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I'm happy to support development of games like this, and my pledge includes the collector's edition for Divinity: Original Sin 2. However, this will be the last CE I purchase from Larian if it ends up being as disappointing as the CE from Divinity: Original Sin.

D:OS CE's was riddled with problems: A map of extremely poor quality (and, honestly, entirely useless as far as helpful maps go), a set of crafting cards which covered only a tiny fraction of the more basic crafting recipes, a page of stickers that are still sitting in the box unused, and a small poster with an annoying amount of folding creases. The manual and deck of cards were decent enough. Really, its only saving graces (to me) were the inclusion of a soundtrack, some fairly weak DLC items, and the additional copy of the game.

D:OS 2's CE is $125. It comes with two digital-only copies of the game, which you are selling for $25 per. That's $50 of software and $75 of everything else, which includes a cloth map, a printed game manual, a "high-quality, hardcover artbook", a "high-quality, hardcover lorebook", a mug, a sticker pack, and some unknown item to replace the Ouija board (thank goodness), and behind the scenes footage (digital only? Which is odd when there's already a plethora of footage available on Youtube). Items like the forum badge are included, but ultimately meaningless to me.

Compare this to a CEs from Blizzard, which range in cost from $75 - $90. They include a $50 game, meaning for $25 - $40 you get items like a 150+ page high quality artbook, CD soundtrack, mousepad (usually with a map printed on it), often wildly coveted DLC items, multi-disc behind-the-scenes blu-ray disc set, free-trial keys for friends, etc.

My point is the price on your D:OS 2 CE is so high that I sincerely hope the lore and artbooks are something more impressive than 20 pages with large font. I don't think anyone is expecting the 1000 page phonebook-style mockups you're using to represent them on the Kickstarter page, but the $75 worth of stuff beyond the $50 of game in the CE box needs to feel worth it (for a change). Especially because you have chosen to focus on physical items and not offer any in-game digital goodies.

I'm not sure what's replacing the Ouija board (I'm just glad something is), but it would really be nice if it were something that could be helpful and both immediately and frequently used with your games, instead of something people will just handle long enough to set down and collect dust somewhere (usually back in the CE box).

I'm not trying to be a cruel, but after the last CE I swore "never again", and yet here I am again purchasing another because I love the kind of games you make. Your last game was awesome, but your last CE was far, far from it. Please.. just knock the presentation in that box out of the park this time.

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Not saying you're wrong, but I'll just say a couple points.

The $25 per game is the Kickstarter early bird price. I imagine that the full retail version will be $40 like D:OS 1, which would make that $80 for the games and $45 of everything else.

The second difference is that the Blizzard CE is for a completed game. The Kickstarter package is meant to help fund the game, which means that it's priced higher than the value of the contents.

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Originally Posted by Stabbey
Not saying you're wrong, but I'll just say a couple points.

The $25 per game is the Kickstarter early bird price. I imagine that the full retail version will be $40 like D:OS 1, which would make that $80 for the games and $45 of everything else.

The second difference is that the Blizzard CE is for a completed game. The Kickstarter package is meant to help fund the game, which means that it's priced higher than the value of the contents.


I considered all of that, but if they make the CE available for purchase later on closer to launch (as they did for D:OS), would it not also be at a higher price since it's no longer receiving an "early bird" pricing? I believe that happened last time as well.

Also, last time Larian sold a duo pack on Steam for $60, not $80. I would be surprised if they didn't repeat that practice for D:OS 2. So, if you want to compare post-Kickstarter pricing we're probably talking about $60 of game and somewhere in the neighborhood of $75 for everything else in that CE box (assuming a $135 price tag for non-Kickstarter CE pricing instead of $125).

That's all speculation, of course. The point is there were obvious disappoints in the CE for D:OS - people were very vocal about them when the CEs were delivered. It would be a nice change to hear extremely positive (and deserving) remarks this time around, and I would sure feel a lot more willing to invest in future collector editions from Larian. Otherwise, next time I'm just sticking with the $25 pledge for the base game. I don't want to be closing that CE box thinking "well that was a huge waste" yet again.

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For what it's worth the "cloth map" of the DOS CE was REALLY a big disappointment and easily the worst cloth map I ever got with any CE. I hope everything the CE offers this time will be of solid quality. Not necessarily spectacular, but at least solid.

