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Now that we have companions with their own origin stories and unique dialogue with NPCs, I find it weird that it's very possible you'll miss a unique interaction for certain characters simply because you never knew that option was there. For example: In the Witch Cave, there's a dialogue option in which Lohse recites words of the Black Ring while the others do not have any unique dialogue with the Witch at all. In future updates, I know there will be more dialogue which involves unique dialogue with specific characters and I'm worried I'll miss those opportunities by initiating dialogue with the wrong character. I think it'd be really accommodating if there was a dialogue system like that of Wasteland 2 in which you can choose/change at any time which character/companion will talk throughout the conversation or a dialogue system which allows companions to interject into a conversation so you can see their dialogues options too instead of having the dialogue locked to a single character throughout a conversation.

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I think this is a good idea.

Maybe another character with a special option / strong opinion on the matter could signal you that they have something to say, and then you can decide to leave the conversation to them or not.

*You notice Lohse has something to say, and let her answer*

This creates some interesting suspense, as you can never be sure what exactly the other character may say (especially for Lohse), and makes the characters feelmore alive, with them having an opinion of their own.

Last edited by HauRukh; 24/09/16 12:20 PM.
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+2 for this!

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I'm against this, because I think it detracts from the entire point of picking a specific origin. You chose that origin to see the story from their perspective, yes? Getting to see all the different options which you didn't pick makes the point of picking an origin much shallower.

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Only your main character should be allowed to lead dialogues in SP imo.

You play the Red Prince and you want to know how an NPC would have reacted to Lohse? Well, take Lohse's origin story for your main character in the next playthrough.

But I agree that your companions should enter dicussions that involve group-choices. In these cases they should be controlled by AI.


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But as of now, your leading origin doesnt matter. You can go between each companion and check each interaction back to back. Like i had some npcs hate my main guy but love my other companion so i only interact with that NPC through my companion. If that's gonna be how it works then might as well make it smoother.

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Originally Posted by SirHewhostabs
But as of now, your leading origin doesnt matter. You can go between each companion and check each interaction back to back. Like i had some npcs hate my main guy but love my other companion so i only interact with that NPC through my companion. If that's gonna be how it works then might as well make it smoother.

I know but I think this system needs to be changed for obvious reasons. Either make only the main character be able to lead dialogues or at least make dialogues dynamic which means that NPCs should remember that they already talked to your party (no matter to which char) and refuse to talk to your party again about the very same matter.

And decision situation within the party will change anyway once the love and hate relationship system will be integrated. Once this system is integrated your companions will be AI-controlled in such decision situations (like it was in DOS1 for your second character).

Last edited by LordCrash; 24/09/16 02:51 PM.

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I think that the current system adds a great deal of replay value to the game. If I want to know how one of the other characters would have reacted in a given situation I get to start over and get a fresh perspective on the entire game.

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Originally Posted by LordCrash
Originally Posted by SirHewhostabs
But as of now, your leading origin doesnt matter. You can go between each companion and check each interaction back to back. Like i had some npcs hate my main guy but love my other companion so i only interact with that NPC through my companion. If that's gonna be how it works then might as well make it smoother.

I know but I think this system needs to be changed for obvious reasons. Either make only the main character be able to lead dialogues or at least make dialogues dynamic which means that NPCs should remember that they already talked to your party (no matter to which char) and refuse to talk to your party again about the very same matter.

And decision situation within the party will change anyway once the love and hate relationship system will be integrated. Once this system is integrated your companions will be AI-controlled in such decision situations (like it was in DOS1 for your second character).


All this. At the moment I actually prefer to play with only one character cause it feels weird having all the origin characters in one party acting like muppets to my whims. Takes away from my origin choices mattering

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Originally Posted by Mathdude
I think that the current system adds a great deal of replay value to the game. If I want to know how one of the other characters would have reacted in a given situation I get to start over and get a fresh perspective on the entire game.

