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A general note to all concerned as my previous comment was obviously too understated: quit snarking at each other and cool it off a bit otherwise people may get moderated. Thank you.


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Originally Posted by tryndatermeirer
If I had known this game would have been implemented like this, I would not have bought EA. Even in a few patches, such a stupid rule change is not mentioned, no feedback is given, and I just want my money back so I don't give fuck.

So, please?


Lol

There was a reason I wanted to buy it on GoG and not on Steam and the same reason as to probably why I couldn't.

They have a full 30 day money back guarantee......


more fool us

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Please yes. This is not Baldur's Gate let alone 5e D&D. I would love a refund. Bait and switch this game is /Yoda

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I went to a restaurant and they claimed to be selling "pecan pie". I love pecan pie, so I plopped down my money and ordered a big old slice of it.

I should mention that the only pecan pie I've ever actually had is my mom's pecan pie. She has a very specific family recipe for pecan pie, and it's honestly the BEST way to make pecan pie. I have a very specific idea of what pecan pie is, and in fact, must be, because I've had my mom's pecan pie many times and it is perfect.

So, reasonably, I was expecting this restaurant, claiming to be selling "pecan pie", to have ACTUAL pecan pie. Like I grew up with.

I'll bet you can guess the scam they pulled on me, can't you? That's right. These shameless crooks TOOK my money, and then they brought me out . . . something . . . on a plate. It was vaguely pie-slice shaped, and did apparently have a crust, and lots of pecans involved with it. But I took ONE bite, and immediately knew that this was NOT pecan pie. I've told you that there's only one correct pecan pie, and it's my mom's. I expected my mom's. Why would they sell some fake pecan pie that ISN'T my mom's? Why would they do that? Do they enjoy just stealing people's money?

I went ahead and ate most of the slice, anyway. But I was deeply disturbed at how different it was from the one true pecan pie, my mom's very specific recipe. After consuming most of it, I felt deep dissatisfaction, and in fact I felt lied to. Maliciously so? Possibly.

So I asked these purveyors of charlatan "pie" to return my money. They said, "But we gave you pecan pie, as you asked for. And you ate it." But I (quite patiently) explained to them that no, this was NOT pecan pie, because I grew up on pecan pie and I KNOW what it is. It's my mom's recipe. That's pecan pie. Not whatever this . . . mockery of the essence of pie was. Thus, they owed me a refund.

Because you can't just go around claiming to be selling "pecan pie" to people, and then not giving them the very specific pecan pie that they expected. That's just not right. That's just not the kind of world I want to live in.

Last edited by Firesnakearies; 03/11/20 01:42 AM.
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Originally Posted by Firesnakearies
I went to a restaurant and they claimed to be selling "pecan pie". I love pecan pie, so I plopped down my money and ordered a big old slice of it.

I should mention that the only pecan pie I've ever actually had is my mom's pecan pie. She has a very specific family recipe for pecan pie, and it's honestly the BEST way to make pecan pie. I have a very specific idea of what pecan pie is, and in fact, must be, because I've had my mom's pecan pie many times and it is perfect.

So, reasonably, I was expecting this restaurant, claiming to be selling "pecan pie", to have ACTUAL pecan pie. Like I grew up with.

I'll bet you can guess the scam they pulled on me, can't you? That's right. These shameless crooks TOOK my money, and then they brought me out . . . something . . . on a plate. It was vaguely pie-slice shaped, and did apparently have a crust, and lots of pecans involved with it. But I took ONE bite, and immediately knew that this was NOT pecan pie. I've told you that there's only one correct pecan pie, and it's my mom's. I expected my mom's. Why would they sell some fake pecan pie that ISN'T my mom's? Why would they do that? Do they enjoy just stealing people's money?

I went ahead and ate most of the slice, anyway. But I was deeply disturbed at how different it was from the one true pecan pie, my mom's very specific recipe. After consuming most of it, I felt deep dissatisfaction, and in fact I felt lied to. Maliciously so? Possibly.

So I asked these purveyors of charlatan "pie" to return my money. They said, "But we gave you pecan pie, as you asked for. And you ate it." But I (quite patiently) explained to them that no, this was NOT pecan pie, because I grew up on pecan pie and I KNOW what it is. It's my mom's recipe. That's pecan pie. Not whatever this . . . mockery of the essence of pie was. Thus, they owed me a refund.

