to make every race shine in what resistances they get.

Also I have every update played a Tiefling Warlock cause that is just my thing.

I'm in the camp that thinks D&D should ditch the term Race and replace it with the term Species, in part to get away from Tolkien-esque turns of phrase like "the race of men" or language which sort of worked at that time and in that fantasy universe, but which feel less well suited to 5e D&D. In the Silmarillion it was heavily implied all the Tolkien races eventually converged into humans as time went on, and that the big 3 shared the same essential source in Eru, so it worked. But in Faerun we got all these monstrous races now like Gith and Tiefs and Half-Orcs and such, where it feels like it would make a lot more sense to think of them as different species. I think one consequence of the 3rd ed experiments was to frame the races in such a way where any race could push basically any sort of stat/class build combo they wanted. Even the way ability bonuses are allotted now. All the races feel way more like a riff on 2e Human/Half-Elves. Its cool for flexibility of imagination but does have a way of making Humans kind of boring by comparison lately. Esp as mentioned above without the variants to spice it up. I don't really know what they could do, but I was thinking the other night that there are very few magical equipment type items that have class restrictions in BG3, and I don't think any that have racial restrictions.

That is one way to liven up bonuses in the game that don't necessarily have to be totally baked in to the class/race/ability choices at char creation. BG1/2 used special items/abilities more as a feature of the NPC companion characters rather than for the main PC, companions with their personal amulates or armors or moonblades or whatever. But something similar could be done in BG3 just geared more towards the main PC. I think you can get a lot of mileage out of magical equipment like that which is acquired early on for characters with specific builds. I don't mean like circlets that raise anyone's intelligence to 18, but things that are geared more specifically towards char creation choices tied to being Humans, or Drow, or Dwarves or whatever. Probably not what the OP was driving at, but its another way to try for an entertaining balance achieved more on the go than at the outset.

The benefit is not only the armor class which may be overshadowed if you play heavy armor, but it gives you initiative to be earlier in turns, which is huge in the harder fights and can make the difference between starting a round with Bulette with 2-3 downed or half dead people and getting to CC chain him before he even becomes a threat.

Charisma is a dead stat for anyone but bard/warlock/sorc/paladin, just as intellect is for non-Wizards at the moment, but Dexterity offers you a benefit both inside and outside combat regardless of class you play.

What's more, dexterity's boost to sleight of hand makes your life immensely easy in the early game in BG3 because of the ease of pickpocketing items you would barely be able to afford only after clearing the whole goblin camp. I'm talking about pickpocketing +1 weapons early, pickpocketing the scale +1 armor, the best armor in the game unless you work with the evil Zentharim to get a single Studded leather armor +1. Let's you stock up on lockpicks, disarm traps, the broken as hell potions all rather early and trivially.

But more importantly, it adds to your stealth ability, which is useful to every class and completely busted in BG3 at the moment, there is no price on landing surprise attacks or trivially gaining high ground without needing to waste a spell slot in misty step.

Dexterity also gives you acrobatics, the ability to resist surfaces.

Then you have Strength giving you pushing capacity for the most broken aspect of the game, pushing enemies off cliffs to their deaths, giving you greater jumping distance for mobility.

You see DEX and STR give you not only dialogue perks, but are the only stats to give you universal combat perks.

Charisma and Intelligence do not. At least Wisdom gives you Perception to detect traps and ambushes.

Moreover, tying the Tiefling racial spell to Charisma instead of choosing the highest of your main stats further pigeonholes Tieflings into 4 classes or watch their racials be useless as a result.

What do I gain from Charisma? A mild to moderate boost in persuasion. Too bad the outcome of persuasion is to often let the villain off easy or to find a way to cower out of combat. They could really work to at least balance out the benefits of Charisma/Intelligence/Wisdom by giving secondary combat bonuses like Dexterity any class can make use of in combat. Charisma could make targets less likely to attack you in combat, unless wearing a shield where it would make you more the center of attention. Intellect and Wisdom could have their own perks, like decreasing the potency of certain status effects or improving them by a %. Just something to make those stats not feel like dead stats if you don't pigeonhole yourself to a few classes shoehorned into the race.