That's exactly how the game does NOT work at the moment. wink


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I agree with the general sentiment of only your main characters origin should matter, but I don't think only the main character should lead dialogue in SP. I think any character should be able to talk. Though in regards to having another character "switch in", I think that should be able to happen if one of your characters has pet pal and an animal initiates dialogue with your party. It should default to the character with pet pal instead of whoever is in the front, because realistically the person who can't speak to animals would just give the person who can the lead when an animal tries to talk to them.

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Originally Posted by Nathan01
I agree with the general sentiment of only your main characters origin should matter, but I don't think only the main character should lead dialogue in SP. I think any character should be able to talk. Though in regards to having another character "switch in", I think that should be able to happen if one of your characters has pet pal and an animal initiates dialogue with your party. It should default to the character with pet pal instead of whoever is in the front, because realistically the person who can't speak to animals would just give the person who can the lead when an animal tries to talk to them.

I think that in SP 'Pet Pal' should be a group-based talent, applying to everybody in the group. You can imagine that the one character who has the actual ability then just functions as translator for the main character.

Last edited by LordCrash; 24/09/16 06:51 PM.

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Originally Posted by LordCrash
Either make only the main character be able to lead dialogues

And what happens if they're dead, but the NPC you just saved wants to initiate a conversation ending the quest?


Originally Posted by LordCrash
at least make dialogues dynamic which means that NPCs should remember that they already talked to your party (no matter to which char) and refuse to talk to your party again about the very same matter.

Then what about party members that were absent during the previous attempt?

And in both cases, all mechanics must remain consistent between SP and MP, otherwise they'd be effectively making two games(identical, but separate).


Originally Posted by LordCrash
Once this system is integrated your companions will be AI-controlled in such decision situations (like it was in DOS1 for your second character).

Which was optional, and as such it should remain.

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Originally Posted by Naqel
Originally Posted by LordCrash
Either make only the main character be able to lead dialogues

And what happens if they're dead, but the NPC you just saved wants to initiate a conversation ending the quest?

There are plenty of workarounds, but it's very rare that your main character should be unavailable anyway. Dead? Maybe use a resurrection scroll?

But for an easier example, if the main character is in prison or something while everyone else is outside...

I do feel that conversations should be led by the main character, and some particular interactions should depend on the presence of the main character. However, generally, interactions should occur based on the characters present for the conversation. That is, characters all participate and interact, much like the suggestion of this thread but I don't think we should usually be choosing, as such. I wouldn't expect to choose to let Lohse talk -- her AI should make that decision.

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I just want some control over this. It's annoying to wander near an npc, open a door, etc and they trigger a closed/one time only dialogue with the closest character, and you can't choose who speaks. This annoyed the heck out of me in the first Original Sin too.

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Originally Posted by Naqel
Originally Posted by LordCrash
Either make only the main character be able to lead dialogues

And what happens if they're dead, but the NPC you just saved wants to initiate a conversation ending the quest?

Easy solution: let the NPC tell your companion that he won't speak with you. So you have to revive the main character first until you can progress. By the way, DOS1 functioned in the same way if only your two (real) companions survived. Most NPC refused to talk to them. You could only use one of your two main characters for most (relevant) dialogues. I don't see why this shouldn't be possible for DOS2, but for everybody in your party with the exception of your main character.

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Originally Posted by LordCrash
at least make dialogues dynamic which means that NPCs should remember that they already talked to your party (no matter to which char) and refuse to talk to your party again about the very same matter.

Then what about party members that were absent during the previous attempt?

Nothing. They're irrelevant. Anyway, I still strongly prefer the solution that only your main character can do the talking with NPCs and that your (AI-controlled) companions only chip in in specific situations in which there is a relevant decision to make.

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And in both cases, all mechanics must remain consistent between SP and MP, otherwise they'd be effectively making two games(identical, but separate).

Yes, and that would be for the best. Because right now, the SP is just an afterthought, no matter what Larian promises. The current implementation is a coop-MP game that can also be played alone but will make much less sense that way in terms of how the narrative gameplay work.