Because you can't just go around claiming to be selling "pecan pie" to people, and then not giving them the very specific pecan pie that they expected. That's just not right. That's just not the kind of world I want to live in.


there is just a big Wrong in your made up story , first in a normal restaurant you pay AFTER you are done.. because if what you get is "bad" you don't pay.
ya know the waitress come and ask you if its at your liking, you can say no ...... you know. tell her that this pecan pie is rotten. and you not gonna pay for it.

so if we would be comparing a video game to a restaurant, it would be MC donald's, since they ask you for your money first. and give you shit after. and only once you consumed it , you regret it after. smile


Last edited by Evil_it_Self; 03/11/20 02:05 AM.

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Also, you shouldn't make pies out of tropical birds.

Oh wait, am I thinking of toucans?

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Steam allows you to return a game if you played less than 2 hours, sometimes, rarely to be honest if its higher than that. The devs have no way of influencing this.

Apart from that, there is nothing to discuss here.

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Originally Posted by mr_planescapist
DOS3 : A DnD tale of Baldurs gate *Minsc included!!

5e in this game is just <dressing> basically. Just watch 5e lovers complaining more and more while Larian does nothing/worsens the DnD mechanics situation to suite a <broader> console audience.
Mechanic changes need to happen by next month, otherwise what we are seeing is probably 80% of what we WILL get. Starting next year <we have no more time, so bug fixing time!> argument starts.

I am seeing more and more positive threads on this forum while the game has barely mechanically changed (many say has worsened). This can mean only one thing. Fans of Baldurs gate and DnD are quickly giving up on the game leaving the forum , while broader RPG fans <<DOS/ Witcher/ Dragon age / console gamers / Mass effect / Skyrim etc...>>are really enjoying the game for what it is: A cringy cinematic piece of shit acting DnD wannabe set in a plasticy static world of Faerun populated by sex craving selfish and drama filled humanoids. Now THAT sells!




Sorry- fan of Baldur's Gate and D&D...been playing since 1st edition. And no, I'm not giving up on the game or jumping on your negative bandwagon. Just because is doesn't meet YOUR definition of what BG3 should be, doesn't mean it fails mine, especially during EA.

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Originally Posted by Evil_it_Self
Originally Posted by Firesnakearies
I went to a restaurant and they claimed to be selling "pecan pie". I love pecan pie, so I plopped down my money and ordered a big old slice of it.

I should mention that the only pecan pie I've ever actually had is my mom's pecan pie. She has a very specific family recipe for pecan pie, and it's honestly the BEST way to make pecan pie. I have a very specific idea of what pecan pie is, and in fact, must be, because I've had my mom's pecan pie many times and it is perfect.

So, reasonably, I was expecting this restaurant, claiming to be selling "pecan pie", to have ACTUAL pecan pie. Like I grew up with.

I'll bet you can guess the scam they pulled on me, can't you? That's right. These shameless crooks TOOK my money, and then they brought me out . . . something . . . on a plate. It was vaguely pie-slice shaped, and did apparently have a crust, and lots of pecans involved with it. But I took ONE bite, and immediately knew that this was NOT pecan pie. I've told you that there's only one correct pecan pie, and it's my mom's. I expected my mom's. Why would they sell some fake pecan pie that ISN'T my mom's? Why would they do that? Do they enjoy just stealing people's money?

I went ahead and ate most of the slice, anyway. But I was deeply disturbed at how different it was from the one true pecan pie, my mom's very specific recipe. After consuming most of it, I felt deep dissatisfaction, and in fact I felt lied to. Maliciously so? Possibly.

So I asked these purveyors of charlatan "pie" to return my money. They said, "But we gave you pecan pie, as you asked for. And you ate it." But I (quite patiently) explained to them that no, this was NOT pecan pie, because I grew up on pecan pie and I KNOW what it is. It's my mom's recipe. That's pecan pie. Not whatever this . . . mockery of the essence of pie was. Thus, they owed me a refund.