As I gave in the example earlier, a Tiefling Druid feels way worse than a Wood Elf warlock, and it's because some races have powerful racials flexible to all the classes while some have mediocre racials or racials that only work with restricted class combinations.

I think part of the issue is how things around Ability Scores have been implemented. Dex is reigning kind because of how easy it is to break certain jmechanics right now, and only one Charisma class is in play. Add on Frends Cantrip (don't get me wrong, I LOVE the change to friends, it makes it no longer so hard to use) AND Shadowheart giving Guidance, and Social Checks have been mostly trivialized when the RNG isn't deciding to constantly screw someone. It isn't so much that the Tiefling racials are weak, but that Larian has deviated from 5e rules that keep things toned back.

Some racials are better and worse than others but often it feels like comparing Apples and Oranges. Racial traits in particular (taking about traits, not ASI right now) can be better suited to one class than another. Post Tasha's ASI has been detached from race, but a race's inclination still remains in my eyes. A Half-Orc or Orc is still better at Fighter and Barbarian, but I don't feel too penalized making a Half-Orc or Orc wizard, even with Savage Attacks being a dead Trait on any Wizard that is not a Bladesinger.
However, going to the earlier thing of Charisma, I don't think it is close to being a dead trait, even on other classes without Tasha's being in play. Many many people use it as a dump stat, but that translates in the character being statistically worse at interactions and the rare charisma saving throw. Charisma for most classes is not a combat stat so people overlook it, but in a Roleplaying FGame, it is still very important.
And with Tiefling's spells scaling off of Charisma, they still are not quite useless when it is a dumped stat. For example, even if Burning Hands Misses because the Tiefling Fighter dumped Charisma, it still ends up doing fire damage OR in table top, can be used more creatively, like making sure to set a tree or house on fire because something is hiding out in it. BG3 unfortunately can not cover every level of creativity, but I think they should do their best to try and reward using combat spells in out of combat manners, making it that even if it is not good in combat because you dumped charisma, it still can be used. And with the larianisms currently in play, a tiefling casting burning hands should have an easy access to surface ignition, and therefor good combat utility right now, which means even if it missess, it can be combo-ed with a spell like web (which is intended to be ignited).
However if I am honest, I don't think leaning on the Larian Surface stuff is a good thing, as it should be toned back and barrels should be far less common.

If you absolutely feel the need to quote a long post, could we ask that you either <snip> it or enclose it in spoiler tags. At the moment, the thread is being buried under a few long posts that are being quoted in full.

To me it seems that Tieflings are there solely for RP reasons. If you want to play an actual build there are still other options available. Speaking of options WHERE IS THE PALADIN?

This is now mostly* off-topic from the thread's topic, but Dex does reign supreme in 5e, with Str and Int being The Dump Statsâ„¢ shortly followed by Charisma. I'd be in favor of returning to earlier editions'/Pathfinder's rules, where
-Str bonus is added to all melee damage rolls unless you take a feat to apply Dex to damage (with finesse weapons only).
-Ranged weapons apply no bonus to damage without a feat and composite bows are brought back into existence (add Str bonus to damage)
-Int bonus gains you additional proficiencies. To prevent an overabundance of proficiencies, maybe not at a 1:1 ratio. Something like: 12 Int gets +1 proficiency, 18 Int gets +2 proficiencies (and 8 Int gets -1 proficiency?).

*Such changes would make the races with Dex bonuses less OP, effectively making all other races-including tieflings-better.

Strength isn't a dump stat anymore when jumping is the ultimate power.

Hey! Don't forget shoving!

You seem to forget that this is a game for a party.

