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Wait wait wait, You mean this game isn’t going to have New Game+ mode? If a game doesn’t have 100 levels why even bother. When are they adding the loot boxes? I’m bored of looking at the same vendor trash. When can I bind fire ball to mousebutton2? I need bigger damage numbers and why are all the monsters talking so much, just die already no one cares.

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It is worth remembering that having a level in a class is actually a big deal in and of itself in DnD. The vast majority of people in the world never achieve this. They are functionally level 0 with 10s in every stat while we're rocking 12s and 16s. A person with 16 Intelligence is nearly a genius in their own right. A person with 16 strength is like a professional athlete in peak physical condition.


Level 1 isn't a novice. It is someone who has enough competence in their art they can reasonably be expected to take on small groups of goblins, kobolds, and bandits on their own. Something normal people wouldn't be capable of.

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Larian doesn't really care about consistency.
They took what they find cool everywhere in D&D and the FR, change,mix them and add their own touche everywhere and... that's BG3.

This game is absolutely inconsistent in regards of the FR and D&D...
If you're a random low level from the surface that jump in a hole and fight with creatures in the underdark... You die. End.
Drizzt almost die there many times even if he's a powerfull native that had years of rude training in Menzoberranzan (and he didn't encounter overboosted minotaurs).

And yes those companions story...
They all lived totally WTF things but yea... Still level 1...

But don't worry, "that's the tadpole" grin

And I don't remember that you can dip your weapon in fire to have a +1D4 fire damage weapon in the FR, but that's another point.

Last edited by Maximuuus; 27/10/20 05:59 AM.
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Originally Posted by Abits
Originally Posted by Bufotenina
Originally Posted by Thieves Rule
This isn't your typical "I start out as a farmer and take up adventuring as a profession after the dragon ate my flock" sort of story. All of the pre-rolled characters have a decent backstory that seems to indicate that they've been doing this a while. You can't tell me that in the 200 years since Astarion was turned into a vampire that he didn't pick up more than the basics of picking locks. Even worse is the thought that Gale was wandering the planes but still can't cast more than a couple of level 1 spells.

Maybe start out at level 5 or something like that. Makes it a bit more plausible unless later on all the characters say that the tadpole must have chewed on the part of the brain that contains all their previous experience.

I'm enjoying the various backstories the characters have and their different personalities, it's just this part of the equation is leaving me scratch my head.


I have to make Will, Shadowheart, Laez'el, spill the beans about their past but if Gale is an example of what happened they all didi something that brought them back to level 1. The archmage messed up with Mystra ending up killing her and with the need of powerful artifacts to avoid him to explode and erase half of the map with him and unable to use magic as he was used to.

Furthermore the really big and epic enemies can not be killed (like the demon lord in the flying squid), and the mobs in the area are at max level 4.

For our character, well the mindflyers kidnapped pratically any sentient living being they could (ehy, they implated a tadpole in a Gnoll!), so they toke a mr/mrs/miss nobody without any exceptional backstory.

Like I said (and for some reason everyone ignored it), what makes you think that any of them (aside from Gale perhaps) deserves more than level 1?


Who are you refering to? O.o Mine was an answer to really clear and targeted question. The original post wasn't about the characters deserving to be more than level 1 but how lame it was that they start at such low level without any given reason.

What can I say, when I answer a question I usually stay on topic and I not used to make another question to defuse the argument brought by the one maing the question.

Said that, lets focus on you off topic answer:

1) Gale was an archmage able to evoke the personification of magic herself, pretty sure is quite an accomplisment, something no level one can even dream off.

2) Will, he has created a militar force, and his name is known all around, and when he shows up he is frigging powerful compared to other npcs and the playing party (indeed he is the one character that seriously seems nerfed when joins the party);

3) Astarion is an elf turned vampire with two hundred years of experience, one can assume he has trained, unless Cazador wanted him just as a pet so didn't allow the pale elf to train his abilities nor those tied to the fact that he is a vampire, nor those tied to his class, I am pretty sure Astarion wasn't even a rogue before he was kidnapped by the mindfliers (that would easily explain why he is a level 1);

4) Laez'el is a trained warrior in a very competitive race where strenght is highly valued indeed the underlings of her fellow dragon raider are all above level one, so it's just normal to think she is of a higher level;

5) Shadowheart was sent to a very difficult mission by her church, pretty sure they won't give such a delicate quest to a low level adept.

