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Originally Posted by Maximuuus
A gameplay issue many games find tricks to deal with, or at least assume that forests, plains, fields and "empty" expanses exist.


The game is already 87GB large and is going to get bigger as they add more stuff. I would strongly prefer not to need an entire extra harddrive to contain it all just so you can spend an extra 20 minutes walking from one place to another.

This is just a gameplay complaint. It isn't about the lore of the setting.

Originally Posted by Maximuuus

A goblin shaman yes. Didn't you notice that there at least 1 goblin shaman everytime you encounter goblins ?


Yes, and there's usually three or four non-casters for every caster in a fight. Seems reasonable enough to me and keeps the fights from being boring.

Can you show me the lore that says goblin casters should be more rare than they are?


Originally Posted by Maximuuus

"Most of what I said" but you only react about druids and the underdark^^


Because those were your lore complaints. Most everything else is a gameplay issue like flaming swords and terrain stuff.



Originally Posted by KillerRabbit


The human who came up with the analogy can speak for himself but I didn't take it that way at all. He's saying the whole is greater than the sum of its parts.

Surely you've seen movie sequels that had every element but not the right chemistry, right?

Now the point isn't to ruin anyone's fun -- I'm having a blast. But to let devs need to know what needs to be changed. The game is fun but not quite BG and not quite FR yet -- but it can get there.


Sure, except I made a post expressing how much fun I was having and how immersed in the Forgotten Realms I personally felt and he came in to tell me I was wrong. That is why I took exception to what he said.


Originally Posted by KillerRabbit

Part of the 'not FR' feeling comes from the lack of an overriding heroic narrative. So far we are on a self interest quest and we do good things in the hopes that our deaths may be prevented. I'm that in chapter 2 we get the chance to be heroes for the sake of being heroes. "Make way evil . . .



The Forgotten Realms isn't about always having a heroic narrative. It is about making choices that influence whether you and your group will be heroes or villains. This is why players can choose their character alignment in most games. You don't gotta play the hero.

I also don't quite get how you took away you couldn't be heroic? I am doing a good guy run right now and I feel pretty strongly in my character and his righteous conviction as he made choices that actively put off his obtaining a cure to help people in need. All the while keeping a deadly poison on his person he planned to drink if it came to it.

I felt pretty heroic. Was there anything specific that made you not feel that way?

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Originally Posted by Traycor
Originally Posted by Maximuuus
I didn't remember that everything was so close when I read books in the FR. Usually travelling means something and take time.

This is just one of those things that has to change for a game. Distance is not meant to be taken literally. It's just representative.

BG1 had big open, empty maps with lots of exploration. But it meant you just walked around for 10 minutes at a time without discovering much or even doing much fighting. Bioware was upfront about that being a mistake, and this was changed for the sequel. BG2 had packed maps where you only went a few steps to discover the next thing.

Books can gloss over distances. "They traveled for 2 days." And moments between the interesting stuff is filled with character moments and plot. In a video game distance is just filled with walking. That's boring.


Actually apart from the Witcher 3 i dont remember any game that had a big open world that actually felt to scale and was done right, like was noted here most games just use tricks which in my opinion is worse than what Larian have done here.
BG2 had a ton of areas true, but many were very small and didnt really feel complete, compare druid grove of BG2 vs BG3 for example, just drawing a map and creating a small location is kind of lazy in todays standards.
another examples is from PF:KM which i really liked, the map was huge and you spent hours of the game just traveling but the areas themselves weren't so big and many had reused assets.
So i the ideal would be what the witcher 3 did but since that is very hard to do with a game like BG3 where many of the resources are being spent on other things i would preferer it how it is now.

and as long as we continue to see more of the sword coast and the planes (hell, shadowfell and astral plane - i am looking at you ) i am going to be very happy

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Originally Posted by SaurianDruid

The Forgotten Realms isn't about always having a heroic narrative. It is about making choices that influence whether you and your group will be heroes or villains. This is why players can choose their character alignment in most games. You don't gotta play the hero.


Well I will always play the hero and I liked that the BG series took this aspect of the FR setting. To my mind the FR setting was set up as an alternative to the grim-dark of Greyhawk / Oerth in which neutral was the default. The primary motivation behind a Greyhawk adventure is greed. Let's gets those golds from the dark crypt!

