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Hiver Offline OP
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I just had about fifteen fights with it. With my lvl 7, three members party.
The thing is either completely broken and bonkers, or completely insane.

I dont even know where to start.


The controller! - it either doesnt work or malfunctions or someone had a completely wrong idea and never actually tried to play all that.
I have that, i have the book. I send one invisible character to sneak right behind Sparkmaster. Ive tried every command in the book. Multiple times.

I can deactivate it completely. It just keels over and then there is no loot. Ok, maybe thats intended and you dont get the loot because you solved the problem that easily. Fine.

Berserk mode does nothing, he attacks me all the same.

Party mode does nothing at all. Except it notices me and attacks me.

I can deactivate the controller though. Gee thanks! That works!


Deactivate Weapons doesnt do anything. His first move is empty, then in second he throws up oil over me, then sets me on fire and then hits me - all in that one single turn - with that yellow disk glowing over its head signifying i had "deactivated its weapons". Then on the next turn it is fully operational.

Jahan can cast rain and turn off those first fires - but that doesnt work on any subsequent fires that Sparkmaster throws every godamn turn. Even though the rain is still falling.

In every turn he can flamethrow, spew oil, hit someone with that claw which creates crippled effect and then flamethrow me or those people again.
I think he even does damage by stepping onto someone.

If we fail a save and start burning that lowers whatever fire resistance i had to -20.

My character APs disappear even though there is no effect on them, just from getting burned. (they also disappear when he cripples anyone with that physical attack or vomits oil over us, which makes us slowed down)

It is mostly resistant to curses, blind effects, stun or anything else. From weapons or spells.

It has at least a thousand HP.

I can slow it but that doesnt do much or lasts long.

I can try to "deactivate weapons" every single turn but that only makes that first attack empty - with three more attacks fully effective, working, inside that same turn.

And it bloody gets two turns while i get turns for the whole party. My first char - Sparkmaster - my two other characters - Sparkmaster - my first character turn - SparkMaster - and so on.

I can kill it but there is no bloody way i can save those guys, not even a single one. They all burn like matchsticks.




- Extra feature -

If i make it self destruct and save all the guys, the other Source Hunter comments its a shame because we didnt save them.

And i can pull the camera out of bounds of the area so i partially see all other underground locations are sections of that same map.



-edit-

There is a way to win the fight and save the other men.

It requires one character to stay back and out of the fight. Because those guys just follow one of my characters.

And really, why would they follow me into the fight? When i meet them they say how far over their heads they are and how dangerous Sparkmaster is - and then run straight into it?

Without me even convincing them to do so for some reason.

They just do.

And i have no way of keeping them from running straight into it but by such a fake, meta way as seeing which characters they tag onto and then abusing that.



Last edited by Hiver; 01/06/14 09:30 AM.
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Well, it seems there is only one way to fight the Sparkmaster.

Leave one main character behind with the ... civilians. take the rest forward and start the fight head on. Try to stun it or freeze it. Use summons to draw its attention away.
All these barely work and mostly dont.


My original mistake was that i tried to sneak right behind it - with invisible-sneaking character - and then use the controller.

That would only make it attack that character, repeatedly, regardless of the commands to go berserk or to "disable weapons" which "works" as well as i described it. It takes away only the first of the four attacks it can do in a turn.

The rain spell only extinguishes fire that was there before. Any subsequent fires are unaffected by rain that is still falling. If i use rain spell or scroll again - it only affects fire that is already burning, not any of the subsequent ones.
As the fire is malfunctioning in general - it creates additional problems of its own.

The blitz bolt and headspike do not produce stun of blindness status effects on it.

Blast of cold and ice arrows freeze it. (it seems blast of cold now freezes anyone wet, not necessarily chilled). Stunning arrows do stun it.
(if you dont have any of those, youre pretty much fu... fudged)

Ice spikes do nothing.
Its resistant to fire and poison.

And then you have those recruits running straight into it despite everything they say about it previously - despite way out being easily accessible, behind us - which they should use, instead of running after one of my characters and joining the fight.