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Yes, all the companions we meet should be level 10. But does the game need it? Is there a point in screwing the game mechanics derived from D&D just to satisfy the thrive for authenticity and logic of some players?

Last edited by Nyanko; 27/10/20 12:21 PM.
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Originally Posted by Nyanko
Yes, all the companions we meet should be level 10. But does the game need it? Is there a point in screwing the game mechanics derived from D&D just to satisfy the thrive for authenticity and logic of some players?


Again, it's all about consistency.
Maybe you don't really care... And I have to admit that in a game like DoS it's not a problem to me... But BG3 is not sell as a DoS game.

I guess when you write stories from nothing, you can easily choose to be consistent to the rules/the lore of the world in which your stories take place... Or you can choose something else. Whatever your choices, your stories can be interresting and engaging.

Last edited by Maximuuus; 27/10/20 01:26 PM.
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Originally Posted by Maximuuus
Originally Posted by Nyanko
Yes, all the companions we meet should be level 10. But does the game need it? Is there a point in screwing the game mechanics derived from D&D just to satisfy the thrive for authenticity and logic of some players?


Again, it's all about consistency.
Maybe you don't really care... And I have to admit that in a game like DoS it's not a problem to me... But BG3 is not sell as a DoS game.


What consistency are you talking about? So playing a level 1 high elf wizard who's 200 years old already with a big background story is fine in D&D but it's not fine in BG3? How does it work exactly?

Maybe you don't know what I am talking about. Have you played any pnp D&D?

Last edited by Nyanko; 27/10/20 01:26 PM.
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Originally Posted by Nyanko
Yes, all the companions we meet should be level 10.


This, especially Gale.
Thing is, Larian can't write "normal" NPCs. They all have to be extra special with some quirk and such, so their backstory never matches the mechanics. Same happened in D:OS2 with their origin characters where everyone except Lohse would have been higher level already.

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I wish the characters backstory would be something like they’ve got lv drained by the tadpole.

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Originally Posted by Nyanko
Originally Posted by Maximuuus
Originally Posted by Nyanko
Yes, all the companions we meet should be level 10. But does the game need it? Is there a point in screwing the game mechanics derived from D&D just to satisfy the thrive for authenticity and logic of some players?


Again, it's all about consistency.
Maybe you don't really care... And I have to admit that in a game like DoS it's not a problem to me... But BG3 is not sell as a DoS game.


What consistency are you talking about? So playing a level 1 high elf wizard who's 200 years old already with a big background story is fine in D&D but it's not fine in BG3? How does it work exactly?

Maybe you don't know what I am talking about. Have you played any pnp D&D?


Oh ok, so BG3 is just designed to be a random custom campaign instead of a consistent story in the FR. That explain so many things.....

Last edited by Maximuuus; 27/10/20 02:58 PM.
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Originally Posted by Orbax
Originally Posted by Argonaut
As far as I remember he tells you some things that maybe allude to him having a connection to Mystra and being a powerful wizard but doesn't explain too much about how he cocked up and his whole affair with Mystra is all inside his head. It would be a lot worse if he did spell all that out for you.


I got him to flat out say all of that haha

Can you screencap it or make a video please?

For people talking about power scaling and ability stats I'm not surprised none of you brought up the Tiers of Play.

Originally Posted by 5e D&D Players Handbook Pg 12 "Tiers of Play"

In the first tier (levels 1-4), characters are effectively apprentice adventurerers. The threats they face are relatively minor, usually posing a danger to local farmsteads or villages.
In the second tier (levels5-10), characters come into their own. These characters have become important, facing dangers that threaten cities and kingdoms.
In the third tier (levels 11-16), characters have reached a level of power that sets them high above the ordinary populace and makes them special even among adventurers.
At the fourth tier (levels 17-20), characters achieve the pinnacle of their class features, becoming heroic archetypes in their own right. The fate of the world of even the fundamental order of the multiverse might hang in the balance during their adventure


5e outlines how powerful you are at every stage, and even with pumped up stats you're nothing special in the first tier. City guardmens or army soldiers and a lot of bandits are stronger than you. We are in tier 4 play as tier 1 characters.

Last edited by Argonaut; 27/10/20 01:56 PM.

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Originally Posted by Argonaut
Originally Posted by Orbax
Originally Posted by Argonaut
As far as I remember he tells you some things that maybe allude to him having a connection to Mystra and being a powerful wizard but doesn't explain too much about how he cocked up and his whole affair with Mystra is all inside his head. It would be a lot worse if he did spell all that out for you.


