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what do you think? How many more people will NOT buy the game if its Turn based, opposed to how many people wont buy it if its RTWP.

Lets face it, RTWP isnt the same as action combat, its even more obscure and more specific than turn based.

And lets get real, its not gonna be either one

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Originally Posted by Sordak
And lets get real, its not gonna be either one


As opposed to what? There's no other good way to control multiple characters simultaneously outside these two systems.

Even controlling one person, if they were going to do an ARPG, they would've continued the Dark Alliance series. A FPP game is waaaaay out of Larian's wheelhouse and the engine they use probably won't support it. A TPP OTS D&D game is already a thing and it's completely dead.

So BG3 will be a battle royale roguelite MOBA card game? Lets get real, it's going to be RTwP or TB isometric top down.

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Originally Posted by Brent2410
Originally Posted by Sordak
And lets get real, its not gonna be either one


As opposed to what? There's no other good way to control multiple characters simultaneously outside these two systems.

Even controlling one person, if they were going to do an ARPG, they would've continued the Dark Alliance series. A FPP game is waaaaay out of Larian's wheelhouse and the engine they use probably won't support it. A TPP OTS D&D game is already a thing and it's completely dead.

So BG3 will be a battle royale roguelite MOBA card game? Lets get real, it's going to be RTwP or TB isometric top down.


Larian has now over 200 all over the world employees that are more than enough to make a third-person game. They are no longer a cute Belgian indie studio. And Swen loves to talk about his dream game which will be AAA game, so sooner or later they will be abandoning the old perspective.

Last edited by Hawke; 06/09/19 10:14 AM.
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Sooner or later is not now. They already said they would be recycling their D:OS2 engine for BG3.

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Originally Posted by Brent2410
Sooner or later is not now. They already said they would be recycling their D:OS2 engine for BG3.


An engine is a tool, you can do whatever you want with it. Aside from that, they have already said that they are not using the same version of the engine.
Quote
Baldur’s Gate III will not use the same game engine as the Original Sin series. “We’ve been in development on this game for several years already. It’s not the same engine as those two, but it is our own engine. It’s built on the technology that we already have,” Vincke said.


https://venturebeat.com/2019/06/06/...es-place-after-dds-descent-into-avernus/

Why are people discussing something when they can't be bothered to google facts a few secs?
I can tell you with absolute certainty that BG3 will be a third-person game with optional iso cam game like Neverwinter 2 or Dragon Age it's the next logical step in their development.

Last edited by Hawke; 06/09/19 10:26 AM.
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Originally Posted by Hawke
Originally Posted by Brent2410
Originally Posted by Sordak
And lets get real, its not gonna be either one


As opposed to what? There's no other good way to control multiple characters simultaneously outside these two systems.

Even controlling one person, if they were going to do an ARPG, they would've continued the Dark Alliance series. A FPP game is waaaaay out of Larian's wheelhouse and the engine they use probably won't support it. A TPP OTS D&D game is already a thing and it's completely dead.

So BG3 will be a battle royale roguelite MOBA card game? Lets get real, it's going to be RTwP or TB isometric top down.


Larian has now over 200 all over the world employees that are more than enough to make a third-person game. They are no longer a cute Belgian indie studio. And Swen loves to talk about his dream game which will be AAA game, so sooner or later they will be abandoning the old perspective.


Old perspective? o.O Action 3rd person games are as old as videogames themselves, from platform adventures to beat-em ups to shoot-em ups. RTwP is in fact a more modern mechanic in videogames.

https://www.history.com/topics/inventions/history-of-video-games

Last edited by _Vic_; 06/09/19 10:48 AM.
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Originally Posted by Hawke
third-person game with optional iso cam game like Neverwinter 2 or Dragon Age

Sounds an awful lot like an isometric RTwP with an optional TPP to me. Controlling one character in a TPP while you let AI control your party doesn't exactly speak "Baldur's Gate" or "Dungeons & Dragons" to me. These are the same people that say it doesn't take "skill" because TB and RTwP aren't action games. You're at a baseball game complaining that nobody is scoring touch downs.

