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I wasn't here when it happened :'D Sorry. But I also don't see how it got so derailed. Last time I was here, it was on point.

That aside, Naqel has made the most logical and cohesive point so far: Just change how the CC functions. It would fit the current combat system very well, wouldn't be too difficult to program, and would create massive potential for boss fights.

Let's take this idea that popped into my head as an example:
Let's say Freeze was reworked into a snare that prevented movement and grounded the target, making them unable to be teleported. In addition, Fire spells used on the target didn't burn them, but freed them and applied Warm.
Now imagine a Void Frost Dragon boss that constantly spreads freezing and chilled. The fight would be about managing your fire spells and warm buffs to free your melee friends and stop the boss from chasing down the backline squishies unchallenged.

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I really don't like the idea of debuffs being turned into buffs, at least in a regularly accessible way. It's too strong in the hands of the players and you really can't predict or play around it in the hands of npcs. In fact, in the hands of npcs it would actively punish you for playing well unless it telegraphed itself somehow, which means even more work for the dev team.


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@Kilroy512512 players have Bless.

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Originally Posted by Kresky
@Kilroy512512 players have Bless.


It's pretty crazy how strong Bless is.
cost: 1 AP, 1 memory slot
duration: 5 turns
cooldown: 3 turns
Effects:
+10% accuracy and dodge
+15% to all resistances
And, stepping on any elemental surface causes it to instead have a positive effect on you (usually resulting in being at full health all the time, unless enemies can 1-shot you)

It doesn't make one immune to CC, but it is damn OP.

Edit: It also removes most* CC from the target, which would be a good enough reason to take the skill all on its own.
*Doesn't remove Knockdown

Last edited by error3; 18/10/16 08:00 PM.
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Ya, if anything, specific bless effects and removing the stopping on surfaces would be a tone down to bless.
What's the cooldown error3? You didn't mention it in your post and I didn't want to look it up. 3 turns?

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I think bless has 5 turns cooldown, as long as the duration.

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Originally Posted by Kalrakh
I think bless has 5 turns cooldown, as long as the duration.


Just checked, the cooldown is 3 turns.

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That's kind of the point. It doesn't even effect actual debuffs and bless is already game breakingly strong...


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Bampitty bam bump.
This topic is relevant.

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But this already happens to an extent. The wet and chilled status make fire less effective and generally require an extra "tick" to activate the Burning status. Likewise, using fire on a chilled subject will set them to warm instead of catching them on fire.

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The point still needs to be said, again and again. CC cannot boil down to a choice of different colors for the exact same effect. Freeze needs to be fundamentally different from Knockdown or Shocked.

Last edited by Fluffington; 22/10/16 05:59 PM.
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Originally Posted by Fluffington
The point still needs to be said, again and again. CC cannot boil down to a choice of different colors for the exact same effect. Freeze needs to be fundamentally different from Knockdown or Shocked.


Even just shocked needs to be fundamentally different that where it is now.

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Originally Posted by Fluffington
If we're going to add a new bar, let's go in the direction of GW2: Stability. With CC so stupidly accessible to both the player and Ai, having a stat that ABSORBS a certain number of CCs would be lovely. (I think the number of abilities that have a stun tied to them is around 30%+. That's insane.)

Or, we can just go in the direction someone mentioned earlier and have different CC do DIFFERENT things. Having a character be stunned the exact same way with 14 different color options on top is just silly.


As an avid GW2 player I must say this is redundant; both player stability and boss break bars essentially work in a similar manner to the magical;/physical armor we already have. You have to strip every stack of stability with a CC attack to get your CCs to take effect if it's a player; if it's a boss, all soft and hard CC drains the breakbar until it empties, at which point you get a stun and a increase in damage.

DOS2 basically uses the same system as a breakbar, minus the damage boost once armor is destroyed, allowing us to be CC'ed instead.

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Just wanted to point out:
I don't really find the idea of removing hard CC wholesale swallowable.

Petrification -> obviously someone can't move during this
Frozen -> a block of ice isn't a moving object either
Stun -> this one actually has room for interpretation

My thoughts lie in this direction:
> Leave petrification alone
> Add levels to frozen and stun status*

*About levels to statuses:

- Depends on the skil, ablity points, stats, and/or a talent

- Level 1: partial frozen/stun that increase AP costs

- Level 2: greater frozen/stun even more AP cost increase and some other effect (maybe a slight increase in armor for instance and a greater effectiveness of blunt weapons on a frozen enemy for instance)

- Level 3: Full on hard CC, but wit greater effects. (in the case of froze, enemy has large armor boost but also greater weakness to blunt weapons)

The point of this system lies in the idea that Hard CC chains would only be possible for high level characters building around it using multiple schools, stat investments, combat ability investments and/or talent investements. Further, the characters would essentially be evolving from soft to hard CC over time.

Yes, it'd be slightly OP but all classes get their in their own time depending on builds so late game OPness for he sake of fun is actually a good design. Warriors will be one shooting everything anyway

The secondary effects of each element, in this case, is what will really define them. As well as the types of anemies they work on.

For instance, a skeleton wouldn't care about the cold until it was actually encased in ice, so I'd say that only level 2/3 frozen status could possibly effect it.

The same idea could be achieved using a variety of skills all based around core concepts but representing tiers in effectiveness, but I don't think anyone wants to bloat the skill trees

**I also agree with the ideas of fire on a frozen target only warming and freeing them and that freezing someone in a puddle should act as an anti-teleport anchor

Last edited by aj0413; 24/10/16 01:17 AM.
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OP has a great idea of balancing things out A LOT. Didn't even read the thread after OP (sorry guys) because I totally agree with topic starter (the penalties/bonuses can be changed, but the general idea is just neat).

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