Because you can't just go around claiming to be selling "pecan pie" to people, and then not giving them the very specific pecan pie that they expected. That's just not right. That's just not the kind of world I want to live in.


there is just a big Wrong in your made up story , first in a normal restaurant you pay AFTER you are done.. because if what you get is "bad" you don't pay.
ya know the waitress come and ask you if its at your liking, you can say no ...... you know. tell her that this pecan pie is rotten. and you not gonna pay for it.

so if we would be comparing a video game to a restaurant, it would be MC donald's, since they ask you for your money first. and give you shit after. and only once you consumed it , you regret it after. smile



There is no BIG WRONG in his story. You are not saying you don't like pecan pie, you are insisting what you were served wasn't pecan pie. If you want to say you don't like BG3, that is certainly your right. But insisting it isn't the BG3 you were promised, is you insisting YOUR definition of BG3 is the only true definition.

Buy new Flubberguts - now with 100% more crusty corn!!!

Ingredients; Crusty Corn, Trout Guts, Skanky 'Shrooms, Rank Rhino Meat, MB3, Q7, Mud Food Coloring.

I want to return these Flubberguts, cause to me 100% more crusty corn meant 100% of the ingredients were Crusty Corn...and I was therefore cheated !!!

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Originally Posted by Anfindel
Sorry- fan of Baldur's Gate and D&D...been playing since 1st edition. And no, I'm not giving up on the game or jumping on your negative bandwagon. Just because is doesn't meet YOUR definition of what BG3 should be, doesn't mean it fails mine, especially during EA.


I am also big fan of BG and DnD and I also really stand my point that this game should not be marketed and selled as BG3 based on DnD 5e. We are creating bad habit and bad acceptance of what developers are delivering. Regardless of the fact, wheter the product is actually good. And it is good. But imagine a situation you buy a bottle of really good whisky and it happens to be really good wine. As a consumer, you have two options: return the bottle and demand either change of concent or change of label - or silently accept good wine. If most customers accept the good wine while being selled as good whisky we created pretty weird environment, don't we?

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Originally Posted by tryndatermeirer
If I had known this game would have been implemented like this, I would not have bought EA. Even in a few patches, such a stupid rule change is not mentioned, no feedback is given, and I just want my money back so I don't give fuck.

So, please?


Seriously? Tell me this question is a joke, a comedy act. No one forced anyone to buy the game, it is a rpg d&d based, it follows (even if extremist ourist don't like the way Larian did the deed) the D6D rules.

Also how do we decide what are the reasons that can be accepted? I like the game but the isometric annoys me a lot, is that a good reason? The movement issues is valid? Every one has their own personal reasons to have problems with the game, are tehy due too for a refund?

It happens that someone would not feel satisfied or won't like the game.

Why in all the pantheons' heavens should Larian (or any software producer) refund not because of objective problems but for personal opinions of a player?

Is like asking cinemas to give back money to people because a movie was not what they expected, or a bookstore doing so, and so on.

Seriously lets act like adults and not like really spoiled men and women (either younger or older) that use hindsight?

[And believe a microscopic part in me would like to support your question due to the big list of games that disappointed me, Fallout 4, Skyrim, Gran Theft Auto 4, etc etc.. ... and don't let me start on movies adaptations of books, mangas, comics that didn't bring out what I expected.. ...].

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Why do people buy into Early Access if they aren't willing to buy into a half made product? It' baffles me.

You should have know that this game "isn't Baldur's Gate" if you did your research. Larian has been open about making a Turn Based game since day 1, so the Real Time with Pause crowd have no excuse other than they didn't do their research.
As for us in the "It's not DnD Crowd", well no, but that's why we are in Early Access isn't it? To make sure Larian get's their rules straight? I'm sure they have gotten the Memo by now and we'll see massive changes during development.

Now I would be furious if they changed the game into Realtime with pause, since I bought into EA because it's a turn based game. But I'm still accountable for buying into the game before it's done.


Buying into Early Access always comes with a risk. And I think we shouldn't act all entitled if the game develops in a direction we didn't want it to. We took the risk.

