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I agree that describing any of the current party members as "evil" seems like a stretch... But then again I can't really say I give a shit about that particular debate.
Just give me interesting and amusing characters and I'm fine.

I can promise no one will hear me cry like a bitch because Shadowheart was a bit sassy with an answer or Lae'Zel pouted when I helped a kid.


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Originally Posted by Abits
I still think it's too soon to tell what Larian would do with all the feedback we provided. I hope sometime in the near future we will get some sort of response to the feedback, but I know for a fact at least some of Larian's developers read it. My impression is still the same - they weren't expecting so much sells at this point and right now just trying to find a way to address as much criticism as possible. I think Larian should do a better job clarifying it but this is how I see things. I added a link from a response by @The Composer:
https://forums.larian.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=719776#Post719776


Thank you for that. Would be nice on Larian part to sticky that answer by @The Composer above, because it is exactly what I've asked for - a civil answer showing us approximately where the ship is sailing. So, it's "Gorshochek, ne vari" for now.

Last edited by Ellenhard; 09/11/20 07:57 AM.
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Interesting interview.

I really like their take on good game first and D&D game second, I fully support it. I also like how they specifically pointed out that various changes are to spice up gameplay like in case of Fighter with Weapon Skills and more baseline bonus action variety, I assume, which probably helps their blandness the most.

I also find it interesting they are actually considering loaded dice to counter miss streak, IMO it could be a nice touch, because nobody really enjoys their example of 8 misses in the row.

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Yes - at the end of the day he said a continuance of the same themes - so no real surprises there.
It’s Larian game & they will put their own spin on the balders gate brand as best they can and they can’t please everyone.
They have a lot of d&d players in their team & will be listening and making changes they believe are in the best interests of their game - and WOTC of course.

As he also mentioned appears a lot of angst & speculation from player base when we have only seen one small part of the game - he does have a point there.

It’s a journey ...

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<<<enticing a new audience to Baldur’s Gate...>>
Great..just great...my least favorite quote when discussing game development. What is this, 1999???

Last edited by mr_planescapist; 09/11/20 08:35 AM.
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Originally Posted by Tuco
I agree that describing any of the current party members as "evil" seems like a stretch... But then again I can't really say I give a shit about that particular debate.
Just give me interesting and amusing characters and I'm fine.

I can promise no one will hear me cry like a bitch because Shadowheart was a bit sassy with an answer or Lae'Zel pouted when I helped a kid.


For me it is more like I am tired of them constantly stepping in and telling me, that they do not like this or that, in the rare cases they comment on a quest. And even if they do compliment me it is always along the lines of "oh now finally you see the light". And the other times they are going the Telltale way of "Lae'zel will remember that." Yet nothing happens really from that "interaction". There is no consequence attached, just a constant bickering and at the very best patronizing. Even Gale just says stuff like "Don't worry, chap, things turn sour sometimes." Like what is that supposed to even mean? Further it is pretty inconsistent, like why would they even care whether I helped a child along the way? Who actually dislikes shutting down a woman like Kagha and saving a child? At the very worst, a character would shrug it off. Companion interaction is really tiresome in this game.
It is not that the characters are evil or very pragmatic, it is the writing and the system attached, that is the culprit here.

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Originally Posted by Aishaddai
Hmm. That's disappointing. Sound's like they are brushing character feedback under the rug and are just going to stick with whatever. Why put characters out to test if they are going to brush it off? I guess they mostly wanted to test functionality of systems. Sound's like feedback does not matter as much as I'd have hoped. I'll see in the next couple of updates.
They know how their entire story is going to play out and we don't, so the writers must be banking on these characters "paying off" in Act 2 and 3.

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Quote
"It's funny, we were trying to figure out how the Sword Coast should look, and one of our artists said we should go do some photogrammetry along the coast of Portugal, as he thought it’d be a good fit. But as he was doing his research, he looked at the emblems of one of the Portuguese cities and it was the same as the emblem you find in the books for Baldur’s Gate. He actually accidentally discovered where the Sword Coast was in the real world. So for the game we just scanned the real-life Sword Coast!"


I've done some research and found nothing. Do you guys have any idea of which part of Portugal is he talking about? Also which emblem?

