Larian Studios Forums Divinity - Original Sin Divinity Original Sin - Help/Tips/Tricks Help for a beginner

I concur that you should play what you enjoy, especially if you're not a passionate min-maxer. Although some builds make the game easier than others, as long as you don't screw up totally (e.g. giving an intelligence-based character strength-based skills) you should be able to manage most fights. You may have to use tactics and preparation more, but then that's where D:OS really shines in my view.

My comrade has much fun playing her rogue and we don't have many problems in fights, although we have no fighter/tank in our party. We focus on crowd control and guerilla tactics instead. It helps that the inquisitor and the mage have three magic schools each, so together with the ranger's special arrows we have every element at our disposal and a huge number of skills in total. Spreading out like this may bar us from the master skills in all but one ability per character, though. I didn't calculate that in advance.

Aerothurge may be good for rogues for Thunder Jump alone. It provides good mobility and may stun enemies, as does Avatar of Storms with its stun-on-hit chance.

Have fun playing D:OS together. It is one of the very best co-op games I ever played, and I'm from ancient days of Commodore 64 and Amiga.

I totally agree with what you say, but what I'm trying to do is build a character who can hold his own throughout the entire playthrough. I like the rogue but as you said before, he is quite weak at start.. He has no control over elements, so I can't sinergize with my fellow mage and more often than not, I'm just hindering the mage's potential because she's afraid of setting me ablaze. This makes me not want to play a melee character. Moreover the typical rogue tasks are of no importance in this game... lock picking, trap springing etc.
So maybe I'd like a class with which I can sinergize with the mage. Yesterday I built some sort of paladin.. sure he fights good and hits hard but... I was impeding my mage all the time. Something in my playstyle is wrong..

Just posting to say, specifically to you, that bows are better than xbows, and that act 1 doesn't change that. I noticed you had a very healthy inquiry into the matter and were served a bullshit answer, but I wasn't sure you noticed.

Xbows benefit more from crit than bows, but that alone doesn't garantee the superiority of one over another at any point. It isn't sufficient.

Additionally, having more AP doesn't benefit Xbows over Bows in the way it was explained (Xbows having more than 1 shot per turn).

I will add here that no, I'm not at all into min-maxing, but I'm much into versatility and role play. Today I started the game again, and tried a "wild ranger". He's got Geo, Scoundrel and Marksman. Geo for summons, the rest for a good and mobile ranger. I took Scientist to create my own arrows and things, and look forward to create something unique. I gave him bow. The crossbow is too impeding, makes me slow and all. Along with the fire/geo mage, we're pretty strong and end fights quite quick. If someone got any advice on how I should make this character "unique" i hereby write what I'm looking to become:

- Skilled long distance sniper
- Rogue-ish high mobility and speed
- Master crafter
- Trap detector/lock picker

I started with a 7 in dex, a 6 in Int (maybe not worth...) and 6 and 6 in speed and percept.

I know it's a bit much to have in one character, but I like unique chars a lot.
My partner will be doing the mouth of the group, she has charisma, and will barter. Maybe just for flavour, she will pick telekinesis.
What else can I do to improve my toon?

@Chrest: Thank you for the input. What advantages do bows have over Xbows exactly?

@Manu83: Although D:OS offers a great versatility what you can do or be, it also rewards specializing in one or two things you will be really good in. Since our group is just level 11 in our first (and probably only) playthrough, I can't say how important specializing is in the levels above 11. But we'll eventually find out.

As said before, you can compensate "weaker" builds with tactics and preparation, and you shouldn't focus too much on your performance at the beginning of the game when any character is but a shadow of his or her later capabilities.

That said, I would advice against spreading your points too thin, e.g. for more than 2-3 roles in a group of 2-4 characters, after all. If you don't plan to switch out npcs much, you could even give one of them the crafter or blacksmith role, as I did the latter with Jahan.

If you don't fear spoilers in regard of skills, you could go the other way around: Look at all of them, pick a combination you like and then think about the personality and style such a person would have. A kind of reverse-engeneered roleplaying.

I guess the Geo-Ranger is already off the table after your later post in the other thread?

edit: As for your mage's fear about hurting you: Well, then she has to be more careful. (and you too) Additionally, that's what the "Avatar of …" and other protective skills are for, as are numerous items that give you elemental resistances.

