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#424376 08/11/10 05:16 PM
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When I closed up TF2 yesterday, the usual steam pop-up came up that showcases new games and sales. Like usual, I clicked through it until the end, and was about to close it until I saw a game called Divinity II: The Dragon Knight Saga.

I've been looking for a good PC RPG, having finished Dragon Age recently, so first I looked for reviews. Unfortunately, the game just came out, so I only found the French one. Then I looked for reviews for the first game, and found that it got relatively poor reviews. This tempered my excitement for the game quite a bit, but I thought that DKS might have changed all the negatives.

Now this brings me to my questions: does DKS really change the game enough to warrant buying? The major issues that were brought up in reviews of the previous game were: uninspired visuals, a grind-y nature, and floaty combat. To me, combat and character progression are the two most important parts of an RPG (aside from story), so I can't buy a game if its lacking in either.

After browsing the forums a bit, I've found that Larian has great customer relations, and it is always nice to support a small studio. I figure that I'll find the most glowing recommendations here, so please, tell me why I should buy this game. Also, I don't really care about the 30 fps thing; I'm cool with playing games at 30 fps.

Thank you.

Last edited by Ninja Squirrel; 08/11/10 05:31 PM.
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Originally Posted by Ninja Squirrel
Now this brings me to my questions: does DKS really change the game enough to warrant buying?


Yes.

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I figure that I'll find the most glowing recommendations here, so please, tell me why I should buy this game.


Because it's awesome.

Pros: Higher quality graphics, and animations than Ego Draconis, better combat balancing which aids in the games pacing, revamped ranged combat (missiles no longer home on you except specific special ranged attacks), revamped user interface and user interaction, very good sense of humour and good music which give the game alot of character.

Cons: On PC the FPS are locked at 30FPS (Larian are working on unlocking this for PC players as I type). On the Xbox 360 their can be the odd long load time when exiting buildings.

I played Ego Draconis last year when it was released. I enjoyed it then though it did have its fair share of issues. Larian have pretty much worked on most of those problems and resolved them with Dragon Knight Saga. I would have given Ego Draconis a 7/10, with the improvements Dragon Knight Saga has made I'd give it a 9/10 (both based on the Xbox 360 version).

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Thank you.


You're welcome.

Last edited by Unreal Warfare; 08/11/10 05:31 PM.


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Remember you are reading mainstream reviews for a very "core gamer" title. If you are usually in line with those reviews then yes, perhaps you should be wary, but if you're not then I would say disregard them. A good way to tell would be: did you love Oblivion? If so, maybe you should be wary.

That said the DKS version of Divinity 2 supposedly makes the game much more easy to play for mainstream gamers, so maybe you should read some of the direct feedback on that.

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I'm rather confused as to what you are trying to say. I guess that I'm a mainstream gamer, but I've played indie games before and loved them. I didn't really like Oblivion that much because of the enemies leveling with you (as I said, I like progression), but the combat system was decent.

I really wanted to know how much DKS addressed the issues that faced the original. I'm strongly leaning towards buying it, but I can't find any good reviews for it that address the gameplay changes.

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The writing is varied and stylish, and makes almost every quest interesting.
Even when a mission's structure is simple, you will always be rewarded with an amusing quip or come across something interesting that will shed a different light on your adventure.
Fetch quests are "disguised" as well as can be.
You don't have the complex morality system favored in some other RPGs, but the quality of the quests and the lively character interactions themselves make it a sweeping adventure.

The geography is also well done, you have a real feeling of level design that is sometimes lacking in RPGs.

I have my reservations about the 360 version because of the cumbersome save system and a few other issues, but if you're a PC gamer, it should be a no brainer.

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Originally Posted by masa2009
I have my reservations about the 360 version because of the cumbersome save system.


Unless you're the sort of person who saves their game like every 5 minutes this shouldn't really be an issue, and in all honesty you don't really need to save your game every five minutes as the difficulty curve has been softened anyway. In any event all you have to do is pause the game and scroll up (it's faster than scrolling down) assuming you have used a different section of the menu (like inventory or your logbook) as it remembers the last section of the menu you left the cursor on last.

I honestly see no reason how this is a big deal.



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Originally Posted by Ninja Squirrel

I've been looking for a good PC RPG, having finished Dragon Age recently, so first I looked for reviews. Unfortunately, the game just came out, so I only found the French one. Then I looked for reviews for the first game, and found that it got relatively poor reviews. This tempered my excitement for the game quite a bit, but I thought that DKS might have changed all the negatives.


Very shortly, basic differences with Dragon Age. Scenario is fine, with much more humor than Dragon Age. The scenario seems very basic at first, but get enough twists later on to be unusual enough (you meet the bad guy several times, he never kills you, but you'll find there actually is a reason for that).

In combat you only handle yourself, you can invoke few monsters (2 max ?).
It's classless, so you can have a "warrior" that cast firewall and shot explosive arrows, while handling a two-handed sword. Combat is action-based, so much more lively than Dragon Age (but somewhat less tactical), and you can freeze it with the space key.

Quests are really well made, sometimes with different ways to go through, and different conclusions.

Special stuff : You can transform into a real Dragon and blow up stuff woehoe

Last edited by melianos; 08/11/10 06:00 PM.
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Originally Posted by melianos
you can invoke few monsters (2 max ?).


You can summon three different types of creature (Ghost, Undead, and Demon), summon your own created creature (which you get access to later in the game), and charm several creatures at a time aswell. So you can have a small group of monsters fighting for you.



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At least in D2:ED only one summon could be active at a time, plus your creature and whatever opponents you could charm (never used that spell).