That's imo pretty weird and alarming given the fact that the VAST majority of people played DOS1 in SP, and ONLY in SP (based on Larian's own survey during the kickstarter). It's like catering to the 10% out of principle, neglecting what the vast majority of the fanbase wants and expects. That doesn't mean that I want them to abandon MP, not at all. But it's imo not done with something like: "Hey, it's good for MP, let's stop here. It will surely work for SP as well...somehow..."

Short: if a mechanic doesn't work in the same perfect way for both SP and MP, they should indeeed make two seperate solutions or at least adjust the solution to the respective needs. Either that or SP will always remain somehow crippled and way below its actual potential. That way DOS2 will never become what BG2 was to BG1, I fear...

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Originally Posted by LordCrash
Once this system is integrated your companions will be AI-controlled in such decision situations (like it was in DOS1 for your second character).

Which was optional, and as such it should remain.

This time we have the "love and hate" relationship system (which was a kickstarter stretch goal). How do you imagine that to work if you control all your characters in your group in terms of narrative exploration? Making love with yourself? That'd be a complete roleplaying overkill (as it is already right now, but even stronger) imo. But well, if people really want to play hardcore coop with themselves, why not...

Last edited by LordCrash; 24/09/16 11:48 PM.

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I prefer to have all characters nearby involved in conversation. Pet pal is a specific example of when the current system sucks. It works in the reverse - people who attack characters on sight will attack you if one of them is present, even if they wouldn't attack the other three. So if there was a scenario where an NPC would only talk to one character - they should talk to that character.

I think the main problem is having the origin stories available as single player party members with POV. They are companions. You should NOT be able to experience their narrative stories.

Players should have a player 'tag' and those with player tags should be able to intercept conversations. This will work equally well in SP and MP.
Companions should have a 'companion' tag so that if they are in the vicinity of a conversation, those currently in the steering wheel will have a options 6 or 7 companion dialog option, highlighted a different color etc.

The hard part is how does a - player interception- work. Well, just like the ear does - except now when another player presses the ear button - they now go into the shared conversation mechanism that was present in D:OS during co-op. Where they both have the option to respond to questions, but where the initiator chooses direction in purely exposition conversations.
And conflicting responses can be handled the same way they used to be.

For example:
1-SP party runs into somewhat annoying imp who delivers important plot points. The Main Char. is addressed, guides the exposition of plot points and concludes a boring conversation
2-SP party runs into a enemy/ally mob - Who recognizes the red prince and threatens the party. Your main character has the chance to talk him down and if picked - the red prince interjects and now you have to talk both down. You succeed - and get a red prince specific companion dialog or a Sebille specific closing dialog you can choose which may alter the direction. but you can pick to let them talk.

1-MP party runs into somewhat annoying imp who delivers important plot points. The Player 1 is addressed, guides the exposition of plot points and concludes a boring conversation.
2-MP party runs into a enemy/ally mob - Who recognizes the red prince (player 2) and threatens the party. Player 1 has the chance to talk him down and if picked - (Player 2) has the choice to interject and now P1 has to talk both down. P1 succeeds and guides the next few moments of exposition. At closing, Player 2 (if still nearby) can choose to say 1-2 things which may result in final enemy/ally disposition of mob.
2.1-MP party runs into a enemy/ally mob - Who recognizes the red prince companion and threatens the party. Player 1 has the chance to talk him down and if picked - (Player 2) has the choice to interject and now P1 has to talk both down and the Red Prince. P1 succeeds and guides the next few moments of exposition. At closing, Player 2 (if still nearby) can choose to say 1-2 things which may result in final enemy/ally disposition of mob.
2.2-MP party runs into a enemy/ally mob - the red prince is not in the party. Player 1 has the chance to get information. If player 2 joins conversation and has a tag / or reason to dislike mob. P2 can refuse to help NPC. P1 and P2 have argument. Player 2 wins, and party fights mob. P1 can remark on lost infor / waste of life or just say, good fight after resolution.

