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A lot of discussion about BG3 tends to trend towards how to make the game more like DnD 5e, which is great that that discussion is being had. What I want to focus on are suggestions we can provide to help make BG3 feel more like a proper sequel to the BG saga. I know there's already been huge topics about making sure companions live and outside of Act one and increasing party size to 5 or 6, which would be awesome if Larian is able to do this. Here's my list for other things they can consider adding or changing:

  • Make the HUD reminiscent of BG.
  • Make the mind flayer logo larger and place that sucker dead center of the start up menu.
  • More dramatic opening music. The opening music for BG was in your face and really set the scene for what you were about to experience. BG 3 music is more subtle and slow to start.
  • Add the rolling for stats system (I am aware they are currently working on this). I miss those days where I spend XX minutes rolling for stats over and over again before deciding to recall the stats I had stored earlier.
  • You may wish to mimic the general character creation process a bit more. For example, the BG character creation piecemeals information to you, so you only have to focus on one thing at a time and your character sheet is slowly filled out as you go. In BG3, the character creation screen throws a pre-filled character sheet at you immediately, which makes the first screen especially too busy. This makes your name or your background forgettable or unseen by some people who don't know where to look or what to focus on.
  • Add Fog of War.
  • Make items that need to be identified blue.
  • Use some similar sound effects here and there to help us subtly or blatantly think of BG. like the sound of an item being identified, or the clicking sound your mouse makes.
  • More voice barks in and out of combat where the characters say something. It's definitely needed when you select them and then get them to perform an action, or when they get a critical, they miss, their weapon is ineffective, etc.
  • Have certain spells be the same vocally as they were in the BG. The way it worked in BG is that the different schools of magic had different Latin words associated with them. Also couldn't hurt to add that more ominous echo that happens when you cast a spell.
  • Party formations.
  • Please add in "You must gather your party before venturing forth." At this point, it's the law. It has to be in the game.
  • Party management system, such as being able to kick out party members at any time. Additionally, talking to a potential party member should allow you to access party management so you can immediately recruit them, instead of them making a comment that your party is full. I realize that this is not needed if you are stuck with the 4 person party that you choose after Act one, but ... I can hope.
  • Give me a spell book that I can look at all my spells on.
  • Have some BG items available in the game. Probably too powerful for EA depending on the item, but as an example, it would be dope to be able to pick up the Flail of Ages again.
  • Hotbar. The way BG handled organizing your different abilities on your hotbar worked, and would be wonderful to see something similar, especially with the hot mess that we currently have. You have icons that represented items, spells, and innate abilities. Once accessed, the hotbar changed and expanded so you were looking at everything within that category.


What else would you like to see added or changed that's a realistic want that could make this feel more like a proper BG sequel?

Last edited by dreambled; 24/10/20 01:55 AM.
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It shall be!

Really all excellent suggestions that would make me smile!

Giant Flayer Logo and Level Up sound effect when the main menu launches hehe
+1

Wisdom is only possessed by the learned, but I'd like to see a tome for that too

Last edited by Black_Elk; 24/10/20 01:57 AM.
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Originally Posted by Black_Elk
It shall be!

Really all excellent suggestions that would make me smile!

Giant Flayer Logo and Level Up sound effect when the main menu launches hehe
+1

Wisdom is only possessed by the learned, but I'd like to see a tome for that too

Oh, yes. Tomes would be a nice edition.

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Agree 100%

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I agree with most of these of these. It is a new UI, after all. and I like the current hotbar. I just found out you can drag it to whatever size you like. BG1 and 2 I thought were limited. Maybe organized hotbars?


Originally Posted by dreambled

  • Add the rolling for stats system (I am aware they are currently working on this). I miss those days where I spend XX minutes rolling for stats over and over again before deciding to recall the stats I had stored earlier.
  • Make items that need to be identified blue.
  • More voice barks in and out of combat where the characters say something. It's definitely needed when you select them and then get them to perform an action, or when they get a critical, they miss, their weapon is ineffective, etc.
  • Have certain spells be the same vocally as they were in the BG. The way it worked in BG is that the different schools of magic had different Latin words associated with them. Also couldn't hurt to add that more ominous echo that happens when you cast a spell.
  • Party formations.
  • Please add in "You must gather your party before venturing forth." At this point, it's the law. It has to be in the game.