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Originally Posted by bernardthehermit
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"It's funny, we were trying to figure out how the Sword Coast should look, and one of our artists said we should go do some photogrammetry along the coast of Portugal, as he thought it’d be a good fit. But as he was doing his research, he looked at the emblems of one of the Portuguese cities and it was the same as the emblem you find in the books for Baldur’s Gate. He actually accidentally discovered where the Sword Coast was in the real world. So for the game we just scanned the real-life Sword Coast!"


I've done some research and found nothing. Do you guys have any idea of which part of Portugal is he talking about? Also which emblem?


The whole coast of Portugal does look like the central Sword Coast indeed. As for the emblem: Baldur's Gate got a caravelle (ship) as it's emblem, and quite a few coastal Portuguese cities have the same or similar heraldry; for example, the ancient emblem of Vila do Conde https://www.heraldry-wiki.com/heraldrywiki/images/6/6b/Vila_do_Conde1.jpg

Or São Pedro (Figueira da Foz) https://www.heraldry-wiki.com/heraldrywiki/images/c/c2/Spedroff.gif

(Actually, it's a good thing we do not have a real-world full-size equivalent to a City of Murder in Portugal!)

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Originally Posted by Ellenhard
Originally Posted by bernardthehermit
Quote
"It's funny, we were trying to figure out how the Sword Coast should look, and one of our artists said we should go do some photogrammetry along the coast of Portugal, as he thought it’d be a good fit. But as he was doing his research, he looked at the emblems of one of the Portuguese cities and it was the same as the emblem you find in the books for Baldur’s Gate. He actually accidentally discovered where the Sword Coast was in the real world. So for the game we just scanned the real-life Sword Coast!"


I've done some research and found nothing. Do you guys have any idea of which part of Portugal is he talking about? Also which emblem?


The whole coast of Portugal does look like the central Sword Coast indeed. As for the emblem: Baldur's Gate got a caravelle (ship) as it's emblem, and quite a few coastal Portuguese cities have the same or similar heraldry; for example, the ancient emblem of Vila do Conde https://www.heraldry-wiki.com/heraldrywiki/images/6/6b/Vila_do_Conde1.jpg

Or São Pedro (Figueira da Foz) https://www.heraldry-wiki.com/heraldrywiki/images/c/c2/Spedroff.gif

(Actually, it's a good thing we do not have a real-world full-size equivalent to a City of Murder in Portugal!)


Hem thanks a lot for the answer.

It might resemble a bit the emblem of San Pedro because of the ship, and the city walls on top it, but I would imagine that's a pretty standard composition in maritime city emblems.

[Linked Image]

It would be great if Larian could tell us which one is the city exactly.

Also yeah, completely agree that Portugal does not need a City of Murder. grin

Last edited by bernardthehermit; 09/11/20 01:23 PM.
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Originally Posted by Aishaddai
Hmm. That's disappointing. Sound's like they are brushing character feedback under the rug and are just going to stick with whatever. Why put characters out to test if they are going to brush it off? I guess they mostly wanted to test functionality of systems. Sound's like feedback does not matter as much as I'd have hoped. I'll see in the next couple of updates.

I dunno. I don't have any inside info but IMHO they wouldn't've asked for feedback if they didn't want it. I know some people think there's cynical motivations for making the EA available but they could've just Kickstarted it as they did with their previous two games...


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Originally Posted by Vhaldez
Originally Posted by Aishaddai
Hmm. That's disappointing. Sound's like they are brushing character feedback under the rug and are just going to stick with whatever. Why put characters out to test if they are going to brush it off? I guess they mostly wanted to test functionality of systems. Sound's like feedback does not matter as much as I'd have hoped. I'll see in the next couple of updates.
They know how their entire story is going to play out and we don't, so the writers must be banking on these characters "paying off" in Act 2 and 3.

To me it seems like the usual problem I see these days. Who is the game really for? Seems like it is 100% Larian hombrew. Every DM is different and not all are good. Get a definitive answer on who the audience is and the vague PR nonsense gets dispelled. Honestly they don't strike me as people who take character feedback well. Most people are already trained to think popular=right so most feedback is lost from that alone. To many ways for things to get drowned out by mobs. I was naive I guess. I think this is just a simple play test for mechanical technicality and gauging reaction so they can tweak future marketing. Kind of like how dos2 had a strong opening but after act 2 it's...different to put it nicely. That was because of PR strategy in my opinion. Maybe they hope to just win by early exposure. Wear people down to just accept there hombrew. I'll just observe like always to see where it goes.