By comparison to Greyhawk the Realms are:
Quote

Finally, the Realms are a land of adventure, and therefore adventurers. It is the time of heroes, when one man of pure heart (or with a powerful artifact) may hold his own against enemy hordes, where legions of evil forces may muster and be destroyed by the actions of a few, where the nations rise and fall on magical tides which mere men can control. It is a time when the bold and the lucky may make their fortunes and gain great power over their worlds.


(If could upload photos from my computer I'd give a screenshot of the page)

Destroying evil hordes, pushing back the forces of evil.


Quote
I also don't quite get how you took away you couldn't be heroic? I am doing a good guy run right now and I feel pretty strongly in my character and his righteous conviction as he made choices that actively put off his obtaining a cure to help people in need. All the while keeping a deadly poison on his person he planned to drink if it came to it.

I felt pretty heroic. Was there anything specific that made you not feel that way?


Nice! smile I also liked saving the Grove and disrupting the Absolute's plans. But so far the tension in BG3 comes from self preservation. As the Thayan door acknowledges -- self interest is a Thayan value. Compare this to the tension in BG1 -- 1) end the iron crisis and 2) stop the war with Amn. BG2 -- rescue your friend before it's too late and stop the evil mage from becoming a new evil god. (and, yes, the alternative to see these as revenge and self preservation missions).

Now there is still an opportunity for the narrative to shift from exclusively self interested to heroic. Stopping the evil before it hurts others instead ending my personal crisis would make it feel more heroic and 'realmsy'.

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Originally Posted by jayn23
another examples is from PF:KM which i really liked, the map was huge and you spent hours of the game just traveling but the areas themselves weren't so big and many had reused assets.

Isn't this how the "world" is, though? Your apartment and office are small "maps", which most likely contain "reused assets".

BG3 contains a lot of FR content, but with everything so close together, it doesn't feel like a "world". And it breaks imersion and logic in some cases. I want to feel the distance. If we can load a giant map like this in a way thet travel looks seamless, nothing stops to do the same with paper world map and a number of small locations.

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Originally Posted by Dastan McKay
Originally Posted by jayn23
another examples is from PF:KM which i really liked, the map was huge and you spent hours of the game just traveling but the areas themselves weren't so big and many had reused assets.

Isn't this how the "world" is, though? Your apartment and office are small "maps", which most likely contain "reused assets".

BG3 contains a lot of FR content, but with everything so close together, it doesn't feel like a "world". And it breaks imersion and logic in some cases. I want to feel the distance. If we can load a giant map like this in a way thet travel looks seamless, nothing stops to do the same with paper world map and a number of small locations.



+1

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Originally Posted by Dastan McKay

BG3 contains a lot of FR content, but with everything so close together, it doesn't feel like a "world". And it breaks imersion and logic in some cases. I want to feel the distance. If we can load a giant map like this in a way thet travel looks seamless, nothing stops to do the same with paper world map and a number of small locations.


True, having the druid grove and goblin camp so close dosent make sense in real life and designing it as an huge open world would be to time/resource consuming plus you would need new mechanics like mounts.
But creating a huge map and populating it with a ton of location that look very similar to where you just visited an hour ago or Creating a village that has 5-6 building feels more like a place holder rather than a location.

One really nice thing Larian did that wouldn't be as cool using a map is there implementation of the underdark, where it really is underground everywhere. the world is built in layers which gives is a sense of realism and immersion i haven't seen in any d&d game. you go find cave go down find a zenth hideout find a elevator go down even more and reach the underdark all seamlessly

My point that there advantages and disadvantages to both , just need to pick your poison


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Playing the game feels like playing D&D, no doubt about that.
About the FR vibe tho? Mixed feelings. I see many elements for sure and most of the time it feels natural to be immersed in them but I think we are in a map too generic to perceive a true FR experience. I'll be back on the topic after we reach BG!

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Originally Posted by KillerRabbit


Nice! smile I also liked saving the Grove and disrupting the Absolute's plans. But so far the tension in BG3 comes from self preservation. As the Thayan door acknowledges -- self interest is a Thayan value. Compare this to the tension in BG1 -- 1) end the iron crisis and 2) stop the war with Amn. BG2 -- rescue your friend before it's too late and stop the evil mage from becoming a new evil god. (and, yes, the alternative to see these as revenge and self preservation missions).

Now there is still an opportunity for the narrative to shift from exclusively self interested to heroic. Stopping the evil before it hurts others instead ending my personal crisis would make it feel more heroic and 'realmsy'.




