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One turn or two maybe three, god forbid... -runs around screaming- Whatever shall we do if the fight lasts even just one turn more! Oh my god NOOOOOO! Just the thought of that makes me squirm.

/Mockery

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This is the max you can get with 2h level 20 scythe. The only way you can get more is either have higher item level or have a crafted item, which will have lower other stats. But then same applies to 1h as well. I haven't seen a single boss I can't kill in 1 turn with meteor or 1h. So now we're in purely hypothetical territory. What if the boss has wings and can fly? You won't be able to hit it with melee! What is its a hugeass robot shooting lasers from its eyes? That's really scary.

Now if we're theorycrafting 1h > 2h statwise because while dealing only slightly less damage, you are able to use a shield, which can increase your survivability at least by 100%, more likely by 400% or smth.

Last edited by MadDemiurg; 22/08/14 06:10 AM.
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If you don't care how long the fight lasts, the best build in the game is pretty obvious.

1 handed + shield
rank 5 shield
rank 5 bodybuilding
rank 5 willpower
rank 5 man-at-arms
leech
weather the storm
picture of health
comeback kid

You won't even come close to losing. No matter what the fight is, you're only several dozen turns away from victory.

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journeyman
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No that is the not the max you can get damage wise for lvl 20 legendary scythe. And there is no way you can get that scythe in game. I am not talking about the damage. I am talking about the 2 elemental types AND tenebrium. The only item with such kind of state is the unique dagger Snakebite. Plus, if you acquire that the conventional way, it should be quite obvious that the damage in none of those slots are maxed. Unless you use something that tells you that those were max. I call BS on te scythe.

Slightly less damage? Go read my post again, not only bosses and AOE and stuffs . 20% being slightly less then 2 h is ike a C is a slightly less an A. lulz

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I find that rogues (or any backstabber) is incredibly powerful. Give it some haste, make it go to town. Too close to die -> walk with the shadows.

Some people say rangers are good too (btw havent read this thread yet) but cant say I would agree that much. Maybe they spam the custom arrows all the time? Not sure, I use them but only when I feel pressured to do so. I always worry that I will need those arrows in the future (which ends up with me stockpiling some of them :P ).

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Originally Posted by haxingW
No that is the not the max you can get damage wise for lvl 20 legendary scythe. And there is no way you can get that scythe in game. I am not talking about the damage. I am talking about the 2 elemental types AND tenebrium. The only item with such kind of state is the unique dagger Snakebite. Plus, if you acquire that the conventional way, it should be quite obvious that the damage in none of those slots are maxed. Unless you use something that tells you that those were max. I call BS on te scythe.

Slightly less damage? Go read my post again, not only bosses and AOE and stuffs . 20% being slightly less then 2 h is ike a C is a slightly less an A. lulz



I indeed made both items with the editor specifically for this showcase :), so maybe you can't find one with 2 elemental types conventionally. But that makes me sure that damage on all the slots IS maxed, because I've put the best possible damage modifiers on both and then added blacksmithing and enchants on top. Anyway, the point of this is that damage ratio stays the same no matter how much buffs you put on top of it.

80% is more like B than C.

I've read your post again and it still didn't make any sense, you're describing some purely theoretical stuff which doesn't happen in the game atm. Again, if speaking from purely theoretical perspective, if enemies in the game actually did serious damage 1h >>> 2h. Survivability bonus of 1h is much larger than damage bonus of 2h. If two builds were to fight, 1h would beat the crap out of 2h. AOE is indeed better on 2h, then again spell AOE is even better.

Now, if only the absolute possible max damage is what interests you, I can easily show that rogue with backstabs will outdamage 50% crit 2h. So going by that logic 2h is now useless?

Btw, everyone and their mother has slashing and crushing resistance in Dark forest after the last patch, so yay for damage type equality.

Anyway, I'm kinda done arguing, since it becomes less and less constructive and I have better things to do. People who read the thread will decide for themselves who made a better point.

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You seem to love theorycrafting even with flawed theories. Case in point. That scythe is not the max you can get. The ax may not even possible, and it has no crit m8. Take that into account too if you want to talk about the long run DPS race. You see, I actually play the game and find those items. I know what is reasonable possible. The second you post that, I smelled BS.

93 is an A. 73 is a C. Lava core is 100. Besides, if the class is that easy that everyone can make 100, that dude with 80 will surely get a C or less.

You are still hanging on "all 8 meteors will hit all the targets I want and there really are 8 meteors because the game says so." The damage to kill everything with WW is important because you can use it only once per battle. Also shield defense is useless if you are KD, stunted, blind etc... My hard enemies = those that can land CC all the time. The fight then, as always, comes down to who has the most initiative and can move first and has the most speed. Next you want to obliterate as much enemies as possible. With that in mind, that "only 20+% less" is laughable.
"Only one or two or three more turns" lulz


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Originally Posted by dirigible
If you don't care how long the fight lasts, the best build in the game is pretty obvious.