Baldur's Gate is traditionally isometric RTwP. D&D is traditionally TB. There's no good argument for TPP action game here besides you're bored with Witcher.

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Of course, it's going to be a game with either a RTWP or turn based combat but it will have 3rd Person exploration. Though I still don't see why that even matters. There are so much more important aspects of RPG than one detail about the combat system.

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Because you're on a thread discussing the merits of different combat systems?

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Originally Posted by Brent2410
Because you're on a thread discussing the merits of different combat systems?


Please do continue, I just came here to correct some false info about the engine. smile

Last edited by Hawke; 06/09/19 11:13 AM.
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Originally Posted by Hawke
I just came here to correct some false info about the engine. smile

Except you were here before that? Even so, you quote Swen saying it's a different engine built on technology they already have. I could link an article claiming that it's the same engine. You can add or change a few things and call it a new engine, when really it's just an upgraded engine... but that's really all just semantics.

Regardless, my point still stands. They're not building a completely new engine from the ground up - they're using parts of what they already have. I don't see them taking the game in a drastically different direction... but I suppose we'll see.

Last edited by Brent2410; 06/09/19 11:52 AM.
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You know, I'm a fan of the original BG and love RTwP. However, I just tried out a new Kickstarter game that is turn-based like DOS. Solasta crown of the magister. It is using the complete 5e ruleset and has a really nice feel to it (part of it is using light, options like pushing enemies off clifts or dropping objects on them. Using the surroundings and light etc. I actually enjoyed the demo a lot and seeing the 5e ruleset in full online play. I also enjoyed DOS but it never felt "serious" enough to be a DnD contender like BG should be.

With that said, I am now completely open to the turn-based, especially if they include a GM mode for tabletop play with friends after finishing the campaign. If they match the feel (or exceed it) then I think I can be fully converted to turn-based combat.

Either way, I think I'm going to be happy. I'm more concerned too if it will feel like a real DnD experience or if it will be more cartoony like DOS. I trust Larian to make this good either way, they definitely have passion and skill.


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Originally Posted by WizardPus
You know, I'm a fan of the original BG and love RTwP. However, I just tried out a new Kickstarter game that is turn-based like DOS. Solasta crown of the magister. It is using the complete 5e ruleset and has a really nice feel to it (part of it is using light, options like pushing enemies off clifts or dropping objects on them. Using the surroundings and light etc. I actually enjoyed the demo a lot and seeing the 5e ruleset in full online play. I also enjoyed DOS but it never felt "serious" enough to be a DnD contender like BG should be.

With that said, I am now completely open to the turn-based, especially if they include a GM mode for tabletop play with friends after finishing the campaign. If they match the feel (or exceed it) then I think I can be fully converted to turn-based combat.

Either way, I think I'm going to be happy. I'm more concerned too if it will feel like a real DnD experience or if it will be more cartoony like DOS. I trust Larian to make this good either way, they definitely have passion and skill.



We see the kind of visuals we can expect in BG3 in the trailer which is very different from DOS2.

And yeah Solasta is very fun, TB for the win.

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Originally Posted by WizardPus
You know, I'm a fan of the original BG and love RTwP. However, I just tried out a new Kickstarter game that is turn-based like DOS. Solasta crown of the magister. It is using the complete 5e ruleset and has a really nice feel to it (part of it is using light, options like pushing enemies off clifts or dropping objects on them. Using the surroundings and light etc. I actually enjoyed the demo a lot and seeing the 5e ruleset in full online play. I also enjoyed DOS but it never felt "serious" enough to be a DnD contender like BG should be.

With that said, I am now completely open to the turn-based, especially if they include a GM mode for tabletop play with friends after finishing the campaign. If they match the feel (or exceed it) then I think I can be fully converted to turn-based combat.

