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The Problem:
With the amount of items scattered around it's inevitable that you will click on someone else's belonging when you merely want to command your character to walk around the table. I have accidentally got myself into fights a couple of times already.

Solution:
Display a confirmation prompt if your character is attempting to steal an item from a left click so players won't accidentally steal things from walking around. Override the prompt mechanism if it's an Alt + Left Click to facilitate quick, mass stealing without confirmation.


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Nooo, absolutely not! Picking up items (including when stealing) is annoyingly slow as it is. I do not want tohaveto confirm every theft.
Zoom in or change angle if you are having troubles clicking where you want.

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I think this is a good idea.

@Skallewag: His suggestion to have a shortcut (Alt +click) to steal means there is no time loss to do it. However, zooming in to walk and not accidentally steal stuff, now THAT is a waste of time.

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Alternatively instead of automatically starting a fight if the player is spotted stealing something. Start a dialog saying hey put that back and if you are trying to steal it you get the option to fight if not you can say sorry and return the item.

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Originally Posted by Skallewag
Nooo, absolutely not! Picking up items (including when stealing) is annoyingly slow as it is. I do not want tohaveto confirm every theft.
Zoom in or change angle if you are having troubles clicking where you want.

+1

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how about just make it a double click to steal

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@Skallewag: lol you have to slow down a bit before kneejerk reaction man. The proposed prompt is only triggered for items that don't belong to you (ie: items where your cursor turns red). For regular items everything stays the same. Also, like I said, alt + click suppresses the prompt so you can steal an entire room full of stuff without any confirmation.

@Mjolnir: this is how they did it for some npcs in original sin 1. Problem is you still suffer negative attitude and sometimes fine even if you try to return the items. I'd rather just have a chance to double check if I really want to steal things or not before anything permanent happens.

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D:OS 1 had an alternative way of walking by clicking and holding the left mouse button. If it's not in any more it should be added again, so you can't accidentally click on red handed items if you use this way of movement.
A pop-up window to confirm stealth or asking for administrator rights wouldn't be a good idea, and requiring a second button to press for stealing isn't quite fluent...

Last edited by Abraxas*; 20/09/16 04:58 PM.

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I really think this needs to be added. Seriously trying to talk to a certain shopkeeper in Cyseal was hell. Because everything around her can be stolen.

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Perhaps rather than just having a request pop up every time you attempt to steal something "Do you really wish to steal?", which I would find annoying as well, there could be a gameplay setting that is a flag "Use steal confirmation popup".

This way, for people that don't want a popup, they can turn it off. For those that do, it's on by default.

Last edited by Dfox; 20/09/16 06:42 PM.
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Originally Posted by Dfox
Perhaps rather than just having a request pop up every time you attempt to steal something "Do you really wish to steal?", which I would find annoying as well, there could be a gameplay setting that is a flag "Use steal confirmation popup".

This way, for people that don't want a popup, they can turn it off. For those that do, it's on by default.


This I very much agree with.

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A confirmation dialouge for every steal is not ideal, it will get tedious fast. An on/off option for this is better but wont solve the problem for those of us who want to turn the confirmation dialogue off.

How about only allowing the player to steal items when s/he is in sneak mode? This should mitigate the risk of a accidental steal significantly, especially considering that the player will be much more attentive once having made the choice of going into sneak mode in the first place. A quick "you must be in stealth mode to steal this item" popup should be enough to inform players of the mechanic.

This of course depends on the player being freely able to go into sneak mode. So on a slightly unrelated note: Please allow players to go into sneak mode even if npc's can see them. I had the seeker following me after saving him from the magisters in the ruins and was unable to sneak because he "spotted me" all the time, even though he was tagged as a friendly.

Last edited by GepardenK; 21/09/16 12:06 AM.
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Originally Posted by GepardenK
A confirmation dialouge for every steal is not ideal, it will get tedious fast. An on/off option for this is better but wont solve the problem for those of us who want to turn the confirmation dialogue off.

How about only allowing the player to steal items when s/he is in sneak mode? This should mitigate the risk of a accidental steal significantly, especially considering that the player will be much more attentive once having made the choice of going into sneak mode in the first place. A quick "you must be in stealth mode to steal this item" popup should be enough to inform players of the mechanic.

This of course depends on the player being freely able to go into sneak mode. So on a slightly unrelated note: Please allow players to go into sneak mode even if npc's can see them. I had the seeker following me after saving him from the magisters in the ruins and was unable to sneak because he "spotted me" all the time, even though he was tagged as a friendly.


I need to emphasize this again: there's a reason I said alt + click should disable confirmation because throughout my entire playthrough of DOS 1 I don't recall a single instance where I decided to consciously steal something without holding down the ALT key first. I am also not quite sure why you think an on/off option won't make you happy. If it's set to off it's literally exactly the same like what we have right now, ie no confirmation whatsoever.