I dunno, I think whether or not the story is driven purely by self interest or by heroic intent is really up to the individual. My first character was a Githyanki pirate and he absolutely was only motivated by self interest. He didn't deal with any of the Grove stuff, bypassed Ethel's swamp entirely, and killed the goblin leaders all to get Halsin back for himself.

My dwarf ranger though is very different. He's going through the same path but not just because he wants to save himself but because he wants to save the grove and the tieflings and stop a bloodbath between them.

Plus thanks to the nature of the tadpole your self interest is also heroic in and of itself. Because if you turn you don't just die; you also become a mind flayer and effectively allow a great evil to manifest from your doom. For my heroic dwarf that is the fate he's so compelled to resist. His own demise is to be avoided, but he'll gladly die before allowing such an evil into the world.

I think one of my favorite interactions was informing Astarion that I do indeed intend to drink the wyvern's poison and die if I start to turn. His reaction really made it feel like my dwarf was a very heroic individual.

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The game is steeped in Forgotten Realms lore in general, and Sword Coast lore in specific, and takes into consideration the substantial passage of time and circumstances in the region. Conflating game lore and game mechanics is a big issue on many of these posts. You can freely argue that the mechanics might not adhere as closely to 5E as some may desire, but you can't really sustain an argument that the lore is somehow not BG, especially when only around 20% of the game has been revealed.

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The game doesn't feel like Forgotten Realms at all.
Sure, they threw a couple of Forgotten Realms elements in there, doesn't mean they make any sense. To me it feels like I'm playing in a Divinity setting and finding Forgotten Realms stuff crammed in without much logic. Oh look mates, a level 1 red dragon! Oh, we're level 3? Let's go conquer the underdark laugh Oh, every goblin pack has mages and clerics and apparently have high INT scores, moronic HP and nonsensical AC, so cool! 700 tieflings in an encampment, just like I remembered, after all they're the most common race in the Forgotten Realms.

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Originally Posted by coredumped
The game doesn't feel like Forgotten Realms at all.
Sure, they threw a couple of Forgotten Realms elements in there, doesn't mean they make any sense. To me it feels like I'm playing in a Divinity setting and finding Forgotten Realms stuff crammed in without much logic. Oh look mates, a level 1 red dragon! Oh, we're level 3? Let's go conquer the underdark laugh Oh, every goblin pack has mages and clerics and apparently have high INT scores, moronic HP and nonsensical AC, so cool! 700 tieflings in an encampment, just like I remembered, after all they're the most common race in the Forgotten Realms.


None of the complaints you made here has anything to do with the FR as a setting. And btw the FR are a generic a fantasy setting withall kinds of fantasy tropes crammed into it. You go from classic high fantasy (Sword Coast, Dalelands) to arabian nights (Zakhara, Al-Qadim) to jungle adventures (Chult) to far east esttings (Kara-Tur) and it goes on and on. So does BG3 feel like it's set on the Sword Coast? Yes it does. You are stranded down the coast under the cloakwood, a region you could explore in BG1 (where you could meet nasty critters charmiong you to death btw...).

Complaining is fine and legit but it needs to make sense otherwise it just comes out as irrational hate.

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Originally Posted by jayn23
Recently i read a steam review saying the game was good but that it dosent feel like the forgotten realms so they cant recommend this game.
personally i feel Larian have done a great job portraying the forgotten realms especially for just ACT1, some examples:

Finding the Zhentarim Hideout was pretty cool
Thayan Cellar was cool especially the Szass Tam reference
Seluns temple
Druid grove and Silvanus reference
all the little lore books you find everywhere
Some conversations - Shadowheart talking about shar and selune, goblin who was imprisoned for following the old goblin god rather than the absolute
And the Underdark - coolest place ever

What about you guys, do you feel your in the forgotten realms? if not what would you add?


What about more or less the whole plot with the tieflings being linked to the Decent into Avernus?


To me it seems the people who aren't happy, are the knit pickers who would never be happy unless they got exactly what they wanted. I honestly don't know what "feels like forgotten realms" means, because "too each their own". This is a setting based on a roleplaying game, where we the players have created the world for decades now. Sure there are some common points, but these common points might differer from gaming group to gaming group.
I personally feel this is a Forgotten Realms game.

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Originally Posted by KillerRabbit
Originally Posted by SaurianDruid

The Forgotten Realms isn't about always having a heroic narrative. It is about making choices that influence whether you and your group will be heroes or villains. This is why players can choose their character alignment in most games. You don't gotta play the hero.