Not really. Just trying to figure out if it's possible to make him "unique" enough. Not the traditional ranger who shoots elemental arrows all the time... it'd be boring. And as I said in the other thread, I almost always end up playing a ranger in rpgs because of versatility.. I'd like to change for once... but don't know with what...

@Raban

In a nutshell, bows just do way more damage than xbow due to the nature of the bow specialisation vs xbow specialisation. The crit component of Xbow doesn't work with Marksman skills nor with special arrows, whereas those skills and those special arrows have high priority because they do very high damage per AP spent. And it only gets worse as you progress in the game, because you learn more and stronger skills (which make you use less auto attack overall in proportion), and because you progess farther and farther in the bow specialisation.

Best crafted Xbow only do 110% the damage of crafted bow, for 125% of the AP cost. And the bow specialisation work for skill (150% damage), whereas the Xbow specialisation doesn't. So, as far as skills and special arrows are concerned, bows end up doing 36% more damage than xbows (150%/110%). The "Ricochet" skill also cost 5 AP for Xbows and only 4 for bows, but I discounted that.

In the case of auto attacks, and with 50% crossbow crit engame (25% for 5 in spec, 10% from the weapon itself, and 15% from trait and perception and buff), if we assume similar damage per AP for bows and Xbows (which isn't the case), bows do overall 150% * 115% damage (bow specialisation bonus + crit bonus), whereas Xbows do 100% * 200% (xbow spec affects critical damage). That would be 16% more damage from Xbows auto attacks. If you factor in the non equivalent damage per AP (only 110% damage for 125% AP), it becomes
150% * 115% vs (110% / 125%) * 100% * 200%
which is only a 2% bonus.

All this being said, the marksman is the best class in the game, and the game isn't hard enough not to be beaten easily even with an Xbow marksman. So I wouldn't advice against building an Xbow marksman if such is your fantasy. But building an Xbow marksman because you think it's optimized is just misguided. Otherwise, there's plenty of good advice to optimize the fun out of an Xbow marksman (guerilla build).

@Chrest, you seem to know plenty about Marksman. Care to guide me in doing something "unusual" such as the build you mentioned? Or something else you may know?

First and foremost, the best advice I have for you is to play the goddam game already. I already answered this to you in one of your previous threads.

This game is not difficult enough for you to be pampered for your first game. And I do not want to decide in your place. I do not see the point of talking about builds that are unusual to me, because as far as I understand, ANY build is unusual to you: a beginner.

Most of the advices that were given to you in this very thread are already quite good. From what I understand, you intend to play co-op with your girlfriend, and with some sort of premium on roleplaying (in video games, I tend to disociate gameplay element and roleplay elements, so I personally don't care if I'm a "dark magic rogue" or an "elemental ranger").

Given that you seem to have such a premium on roleplaying, I cannot give you solid advice because I see you liking being one thing one day, then liking something else the next day. A generic information would be that there are 4 archetypes in the game: ranger (range dex), mage (range int), warrior (melee str) and rogue (melee dex), and that ranger > mage > warrior >> rogue. However, some rogue utility skills are really useful, so worth taking even on a ranger for instance. Party I would call well-rounded would be ranger + mage + warrior + anything. In case you want to play two lonewolf (for roleplay reasons), ranger + mage is the best combination. You could do other ones, but pay attention to bodybuilding and willpower, as being CC is more dangerous in a party of 2 than in a party of 4.

As far as rangers go, well bow > xbow, and crafting is very strong (but you should read a guide to know what to craft for power or gold, because a lot of crafts are not worth the time and might give you inventory management problems).

As far as mage go, they are mostly a support class in this game until the endgame where they get very powerful AoE spells. Dabbing in all magic schools is excellent. I would consider 1 in fire (firefly), 1 in earth (spider, oil), 1 in air (bitter cold, teleportation, wind of change if 2 lonewolf), 2 in water (rain, regeneration, water of life) and 2 in witchcraft (malediction, oath, rapture) to be the core of a mage. Anything else is up to you, as some spells can be useless or too strong.