If you have a max dex rogue who can sneak, steal and disarm traps
you can also have a low dex fighter with tons of str and a huge weapon.

This game is not super difficult and unlike earlier editions no race gets penalties, only bonusses.
Play whatever you want, a +1 bonus will not turn an impossible game to a super easy one.

Plus this is not a world of warcraft tournament, its a role playing game.
Min maxers obsessed with solo speed runs might take the same one or two races over and over.
Everybody else can play whatever they want.

Perfect balance cannot be achieved and when you get it, it would be boring.
I am against Larians changes to many rules because they make differences between classes pointless and they force players to repeat the same cheese again and again.
I do not want changes to DnD races because they are not perfectly balanced.

If your talking melee damage as well alot of the better weapons are str weapons even if your duel wielding its something ive commented on many times as being underutilized in 5e is at max level its hard for duel wielding to compete with 2 handed weapons or pole arms. So playing a dex based fighter isnt going to win you any benefits over an str based fighter significantly enough to benefit. The Dex armor cap actually is a good benefit because it limits that also there is a stat cap generally at 20 outside magical boosting to physical stats for most cases at which point charisma there are tombs to boost it meaning you can make hex blade hybrid classes that can get more base damage off charisma. While charisma does not benefit armor class a character with high charisma can utilize that for conversation benefits as well as better utility to spell casting and tool kits from classes with the additional tiefling races you do get utility to use that for different tool racial setups however a class with a +2 in the primary start for that class and a +1 in a secondary stat is always going to have a slight edge for min maxing that class / race to an extent due to ability caps however if you added in rolling to stats then that difference would be less factor on the character because if your rolling stats and you end up with a combination of stats in the 90+ range there isnt really a huge amount of stat increase you can really add to make a difference since you cannot reach over 20 outside magical enhancement there for half feats become more prominant as oppose to ability score increases since ouside that maybe +2 to 1 ability score your really not going to push the +2 as much on other scores. As there are feats that are more useful overall for tool boxing the class with a +1 partial increase long term.

Regarding fire resistance like half the characters in the game use fire surface arrows the one missing your completely in a burning building ... Em all the barrels of oil / gunpowder / firewine... there is alot of stuff does fire damage there is even fire present on the intro. So yeah. There is a decient amount of poison damage mostly with the gith later out and in some of the swamp areas acid / poison = different damage element so that is a point to note.

Some of the really good toolbox tiefling abilities like flame blade which would be great with a warlock, bard or paladin melee tiefling would be great combined with pact weapon. Scimitar and a +1 dex +2 cha boost. There are alot of utilities there could be combined on a barbarian tiefling your talking resistance to slashing piercing bludgeoning fire damage and a potion your basically would have 5 damage resistances. Making you very tanky even against alot of casters. There are plenty of ways to go about designing classes in a way that takes advantage of there stat boosts but taking +1 int +2 wis tiefling race as a barbarian you are not really benefiting from your race if thats the way you want to build it. However Zariel tieflings still get a +1 str and there is another subrace with a +1 con. Additionally outside wyll none of the characters are partcicularly good at charisma checks so having a character with that skill set as the face of the party would make alot of checks easier and less time consuming outside save scumming it and I am sure there will be more difficult checks later not having a character with high cha for certain checks would put you at a disadvantage with. Additionally as a side note drow do have some advantages early access wise in there interactions. Every class typically has 2 dump stats if your playing a class where one of your using a +2 cha race chances are your better off taking things like intimidate or persuasion for conversation skills over insight and perception. So its a matter of what point your aiming for with your build. Because of current EA lacking any option to roll stats playing a Melee class currently with options is probably not going to benefit you much in early levels however as a tiefling until paladin or bard comes out unless they release the hexblade subclass or the +1 con +2 cha tiefling as a barbarian and even then your taking an early game melee damage hit to get the fire resistance. There will always be slight advantages to 1 race/class combination over another.