As for the price, Stabbey is right. Since the CE is KS exclusive (is it, this time?) the price is not only justified by what it offers but also by funding means. KS is no preorder, as everyone should know by now. Nevertheless though, whatever the CE offers should be of solid quality at least. I think the backers deserver that. smile

Last edited by LordCrash; 30/09/15 08:35 PM.

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Originally Posted by LordCrash
For what it's worth the "cloth map" of the DOS CE was REALLY a big disappointment and easily the worst cloth map I ever got with any CE. I hope everything the CE offers this time will be of solid quality. Not necessarily spectacular, but at least solid.

As for the price, Stabbey is right. Since the CE is KS exclusive (is it, this time?) the price is not only justified by what it offers but also by funding means. KS is no preorder, as everyone should know by now. Nevertheless though, whatever the CE offers should be of solid quality at least. I think the backers deserver that. smile


Yes that map was whole reason I really had a lot of second thoughts about getting a CE this time.

Btw, I doubt that the CE will be KS exclusive, the german publisher most likely wants to do a CE edition of his retail version again, they sold very well last time too. What we get is most likely a KS exclusive edition of the CE.

And lastly, I am totally with you: I have no problem paying extra on my pledge to found the game. But I want every item that in the box be worthy of keeping and worthy of being part such a memento. Bad cloth maps, missing dice and recipe cards that are outdated at the day of release are bad. If this happens again then this was indeed my last CE from Larian. I still would buy Larian games, but would mock Larian for eternity about the bad quality of their collector editions.

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I agree... I'm expecting solid quantity for my CE, not just for the cloth map, but also for the hardcover books. I will be very unhappy with a simple 20-page booklet. Given that you can add the books as add-ons to your pledge for $50 each (and that I'm expecting separate add-ons to be a bit more expensive than the packaged deals), I'm expecting at least $40 worth of retail value... which means they should be closer to 200 pages than to 20 (compare them for example to the limited hardcover versions of the Prima Game Guides, which are usually also full of lore and artwork - for example the 512 page Pillars of Eternity CE Strategy Guide, with a retail price of $40).

As for pricing... if you want to set up a successful KS campaign that will not only give you enough money to fund the product, but also keep your clientele happy, then you should either offer the people the product below retail price, or offer quality exclusives that will not be available in the retail editions. Personally I don't think $125 for the CE is all that much, if you consider all the stuff they put in it, but yes, that is based on the fact that I'm expecting large and high quality versions of those two books. Those two books are the main reason why I went for this CE, instead of another version.

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Originally Posted by The Centaur
Given that you can add the books as add-ons to your pledge for $50 each

Actually, they were $25 each.

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Originally Posted by Raze
Originally Posted by The Centaur
Given that you can add the books as add-ons to your pledge for $50 each

Actually, they were $25 each.


Hmm... you're right, found it again. Don't know how I had $50 in mind. I really thought I'd read that somewhere. Wishful thinking, maybe. Damn, looks like there's no way I'll get the size of books I was hoping for, then. Still, at $20-$25, I definitely hope that they will delivery solid quality. Even at those prices, I will still be very unhappy if I receive a simple 20-page booklet.

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Originally Posted by The Centaur
Originally Posted by Raze
Originally Posted by The Centaur
Given that you can add the books as add-ons to your pledge for $50 each

Actually, they were $25 each.


Hmm... you're right, found it again. Don't know how I had $50 in mind. I really thought I'd read that somewhere. Wishful thinking, maybe. Damn, looks like there's no way I'll get the size of books I was hoping for, then. Still, at $20-$25, I definitely hope that they will delivery solid quality. Even at those prices, I will still be very unhappy if I receive a simple 20-page booklet.


Technical a 500 pages SR5 hardcover core rulebook is just 20 squids per copy in retail, but I would not consider that thin paper high quality laugh

And 111 Pages are still closer to 200 than to 20 ;-)

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Originally Posted by Apocalypse
And 111 Pages are still closer to 200 than to 20 ;-)


Well, in the same quality, I'd definitely be happier (read: less unhappy) with 111 pages than with 20 wink

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The CE for D:OS was pretty shit. More like what used to be a regular game box sold in stores than a 'collector's edition'. But mine was signed, so that's still cool.