1 handed + shield
rank 5 shield
rank 5 bodybuilding
rank 5 willpower
rank 5 man-at-arms
leech
weather the storm
picture of health
comeback kid

You won't even come close to losing. No matter what the fight is, you're only several dozen turns away from victory.


This build no longer functions in the latest patch.
Leech does next to nothing anymore (flat 15 hp on your turn only in combat, does not scale with level/hp), and no longer combos with comeback kid.

Weather the Storm no longer has any effect past level 10 or so, since your gear will cap out your resists at 80.

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Originally Posted by strider24seven
[quote=dirigible]Weather the Storm no longer has any effect past level 10 or so, since your gear will cap out your resists at 80.

Why's that? Why can't you instead choose equipment that gives you other stats besides resists?

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It is likely that armor, sarong, shield, amulet/rings will get you to 80% even when you are not trying.

With kind regards,

Rashar.

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Originally Posted by Mangoose
Originally Posted by strider24seven
[quote=dirigible]Weather the Storm no longer has any effect past level 10 or so, since your gear will cap out your resists at 80.

Why's that? Why can't you instead choose equipment that gives you other stats besides resists?


Generally speaking, unless you are trying a naked challenge, you will max out your resists before you leave Cyseal if you choose to use rare/magical/legendary gear. Unless you have terrible luck with the RNG.

Edit: This is without rubies/essences, and without talents like Weather the Storm and Zombie, and does not count Tenebrium resist.

Last edited by strider24seven; 23/08/14 09:27 PM.
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Originally Posted by strider24seven
Originally Posted by Mangoose
Originally Posted by strider24seven
[quote=dirigible]Weather the Storm no longer has any effect past level 10 or so, since your gear will cap out your resists at 80.

Why's that? Why can't you instead choose equipment that gives you other stats besides resists?


Generally speaking, unless you are trying a naked challenge, you will max out your resists before you leave Cyseal if you choose to use rare/magical/legendary gear. Unless you have terrible luck with the RNG.

Edit: This is without rubies/essences, and without talents like Weather the Storm and Zombie, and does not count Tenebrium resist.

Only if you choose resist gear instead of +Attribute gear...

Besides, I'm not even close to 80% resist and I'm at level 14.

Last edited by Mangoose; 24/08/14 01:07 AM.
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Originally Posted by Mangoose
Besides, I'm not even close to 80% resist and I'm at level 14.


Then there are several possiblities:
a) You have ignored most of the chests and merchants in the greater Cyseal/Luculla area
b) You are extremely unlucky with the RNG
c) The people I play with, including myself, are extremely lucky with the RNG

I would not presume a) to be the case until you state otherwise, and since my sample size for c) is reasonable (n>30), I suspect b) to be the case.

To remedy this, either play the game a lot more... or start savescumming.

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I just finished a game with both Rogue and Ranger in my team, they are far from underpowered. They dealt great damage throughout the game.

1) Rogue

He may have weak attack, but backstab always doubles your damage. Even if sometimes its not that much, it is still very good in most situations. Just try to keep him a little safer. Also he can spam his attacks a lot, so in many occasions he dealt over 50% of HP in one enemy than my 2H tank. Having full sneak means 4x damage per attack with only 3 points. Give him a 10AP worth of speed and make circles killing the squishes. Also, his bomb ability is usefull as hell. Spawn that thing and teleport it with jahan. Laugh your ass out

2) Ranger, a little weak at first but she have have dealt the most damage out of everyone overall. Her 2 damaging abilities are great to use(not ricochet). I never used her special arrows because i was satisfied with her damage.

3) My "secrets"

Lots of Stun, Knock down etc etc, bully in Madora, Rogue and Ranger helped their overall damage a lot. Also charm on both rogue and ranger is very helpfull. Take 2 enemies 90% of time and laugh.

Jahan, having freeze as well is always helpfull. The less enemies you take care of at one time, the easier it gets.

Really, even on hard i found my ranger and rogue to be very powerfull and usefull, in both Direct and Indirect ways.

Last edited by Kolopaper; 24/08/14 11:55 PM.
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apprentice
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Interesting.
BTW: What's wrong with Ricochet? I've heard it knocked before but it looks OK "on paper" Is there something not obvious?

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Nothing "wrong" with ricochet, it is one of the 11 expert marksman skills you eventually want.

However single target "auto" attacks are in most situations better because they cost only 3AP (with quickdraw) and they add elemental damage from your weapon. So compared to ricochet it's total damage the auto attacks will usually do more damage in total and in general it's better to focus the damage on 1 enemy at a time. (while either ignoring or cc-ing the others.)

The possible advantage ricochet has is that it does not require a to hit roll, so it can not miss. Another relatively small (dis)advantage is that it is based on weapon damage, so it gets better when you use crossbows.

With kind regards,

Rashar.

Last edited by Rashar; 25/08/14 01:05 AM.
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Thanks, that was a very concise explanation.

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