I got him to flat out say all of that haha

Can you screencap it or make a video please?






Like more than half of the companion' stuff it's easy to miss.

Last edited by Rhobar121; 27/10/20 02:19 PM.
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Originally Posted by Rhobar121
Originally Posted by Argonaut
Originally Posted by Orbax
Originally Posted by Argonaut
As far as I remember he tells you some things that maybe allude to him having a connection to Mystra and being a powerful wizard but doesn't explain too much about how he cocked up and his whole affair with Mystra is all inside his head. It would be a lot worse if he did spell all that out for you.


I got him to flat out say all of that haha

Can you screencap it or make a video please?






Like more than half of the companion' stuff it's easy to miss.

Here is the OP statement.

Quote
Well, Gale was such a prodigy he had sex with Mystra, the goddess of magic and after she ignored him he found a Netherese artifact left over from Karsus' Folly, the only 12th level spell ever cast where Karsus took over her body, the weave undid itself, she committed suicide, and a new goddess was born to take over and repair it. Gale then had this shadow weave chaotic magic from the time of days of the most powerful spells cast and items created and it somehow consumed him when he opened it and now has to feed it powerful artifacts or he thinks that his explosion would wipe out the largest city on the Sword Cost, Waterdeep.

He didn't flat out say any of that shit. He said he was powerful and he lost his power because he tried to gain mystras favor(which is a no no to mystra). Sex with mystra is in his head, she didn't ignore him so much as he wanted her favor etc.


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Originally Posted by Argonaut


He didn't flat out say any of that shit. He said he was powerful and he lost his power because he tried to gain mystras favor(which is a no no to mystra). Sex with mystra is in his head, she didn't ignore him so much as he wanted her favor etc.



He did. You saying it was in his head means he told you about it. You are choosing to not believe what he says. And in 6 playthroughs he said all that ONCE. You have a false assumption that you have had every possible conversation with him. Your experience is not other people's. If you are this vehement about it, you obviously didnt see the text I did. You're just choosing to not believe something because you personally haven't seen it. Hubris.


What is the problem you are solving? Does your proposed change solve the problem? Is your change feasible? What else will be affected by your change? Will your change impact revenue? Does your change align with the goals and strategies of the organizations (Larian, WotC)?
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@Orbax
Video or Screencaps please. What he says in the video covers what I said but not what you said. Also when I said its in his head I meant from the tadpole or delusions, as in it didn't actually happen. You present it as though its fact that happened.

Citation. Needed.


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Originally Posted by Argonaut
@Orbax
Video or Screencaps please. What he says in the video covers what I said but not what you said. Also when I said its in his head I meant from the tadpole or delusions, as in it didn't actually happen. You present it as though its fact that happened.

Citation. Needed.


You just made me realize how little I care about you believing me or not. Pretend this is a victory when I am not going to go back and restart a game specifically to get to a point in a conversation so I can screen cap it to "Argonaut" and say "see see!". Enjoy your version of the game.


What is the problem you are solving? Does your proposed change solve the problem? Is your change feasible? What else will be affected by your change? Will your change impact revenue? Does your change align with the goals and strategies of the organizations (Larian, WotC)?
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@Orbax
Why not just go find it on you tube in 5 seconds? Nice head cannon mate.


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Originally Posted by Argonaut
@Orbax
Video or Screencaps please. What he says in the video covers what I said but not what you said. Also when I said its in his head I meant from the tadpole or delusions, as in it didn't actually happen. You present it as though its fact that happened.

Citation. Needed.



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Originally Posted by Argonaut
@Orbax
Video or Screencaps please. What he says in the video covers what I said but not what you said. Also when I said its in his head I meant from the tadpole or delusions, as in it didn't actually happen. You present it as though its fact that happened.

Citation. Needed.

Not sure if this will help or hurt, but I can confirm that Gale says all of these things. He romanced Mystra. Lost favor. Found that artefact and tried to use it to give Mystra back some of her lost power and win back her favor. It backfired and now he has a magic-eating nuke inside of him that he has to keep feeding or else it will explode.

Edit: or see Rhobar121's link above

Last edited by mrfuji3; 27/10/20 03:47 PM.
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Originally Posted by Nyanko
Yes, all the companions we meet should be level 10.


Only if you believe the stories they're telling you. smile

Some of it could be exaggeration revealed later, or just accepted on faith but we don't really know if all those stories are true. All we have is their word for it. And we already know some of them, or all of them, are concealing things from the player character.

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