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Originally Posted by Aishaddai
To me it seems like the usual problem I see these days. Who is the game really for? Seems like it is 100% Larian hombrew. Every DM is different and not all are good. Get a definitive answer on who the audience is and the vague PR nonsense gets dispelled. Honestly they don't strike me as people who take character feedback well. Most people are already trained to think popular=right so most feedback is lost from that alone. To many ways for things to get drowned out by mobs. I was naive I guess. I think this is just a simple play test for mechanical technicality and gauging reaction so they can tweak future marketing. Kind of like how dos2 had a strong opening but after act 2 it's...different to put it nicely. That was because of PR strategy in my opinion. Maybe they hope to just win by early exposure. Wear people down to just accept there hombrew. I'll just observe like always to see where it goes.
If DOS2 EA veterans are to be believed then you will be proven right when BG3 comes out in full. I just hope that Larian takes the year that they have to at least explain why our character feedback is irrelevant compared to what's in their story bible. We can only divulge so much information from Act 1 and datamining, so we will never develop enough of an understanding about the origin characters' arcs to give them anything on the level.

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Originally Posted by Gaidax
Interesting interview.

I really like their take on good game first and D&D game second, I fully support it. I also like how they specifically pointed out that various changes are to spice up gameplay like in case of Fighter with Weapon Skills and more baseline bonus action variety, I assume, which probably helps their blandness the most.

I also find it interesting they are actually considering loaded dice to counter miss streak, IMO it could be a nice touch, because nobody really enjoys their example of 8 misses in the row.

Completely agree with you on all this. These points were the positives for me from that interview, along with official confirmation we will get quite a number of good-oriented companions in the future (because for me several of the current companions are very solidly evil).

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I'm split on the interview. Like @kanisatha I'm happy they are signaling more good characters. I also like the loaded dice issue as an option.

As I said in another thread I don't like the cognitive dissonance inducing we love D&D along with were going to keep changing the rules because they aren't fun enough. Rule changes should be options. Loaded dice is better solution than the AC lowering / HP bloat / Dipping / surface effects on cantrips.

Let us chose if we want use the homebrew rules just like BG gave us an option between core rules and easy.

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i dont think its wrong to discribe the current party members as evil.
Id actually say thats how you properly play evil characters.

Eating babies is a pretty bad way to itneract with any group.
of course... so is eating your group members...

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Originally Posted by KillerRabbit
I also like the loaded dice issue as an option.


I absolutely hope they would homebrew it in by default where let's after your 3rd attack or spell miss, you start getting increasing attack/DC modifier until you finally connect something.

They do need to make sure you can't reasonably game it by throwing some spells/attacks with deliberately lowered DC (scrolls and such) to prop up that big one. I imagine this probably won't be a big issue, because trying to do this would be unreliable plan AF, but who knows.


And absolutely that example of 8 misses, really that should not happen like ever, IMO, even at cost of them making that 8th attack/spell assured hit unless target is outright immune. At this point you need to be some absolutely hardcore D&D fanatic to enjoy something like 8 misses in the row.

Last edited by Gaidax; 09/11/20 08:34 PM.
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Originally Posted by Gaidax
Originally Posted by KillerRabbit
I also like the loaded dice issue as an option.


I absolutely hope they would homebrew it in by default where let's after your 3rd attack or spell miss, you start getting increasing attack/DC modifier until you finally connect something.

They do need to make sure you can't reasonably game it by throwing some spells/attacks with deliberately lowered DC (scrolls and such) to prop up that big one. I imagine this probably won't be a big issue, because trying to do this would be unreliable plan AF, but who knows.


And absolutely that example of 8 misses, really that should not happen like ever, IMO, even at cost of them making that 8th attack/spell assured hit unless target is outright immune. At this point you need to be some absolutely hardcore D&D fanatic to enjoy something like 8 misses in the row.


I never missed 8 times, but when I couldn't hit Flind with 3hp for 4 times in a row that I started to get irritated.

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This one is much better. It seems like the interviewer actually knows what he's talking about here and what to ask.


Larian's Biggest Oversight, what to do about it, and My personal review of BG3 EA
"74.85% of you stood with the Tieflings, and 25.15% of you sided with Minthara. Good outweighs evil, it seems."
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