As for entering sneak while under friendly sight cone, that might be a problem because people can then steal anything from a friendly NPC with impunity by simply entering sneak whenever where ever. In your case, it's easier to just break formation with your rogue and have him entering stealth somewhere else. Unless the seeker happens to be following your rogue of course.

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Originally Posted by M3SS3NG3R
I am also not quite sure why you think an on/off option won't make you happy. If it's set to off it's literally exactly the same like what we have right now, ie no confirmation whatsoever.
If it's set to ON then it will annoy me with popups (unless ALT is down ofcrs), if it's set to OFF then it wont solve my problems of accidental stealing. I thought I made that clear. To be clear I don't think your solution is terrible, I just think the problems of accidental stealing is better solved by just allowing you to pick up "owned items" when in sneak mode. Feels more natural imo and you avoid popups altogether.

Originally Posted by M3SS3NG3R
As for entering sneak while under friendly sight cone, that might be a problem because people can then steal anything from a friendly NPC with impunity by simply entering sneak whenever where ever. In your case, it's easier to just break formation with your rogue and have him entering stealth somewhere else. Unless the seeker happens to be following your rogue of course.
If they can see you then they will catch you stealing anyway. Friendlies should not care that you sneak or it will just create annoying situations, at least they shouldn't care when you are in wilderness territory. If you are inside their house then of course they should care

Last edited by GepardenK; 21/09/16 01:31 AM.
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I can kinda see how accidentally stealing when you didn't mean could get frustrating, but even more frustrating would be having to click a box each time to confirm. Just save often in case you screw up.

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Originally Posted by GepardenK
If they can see you then they will catch you stealing anyway. Friendlies should not care that you sneak or it will just create annoying situations, at least they shouldn't care when you are in wilderness territory. If you are inside their house then of course they should care


This is more or less a digression from the topic but here goes. Sneaking as a mechanic prevents anyone besides those in your party from seeing you, friendly disposition or not. The only difference between sneaking and full on invisibility, AFAIK, is sneaking gives you movement speed penalty (without speedcreeper anyway) and can be broken by entering someone's sight cone. This means if you can enter sneaking mode directly in front of a friendly, then he cannot see you which enables you to pick up everything he owns right in front of his nose. If you want to go with defining an area as "wilderness", "house", etc then all of a sudden Larian is faced with the exponentially larger workload in defining just exactly what constitutes a "wilderness" and what constitutes "this person's house". In other words, the mechanics of sneaking is now inconsistent across the map and highly dependent on the specific location and the relationship between characters. I can see how it would be annoying when you have to make tactical placement involving third party friendlies prior to a battle. But in that case Larian should probably just define the third party friendlies as temporary allies/henchmen etc whose sight cones are not taken into consideration when computing for detection. Generally though I think it's better to leave the mechanism alone and enter sneaking mode by moving your rogue away from the party.

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Originally Posted by M3SS3NG3R

This is more or less a digression from the topic but here goes. Sneaking as a mechanic prevents anyone besides those in your party from seeing you, friendly disposition or not.... This means if you can enter sneaking mode directly in front of a friendly, then he cannot see you which enables you to pick up everything he owns right in front of his nose
Yeah I agree this is a digression so I hope I don't drag this too far off. My issue is with stealth and how friendlies in combat are forcing you out of it when the sneak act is intended for the enemy, and I agree with you that the whole wilderness/home area thing is a way to complicated solution.

So how about this instead: You are never forced out of sneak by friendlies, but npcs who see you go into sneak (or see you while sneaking) will be tagged as having spotted you and your sneak bonus will no longer apply to them. This way sneak is not some free invisible spell to steal from friendlies but you can still hide from enemies while friendlies are nearby. In short: Friendlies will spot your sneak attempt but not make it fail globally

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So, as I see it, you're simply substituting "sneak mode" as your toggle. In sneak mode, you can steal. Out of sneak mode you cannot.

This is basically what I proposed, and have others, except the other proposals are, IMHO, better because they aren't convoluted with the sneak mechanic.

How is toggling sneak mode, any different than just toggling steal mode?

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Originally Posted by Dfox
So, as I see it, you're simply substituting "sneak mode" as your toggle. In sneak mode, you can steal. Out of sneak mode you cannot.

This is basically what I proposed, and have others, except the other proposals are, IMHO, better because they aren't convoluted with the sneak mechanic.

How is toggling sneak mode, any different than just toggling steal mode?
I just find sneaking and stealing to go naturally together. Make picking up items that others own possible when in sneak mode and make it impossible otherwise. Should solve the problem of accidental stealing without having to resort to popups or extra unneeded toggles/modes.

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Yes I understood that it was in regards to stealing, not picking up legally "free" stuff.
I specifically do not want to haveto confirm stealing things because sometimes you are timing things with a guard on patrol. Got 10s to clear a table at the market before the vendor looks back? Guess how fun an extra confimation click per item would be?

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