Well I will always play the hero and I liked that the BG series took this aspect of the FR setting. To my mind the FR setting was set up as an alternative to the grim-dark of Greyhawk / Oerth in which neutral was the default. The primary motivation behind a Greyhawk adventure is greed. Let's gets those golds from the dark crypt!

By comparison to Greyhawk the Realms are:
Quote

Finally, the Realms are a land of adventure, and therefore adventurers. It is the time of heroes, when one man of pure heart (or with a powerful artifact) may hold his own against enemy hordes, where legions of evil forces may muster and be destroyed by the actions of a few, where the nations rise and fall on magical tides which mere men can control. It is a time when the bold and the lucky may make their fortunes and gain great power over their worlds.


(If could upload photos from my computer I'd give a screenshot of the page)

Destroying evil hordes, pushing back the forces of evil.


Quote
I also don't quite get how you took away you couldn't be heroic? I am doing a good guy run right now and I feel pretty strongly in my character and his righteous conviction as he made choices that actively put off his obtaining a cure to help people in need. All the while keeping a deadly poison on his person he planned to drink if it came to it.

I felt pretty heroic. Was there anything specific that made you not feel that way?


Nice! smile I also liked saving the Grove and disrupting the Absolute's plans. But so far the tension in BG3 comes from self preservation. As the Thayan door acknowledges -- self interest is a Thayan value. Compare this to the tension in BG1 -- 1) end the iron crisis and 2) stop the war with Amn. BG2 -- rescue your friend before it's too late and stop the evil mage from becoming a new evil god. (and, yes, the alternative to see these as revenge and self preservation missions).

Now there is still an opportunity for the narrative to shift from exclusively self interested to heroic. Stopping the evil before it hurts others instead ending my personal crisis would make it feel more heroic and 'realmsy'.

Agreed. The D&D game system (i.e. gaming mechanics) allows for people to play as they wish. But the FR setting is Heroic and favors good. And by contrast the Greyhawk setting is more neutral, and some other D&D settings even favor, or at least are supportive of, evil.

As someone else already pointed out, there is the D&D system and there is the FR setting, and while these two things are related they are not the same thing. One cannot speak of "D&D" and "FR" as though they are interchangeable things.

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Let me try to express my point of view in another way.
I will try as much as possible not to use elements that could be subject to personal interpretation.

Rather than talking about reality (if I use the term on it's own some will take pleasure in quoting me to tell me that the FR is not a real world) . I'm going to talk about the "reality of the world" in which the game is set.

In the reality of the FR (and usual other classic fantasy reality), the following elements doesn't seem to me very usual.
If they are sometimes in, I think we can agree that they are generally very unconventional:

- Dip your weapons directly into fire to create magical weapons.
- Constantly jumping (in each round) during a single combat to gain efficiency.
- Eating a sausage during the confrontation, I was hungry.
- Burn everything down as soon as you meet any creature.
- Losing 30 L of blood when you die
- Being able to teleport so easily (Fast Travel)
- Having 25% more chance of hitting your target with a bow if you are higher.
- A small army unable to find their ennemies, even if they're doing a great ritual in their camp and had hosted refugees, 1km away
- ...

This is not a short bug list, nor something we could use to describe what the reality of the FR is.
This is a list of choices made even if some are probably subject to modification or adjustment.

Let me also talk about some other issues that are very much rooted in the reality of the FR but not really in BG3.
- The question of time (day and night cycle, travel time)
- The question of the environment (weather that does not exist)
- The question of the scale of the map (5 extremely varied locations over 2 or 3km², Goblins unable to find the druids)

This looks like important questions. If you had to describe a world or a part of it, I guess this is something you would talk about (densisty, climate, distances, time,...)
The FR references are great and give the specific "taste of FR" to the adventure but the reality of the world in which the game takes place is not respected.

From that point, I find it hard to imagine that we can find the world really consistent with what it claims to be.
Let's say that for me it's currently 50/50.

Afterwards, everyone is free to assess what is or isn't part of the reality of this world.

That said, I really think that everything is a whole when you're playing a video game.
Whatever we're talking about "the lore", the animations, gameplay mechanics etc... everything is a part of the experience and everything is a part of the reality of the world in which you're playing.



To come back to the map because one understands that I want a map full of wilderness to be travelled in real time on like in TW3, the other that I want maps like BG in which there is often not much things to do...