Either way, I think I'm going to be happy. I'm more concerned too if it will feel like a real DnD experience or if it will be more cartoony like DOS. I trust Larian to make this good either way, they definitely have passion and skill.


Kudos to you, I also downloaded the demo in steam and the game looks great. I look forward to backing if they promise that there will be more races and classes.

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Originally Posted by Omegaphallic

We see the kind of visuals we can expect in BG3 in the trailer which is very different from DOS2.

And yeah Solasta is very fun, TB for the win.

No, we don't.
CGI trailers have typically hardly any telling on the sort of visual style you can expect from a party based RPG.


Party control in Baldur's Gate 3 is a complete mess that begs to be addressed. You too can join the good fight HERE
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Originally Posted by Hawke
I can tell you with absolute certainty that BG3 will be a third-person game with optional iso cam game like Neverwinter 2 or Dragon Age it's the next logical step in their development.


Originally Posted by Brent2410
I could link an article claiming that it's the same engine...... They're not building a completely new engine from the ground up - they're using parts of what they already have.


Tick, tock.

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Originally Posted by Tuco
Originally Posted by Omegaphallic

We see the kind of visuals we can expect in BG3 in the trailer which is very different from DOS2.

And yeah Solasta is very fun, TB for the win.

No, we don't.
CGI trailers have typically hardly any telling on the sort of visual style you can expect from a party based RPG.


It's from the game itself and not just the beginning. Plus they've said it doesn't look like DOS2.

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Originally Posted by Omegaphallic

It's from the game itself and not just the beginning. Plus they've said it doesn't look like DOS2.

Sure, and I'm glad of it. Then again that doesn't mean it will look like the CGI teaser either.

P.S. I have no clue what the first sentence is referring to.

Last edited by Tuco; 07/09/19 01:18 PM.

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Originally Posted by Omegaphallic
Originally Posted by Tuco
Originally Posted by Omegaphallic

We see the kind of visuals we can expect in BG3 in the trailer which is very different from DOS2.

And yeah Solasta is very fun, TB for the win.

No, we don't.
CGI trailers have typically hardly any telling on the sort of visual style you can expect from a party based RPG.


It's from the game itself and not just the beginning. Plus they've said it doesn't look like DOS2.



Completely and utterly wrong the trailer was made by a different company called unit image and isn't even rendered in the new Divinity Engine thus does not represent the final game at all.
Source https://www.unit-image.fr/film/baldurs-gate-3/
So the trailer tell us absolutely nothing about the final game!

Last edited by Hawke; 07/09/19 01:44 PM.
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From the business perspective of wizards of the coast, i don't see RTWP making much sense.
They would please some fans of the old games if going for RTWP, but that isn't to profitable compared to capitalizing on the surge of new people in the hobby that has been exposed to DnD from the likes of Critical Role. Since turn based would be a lot more faitful to the actual 5e roleplaying game then RTWP, I think advertising to players that you can experience 5e by playing Baldurs Gate 3 is a much better idea then going for RTWP to please some of the old fans.
It would work the other way as well, people that has not played the pen and paper game, might get more intrested in doing so after playing Baldurs Gate 3, if its turn based.

Also, why would Wizards say that Larian is the perfect studio for the job, if they are not planning for turn based, when Larian is known for turn based.

Why not both? Some have asked. Well its a lot more work ofc. But if you look at the tacked on Turn based from Pillars 2, that dosent go over to well. Some of the combat mechanics like incresed attack speed dosent work in turn based, it just make you go first in a turn, wich isn't that huge. The engame bosses are extremly slow fights because they are made for a system where attacks happen much more rapidly. When doing turn based you need to design the game for it, removing useless trash fights, and instead have mostly intresting, harder fights. And having to powerful healing so fights go on forever isn't a good idea.

So I don't think we'll see both systems either.

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