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Yeah the Sparkmaster has never worked quite right for me. The control has only ever detonated it, and as you say that gives no loot. The deactivate / party mode commands don't seem to work.

Its definitely much tougher than it used to be, especially if you are trying to keep those 3 guys alive.


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Perhaps your party was just too weak to save all the villagers involved. Rethink your battle strategy or party composition.

For my part I succeeded in winning the fight without much a scratch with a lvl 5 party:

lvl5 Knight (main char):

Leadership and Charisma focused character. Leadership gives terrific combat bonuses to the whole group AND to the villagers. Knight has access to Cure wounds which can fully restore a villagers HP bar. Also has access to Ranger abilities and scrolls to reposition and remove crippled status.

lvl5 Shadowblade (main char):
Raistlin specced Shadowblade that also has a splash into Pyrokinetic. Uses Fast Track to haste himself. Pyro grants access to Wildfire and Witchcraft grants access to Oath of Desecration. Equipped with an Ice-damage Rondel that costs 2AP per attack, this guy gets 4 to 7 attack in per turn depending on spell use or not. Also uses Rain scrolls when necessary to put out fire. Also chills the SparkMaster whenever possible. Also uses Wildfire scrolls on Jahan to keep his AP gain very high and Minor Heal scrolls on villagers when needed. Uses anti-burning scrolls on self.

lvl5 Madora (Two Handed high STR specced, pure specced into Warrior skills):
Most useless in this fight as AP gain is low and damage is low because of no elemental weapon. Can withstand high amount of damage however and doesnt require much healing/buffing.

lvl5 Jahan (1 Dip into Geomancer, very high int/con build): Gets Wildfired by Shadowblade on first turn granting massive AP gain. Thro Chills the SparkMaster whenenever possible. Uses Blitzbolt every turn along with Rain whenever required to put out fire. Also comes equipped with scrolls of Rain to put out every single fire. Also uses Minor Heals on villagers. Uses Fortify on Shadowblade to ensure he does not take critical physical damage.

As you can see, this fight becomes cake when ur sufficiently prepared (tons of scrolls, proper buffing/leadership party). My villagers outsustain and outlasts the SparkMaster!

Last edited by Naj; 02/06/14 01:44 PM.
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Hiver Offline OP
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My party was lvl seven Naj, and ive been through the whole beta about ten times so far, including a run with only two Source hunters - without lonewolf or raistlin talents.

Maybe you should rethink your mental strategy?

Also - your reading strategy might be long overdue for a complete overhaul.
Here is an advice... - read more then titles.

Sounds strange, i know. But it really works, man!

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From what I read, you could not save all the villagers without having 1 of ur main chars stay away with the villagers.

Here I am offering a another perspective into that fight. Take it or not, my group of lvl 5 succeeded in direct confrontation with SparkMaster without breaking a sweat or losing a villager and without high lvl 7 spells, compared to your lvl 7 group.

And you're not the only one to have run through this game without Lonewolf/Raistlin with 2 chars only, mind you.

Last edited by Naj; 02/06/14 02:22 PM.
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Im surprised you managed to do this without at least some of the 3 guys dying. They are weak as shit, and the AOE spells the sparkmaster cast knocks them all to half hp in one combat turn.

I've facerolled it, but the guys always die if they get involved.

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Hiver Offline OP
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Yes, yes, you are soooo cool maaan.
Youre specifically built and specced party, with all those pre-aranged spells and items and equipment. And you call that "without breaking a sweat" - because you are so eager to show what an awesome fighter you are.

Fascinating.

I did go through that fight, and managed to keep all the towns people (its a town, not a village) without all those numerous spells you mentioned and that preparation and those specific builds.
Mostly because berserk order suddenly worked in one fight - started from a different position.
Which caused Sparkmaster to attack empty space in a turn or two.
And because blast of cold spell suddenly freezes each time i use it - even though there is no chilled effect on Sparkmaster.



But this is not really a contest of who is a better fighter.

The point of my post was to show how constrained the encounter is and what doesnt work in it.
In what exact ways.

