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I've noticed that a lot of the time I need one more Action Point than required for a melee attack...I thought I had most of the game mechanics figured out, but this one eludes me.

For example, Madora will walk up to a mob and attack for 4 Attack Points. However, the next attack will cost 5. She is NOT in power stance (unlearned the skill for something else), she is NOT under any neg effects, and she does NOT need to move any closer, and she is the same level of her weapon. And yet, the game still taxes me for Action Points for some reason I cannot figure out. It's really annoying when I've calculated my turn and still come up short of AP for no apparent reason that I can't anticipate at all. It's left me in a some pretty dire situations when I've prepared Madora for a killing blow but all she can do is stand there, staring at her last 4 Attack Points wondering what's going on...then she dies.

This seems to only happen with melee attacks, casters and bows calculate AP properly. Fortunately I'm running a caster-heavy team right now so it's not that big a deal...I really want to try a melee-heavy approach at some point but this is really putting me off.

Has anyone else experienced this? Any explanation?

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Maybe it happens when your character need to turn to hit, when he isn't facing the enemy? Or he need to move only a little, so little that it's barely noticeable.

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Originally Posted by Shaki
Maybe it happens when your character need to turn to hit, when he isn't facing the enemy? Or he need to move only a little, so little that it's barely noticeable.


I would suspect this except for the fact that it often happens on the second attack in a row. Meaning, Madora has already approached the enemy and attacked once for 4AP, the second attack will sometimes cost 5AP. Unless her first attack actually staggers the enemy back 1 step?

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could she have the obedient trait and have moved out of range of leader?

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Power stance makes attacks cost 1 extra AP. Using a weapon above your level costs extra AP. Various debuffs can cause a lack of AP. Heavy armor increases the cost of movement. Just some thoughts.

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Originally Posted by Vedros
Power stance makes attacks cost 1 extra AP. Using a weapon above your level costs extra AP. Various debuffs can cause a lack of AP. Heavy armor increases the cost of movement. Just some thoughts.


Did you read my post?

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Originally Posted by DragonCommander
could she have the obedient trait and have moved out of range of leader?


One of my mains has the Leadership talent, so that is definitely in effect (although Madora doesn't have Obedient trait, she actually has no traits because she's a for-hire NPC). I always thought Leader-in-sight affected just damage and initiative (turn order). Does it have an effect on AP?

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Originally Posted by mrvile
Originally Posted by Vedros
Power stance makes attacks cost 1 extra AP. Using a weapon above your level costs extra AP. Various debuffs can cause a lack of AP. Heavy armor increases the cost of movement. Just some thoughts.


Did you read my post?


Yes. I think you're overlooking something.

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Originally Posted by Vedros
Originally Posted by mrvile
Originally Posted by Vedros
Power stance makes attacks cost 1 extra AP. Using a weapon above your level costs extra AP. Various debuffs can cause a lack of AP. Heavy armor increases the cost of movement. Just some thoughts.


Did you read my post?


Yes. I think you're overlooking something.


Okay, I'll humor you.

I am looking at my character screen now...Madora does not know Power Stance, so that can't be it. She is level 7 with a level 7 Scythe (req: 4AP), so that can't be it. The last time this happened the first thing I assumed was that she was under some neg effect (which I've seen increase AP cost in the past, I'm aware of this), but she was totally healthy. She's wearing a Light Mail Armour type which actually gives her +0.1 movement, and she has 2 points in Armour Specialist, so I wouldn't assume this to be the issue either.

The weirdest thing about this is that it has happened during times when I have two back-to-back attacks queued up in the same turn...the first attack costs 4, the second attack costs 5. That makes it really hard to figure out what's happening...perhaps it's a bug?

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Originally Posted by mrvile
Originally Posted by DragonCommander
could she have the obedient trait and have moved out of range of leader?


One of my mains has the Leadership talent, so that is definitely in effect (although Madora doesn't have Obedient trait, she actually has no traits because she's a for-hire NPC). I always thought Leader-in-sight affected just damage and initiative (turn order). Does it have an effect on AP?


isnt madora a companion and companions have traits?

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Originally Posted by DragonCommander
Originally Posted by mrvile
Originally Posted by DragonCommander
could she have the obedient trait and have moved out of range of leader?


One of my mains has the Leadership talent, so that is definitely in effect (although Madora doesn't have Obedient trait, she actually has no traits because she's a for-hire NPC). I always thought Leader-in-sight affected just damage and initiative (turn order). Does it have an effect on AP?


isnt madora a companion and companions have traits?