They have more artists available, so I guess they'll have more art, which means a bigger artbook, which means we'll be happier than the last one we got.

A cool box is mainly my concern, I'd like something that's pretty to look at on my shelf or even as a showcase. The one we got for D:OS wasn't too cool imo, again, 'more like what used to be a regular game box sold in stores'.

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Originally Posted by Haleseen
The CE for D:OS was pretty shit. More like what used to be a regular game box sold in stores than a 'collector's edition'. But mine was signed, so that's still cool.

They have more artists available, so I guess they'll have more art, which means a bigger artbook, which means we'll be happier than the last one we got.

A cool box is mainly my concern, I'd like something that's pretty to look at on my shelf or even as a showcase. The one we got for D:OS wasn't too cool imo, again, 'more like what used to be a regular game box sold in stores'.


Regular game boxes are not sold anymore in stores (thank you walmart). These days if it is a box, it is already a collector's edition. Actually, I think I have already half a dozen limited editions of games that are basically just a dvd steelbook case with a printed manual. The whole idea of collectors editions are based on bringing back the old game boxes with goodies and (inflation adjusted) the same prices those boxes had.

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I also had pretty mixed feelings about the DOS1 CE box.

I don't use posters anymore since decades, especially with so many fold lines.
The same with stickers, loved them as I was younger.

The cards were a bit more of fun.

The cloth map was the biggest disappointment. Maybe if they find a better manufacturer for the DOS2 map they can reprint the DOS1 map on the backside in a better quality. Just an idea.

Soundtrack CD's are always the best in CE's even I am sure Larian could make now almost soundtrack DVD with Kirill's work, mixed with some videos from his KS concert and the one where he created the silly update song on the fly.

All in all I do not want to sound ungrateful, the CE box was a nice mix of gimmicks and of course it is after all extremely expensive to make physical rewards in such a limited edition in a decent quality.

I don't know what Blizzards CE number were, Gyson, but you can be that they can afford much easier much higher manufacturers simply by much higher production numbers and their damn milkcow WoW&EA in the back.

The artbook was the best (besides the soundrack CD). Even it was too large for the CE box did I love the high quality print and binding.
I was long on the edge to get me a CE edition this time as there was no info about the art and lore book.
I just hope they will have the same excellent quality of the DOS1 book and are large enough to not hurt the eyes even they do not fit in the CE box as they get on a shelf anyway to be used. If those two books are as good as the one we got last time then I am veryhappy with the CE edition this time.

I think dices are also more fitting to the DOS2 CE with the bonds Larian and the marvelous Dinity games have with our passion for paper rpg's.

I expected that Larian would make huge modifications of the game so that I think the idea to not have physical discs in the DOS2 box makes sense.
Nonetheless, it would be nice as backer for both games to get maaaybe one day the option to get a voucher for a physical copy for the DOS1 and/or DO2 game way, waaaaay down the road when the games are long enough on the market t be more or less final for the CE boxes.

But even I mentioned the idea, I don't think it would be feasible for Larian to keep track of who still gets one and who not as the time for physical copies is just really coming to an end. But it would be up to them to decide.

What I actually have missed the most in the CE editions were again a small handful of simple, cosmetic digital items, a message in the woods would be now in a game you cna play with up to three people allow some nice puns or messages to the other players, or to bring a smile on their face.

And how about some pdf version for spell or crafting recipes? Easy to make and to distribute for both games. That would be another nice icing on the cake.

Last edited by Bearhug; 02/10/15 04:42 AM.

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Originally Posted by LordCrash
For what it's worth the "cloth map" of the DOS CE was REALLY a big disappointment and easily the worst cloth map I ever got with any CE. I hope everything the CE offers this time will be of solid quality. Not necessarily spectacular, but at least solid.
That's why I would really love to see the money saved on the Ouija Board invested into a proper cloth map this time. If you are of like mind, consider casting your vote for a cloth map worth its name.

To emphasize my point, I actually dug out some of my collectibles today and made some pictures of great and not so great examples.

What we should get
[Linked Image] [Linked Image] [Linked Image]

What I absolutely don't want to see
[Linked Image] [Linked Image]

The DA:O map is so bad, there's already thread coming lose, despite all it ever did was sit inside the game box. Printing is so shoddy, even large text is barely legible.


