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Originally Posted by strider24seven


I actually rather like this idea. Customizable difficulty would be an interesting idea.


Or just make it part of the "hard" difficulty setting.

I do think it should be possible to get 100% resists, if only with spells/potions, just because a lot of the game seems balanced around that being possible.

I also really, really want to know if it's a bug or an actual design decision. When things aren't in the patch notes like this I don't know whether I should restart or can keep playing or what because I don't know what the intended rules are.

My guess is that the 80% resist cap was part of a test build that accidentally got pushed live. It's a decent idea in the abstract but obviously something that wasn't fully tested (if it had been, they'd have found the issue with Zombie, the pyro pbaoes, elemental affinity, etc).

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Originally Posted by Dr. Hieronymous


My guess is that the 80% resist cap was part of a test build that accidentally got pushed live. It's a decent idea in the abstract but obviously something that wasn't fully tested (if it had been, they'd have found the issue with Zombie, the pyro pbaoes, elemental affinity, etc).


My guess as well. Hopefully they get this, the crashing that's been reported, and the health bug fixed soon.
I was looking forward to playing tonight, but guess I'll find something else to do til it gets fixed.

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My guess is that the change was intentional, and that they forgot that the Zombie talent works off of a 200% Poison resistance. There was a very specific line that they had to change in the Character stats, and it fits with their intention of 'balancing' the game. I fully expect Larian to fix the Zombie talent so that it actually works again.

I don't get why the resists can't at least be capped at 100% instead of 80%. 80% just seems so unnatural.

Rhidian #546745 22/08/14 04:40 AM
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This is my first Larian game. Do they have a history of including major undocumented gameplay changes in patches or do their patches usually match the patch notes?

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Definitely not a fan of the 80% cap, even though I didn't go out of my way to exploit it before. Hopefully it was an unintentional "maybe we could try this" that was inadvertently released... I'm also not entirely convinced about the merits of the new restrictions on inventories, which is something where I find myself wondering whether or not it was intentional.


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This would be a very strange change to accidentally make. Just bad patch notes I suppose. I for one think it was a lame solution to the problem of elemental resists, though probably still better than how it was before. For one, 80% is still easy to get and makes enemy mages a joke. But also, it is kind of cool that if you get enough resist in something, you can get healed by it. It just needs to be much harder to get there, and something you should have to focus on to achieve. I would return the cap to 200% but massively reduce the amount of resists you can find on gear (as well as the amount of resist from elemental shields). However, I'd like to see gear (chestpieces especially) that had high resists in one or two elements, but no other resists, instead of like 50 resist in everything. Essences and rubies also need to take a huge hit.

In short, it's good Larian knows there's a problem, but this bandaid isn't the best fix.

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Originally Posted by strider24seven
-Inventory changes. Now you cannot have more than one inventory open at a time, nor can you have one character operate on another's inventory via crafting.

Completely false. Opening up multiple inventories still works fine. So does operating on another's inventory (tested with repair hammer).

The only change I see is that when you switch active characters, your open inventory window(s) may change to a different character. Lots of people had asked for this, I guess. Hopefully they enjoy what they whined for, because it can be confusing as hell now when you switch active chars with multiple inventories open.

edit: I'm also going to guess that that last part is your source of confusion. To bring up additional inventory windows, right-click on character portraits, or left-click the inventory icon below their portrait.

Last edited by Fireblade; 22/08/14 05:01 AM.
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How are you able to roll back this patch? I would love to do that. I bought the game on steam and it just auto-updated without my permission. That's VERY frustrating for a non-MMO type game. I don't see an option in steam to disable updates or to roll back.
Thanks

ncostes #546751 22/08/14 05:03 AM
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Originally Posted by ncostes
I bought the game on steam and it just auto-updated without my permission. That's VERY frustrating for a non-MMO type game.

Are you new to Steam? Is there any game on Steam that doesn't auto-update?

LeBurns #546783 22/08/14 06:36 AM
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Originally Posted by LeBurns
Healing magic is different that fire resistance. I can understand a Fire Elemental being healed by fire, but someone of Flesh and Blood should not be healed by Fire, regardless of their resistance to being burned. To heal Flesh and Blood requires a different kind of magic, not negative burning.

And yeah I know it's a single player game and I know I can just make the game difficult on myself, but I'd rather game logic be logical. But to each their own I guess.

I agree with this. Damaging environmental effects healing certain types of monsters makes a lot of sense to me, but it's probably very hard to balance fights if it works that way for the player too. So, a cap on resistances is a Good Thing (tm).

What's of course not good is that there were some oversights like the Zombie trait. As that's a special case for only one type of damage and costs one trait, I'm fairly sure the trait will be fixed. Other talents may well have to be re-evaluated as well.

Originally Posted by Dr. Hieronymous
There needs to be some way to reach at least 100% resist just because there are so many spells and talents that rely on standing in the middle of damaging terrain. It's not just Zombie, it's also Elemental Affinity, Explode, Storm, Self-Immolation, so on and so forth.

There are also spells that provide elemental shields or immunity against related status effects. You'd still get some damage but wouldn't have to suffer the elemental side-effects. Although in the case of shields, I wouldn't mind if they set the resistance to a fixed 100% instead of reducing partial damage ...


All that said, Larian should maybe have provided free respecs in some form as is usual in MMOs when Talents change a lot. But the resistance change in itself is, IMO, good for the game.

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I think the elemental shield spells would be more balanced overall if they set the resistance to 100% for a single element, and didn't absorb any damage.

Arhu #546922 22/08/14 08:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Arhu
[quote=LeBurns]
All that said, Larian should maybe have provided free respecs in some form as is usual in MMOs when Talents change a lot. But the resistance change in itself is, IMO, good for the game.