Well both Madora's and Jahan's "Traits" panels are empty, like completely blank. My two mains have a variety of Traits, but the two NPCs do not. Are NPCs supposed to develop social Traits throughout the game as well? Is my game broke?

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Originally Posted by mrvile
I've noticed that a lot of the time I need one more Action Point than required for a melee attack...I thought I had most of the game mechanics figured out, but this one eludes me.

For example, Madora will walk up to a mob and attack for 4 Attack Points. However, the next attack will cost 5. She is NOT in power stance (unlearned the skill for something else), she is NOT under any neg effects, and she does NOT need to move any closer, and she is the same level of her weapon. And yet, the game still taxes me for Action Points for some reason I cannot figure out. It's really annoying when I've calculated my turn and still come up short of AP for no apparent reason that I can't anticipate at all. It's left me in a some pretty dire situations when I've prepared Madora for a killing blow but all she can do is stand there, staring at her last 4 Attack Points wondering what's going on...then she dies.

This seems to only happen with melee attacks, casters and bows calculate AP properly. Fortunately I'm running a caster-heavy team right now so it's not that big a deal...I really want to try a melee-heavy approach at some point but this is really putting me off.

Has anyone else experienced this? Any explanation?


There's an issue with AI pathfinding that allows PC's to attack a creature that they are not within range of (in melee). The PC is probably an inch away from the attack range causing the game engine to think that the PC needs to move 1 AP towards the target (when really, the PC doesn't move anywhere at all), so the total action cost is +1 what is normal.

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Originally Posted by Haleseen

There's an issue with AI pathfinding that allows PC's to attack a creature that they are not within range of (in melee). The PC is probably an inch away from the attack range causing the game engine to think that the PC needs to move 1 AP towards the target (when really, the PC doesn't move anywhere at all), so the total action cost is +1 what is normal.


Ahh, that explains it. It looks like the game first allows me to attack for 4AP thinking that I'm within range, but the second attack realizes that I'm not and requires me to move 1AP further. This seems like it's a fairly rough bug to play around for melee players, I hope it gets resolved soon!

Thanks.

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mrvile isn't crazy, I've got this exact issue with a rogue + long_dagger.
Game was showing 3AP attack instead of 2AP.
Reason why because I was just a bit too far from the monster.
So I just move myself from 2 pixel in the monster direction and got back my 2AP cost.

In fact I have a video of this issue in my twitch stream archive.

So maybe it's a feature not a bug ?

Last edited by Huyt; 17/07/14 03:35 PM.
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It's an annoying bug. I've had this problem occur post-launch with Madora. She had not moved for several turns, and the only debuff she had on her was "wet". And yet it cost her 5 AP to swing her weapon (instead of 4) from a stationary position for most of the battle.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

As you can see, the cost on the weapon is 4 AP, but the game is charging me 5 AP instead (and that character and elemental had not moved for a few turns). I've had it happen to me several times on different melee characters for no apparent reason.

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The only thing I have experienced is the game claiming I need 1 more AP and refusing to let me do the action if I don't have that 1 more AP, but never actually consuming the 1 extra AP it claims to require when it actually doesn't.

I also have a problem with the skillbook, which I had been regularly using, where I needed 1-2 more than the required AP to use anything in the skillbook. It simply would never let me use a skill from the skillbook if I had the exact amount of AP required. Using the skills from the skillbar would never experience this problem, so I ended up moving things on and off the bar to use them. Again, it never actually consumed more than the proper amount of AP.

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I experienced same situation before, when I move my melee character to attack someone, the second attack costs 1 extra AP, no idea why this is caused anyway frown

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where can you report such bugs?

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Originally Posted by mrvile

This seems to only happen with melee attacks, casters and bows calculate AP properly. Fortunately I'm running a caster-heavy team right now so it's not that big a deal...I really want to try a melee-heavy approach at some point but this is really putting me off.

Has anyone else experienced this? Any explanation?


I think I've had this happen with a crossbow as well. I shot once with a crossbow for 7 AP, and for the next shot the game reported I needed 8 AP. If I remember correctly.

As for melee... I'm not sure, but it seems to me that characters sometimes move a few pixels after being hit. Sometimes a character is next to fire/poison for example, gets hit and suddenly bursts into flames. But I don't know, maybe they already were in the fire in the first place.

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You can work around this by never moving+attacking within one action.

Instead, move your melee attacker very close (circle overlap if possible) to the enemy you want to attack, then initiate the attack separately.

This way you should not have this problem, I know for one I haven't.


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