@chrest

Thanks for the answer, although a bit harsh. The fact that I'm a beginner in this game doesn't mean that I'm a beginner in ALL crpgs. This is to say that when I ask your advice for a UNIQUE (not unusual) builds, tis to say something like "don't tell me ranger or warrior, but tell me something like ranger with scoundrel with geo" and of course that would be your opinion. Then it will be up to me to test if I enjoy it. It almost seems that everyone playing this game plays a ranger or a mage, while I was searching for a different approach and thus gathering ideas. Nothing wrong with this I suppose..?

It's difficult to answer your question because it's a little bit nonsensical.

I do not know where you gathered that everyone playing the game was playing ranger or mage.

In term of builds, the game has a lot of leeway and you could beat the game with almost nothing. So I could give you random builds and they would be both unique and workable.

You being a beginner or not in other games doesn't matter much. This game has its mechanics, and you only discover them as you progress in the game (you cannot discover everything toying at level 1, because not everything is unlocked at level 1). There is no alternative to you making your choice, sticking to it and play the goddam game.

It's a little bit like you are asking what flavor of ice cream you should pick, and you are fidgeting for hours around the ice cream truck, smelling around yet not eating any. And you are asking, and asking, then smelling and smelling. It is annoying. I cannot debate much with you about ice cream, as you haven't eaten any yet, just smelled.

I don't find it nonsensical. I only asked for some fun builds. I've played this game for about 3/4 hours, the found it boring to always do the same things.. If I ask you to give me 2 ice cream flavors that go well together, you may tell me strawberry and lemon. It will be up to me to verify, but you gave me something to work on. That is all I ask. If you don't want... fine

@Chrest: Thanks again for your detailed take on bows and Xbows. I'll inform my co-op companion as she is playing Bairdotr. She prefers bows stylistically anyway.

@Manu83: I second what Chrest said about playing the game. Don't overthink it too much in advance, you may discover things about the "classes" of D:OS later that you can't know yet (or we for you). And since D:OS doesn't have fixed classes anyway, you can modify your character to some extend later. Chrest already gave you much basic information about the classes and their role in the game, so I don't think he/she doesn't "want" to help you. As a friendly advice, don't focus too much on wording, everyone has their own style of expression.

Finally, I want to add that not all is about combat, especially in D:OS. There is much to do between fights and also a fair number of quests that don't need combat skills at all (don't forget to take Pet Pal ). As long as you're fit enough to survive through the fights so your progress through the game isn't jeopardized, you're free to screw with your build however you like. From roleplayer to roleplayer, if you want to "be" someone unique in the game, just play him or her like that. D:OS gives you many opportunities and dialogue options to portray the character of your character.

I understand what you mean, and I've already played the game until a certain point (that'd be around 4 hours..) but i reach a point at which I begin to find it boring. I am a "difficult to satisfy" kind of player, because I come from D&D tabletop, which I've been playing since the 2nd ed. (AD&D) so I ask you to be extra patient with me. In the Steam forum, a guy suggested me this combination: Marksman with Xbow + Witchcraft. All rounded up with Pet Pal, craft and repair. The role would be a support character with buff debuff (Witchraft prevails over Marksman) who can also shoot elemental arrows or just autofire towards the most annoying foe. Whaddaya say?
Got something to add/modify?

What became of "the crossbow is too impeding, makes me slow and all" you wrote earlier, and which was also Chrest's point against Xbows? But since you can use both, that's not a real issue for your build (or just one: does the "bow" ability also work on Xbows?)

I wouldn't give one character both craft and blacksmith (repair) and spread the needed points among two characters. In addition, it's convenient in co-op to "hand around" the blacksmith character instead of the items that need repair, so I wouldn't train a main character in it. The blacksmith doesn't need the items in his/her inventory, you can repair the items in any character's inventory by right-clicking on them as long as this player also controls the blacksmith. The same goes for Loremaster to indentify items. There is a workaround for a main with blacksmith, though: If the other player is not online, you control all of the characters and thus you can repair everyone's items in their inventory. But I personally would find that cumbersome and it excludes the other player from this small but essential part of the game.

I like Witchcraft for support and crowd control, and summons are (universally) very helpful as distraction or "meat shields" to get the heat off the characters. But then again, other spell "schools" also have great support spells (e.g. Bless and Fortify from Geomancing). The developers saw to it that no school "rules" but that they work in synergy. Unique in Witchcraft is the adept spell Rapture which I often combine with Drain Willpower in advance. Charming enemies is great to get them use their support skills on your group and (preferably after that) draw their former allies' fire. edit: As Marksman you can also use charming arrows for that.