The last point quoted is on T-shirts, Memes, and is now a staple in the industry, it should not be missed.

BG1 , more so than BG2, had great one liners we still remember over 20 years later.
"Ho there, wanderer"
"Don't touch me! I'm super important!"
Minsc lines regarding Boo are in a league of their own.

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I agree with everything.

It would be great, but if I had to choose I'll talk more abou the voice of companions and their sentences because it's a litte bit ridiculous atm. They just never open their mouth... your suggestion would lead to "more BG" but also to way more interresting and engaging characters.

I'll add that it would be great if the fast travel system was not about TP /ancient runes lolz. It could work on the worldmap, which is designed a little bit like the maps of BG1/2.
That would be a great, way more immersive and an easy "BG taste" inside their new gen game.

I'll also like beautifull portrait instead of those awfull 3D models.


But I really think Larian totally don't care about BG 1/2.
I'm even not sure they played it, remember it and/or understand why they are special in the head of so many people... (Even if there as many reasons as it have players).
It seems like they reject everything that looks "like" BG. They sold it like "yea yea you'll find BG elements, old fans will be pleased" blablabla... But we'll probably only have Minsc and Boo and nothing more... Even the most easy things, they won't do it... Even the things that will greatly improve their game, they won't do it... And that's a shame.

Last edited by Maximuuus; 24/10/20 06:08 AM.
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Most of these are just "easter eggs" for the BG die hards, and not the "GIEF RTWP!" styles.
None of this messes with the current game so, I can't disagree. (Although some of them aren't really needed for me personally, I don't see the harm)

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Agree with most points. Only nitpicks I have:


Quote
Add Fog of War

We have fog of war. In a sense. You can only explore abit around your characters and need line of sight to know if any creatures are present. Which is essentially the same as fog of war. Aldo considering our characters can see more then 10 feet infront of them it makes sense that they can see the scenery up ahead, but cant tell yet if theres potential hostiles there. I like it smile

Quote
Give me a spell book that I can look at all my spells on
.
We have a spellbook. In a sense but its very basic and needs to be expended upon. Non dnd players need to be able to see ehat each spell does and its current implentation leaves something to be desired.

For the rest: +1

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Originally Posted by Aurgelmir
Most of these are just "easter eggs" for the BG die hards, and not the "GIEF RTWP!" styles.
None of this messes with the current game so, I can't disagree. (Although some of them aren't really needed for me personally, I don't see the harm)


It's pleasant to read something like that because it looks like you can't say you want more BG in BG3 without being treated as a nostalgic troll that want RTWP and 2D graphics in 2020^^
That's not what reasonable people that think BG3 is a good/promising game but not a good BG game ask.

Last edited by Maximuuus; 24/10/20 11:16 AM.
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Might I add one:

Add a conversation bar. Sometimes people say something in the surroundings or my companions are talking whilst I was offscreen trying to figure out where to go and I missed half the conversations. In bg you could always read what was said so if you missed something it wasent that bad


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Originally Posted by Demoulius
Might I add one:

Add a conversation bar. Sometimes people say something in the surroundings or my companions are talking whilst I was offscreen trying to figure out where to go and I missed half the conversations. In bg you could always read what was said so if you missed something it wasent that bad


Totally agree with this.

Quote

More voice barks in and out of combat where the characters say something. It's definitely needed when you select them and then get them to perform an action, or when they get a critical, they miss, their weapon is ineffective, etc.
Have certain spells be the same vocally as they were in the BG. The way it worked in BG is that the different schools of magic had different Latin words associated with them. Also couldn't hurt to add that more ominous echo that happens when you cast a spell.
Party formations.
Please add in "You must gather your party before venturing forth." At this point, it's the law. It has to be in the game.


And this.

Originally Posted by xxMunsonxx

BG1 , more so than BG2, had great one liners we still remember over 20 years later.
"Ho there, wanderer"
"Don't touch me! I'm super important!"

I miss this most of all. It created what I think of as THE Baldur's Gate atmosphere.

Last edited by Moirnelithe; 24/10/20 11:27 AM.
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To OP: You sound like you have a passion for Baldur's Gate just like me. The sooner we leave this place and hide in our hovels the better.