I'm not saying that thesee exemples are the best way ofe doing things but this a my feeling about what they could do (have done) to increase the FR feeling.

I.E They could have created 3 or 4 smaller maps by adapting them of course:
- The crash site and the blighted village.
- The druid grove and its surroundings
- The goblin camp and its surroundings
- The marshes

They would be far from ridiculous in terms of size and content, we would travel "as" in the old BGs, the notion of time could be created when travelling, the notion of distance would also make sense, the camp could have been in a place "easily" accessible on foot and we wouldn't have to disappear to get there, a day/night cycle, even a cosmetic one, would probably have been simpler to set up, random encounters on the roads too, for example.
This looks very FR and/or BG to me.

This last example would also have had an effect on the rest system.
Exept that travelling to the camp would have been justified on a map rather than with another wtf teleportation, we could have encountered enemies while travelling. In other words, this would have had a direct effect on the notion of resources management, i.e for spells but not only. Either an important gameplay element of D&D.

I.E Back to the jump system and let's talk about backstab.
At the very least, if they want to keep their backstab system, let them create a new bonus action called "surprise the opponent". A dexterity throw in front of the enemy AC and if you succeed, you find yourself behind. It could be ultra cool with a nice animation. If you succeed you are behind and can do your action, otherwise you are at a disadvantage when using your action.
Just make the jumps trigger the opportunity attacks and you have consistency and two tactical possibilities instead of one totally WTF tactic + a better visual feelings of the FR while fighting with really D&D mechanics.

I.E About Fast Travel : they have a wonderful worldmap. Let us use it for fast travel. I guess it's also much more FR than portals everywhere.

Anyway I hope that you'll understand what I was talking about.
It's totally about the FR and it's reality, whatever it has an influence on our feelings about the game or not...

According to me actually this world is half custom and inconsistent, half FR... That is definitely not sufficient for me to feel like I'm playing a video game in the FR.

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I feel like the writers did their homework on Faerun and lorewise the world is intact.

It's the gameplay that makes the world feel much less credible. The videogamey additions that are not a part of 5e.

1) Eating food does not magically heal you in Faerun. In BG3 food is mechanically like healing potions, only more powerful and more abundant (!?). If they wanted free healing, they could have just increased the number of Short Rests. But they chose to add magic food instead which is a REALLY weird choice. Is that a thing in Divinity? I can't remember. But in Faerun, people don't eat pigs heads in 6 seconds while fighting. The gameplay devs probably don't understand how this affects immersion in an RPG. Not everything needs to be a system.

2) The exaggerated Shove and Jump. The Shove is more like a joke. Even weak characters can send big monsters flying across the screen. Jumping around in melee is the next best combat move in this world. It's like reading a comic book instead of R.A. Salvatore. It's impossible to take any characters in this game seriously when you know you can just SLAP anyone off a ledge.

3) The barrels. The explosions. Acid and poison surfaces. Dipping weapons. The knockback and explosive arrows. These exist solely for gameplay mechanics without making any sense.

Forgotten Realms and 5e rules are much more grounded in realism than BG3 is. BG3 would benefit greatly from a realism pass across all of its systems.


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Again, stop conflating Lore and Mechanics. The mechanics may currently come up short of the 5e detail desired, but the Lore is unmistakably Baldur's Gate, Sword Coast flavoring.

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Originally Posted by Anfindel
Again, stop conflating Lore and Mechanics. The mechanics may currently come up short of the 5e detail desired, but the Lore is unmistakably Baldur's Gate, Sword Coast flavoring.


The question was "What about you guys, do you feel you're in the forgotten realms?".
As I said, when you play the game you experience everything - lore / mechanics / visual / (side) stories / ... - at the same time. Everything is a part of the world in which you're playing.

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while personally the Lore/Visual/Quests are what make me feel in the FR setting.
Mechanics influence if i like/love/hate the game - but Maximuuus is defiantly entitled to have his own opinion

While i dont want the topic to be about mechanics god knows we have more than enough threads about that, some of the things mentioned need some work like amount of oil barrels all over the place should be toned down by at least 50%
but the act of shooting an oil barrel and it exploding is realistic and shouldn't affect immersion just because..

any way while i have a lot to say about mechanics i will save it to dedicated threads

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Originally Posted by Maximuuus
Druid outside the forest next to a beach and next to a village.
Underdark in which surfaces lvl 3 characters don't die.
Dipping a non magical sword into non magical fire to create a magical fire sword.
Jumping everytime as a part of combats.
OP random goblins
Small map with many different locations (no exploration)
...

