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#461517 29/03/13 03:51 AM
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I just discovered this game today and never have played the previous games, so by saying this I don't want to sound like that new guy that comes into a franchise he has never seen or tried trying to change it to something it's not.

Anyway...I am not too keen on the whole turn-based thing. Why is it turn-based? I assume it's because the combat is so deep. You are able to use the environment and elements to your advantage and that might be a bit challenging if everything was real time.

Don't get me wrong, the game looks great and I can't wait to see what more they do with it! But the whole turn-base system turned me away slightly.

fallensinner #461518 29/03/13 04:20 AM
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Yes, essentially turn based allows for more tactical / strategic combat. It can also be better suited to party based games. With parties the character AI may not be very good (and is rarely great), so you might be forced to control a mage so they don't waste mana using powerful spells on weak opponents, or an archer so they don't run around to get a slightly better shot and draw additional opponents into the fight, etc.

Larian has also been trying to make a game with turn based combat for awhile. Beyond Divinity (the second game in the Divinity series) was originally turn based until about 6 months before release, IIRC, when the publisher insisted on real time combat. In that case, though, there were 2 main characters, who (depending on the character builds) could usually be selected and controlled as one. Up to 4 additional party members could be summoned, which could add a lot of pausing to micromanage if you wanted to use them in combat, but they were not that tough, and made better mules than warriors (one could use a crossbow, though, so could provide good support if kept out of melee range).
Original Sin also has 2 main characters, plus an optional 2 henchmen and a couple summons, with much more of an emphasis on combining skills and strategies, taking advantage of the environment, etc.


There will be a demo, so if none of the kickstarter updates alleviate your concerns, you'll be able to try it out for yourself (eventually).


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Raze #461533 29/03/13 03:53 PM
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Thanks for the reply, Raze! The more I watch these videos the more I can not wait for this game.

I watched another video were they showed the combat a bit more and I'm not so much concerned about it anymore. One thing I did noticed is that the players could actually walk somewhere then do an attack. I don't know all about turn-based games, but I assume you are actually able to move your character without losing a turn? I guess I'm just a bit confused on how the turns rotate. Anyway, one other thing. What is "top-down". I heard it in one of their videos; I thought he said "dumb-down"...Hope he didn't. :P

fallensinner #461535 29/03/13 05:04 PM
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Originally Posted by fallensinner
I don't know all about turn-based games, but I assume you are actually able to move your character without losing a turn? I guess I'm just a bit confused on how the turns rotate.
Seeing from the kickstarter video, your characters have a small number of action points (the green dots) that are refilled every combat turn (a turn = everyone used their action points or passed). Any action will cost you a number of action points. Moving seems to cost 1 AP per meter. Perhaps the cost depends on your skills and stats related to the action.

Originally Posted by fallensinner
Anyway, one other thing. What is "top-down". I heard it in one of their videos; I thought he said "dumb-down"...Hope he didn't. :P
Hehe. Top-down simply means that the camera is high above the terrain and characters, looking down (instead of first/third person).

Last edited by Xodetaetl; 29/03/13 05:07 PM.
fallensinner #461536 29/03/13 05:06 PM
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Moving a character costs you action points. If you still have enough left at the end of your turn, you can perform an attack or use an item.

Xodetaetl #461540 29/03/13 05:43 PM
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A higher speed stat lets you move further with the same number of action points. I assume there is some kind of warning or indicator if you move your mouse cursor far enough that walking to that point would use up so many AP that you wouldn't be able to attack when you get there.


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Raze #461543 29/03/13 06:44 PM
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Thanks for the responses everyone! I think I understand the combat system better now. Can't wait to play it to see how I really like it.

fallensinner #461570 30/03/13 01:24 PM
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The turn based system is an initiative system. Exist an option to change the turn based system?

Rei #461571 30/03/13 01:57 PM
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No. The entire combat mechanics and balancing revolves around it being turn-based combat. It can't be changed, even with modding, I imagine.

Stabbey #461586 30/03/13 06:29 PM
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Turn-based combat is great. smile
But I don't like the initiative system. I want my move with all my units, then the enemy move and then the next turn.