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So how much this feels like Dungeons and Dragons has a lot to do with when you got into the game. If you ever played second edition, with percentile dice on hide depending upon how much ambient light was in your environment and how attentive individuals were to their surroundings, you probably expected a real gritty, grounded setting and atmosphere with narrative structure uncomplicated enough for any age to appreciate but possessing some nuance for mature tastes. Humor? Absurdity? Sure, comedy breaks up the tension, but it should be still treated more seriously than not. Right? Well if you don't think so then you may have started with 3rd and your experience was less like literature and more like a big budget film. Mostly grounded, but with some over the top elements. More fun than serious. Fourth? Fifth? Superhero cartoons. These are generalities based upon what you could do with the system, individual experiences will obviously vary. . .As will what each us of consider quintessential Dungeons and Dragons.

If this game tries to please every fan of DnD it will end up a failure. It simply can't make all of that work together. It will end up inconsistent and flat. The video games pretty much paralleled the systems. The first was THAC-0 based and rooted in 2nd edition mechanics while the Shadows of Amn and Throne of Bhaal were influenced by 3rd edition. So this series is intrinsically linked to DnD as it was and will appeal primarily to people who loved prior iterations. It should come as no surprise then that this game is going to be a departure from both of its predecessors though. WotC wants to increase the attraction of their brand and satisfy the latest generation of players, and that is precisely what the prior sequel did as well just with more finesse. Disappointment is not unreasonable.

Having said all that give those people who want refunds their money back. +1



=-=-=-=-=-=-
Addendum
=-=-=-=-=-=-

Remember this? https://youtu.be/5YGc4zOqozo

United Airlines broke a guitar that belonged to the lead singer of a tiny Canadian band and refused to shell out the 1500 bucks it would have cost to repair it after six months of claims and calls, so the band wrote a song about it. It got a million views the first week it hit Youtube and United ended up losing 180 million dollars in share price fall over the whole affair. Larian has more to lose than a few people's purchase - like the goodwill of potential fans and the future success of this title

Last edited by DistantStranger; 03/11/20 10:19 AM.
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Originally Posted by DistantStranger
So how much this feels like Dungeons and Dragons has a lot to do with when you got into the game. If you ever played second edition, with percentile dice on hide depending upon how much ambient light was in your environment and how attentive individuals were to their surroundings, you probably expected a real gritty, grounded setting and atmosphere with narrative structure uncomplicated enough for any age to appreciate but possessing some nuance for mature tastes. Humor? Absurdity? Sure, comedy breaks up the tension, but it should be still treated more seriously than not. Right? Well if you don't think so then you may have started with 3rd and your experience was less like literature and more like a big budget film. Mostly grounded, but with some over the top elements. More fun than serious. Fourth? Fifth? Superhero cartoons. These are generalities based upon what you could do with the system, individual experiences will obviously vary. . .As will what each us of consider quintessential Dungeons and Dragons.

If this game tries to please every fan of DnD it will end up a failure. It simply can't make all of that work together. It will end up inconsistent and flat. The video games pretty much paralleled the systems. The first was THAC-0 based and rooted in 2nd edition mechanics while the Shadows of Amn and Throne of Bhaal were influenced by 3rd edition. So this series is intrinsically linked to DnD as it was and will appeal primarily to people who loved prior iterations. It should come as no surprise then that this game is going to be a departure from both of its predecessors though. WotC wants to increase the attraction of their brand and satisfy the latest generation of players, and that is precisely what the prior sequel did as well just with more finesse. Disappointment is not unreasonable.

Having said all that give those people who want refunds their money back. +1



=-=-=-=-=-=-
Addendum
=-=-=-=-=-=-

Remember this? https://youtu.be/5YGc4zOqozo

United Airlines broke a guitar that belonged to the lead singer of a tiny Canadian band and refused to shell out the 1500 bucks it would have cost to repair it after six months of claims and calls, so the band wrote a song about it. It got a million views the first week it hit Youtube and United ended up losing 180 million dollars in share price fall over the whole affair. Larian has more to lose than a few people's purchase - like the goodwill of potential fans and the future success of this title


Not really. They said they are making DnD 5e, so it shouldn't matter when you got into DnD.
Point is, right now the game has taken too many liberties with the 5e rules, which is the issue. DnD 5e is the current edition, and the official DnD as of right now. So talking about ADnD or 2e or 3.5 is a little irrelevant.