They have more writers... Maybe this is doable.

Essentially - they need a way to share salient conversation points from companions in both SP and MP. They need to find a way to have important conversation tags like pet pal or the red prince still be available when another character is talking. They need to implement a way for co-op characters to have discussions with NPC's because I haven't run into any of those situations yet with my co-op play through and it's really disconnecting. I miss arguing about whether or not to toss the clam into the ocean or eat it.

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Originally Posted by Surrealialis
They need to find a way to have important conversation tags like pet pal or the red prince still be available when another character is talking.

I must say, that I like your ideas a lot.

First, I agree that only the main character's origin story should work in SP. Every other orign story related content for other group members should be blocked in SP and become invisible. Competitive questing was only envisioned for coop-MP anyway.

For all the rest of the normal dialogues it would indeed make sense if Larian implemented some kind of "group dialogue" for SP which means that when you talk to an NPC every possible dialogue line that applies to one of the party members of your current (chained) group is visible and choosable no matter which character is currently active.

I think that it would be pretty easy to implement such a system for SP. The game only had to notice that only one player is playing right now (you could even manage that by a manual button in the menu like "play the game in SP mode") If that's the case the game doesn't differentiate between members of the current chained party anymore in dialogues and instead offers one dialogue option for the whole group. So if your current chained group for example consisted of Ifan, the Red Prince and Lohse a possible dialogue window with an NPC would look like that:

NPC text, text, text...

1) Generic reaction/answer one
2) Generic reaction/answer two
3) [Ifan]...
4) [Soldier]...
5) [Red Prince]...
6) [Scholar]...
7) [Lohse]...
8) [Mystic]...


If you unchained Lohse and your group only consisted of Ifan and the Red Prince options 7) and 8) wouldn't be visible anymore. For a one-man party only consiting of Ifan only option 1) to 4) would be visible and choosable if you start a conversation using Ifan.


That way it wouldn't matter anymore which character of your group initiated a dialogue because it always involves the whole chained group. This solution would offer a viable solution for all current issues with dialogues in SP imo:

- you don't have to start multiple dialogues with the same NPC anymore to have access to origin/race specific dialogue options

- dialogue feels dynamic and includes the whole party, giving you the feeling that it's more like a discussion with the whole group where everybody can get involved

- if only one party member has access to pet pal you don't necessarily need this character for starting dialogues with animals

- scripted dialogues that start automatically will never again happen with the "wrong" character who just happened to stand closest to the respective NPC

- situations that split up your party (death, prison, etc.) wouldn't be negatively influenced by this solution



The more I think about this solution the more I'm convinced that it's really a winner. Larian, please take notice, this is good stuff. smile

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They need to implement a way for co-op characters to have discussions with NPC's because I haven't run into any of those situations yet with my co-op play through and it's really disconnecting. I miss arguing about whether or not to toss the clam into the ocean or eat it.

That will happen. The whole party interaction and relationship system just isn't implemented in the early access version yet. You can see that when you start a dialogue with another party member. In the final game companions will behave according to their character traits in decisive situations, controlled be the AI.

Last edited by LordCrash; 25/09/16 06:20 PM.

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Originally Posted by LordCrash
First, I agree that only the main character's origin story should work in SP. Every other orign story related content for other group members should be blocked in SP and become invisible.


I agree with this. I understand why some people like to have all that content available so they only have to play it once, but I don't agree. Picking an origin character should be a special choice, you shouldn't get almost all the experience seeing the origins you didn't pick. That just makes it less special.

The rest of your idea sounds pretty good as well.


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I always thought Wasteland 2 did dialogue correctly, IMO. Where anybody can talk at anytime, each character can have special charisma skills and they can use them whenever it is applicable. Also a stat like barter is a dump stat that is shared across the party, is something I would like to see in this game. In fact, the whole Wasteland 2 dialogue logic should be in this game.

So in short, each character can talk anytime and have charisma skills, and there should be 'dump' skills (such as barter) that are shared across the party.

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