But let's never stop dreaming...


"Tiax rules. Make way."
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Great suggestions overall. I'd just go easy on fog of war; let it reflect what the characters would realistically see.

I have a minor idea for travel - make it appear not as TP, but, very simply, like timeskip during which the party travels in a perfectly mundane way. Maybe reduce waypoints and add this characteristic BG wheel icon when hovering over the waypoint.

Last edited by Uncle Lester; 24/10/20 07:03 PM.
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The companions already banter as you travel. If you are zooming around the map you ahead of your party you won't hear it though. It's not constant but it is there, and you can hear them distrust each other or comment on the destruction and gore around them.

I really don't need constant one liners though. That is off putting to me. I know some people are totally ecstatic to click on characters and hear them say "leave me alone" and then keep spamming them till they say something else. I remember NWN always hearing the thief saying "done is done" after every action I ask him to do. I don't need catch phrases, it's too cliche to me.

Rolling for stats in every game results in me constantly rerolling till I get what I want. The point buy system is superior in terms of getting the game going and still forcing weaknesses. I remember rolling for stats in champion of krynn and having +18 on almost every stat. That took hours of rerolling till I got what I wanted (I had to make sure my melee had 18 and then at least (50 over) how ever that rule was for AD&D for beyond human str).

Rest of the suggestions I guess are harmless but I feel are low hanging fruit that just panders. UI changes to look like old BG I think would be bad, but hotbar organization would be good. I do it manually now and you can change tabs to sort by spell type or what ever you want, but it isn't as clean as it could be.

Spell book? Like you want a spellbook in your inventory or when selecting spells you want it to have a UI that looks like a book? Again just cosmetics.

Music and logo? Already present. Music is already pretty over the top actually.

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Excellent list, I agree with it all.

By far the biggest glaring thing that simply NEEDS to change are the portraits. Right now they are awful, can we get some awesome art that makes it feel like Baldurs Gate?

The HUD and UI just feel so UN Baldurs Gate to me as well. This stuff has to change. Please Larian listen to this feedback. We don't want DOS:3, please try your best to differentiate this from the divinity series. The inventory art is identical to DOS and needs a series makeover to make it seem more baldurs gate. The art is too cartoonish. Baldurs gate is NOT a cartoon style game.

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I actually was looking at buying the old bg1&2 on steam and saw the excessive portrait packs pushing the price up to $90. I can do without portrait art. I know that was really popular in early 2000s with nwn and such, but I went back and looked at them and they are a bit....bad. Some are exactly what you accuse bg3 of, cartoony and caricature, to the point of being tacky. Some are obviously real photos that had fantasy art put over them.

The point of the current portait system is to represent the character you have. Having art that isn't the face of the character is "immersion breaking" as I keep seeing people say on the forums. Having multiple pieces of the characters doing different poses is unnecessary to me.

Also consider character creation in the older games didn't have you pick hair/face/eye color/skin tone/tattoos/makeup/etc. So portraits then are character customization cosmetics that we do now with the actual character models.

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Ah there is it is, the discussion I want!

I agree its going to be modelling and cosmetics now, 3d won.

But the portrait has not been given the full treatment yet. Custom 2D is a stopgap for custom 3D portrait creator.

What they need to do is hire an art team from a broad range of backgrounds, including cartooning and caricature, and make a portrait studio for the models. That has always been my dream for a CRPG. I remember when I waa in elementary school and the first apples were brought into the classroom, Oregon trail era. And there was a program called like "Monster Maker" or something similarly DOS sounding. I think it was in the arts and computer curriculum in mtn view, but the idea was that you made your own monster from all the many parts, 3 eyes or 6, extra arms, horns, tails whatever. But it was the greatest! How rad would it be if they took the best modeling from these AAA titles we've seen and put a bunch of portrait artists and modelers together in a massive hall where they could work out what makes a killer portrait. I think backgrounds and lighting would be a lot of fun, because there is a ton you could do there with textures or background scenery or effects like fog. Directional lighting/color vfx. Then have a facial stretch mesh model with all kinds of emotive drop downs or presets, to change the faces' expression. Full poser for the bust would be better with equipment. But if they could get it to the point where you had a fully pose-able and equip-able mannequin to deck out in a studio with all the gear that would be so legit. I know it could be done, it just hasn't been tried yet at that level.