I guess it's a matter of opinion, but references doesn't mean consistency and immersion to me.
According to me BG3 offer.a custom map with FR references, not a journey in the FR.


I have to agree. From a gameplay standpoint "dipping" seems like a nice introduction and hp bloat makes gameplay drag out a bit and hyper condensed maps make it.....All these significant little changes add up. Changes like disengage jumping attacks for all, backstab mages, height OPAF advantage etc. Make it a game with a FR story without the lore. Much of the lore is tied to classes, races and abilites, goblins "act" like goblins but dont fight like them. They run to higher ground 100% of the time and shoot you with OP arrows and bombs.

I find myself asking "this isn't right" constantly which isn't a good place to be. The voice acting is great especially on goblins etc, graphics and story are interesting and feel like it is set in FA but missing elements like night and day, time of day, changing weather, camping warps from anywhere, lack of random encounters while camping, loads of unfamilar fight mechanics...... I can live with condensed maps tbh as it is relative. I want the game to feel like D&D not just look like it.

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Originally Posted by Maximuuus
Originally Posted by Anfindel
Again, stop conflating Lore and Mechanics. The mechanics may currently come up short of the 5e detail desired, but the Lore is unmistakably Baldur's Gate, Sword Coast flavoring.


The question was "What about you guys, do you feel you're in the forgotten realms?".
As I said, when you play the game you experience everything - lore / mechanics / visual / (side) stories / ... - at the same time. Everything is a part of the world in which you're playing.


+1

And this is where I am coming from. This feels like a theme park that has been reskinned for a particular event. Like when Disney turned the Twilight Zone Tower of Terror into the Guardians of the Galaxy ride. Superficially it says all the right things and it looks gorgeous, but Forgotten Realms was written to feel like a real world. This absolutely doesn't. Some of it has to do with the proximity of locations, but some of it also has to do with how all these locations are tied to one another. Druids in FR are typically portrayed as reclusives who settle in the most inhospitable of wilds as far removed from civilization as possible in order to preserve the natural order in its natural state or as individuals on a mission to restore that balance. . .They don't usually make hippy communes off the side of the road between major trade routes and towns with No Girls Allowed signs around the perimeter. Even before the Snail Boat crashed there was no wilderness in this area left for the druids to protect or cultivate. Deer? Wolves? Bears? Well there is a single Owl Bear Just very little of this makes any real sense if you think about it. There are ruins on the beach that any novice can break into that look like they have been abandoned and unmolested for at least a century. There are self styled adventurers scavenging them about the same time the party discovers them, but they don't appear to be locals or else they would have been more concerned with the Gnolls and Goblins. . .And if they are not locals, then why would they push through all the obvious threats in order to raid that particular location only to haul their treasure horde back through those previously ignored threats, There are Harpy nests and numerous skeletons within eyesight of the enclave which noone seems aware of or concerned by. There are Absolute worshippers and parasite bearers literally everywhere you go. Is this a localized phenomena or global? How long has this been going on? It doesn't feel as though these things really have explanations. A lot of this feels hastily thrown together and just kind of lazy, which is not at all reflective of most FR content as it has been produced over much of its run.

Even the plot hook itself is kind of stretched in consideration of the setting. With Greater Restoration or the True Resurrection spells out there our primary motivation becomes pretty inconsequential. We are constantly told these won't work, but the only justification offered seems to be Because Magic and the only reason we don't have access to them is because of arbitrary levels caps which have been incompetently imposed. I am sure everyone here has seen the thread about the level of archdruids and dragons in EA.

It is a very pretty game and it is obvious some hard work has gone into it, but the writing is disappointing, and a little more hard work could fix that. It isn't personal its just an honest appraisal. Some people probably don't see it and I imagine many people don't care, but that is no reason to argue with the individuals who are sensitive to the flaws. If the people pointing out structural weakness in the game are are listened to then things may be improved, if not then things stay the same. Either way most people will never notice or care except for the truly invested. Arguing that things are fine as they are is sort of silly. The point of EA is to get feedback, everyone should be at ease to express their opinions. Discussions are useful in identifying individual elements but argument over it is ridiculous. Furthermore, I think most people are capable of distinguishing between those personal aspects which make up our own tastes and other other independent aspects which allow us to have a shared experience. Not all expectation hinges upon preference

Last edited by DistantStranger; 03/11/20 11:11 AM.
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