Rei #461587 30/03/13 07:14 PM
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That's not how this system works. I'm sure that's intentionally part of the challenge, and it is to add variety to the combat because you won't always be able to just to the same winning strategy and make moves to shut the enemy down completely before they even get a chance to move.

Stabbey #465678 03/05/13 08:44 PM
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I'm disappointed with the turn-based combat decision. I've bought DD, BD and Divinity 2 (Ego Draconis and DKS). Loved supporting Larian and the series, but I do.not.like turned based games. I wish they had just started another franchise if they wished to go turned base. This will be the fist Divinity game I've skipped in over ten years.

Jeffredo #465680 03/05/13 10:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Jeffredo
I'm disappointed with the turn-based combat decision. I've bought DD, BD and Divinity 2 (Ego Draconis and DKS). Loved supporting Larian and the series, but I do.not.like turned based games. I wish they had just started another franchise if they wished to go turned base. This will be the fist Divinity game I've skipped in over ten years.


Can't please everyone, glad you at least gave it at try... rolleyes

Turn based combat quality, just like real-time combat depends on the quality of implementation and it's looking good in that respect if you ask me. But hey, don't let me stop you from judging something that's nowhere near release yet...


* as usual this is imho (unless stated otherwise); feel free to disagree, ignore or try to change my mind. Agreeing with me is ofc also allowed, but makes for much worse flamewarsarguments.

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Originally Posted by Jeffredo
I do.not.like turned based games.
That's kind of a bold statement. There's a lot of different types of turned based mechanics. The contrast between fallout, final fantasy VI, resonance of fate, ultima and final fantasy XIII is pretty big, i could even picture someone liking the gameplay of fallout but hating FFVI, liking ultima but disliking resonance of fate or someone loving fantasy XIII an... Well, maybe not the last one. I'm not calling you a liar, you obviously know better about your own personal taste than a stranger in the internet, but there's a lot of variety within the genre and maybe there's something for you in it.

Jeffredo #465698 04/05/13 05:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Jeffredo
I'm disappointed with the turn-based combat decision. I've bought DD, BD and Divinity 2 (Ego Draconis and DKS). Loved supporting Larian and the series, but I do.not.like turned based games. I wish they had just started another franchise if they wished to go turned base. This will be the fist Divinity game I've skipped in over ten years.


If you've bought BD, you might as well like this game.

I know from your perspective that you'll keep a blind eye on the gameplay and focus on the story line. Hope you reconsider though. Are you in anyway going to skip DC (Divinity: Dragon Commander) also? It's a hybrid of mount and blade and Total War Series. RTS battles w/ active engagement on the battlefield and TBS campaign map.


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henryv #466037 09/05/13 04:00 PM
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Well, the turn based tactical combat is a extremely good choice since the genre is pretty much dead for the PC market.

Why is it a good choice? Well, look at it from this perspective.

a) Think of it as a new experience. The game will make you to actually think instead of spamming left-mouse button to attack.
b) Tactical turn based combat system is the original RPG method of playing.
c) There's nothing wrong with it, give it a try!
d) The game was originally made to be with this system so arguments against it are irrelevant, to say the least.
e) It's keeping you awake, actually. Action combat based on pressing right-click for movement and left click for attacking can be very tiresome. Like this you'll play like a sir. Literally. Almost like a chess game.

Mr.Milky #466046 09/05/13 06:05 PM
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Really agree with the b> QUOTE --Tactical turn based combat system is the original RPG method of playing.


AkashD #466056 09/05/13 08:37 PM
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I don't really like strategy much but I like turn based games like Wizardry 8 etc. Maybe if you give it a go you'll like it?? I think for multiplayer it will be a lot of relaxed fun. I do tend to be a singleplayer but I'm open to try it and other multiplayer turnbased games I've tried have been too restrictive....making players wait for each other, this looks a lot better thought out.

Catelee2u #466065 10/05/13 12:07 AM
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There is no "golden way" how to make a combat system for CRPGs. You can mainly go two ways: real time or turn-based. One has more action, the other more strategy. Both are valid mechanics you just have to decide for one..... wink


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LordCrash #466089 10/05/13 01:16 PM
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Or go with RTwP, that is, real time with pause - which actually is a perfectly fine mix between the two. smile


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