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You're right, I confused this thread with another I had also been reading. Oh well, its 3 am and I am at work, so I hope you forgive me for an attention slip :p

Last edited by DistantStranger; 03/11/20 11:25 AM.
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Man all these Larian fanboys(or girls) jumping to Larians defense.

It's been a month, nothing has changed, there is no sign of changing, and we all paid 60 dollars upfront.

The whole "hey its just an EA" excuse will get old pretty quickly.

Personally, I'm used to seeing Swen do his YouTube videos, like for Divinity, showing status progresses and upcoming plans. I guess when the games were kickstarted they treated us players like stockholders.

Now it just feels different. Like they are bowing down to Wizards of the Coast overlords who only care about profits and useless statistics. They are the true Devil who Swen had to make a pact with to get this game out.

So yeah I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for amazing changes. Unless I was an air genasi.

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Originally Posted by Tequilaman
Man all these Larian fanboys(or girls) jumping to Larians defense.

It's been a month, nothing has changed, there is no sign of changing, and we all paid 60 dollars upfront.

The whole "hey its just an EA" excuse will get old pretty quickly.

Personally, I'm used to seeing Swen do his YouTube videos, like for Divinity, showing status progresses and upcoming plans. I guess when the games were kickstarted they treated us players like stockholders.

Now it just feels different. Like they are bowing down to Wizards of the Coast overlords who only care about profits and useless statistics. They are the true Devil who Swen had to make a pact with to get this game out.

So yeah I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for amazing changes. Unless I was an air genasi.


What, you expect them to jump at every complaint on the forums?
If they were bowing to WoC, do you really think they would have gotten away with all their changes to 5e?

I'm no Larian fanboy or anything, nor was I here for Divinity's early access. I just don't expect Larian to change everything straight away. I would be cool with better updates, but we have gotten some updates so far.
Besides the EA is a lot bigger than expected, so I bet the amount of Data is bigger than expected too.

I just don't get the "they haven't changed anything yet" complaint honestly.

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Originally Posted by Tequilaman
Man all these Larian fanboys(or girls) jumping to Larians defense.

It's been a month, nothing has changed, there is no sign of changing, and we all paid 60 dollars upfront.

The whole "hey its just an EA" excuse will get old pretty quickly.

Personally, I'm used to seeing Swen do his YouTube videos, like for Divinity, showing status progresses and upcoming plans. I guess when the games were kickstarted they treated us players like stockholders.

Now it just feels different. Like they are bowing down to Wizards of the Coast overlords who only care about profits and useless statistics. They are the true Devil who Swen had to make a pact with to get this game out.

So yeah I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for amazing changes. Unless I was an air genasi.


You can call people fanboys, sure. But lets be honest: people who are now screeching for new content and that there is not a new build are just impatient bad consumers. You have had a very wrong understanding about what the EA will be obviously.

Be mature, be patient. This EA is not a live service game, like an MMO, where the Devs need to put out new content to keep players happy.

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Originally Posted by Tequilaman
Man all these Larian fanboys(or girls) jumping to Larians defense.

It's been a month, nothing has changed, there is no sign of changing, and we all paid 60 dollars upfront.

The whole "hey its just an EA" excuse will get old pretty quickly.

Personally, I'm used to seeing Swen do his YouTube videos, like for Divinity, showing status progresses and upcoming plans. I guess when the games were kickstarted they treated us players like stockholders.

Now it just feels different. Like they are bowing down to Wizards of the Coast overlords who only care about profits and useless statistics. They are the true Devil who Swen had to make a pact with to get this game out.

So yeah I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for amazing changes. Unless I was an air genasi.



Go easy on the Tequila and next time don't buy and early access game. You're expectations clearly doesn't match reality.

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Originally Posted by Zefhyr

Tuco
No one forced you to click on tthis threzd or comment it but it looks like YOU. NEED. IT. ^^"


I never even remotely complained about "being forced to click on the thread", so I'm genuinely not sure what you are even bitching about, let alone why I should care.


Party control in Baldur's Gate 3 is a complete mess that begs to be addressed. SAY NO TO THE TOILET CHAIN
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