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Originally Posted by Ninja Squirrel
I'm rather confused as to what you are trying to say. I guess that I'm a mainstream gamer, but I've played indie games before and loved them. I didn't really like Oblivion that much because of the enemies leveling with you (as I said, I like progression), but the combat system was decent.

I really wanted to know how much DKS addressed the issues that faced the original. I'm strongly leaning towards buying it, but I can't find any good reviews for it that address the gameplay changes.


I just mainly meant polish and ease of use versus depth. Oblivion appealed to a larger base of people because it was slick and simple, compared to other open-world RPGs before it. If you like RPGs without needing them to be like that though I think Divinity 2 is an under-appreciated and great game in the genre, especially the PC version.

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Originally Posted by Unreal Warfare
Originally Posted by masa2009
I have my reservations about the 360 version because of the cumbersome save system.


Unless you're the sort of person who saves their game like every 5 minutes this shouldn't really be an issue, and in all honesty you don't really need to save your game every five minutes as the difficulty curve has been softened anyway. In any event all you have to do is pause the game and scroll up (it's faster than scrolling down) assuming you have used a different section of the menu (like inventory or your logbook) as it remembers the last section of the menu you left the cursor on last.

I honestly see no reason how this is a big deal.


RPGs like these require to save very often, don't act like it's an oddity to save every 5 minutes.
Players of the PC version, for which the game was designed, do just that.
It's often quoted as a motto of PC RPG gaming, and reviews for the game even state it plainly: "Save often!"
There are plenty of times when you get ambushed by stronger enemies coming from all sides and attacking from afar, and die suddenly.

I'm not the only one who has pointed to the rigid save procedure.
And again, if you look at other recent RPGs like Fallout NV, it has a much more accessible save menu (in addition to non-disrupting checkpoints each time when you enter and get out of every building). Same thing for Gothic 4.
If other games do it, then it must be of interest to a fair number of consumers.

The saving procedure must have taken a certain amount of your own time for you to notice the small advantage of scrolling up versus scrolling down. I didn't even notice.

Last edited by masa2009; 08/11/10 07:07 PM.
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What exactly is the combat system like in DKS? I know that its action oriented, but is it button-mashing, Diablo style combat, timing like The Witcher, or circle-strafing like Oblivion. I know that its based off of the Gamebryo engine, but that doesn't tell me too much.

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Originally Posted by masa2009
RPGs like these require to save very often, don't act like it's an oddity to save every 5 minutes.

Players of the PC version, for which the game was designed, do just that.
It's often quoted as a motto of PC RPG gaming, and reviews for the game even state it plainly: "Save often!"

There are plenty of times when you get ambushed by stronger enemies coming from all sides and attacking from afar, and die suddenly.

I'm not the only one who has pointed to the rigid save procedure.
And again, if you look at other recent RPGs like Fallout NV, it has a much more accessible save menu (in addition to non-disrupting checkpoints each time when you enter and get out of every building). Same thing for Gothic 4.
If other games do it, then it must be of interest to a fair number of consumers.


It is an oddity. Why? because Dragon Knight Saga is just not as hard as Ego Draconis. You don't need to save every five minutes. Making it something you do out of habit than neccesity. Hell even in Fallout I didn't save every five minutes, which was in general a tougher game if you got too far ahead of yourself.

You're also trying to compare the mentality of PC gamers, due to what they are used to on a PC, to console gamers. That just doesn't really cut it here. Not everyone has this stop/start mentality of gaming to the point where they have OCD as to whether they saved the game or not.

You say the save system is inaccessible? What's so hard about pressing Start, pressing Save, and choosing a file to overwrite (which alot of Xbox 360 games also do)? If you are literally stopping and starting eveyr five minutes to save your game you should have no problem with the game saving the cursor point in the main menu for you seems you can use the RS and LB/RB to access potions etc from your inventory, and press Select for your Map. You don't pick great loot up that often to be in the inventory 24/7 either.

Sorry, I feel for you if it bothers you, but I just don't see how in any way it's "inaccessible" (which more describes it as unusable) or as cumbersome as you try to make it out to be.



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Originally Posted by Ninja Squirrel
What exactly is the combat system like in DKS? I know that its action oriented, but is it button-mashing, Diablo style combat, timing like The Witcher, or circle-strafing like Oblivion. I know that its based off of the Gamebryo engine, but that doesn't tell me too much.


It's mainly focused on dodging and keeping yourself moving... there is, to be honest, a lack of strong tactile feedback like physics, but there is also a great sense of fast and agile combat. It's not the best RPG action combat, Oblivion did that very well, but it's still good.

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Originally Posted by Ninja Squirrel
What exactly is the combat system like in DKS? I know that its action oriented, but is it button-mashing, Diablo style combat, timing like The Witcher, or circle-strafing like Oblivion. I know that its based off of the Gamebryo engine, but that doesn't tell me too much.


You got the beginning of the game here, the video starts right with the first fight. You can see better fight later in the video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_9TaC9Pj-A

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Originally Posted by Ninja Squirrel
What exactly is the combat system like in DKS? I know that its action oriented, but is it button-mashing, Diablo style combat, timing like The Witcher, or circle-strafing like Oblivion. I know that its based off of the Gamebryo engine, but that doesn't tell me too much.


it's more or less button mashing, but you can avoid pretty much every kind of attack except a couple select bow skills by dodging out of the way (direction key + jump)

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It looks rather hack and slashy with skills thrown in...
Does DKS improve on the physics a bit, because while it looks cool, the character seems like she just floats around as she fights.


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