Probably would be cooler to start with a monster maker portrait thing, since it'd be great fun to play with. They are at the floating head level now. Bust with arms probably the next step in portrait progression. I swear they could milk EA for a decade with something like that lol. Most fervent wish for a game in the Forgotten Realms, that'd be so cool.

The idea of a custom portrait though is where BG moved the ball forward. At the time 2D image was the only viable way. Now modelling has advanced a lot, but it was the whole idea of tapping into the art zine on a custom level that made BG. They could do it again, they seem to have the rotoscope tech going.

Illustrators do this shit in their bedrooms with like broomsticks for spears, and blankets for capes all the time hehe. It's possible they could distil some of that and make a portrait creator that builds off the avatar model in game but has a unique treatment. Same could be done with all the equipment to the Nth degree.

ps. they could hire Rapoza to do the Baldur's Gate gang like he did the Turtles. I'd be there in a heartbeat! Someone out there would find a way to make it glorious and distill the essence




Last edited by Black_Elk; 24/10/20 08:12 PM.
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Portrait backgrounds and various emotes and facial expressions are totally doable, seen it in other games (can't remember which off the top of my head).

Also the facial expressions already exist programmed in as we see in the conversation cut scenes.

I personally think the portraits should change depending on condition. If the character is low on health they should be hunched over, maybe grimacing in pain. If they are in good relations with you maybe they are smiling, and if they are at a point of negative relation status they may be frowning.

If there is a storyline aspect that changes their personality like afraid of the dark, or don't like being friendly with goblins or something, they could show the discomfort or aggression.

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Yeah that stuff is great! They did it in Might and Magic way back when. Same concept, just 3D modelled next level.

It would be so cool, and similar functionally to the fatigue or drunk icon, but with way more character haha.

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Originally Posted by CMF
The companions already banter as you travel. If you are zooming around the map you ahead of your party you won't hear it though. It's not constant but it is there, and you can hear them distrust each other or comment on the destruction and gore around them.

I really don't need constant one liners though. That is off putting to me. I know some people are totally ecstatic to click on characters and hear them say "leave me alone" and then keep spamming them till they say something else. I remember NWN always hearing the thief saying "done is done" after every action I ask him to do. I don't need catch phrases, it's too cliche to me.

Rolling for stats in every game results in me constantly rerolling till I get what I want. The point buy system is superior in terms of getting the game going and still forcing weaknesses. I remember rolling for stats in champion of krynn and having +18 on almost every stat. That took hours of rerolling till I got what I wanted (I had to make sure my melee had 18 and then at least (50 over) how ever that rule was for AD&D for beyond human str).

Rest of the suggestions I guess are harmless but I feel are low hanging fruit that just panders. UI changes to look like old BG I think would be bad, but hotbar organization would be good. I do it manually now and you can change tabs to sort by spell type or what ever you want, but it isn't as clean as it could be.

Spell book? Like you want a spellbook in your inventory or when selecting spells you want it to have a UI that looks like a book? Again just cosmetics.

Music and logo? Already present. Music is already pretty over the top actually.


Banter ? Something like 5 times on 25 hours ?
They don't have to say things like "leave me alone" and they don't have to talk everytime you click on them...

But they HAVE to looks like characters and not only companions. The biggest part of the game is combats and exploration and they absolutely NEVER say a word during battles. Is that complicated to add a few sentences when they're dying/crit/kill an ennemies i.e ?

That's exactly why they feel so alive in BG1/2 and why everyone loved them despite their (very) short background/story/sidequest.
Their personnalities travelled with us during the whole game.
In BG3 they're just tools with a few side quest dialogs and a few sentences when you reach a point of interrest.
They didn't feel alive at all during the biggest part of the 25h.

About dice roll you want a constraint because you're not able to stop rolling... And I want to play how I want to.
Sometimes yes, I assume rolling again and again to have a badass character... And sometimes I assume rolling only once.
My fun doesn't have to suffer because you're not mentaly strong enough.

Last edited by Maximuuus; 24/10/20 08:27 PM.
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