One issue I don't have the end-game experience to comment on is whether or not you need a high degree of healing to survive the late game attacks. There doesn't appear to be a "Heal Entire Party" spell at all, for example -- it seems like the game is designed from the ground up for characters to be generating a lot of healing through resistances. (I mean, the buff is titled "Absorb Elements.")

There are two problems with a free respec. The first is that respecialization in this game wipes out your skillbooks and there are unique skillbooks you can't re-buy, like Dust Devil or Whirlwind or Barrage. The second is that the two changes hitting together (leech and resists) knock out a lot of interesting builds. Just about every hybrid tank/mage build I've seen posted is now invalid, for example, or changed enough that it might be invalid (especially on Hard difficulty).

So I don't know what I'm supposed to respec *into*. It's not just Leech that's nerfed, it's also Elemental Affinity, most high-end AoE spells, and a bunch of other things; Glass Cannon is a lot more risky on Hard if my tank can't generate fire-based healing; so on, so forth.

Originally Posted by Fireblade

Are you new to Steam? Is there any game on Steam that doesn't auto-update?


You can set auto-updates on or off in your Steam settings, but once they're downloaded you can't roll back. I think most people generally just auto-download patches though. It does feel a little weird to get hit with a "nerf" in a single-player game like this though, not something I was expecting.

Last edited by Dr. Hieronymous; 22/08/14 08:30 AM.
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So is there a co-op dialog fix? I cannot see it in patch description and they promised that it will be included in next patch...

After almost 3 months I am still waiting with my friend to play this game correctly...

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Originally Posted by Dr. Hieronymous
You can set auto-updates on or off in your Steam settings

No you can't. You can only configure whether you want it to update the game automatically, or update the game when you launch it. Either way, it's updating the game.

Unless there's something I'm missing...feel free to fill me in if there is.




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Originally Posted by strider24seven
Let's discuss the new patch.

I for one am thoroughly disappointed in Larian and will be rolling back my patch to finish out my current games....

-Resist hard-capped at 80%, not noted in the patch notes.....
-Leech heals only on your turn.

Dev are trying rebalance a broken difficulty management and the game needs it. But yeah it can break a current play and party build. No idea how manage both.

But I think the game needs a difficulty tuning and removal of too basic OP exploits making most combats trivial. Leech was clearly wrong, I haven't tried yet the new version.

Looks like there's a side effect of res cap on Zombie talent and this need be fixed, now is the cap good or not, I don't know. But it's good the dev are trying to tune better the difficulty and if cap res is a requirement for that, then ok for me.

Originally Posted by strider24seven

-Inventory changes. Now you cannot have more than one inventory open at a time, nor can you have one character operate on another's inventory via crafting. This is a logistical step backwards, but is not a huge deal overall - more of an inconvenience. The addition of sorting in the barter screen was a nice addition.

I came here to investigate about this point. hehe

It's wrong that you can't open multiple inventories, it's possible through the inventory button.

It's now more classical, so for new players it's probably better. But the lame point is now identify and repair are very tedious. Ie you select a character and switch successively all inventories for repair or identify, the tool is in the action bar of the character selected.

I don't know what's the best, but really the ability to select a character for repairing or identifying, then check successively all inventories need be restored.

Now I admit that those new points are good:
- Right click on portrait select the character and open inventory is much more clear.
- Select a character portrait when the inventory panel is open, also change the inventory selected, this is also more clear because more classical.

So in that context I think that even if it could seem non consistent, arrows on top of inventory panel should NOT change the character selected. Or at least a game interface option should allow this.

Anyway now the game try use two inventory panel types, to both synchronize character selected and inventory selected, but also open multiple inventories (in my opinion pointless in single player, use bags) so the suggestion I proposes to add isn't more complex.

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Originally Posted by Fireblade
Originally Posted by Dr. Hieronymous
You can set auto-updates on or off in your Steam settings

No you can't. You can only configure whether you want it to update the game automatically, or update the game when you launch it. Either way, it's updating the game.

Unless there's something I'm missing...feel free to fill me in if there is.


Same for me, so I agree with you.

Now you can also launch the game out of the steam client and then don't get the update, but yeah also no achievements and play time.

Arhu #546947 22/08/14 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Arhu

All that said, Larian should maybe have provided free respecs in some form as is usual in MMOs when Talents change a lot. But the resistance change in itself is, IMO, good for the game.

I suppose your comment concern the difficulty balance changes and a current party build played broken?

Ok, but I don't agree to change a fun and small challenging respec that requires organization and some focus and planing, to some too easy one click respec.

Last edited by Fend; 22/08/14 09:23 AM.
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Originally Posted by strider24seven

However, the patch introduced very few positive changes
....


One quite cool you didn't listed is now the inventory panel never hide the portraits, very cool fix.

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Originally Posted by strider24seven

-Quest fixes and bug fixes. Most of them were fairly minor, though actually filling out the philosophy of death I guess is good for newer players who haven't figured out the answers to the ghost's questions yet.


Actually, from a nihilistic point of view, I had found the empty book quite a funny and on-the-spot pun. I had no idea it was bugged, hehe.

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Originally Posted by strider24seven
I believe this patch to be a huge step backward, with the resist cap - which is not even noted in the patch notes - being the largest offender. The leech change I suppose was inevitable, but I personally thought it was fine the way it was. The inventory changes are annoying, but I can live with them.


For me it's a huge step into right direction. Leech was a game breaker and I'm glad it's fixed. When comes to resistant cap I think it's also a good thing, but I'd prefer to have ability to become immune to single elemental.

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