If the rain is continuously falling - i should not be required to throw rain every single time Sparkmaster uses fire - which is two times per turn. and it has double turns compared to my party.

Blitz bolts do not stun it, headvice does not blind it - rain or not.

I should not be required to specifically boost jahans AP with specific spells just so i can throw a few more spells or scrolls in every turn.

I should have more APs when status effects disappear from my characters.

Deactivate weapons order should bloody deactivate them - atleast for a turn.
Berserk should work regardless from which position i use it.

The towns people should not run straight into it - they should instead run out of the cave.
According to what they say themselves.

Or their starting positions should be changed so i would actually NEED to save them for a REASON.


I should not be required to write these same things repeatedly just because you are quick to jump to conclusions and then run to show what an awesome fighter you are - either.

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What you're asking for is basically an easier encounter though.

And I am so against that idea of making a computer opponent easier! How many games have become boring just because of whiny casual players.

I want a game that thrives on difficulty, that makes the unprepared players weak and miserable, that forces the player to TRULY think and become a good tactician!!!

Please don't nerf the game, please look at different strategies to tackle your obstacles!

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no one here wants the encounter nerfed. The problem is, that the controller is not working correctly, the encounter should actually be hard (and even harder if you don't use the controller AND want to save the npcs), but it should work as intended, what it is not in the current build.

all in all, beta is beta.


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Quote
What you're asking for is basically an easier encounter though.

that bull...t above exists only in your head.

You are telling me ... what i am thinking?

- If you want to have a normal conversation with me i suggest you check your telepathic privileges and then stop inventing what i am thinking and then replying to yourself, basically.




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Quote
But this is not really a contest of who is a better fighter.

The point of my post was to show how constrained the encounter is and what doesnt work in it.
In what exact ways.

If the rain is continuously falling - i should not be required to throw rain every single time Sparkmaster uses fire - which is two times per turn. and it has double turns compared to my party.

Blitz bolts do not stun it, headvice does not blind it - rain or not.

I should not be required to specifically boost jahans AP with specific spells just so i can throw a few more spells or scrolls in every turn.

I should have more APs when status effects disappear from my characters.

Deactivate weapons order should bloody deactivate them - atleast for a turn.
Berserk should work regardless from which position i use it.

The towns people should not run straight into it - they should instead run out of the cave.
According to what they say themselves.

Or their starting positions should be changed so i would actually NEED to save them for a REASON.


The thing is: if you fix any of this, you make the encounter easier, hence nerfing it.

Ask yourself: what if everything is working as intended. What if the controller was not supposed to always work. What if the SparkMaster is immune to certain spell effects (because it actually is immune to fire spells and vulnerable to air spells while immune to most CC effects)?


I see your analytical skills are terrible, which makes you think I am a telepath.

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Hiver Offline OP
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I already told you that air spells do not cause any status effects on it, (being immune to fire has nothing to do with that) - which is obviously buggy and ive written it atleast three times already, but youre just so stupid that you cant read or are not capable of understanding what you are reading.

Im not going to repeat all the other things once more again - seeing how you are not capable of understanding even such simple facts. All because of that burning desire of your little ego to be the one who is "better". Which is laughable, pathetic and completely useless for this subject or issue.


/

As for "seeing" things and analytical capabilities ...


The thing is, if the devs fix any of that then the encounter would actually work as intended.
And actually fit the story and narrative that presents it.

The encounter hardness should not come out of bugs and malfunctions, or from falsely represented info. Nor should the sense of achievement come from abusing the obvious buggs in the system, and or deficiencies in the encounter itself.



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You make a valid point that 'The encounter hardness should not come out of bugs and malfunctions, or from falsely represented info. Nor should the sense of achievement come from abusing the obvious buggs in the system.'

However, in RPGs, what you read in a book should not always be what is supposed to be truth. Ahru says himself that the robot he created escaped his control. If his Great Wizardness could not succesfully control his creation through the controller, what makes you think mere Source Hunters could?

This is called analytical reading, which you obviously lack. And you thinking that the only way to save the townspeople without abusing the system by having a main char stay away with the townspeople is a definite proof that your tactical skills still need improvement, am I right?