While I understand that the larger part of the CE cost goes (and should rightly go to) making the actual game, I hope that perhaps reducing content quantity could help with the quality of the remaining items. So don't replace the Ouija board with anything else!

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Somehow I find the "good" cloth maps in your examples too perfect. I mean it looks too manufactered, done by machines. Small thread, perfect tight pattern, perfectly cut edges...
Sure I don't expect Larian to handcraft 10K or more cloth maps for the CEs, but I'd rather not have something so perfect, clean, smooth and modern that it doesn't look like an old map but rather like a printed handkerchied someone would use to clean their glasses.


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Originally Posted by Dr Koin
Somehow I find the "good" cloth maps in your examples too perfect. I mean it looks too manufactered, done by machines. Small thread, perfect tight pattern, perfectly cut edges...
Sure I don't expect Larian to handcraft 10K or more cloth maps for the CEs, but I'd rather not have something so perfect, clean, smooth and modern that it doesn't look like an old map but rather like a printed handkerchied someone would use to clean their glasses.
Well, to me that sounds more like an issue of design, not of quality. Something can be designed to look old and handcrafted and still have good quality.

Besides, you're free to add all the coffee stains you want, drag it through the mud or have your kids or pet play with it to achieve that worn look you are after. If the quality is right, you'll be fine. But if it already falls to pieces just from looking at it ...

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Originally Posted by ka1man
Originally Posted by Dr Koin
Somehow I find the "good" cloth maps in your examples too perfect. I mean it looks too manufactered, done by machines. Small thread, perfect tight pattern, perfectly cut edges...
Sure I don't expect Larian to handcraft 10K or more cloth maps for the CEs, but I'd rather not have something so perfect, clean, smooth and modern that it doesn't look like an old map but rather like a printed handkerchied someone would use to clean their glasses.

Well, to me that sounds more like an issue of design, not of quality. Something can be designed to look old and handcrafted and still have good quality.

Besides, you're free to add all the coffee stains you want, drag it through the mud or have your kids or pet play with it to achieve that worn look you are after. If the quality is right, you'll be fine. But if it already falls to pieces just from looking at it ...


Ahah yes, you're right. Sure it's more design than quality, although *from the pictures* I'm really under that impression that the weaving/material looks too modern.
However old-looking doesn't prevent something to be also sturdy. A good homespun dress looked sturdy and probably was, but was still very rough at the same time. And I think I have something like that in mind regarding what I'd expect from the cloth map.


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Originally Posted by ka1man
Originally Posted by LordCrash
For what it's worth the "cloth map" of the DOS CE was REALLY a big disappointment and easily the worst cloth map I ever got with any CE. I hope everything the CE offers this time will be of solid quality. Not necessarily spectacular, but at least solid.
That's why I would really love to see the money saved on the Ouija Board invested into a proper cloth map this time. If you are of like mind, consider casting your vote for a cloth map worth its name.


I disagree with the idea that we should have to sacrifice an item from a CE package that is already far too light on items for its price to begin with. That should not be a required step to receive a map of reasonable quality, particularly when it is already one of the promotional items advertised for the CE. The quality of the map should be reasonable regardless of what item replaces the Ouija board.

We're already not receiving a phsyical game disc or the packaging for said discs in the CE box, so there are plenty of places where costs have been cut already without being reflected in the price. Let's not cut any further.

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Originally Posted by Dr Koin
Somehow I find the "good" cloth maps in your examples too perfect. I mean it looks too manufactered, done by machines. Small thread, perfect tight pattern, perfectly cut edges...
Sure I don't expect Larian to handcraft 10K or more cloth maps for the CEs, but I'd rather not have something so perfect, clean, smooth and modern that it doesn't look like an old map but rather like a printed handkerchied someone would use to clean their glasses.


You never have seen the DOS1 'cloth map' right? A piece of plastic fabric that you could use equally well as a handkerchief as some yoghurt pot. The DA:O cloth map is most likely still superior to the DOS1 cloth map laugh

Besides that, a bigger, better cloth map for me is fine, something that I can actually frame and hang on my the wall without getting into trouble with my wife sounds like an excellent item for collectors edition. Something that I can add to my collection of art and enjoy.


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