But as I said before, my experience is limited to one running playthrough up to level 11. So there might be implications I didn't stumble upon yet that more experienced players might add.

Ok, first of all, my girlfriend left. She doesn't like the game, she says there's too much to read...

Second.. Taking away skills from my main, makes me rather dull as a character. I don't want to only be a pew pew shooter. What shall I do while out of combat? That's the reason I try to set some personality or crafting skill on him. Yesterday evening I went up to the king crab inn and took Madora. But in all this, I almost did nothing. It was the mage the burned almost all the enemies. I failed a lot of shots, I don't talk since I have know-it-all on me, so what role shall this character have if not being a buff-debuff with some utility out of combat?

Even though most dialoge is fully voice-acted? My co-op partner don't like reading long texts in games either, but we get by with me reading (I like it) and summarizing it for her. In contrast, she likes in-game cooking more than I do, so I leave that to her. You both may have made a similar agreement.

Besides, you don't have to read everything the game offers you. If you only read the absolute minimum, you'll just miss the occational hint about abilities, quests, or the world you're playing in.


I just wanted to warn you of spreading out your abilities too thin. What use is pickpocketing, lockpicking, crafting, and blacksmithing along with some combat and magic abilities if you fail all the time because you can't afford higher ranks in them?

You should at least do some calculation beforehand. If you already did that, my concerns are negligible. Don't forget that you have 2-4 characters you control, so the in-game "you" is not just one of the two main characters, though.


Again, don't judge your character's effectiveness on the first hours of the game. Every class gets more versatile with their growing number of skills. And don't forget UnderworldHades' remarks about mages getting less efficient in mid to late game because of the enemies' increased elemental resistances.


I didn't argue against some non-combat utility, but against too much for your ability points.

Hey Raban, thanks first of all, for the detailed answer.
As for my partner, the problem is that the game is dubbed in English, and we're Italian. I fully understand english, but she doesn't and likes a game with more action than talk. I'm quite different, since I've also played PoE and enjoyed it a lot.

As for the character.. true enough that I play 4 of 'em, but I like to think that I'm the main one while the others follow, so I tend to create jacks of all trades into my main. I believe this is where I'm lacking.

I'm slowly discussing my build on the Steam forum, it's a Xbower + Witchcraft, as I told you. Still unsure about the combination...

I get where you're coming from. I also identify with one character in most games, like my Inquisitor in D:OS. I prefer games where I can play only one avatar – per se or optionally. Before D:OS, my friend and I played through Icewind Dale with only one character per player (Fighter/Druid and Fighter/Thief). Our quicker levelling and multiclassing compensated very well for the missing four other characters in most situations.

But there's a threshold how far I will go to have only one avatar. In D:OS, the named NPCs you can take with you are just too fleshed out to miss, so I digressed from my usual path. But even so, we have a fixed assignment of the two NPCs, so Jahan is "my" follower while Bairdotr belongs to my friend. Thus, my main character (aka me) has some of the skills I like to have, while Jahan has others I also prefer, but slightly less. The same goes with my friend's rogue and Bairdotr.

I fully understand your desire to make one "you" that has as much options as possible, I just want to show you another way you could come close to that with a much better points pool and effectiveness. And since D:OS doesn't let you play just one character, you may just make the best of it. The game even offers you the option to have only two bolstered characters with the Lone Wulf talent.

I'm curious, which arguments for the Xbow are given in the Steam forum?

Well, there's no real argument about the Xbow on Steam, at least in my thread. I've centered the argument on the interactions between Marksman and Witchcraft, which is a thing that still I'm not totally convinced of. A member of that forum insists that te combination is viable, although not a powerhouse, but I still find it unoptimized, especially because the crossbow takes some time to really flourish, and the witchcraft skill doesn't do any damage at start. I'm still debating about this, and know that perhaps taking bow instead of Xbow might solve things, but I always play archers, so for once I wanted to change something... perhaps witchcraft is not the best mate for marksman... maybe it's better to add some elemental force...