I did what you could not, without breaking a sweat, with a lower level party and without abusing the system like you did. Call me a moron, but I'm still tactically better than you at this game.

Last edited by Naj; 02/06/14 04:28 PM.
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No, thats not called "analytical reading", but it may be called "anal reading" in your case.

Arhu actually says that his Sparkmaster attained a will of his own, a consciousness of his own.
Which, if you could read with anything but your backside, would be very clear to you.

He also never mentions trying to use the controller on it himself - which is another of your anal fabrications.
He actually says he has no time for it - since he is very busy with actually important stuff - which is the reason he gives you the controller.


Opposite of all that, we see a sparkmaster being ridden by some undead. Under their... "control". For some unexplained reason. (i think its just for lulz, btw) Something we never hear about or see before or after that one case.

Which doesnt fit even with your wrong misunderstanding and misinterpretation of Sprkmaster getting "out of control". Naturally you will try to counter this by simply pulling out another invention of "undead being able to control Arhu mechanical contraptions" - which is as useless, incoherent and nonsensical as the rest of your posts and anal logic.
(that would be as in "anal fixation", according to dr. Freud btw, before anyone accuses me of using curse words, mkay?)



Quote
I did what you could not, without breaking a sweat, with a lower level party and without abusing the system like you did. Call me a moron, but I'm still tactically better than you at this game.


What you did there is easily and factually confirmed what i said about you previously is really true. And, by the way...to win that encounter - you did abuse the bugs and deficiencies of that encounter. However unwittingly.

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Originally Posted by Hiver
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What you're asking for is basically an easier encounter though.

that bull...t above exists only in your head.

You are telling me ... what i am thinking?



Why do you attack people? Just say why you don't agree, but you make it personal.

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Coz personal attacks on the internet are safe and you can't get your posterier handed to you, that's why.

I beat Sparky at level 6 and saved the 3 amigos. I have an archer though, with high speed, and so he can hit the robot with slow arrows and those seem to work. I had him split, and ahead of the rest of the party. I start combat by lighting the whole area on fire by taking out the barrels of oil with fire arrows from the ramp. That doesn't hurt Sparky, but it kills the undead support and it stops the stupid amigos from running straight up to Sparkzilla and getting killed.

I totally agree with Hiver though, that the controller needs to be fixed or taken out of the game.

Last edited by crpgnut; 02/06/14 05:32 PM.

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You sure sound like a vulgar person though. Calling me moron and now using anal... really? Pretty sure that's against forum regulations. If you want to insult me, keep it classy at least.

There is no mention that he did not use the controller on it. And the Sparkmaster attaining a will of its own is exactly the reason why it went out of control in the first place. Sure the undead is for lulz, that much we can agree on.

To win that encounter, I fought it head-on unlike a coward like you who actually had a main char stay behind.

My point remains that any change made to the game that would be lower its difficulty should be frowned upon. Enough games cattle to the the casual audience. Let's for once have a tactically challenging game for once.

And I challenge you to play the game by only using 1 character. Pretty sure very few people have actually had the dedication to try that out.

And finally you are right, I care about being tactically better than you. It's what drives me to play strategy and war games. To compare to my peers.

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No word "moron" in any of my posts above, but i am sure sorry i removed it.

Originally Posted by Horrorscope
Why do you attack people? Just say why you don't agree, but you make it personal.


Why do you use an obvious ad hominem fallacy to paint me as someone who "attacks people" instead of at least bothering to read the argument and seeing that i am actually nice to someone who is basically inventing incoherent, nonsensical issues and arguing against his own inventions and ludicrous nonsensical lies and logical failures, that he uses as strawman argument that somehow i said or was actually thinking - all in idiotic desire to paint himself as "a better player" then me - which he admits himself directly?

Which has absolutely nothing to do with the thread or the issue i described.

You know why? Because you are too lazy to actually read and think for yourself.




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Originally Posted by crpgnut
I totally agree with Hiver though, that the controller needs to be fixed or taken out of the game.


Yeah the issue is valid, but I don't think he notices how abrasive he is.

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